Ok. Rules are SOMETIMES meant to be broken. So, Here's the deal. I am 2 weeks post op today. I am one of those who had zero issues and had a smooth ride from recovery room to date!! This post is not intended to mean I am sure I will have a long term good go at this! It also doesn't address the future, but really ONLY the many threads that I have read regarding the preo op and post op liquid diets and the Pre and post few weeks Do's and Dont's!

I have read almost every post on here before and after surgery, lol. Here is the point that I will explain. Your/Our obsession over following diet rules is what got us here in the first place.. isn't it?? I mean, it's great to have black and white rules.. Do's and Don's. can and cant's.. That's why we were ALL great on Atkins (remember the carb counting obsession), and South Beach (remember how carefully we chose the meals), weight watchers, low cal, grapefruit, slimfast , yada yada yada......RIGHT?

Sure, it worked. THEN WE WENT OFF THE WAGON and got sick of the rules and restrictions and put weight back on (and then some).... That's because it was a DIET.. Why do so many of you do that on here? I'm not judging, but trying to help! Yes, it's easier for me, since I have had no issues. I come from a strong medical family (i had bio as a minor,4 docs and 2 nurses in immed family) and I always love to understand WHY the rules are in place. If something doesn't make sense, I want to know why and not just follow a rule because it was put out there.

My surgeon told me that "rules" are on here for the lower end of reaction spectrum. meaning, many need not follow them, but since 30%, for ex, will have issues with some things, they want to make a general rule......

As EVERYONE says on here, as well as EVERY doc, ALL OF US ARE DIFFERENT! We heal differently, We tolerate pain differently, foods differently, weight loss differently, etc..... EVERY SINGLE ONE So, the rules need not be applied to the T!

Now, as a caveat and from feedback so far on this post, this is not an excuse to eat junk NOR stay on bad habits. I don't mean to enable anyone. here is what BUTTERTHEBEAN wrote:

"The only reason I say "enabling" is because I think there are some people waiting in the wings to hear someone tell them it's okay to eat whatever they want. They haven't tackled their food addictions and they are hoping for "permission" to go back to their old ways. I know there are some that can learn to eat "all things in moderation." I have no problem with that. For me, I chose to embrace my inner health nut. It's not fear or weakness or lack of self control...it's the desire to live a long, healthy and active life. I'm not depriving myself, or sacrifing. The things I'm doing and the life I'm leading now feel way better than eating pizza and cupcakes ever did (even in moderation). By that I mean that food did not give me pleasure (never did, I just thought it did), so I no longer look to food to satisfy my needs, except nutritionally."

Ok... Back to the post. Specifically, here is what I have had debunked by my brother (Anesthesiologist for bariatric), My mom (nurse and nutritionist), my bro's good friend and bariatric surgeon, and my surgeon..........

* Yes, the liquid PRE OP diet is not to be messed with. It sucked, but we need the liver to be soft and looking like liver in a supermarket. That will happen in most cases with one week.. Many docs do one week only and many do 2 weeks..... So, if you have a 2 week doc, don't worry if you cheat a little and wants some low calorie food.. It's OK!! have the Soup... etc. I didn't cheat as mine was only a week and I did not want to have a lifetime of liver issues if it was frail and broke a bit/injured while being moved for my surgery....

* Most docs on here POST OP put you on liquids for 2 weeks.. Why?? NOTHING medical. Really? Many docs, including mine, put me on Clear Liquids only day 1 in the hospital and then put me instantly on pureed foods (tuna salad, chicken salad, egg salad, greek yogurts, ricotta cheese, etc).. Yes. DAY 2! He does this for EVERY patient.. He has had NO MORE COMPLICATIONS than anyone else ever.... It is NOT true that eating this will cause a leak.. It can't get caught in you stitches, lol, as they are on the outside and you can't see them even in your stomach.. The ONLY risk is a)that you eat way too much and thus can cause leaks, so don't do that. and that is WAY too much. Meaning you go out of your way to test the limits. As any surgeon will tell you, stretching the stomach to break the staples is no easy task.... easy enough to follow that rule .. and the risk is that you get nauseated.. Ok.. we are all different. Some take 90 minutes the first time they eat to get down 4 oz of chicken salad.. I didn't . I got it down in 15 min and could have done it in 5..... But the point is, listen to your body. start slowly and if you tolerate it, then screw the rules.....

What does this mean? It means so what if you doc put you on 2 week post liquid. That is soo hard.. so, do it mostly, but don't obsess about cheating. have a friggin plate of tuna salad.. It will taste yummy.. Add some great yogurt. If you can handle it, you are good to go! I did.. They also want you on this liquid to max your weight loss for motivation up front? do you really need that?? I don't care if it takes me 1 more week than you to hit the same goal? Frankly, I decided to keep my calories around 800ish anyway for my first 2 weeks. It was a little hard, but nothing like your liquid nightmare and i lost as much weight... I'm now on 1200 cal full diet plan (less hard carbs and hard veggies) as of last night.

I've heard people say they are craving one Dorito chip.. Then the advice replies were "lick the cheese off" or "take a bit and spit it out...." LOL. Really? This is your diet/lifestyle for the rest of your life. HAVE A CHIP.. See if you get a lot of gas.. Chew it well.. If not problem, then enjoy the one chip. You got here because you at a half bag . One or three chips won't kill you! You need to find a way to eat what you will do.. The docs want you to build your healthy habits now.

*The first year is where you get your max weight loss- Ok. For sure,, so, as noted, build your healthy habits now.. but make it last. So, if I want a Dorito chip. I have one or two.. On my pureed phase, my kids had pretzels at a game. I took 2 small ones....I had a qtr of his hotdog meat.. The point is, if we can seriously lower the number of calories we eat (which, for me, they figured i was eating between 3500-4000 per day and needed to be at 2400 or so.. Now, with 1200, which believe me, with the sleeve is a mini feast, I will be eating half the amount and will lose a lot of weight. So, yes, build good eating habits and i'm working on good food choices that I can live with! Can I eat white bread. Damn right?should I// nO?? it's a waste of calories and spikes your sugar and appetite. But, I sure will if i want a hamburger or great sandwich. A month ago i would have had 2 cheeseburgers and 2 hotdogs at a bbq. .So, guess what, i'll lose weight. Can't make it a daily thing.. But, again, stop obsessing..

*Eating and drinking slowly eating- well, you don't HAVE to eat slowly, but as we have been told our whole lives, eat slowly so that when you are really full, you know it! Also, you need to see what your bod can tolerate and if you eat too quickly, you may not have realized you were about to puke. If you can tolerate it, you can eat and drink quicker than others, but not a good idea for reasons mentioned. so work on it, but don't obsess.. At the hospital, they told me I had to drink in in little tiny medical cups a few cc evry 20 min. I laughed, as Water went down easily in recovery even. ALL NURSES TOLD ME NO. When I saw my doc, i asked why I can't just drink as I can tolerate it at home and get my 64 oz is. HE said dont' chug, but do whatever you can do without discomfort. So, 8 oz bottle of water went down in 5 minutes... etc....

*Chewing your food- ALL true... We have that banana sized stomach.. So, the doughy breads, and stringy veggies and large pieces of non chewed enough food INDEED often get stuck! Not stuck like a lap band, but rather, they move toward the pyloric valve and are too big to pass through it, since there isn't as much acid, etc in your stomach and, well, the route to the valve is now MUCH shorter.. So, it sits in front of it and as soon as the next item goes there, it waits in line. your body puts out gas and then knows there is a problem, so will signal you to vomit it up. not fun... So, chew! All true! Also makes us take longer to eat and thus enjoy the tastes more than ever and have the full signal sent to our brain while we are still eating or pretty close to that!

*Caffein is bad... Ok. Google whether it's an appetite suppressant or stimulant.. It's hysterical.. You'll get equal replies from GREAT sources that say the opposite. I WANT my one cup a day. I'm not an addict. I asked. I am now sipping on my first REAL one. It is indeed a diuretic for some. So, drink a half cup more water than a day! If you feel it makes you hungry after you have it and you don't want to hold back, then stop the coffee.. It doesn't for me. It does for some... But what will you be doing in a year from now??/ There is NO medical reason why you can't have caffein after a few weeks

*ALCOHOL is a no no for 2 months. NONSENSE.. Again, just there so we don't put empty calories. BUT what if I WANT one drink or two on a date tonight?? I am told, go for it, but just know you will have ingested 400 wasted calories. Ok. I get it, but I WILL drink in my life, although never drank a ton and that was not the cause of most of my weight.. Watch the calories and don't do it twice most weeks.. Or if you will, then cut back a bit on your Snacks, etc. Anyway, looking forward to a martini with my date tomorrow at dinner.. Oh, most people on here for a while, will tell you since there is less food to bind with alcohol, it goes into your intestines/blood stream much quicker and you get a nice buzz faster with less! way cool!

* Most other rules and comments on here are just not universal and again, if you feel the NEED to cheat, then well, cheat! How can it be cheating if this will be your new life! WOrk hard at right food choices and don't make this soooo hard. The harder you make it, the more YOU WILL revolt and end up going off the wagon like the good old days... Since I have had no pain, etc and pretty much eat what I wanted (and cheated on my puree period even), I feel this is just toooo easy. I hear so many of you struggling (not because you have pain, but because you want to break a rul) and so many of you "supporting them" to stay strong, that I just wanted to add this post! Also, again, much of the medical advice that our well meaning friends on here provide, just isn't true. Sorry, but it isnt.

I hope this helps some of you enjoy your Pre and Post diets much more than you may be now!

Best, my friends!

I have had the worst pickle craving, I think the skin might be hard to digest though. I totally want that for my first real

meal too!!

Tamara - just to get you through it, could you take a swig of pickle juice? ; )

Wrong. Of course people want to change their bad behaviour otherwise we would of never had the surgery. The sleeve is designed to control portion sizes. It was never designed to change the mind set. It has no connection to the brain or our thought patterns.

My bad behaviours have changed tremendously. I now drink half a cup of diet coke every second day as opposed to 2 cans of real coke per day. I have had only one bite of a McDonalds hamburger in the past 3 months as opposed to 3-4 maybe 5 servings of McDonalds per week. So' date=' yes we do and we are changing our bad behaviours..

Changing bad behaviours doesnt mean we have to live on tuna and salad for the rest of our lives or completely deprive ourselves, its all about moderation, isnt it?[/quote']

I know there are plenty of people here who want to change their behavior. I do not mean to discount their efforts. But there are some that don't believe they should change "what" they eat at all, only "how much" they eat. Well that's fine if your only problem was overeating decent foods. But if you suffered from late night candy runs, hiding food and eating in secret....any number of unhealthy eating obsessions....then perhaps portion control is not going to be enough.

And for me....no, it's not all about moderation. I'm one of those that decided to kick off a whole new healthy way of eating and living. I spent too many years having whatever food I wanted, at the expense of having the life I wanted. But to each their own. If you reach your goals, that's all that matters.

I know there are plenty of people here who want to change their behavior. I do not mean to discount their efforts. But there are some that don't believe they should change "what" they eat at all, only "how much" they eat. Well that's fine if your only problem was overeating decent foods. But if you suffered from late night candy runs, hiding food and eating in secret....any number of unhealthy eating obsessions....then perhaps portion control is not going to be enough.

And for me....no, it's not all about moderation. I'm one of those that decided to kick off a whole new healthy way of eating and living. I spent too many years having whatever food I wanted, at the expense of having the life I wanted. But to each their own. If you reach your goals, that's all that matters.

Very eloquent response!

i kind of feel what you saying. i had to go through 3 months of classes before i could get it. and they have inbedded things in my head. my goal is to eat what i want, this is a tool for me i can have pizza with friends because my tool will only allow 1-2 slices and i would be to full to eat more than that and i would be satisfied

no taking a bite of a chip that i cant do a bite of chip will turn into days of eaten chips so i wont go there. each person is differant. i am one of those that cant just have a cookie i will eat all of the cookies. but i want to just eat normal and my sleeve work for me. if that makes sense

Spot on my friend! I'm 2 1/2 months post and eat whatever just not as much. I'm down 50 lbs.

My doc's office (he & his staff) have said: be 90% good, 90% of the time.

I think it's fabulous advice & will help to not obsess over slip-ups.

Well said Neilsleeve! I enjoyed your post. I am only a week 2 days post op and I'm not getting in much, I know I need protein, but my body no longer tolerates whey protein. As soon as it goes in, right back out. Well I need protein to heal, today I'm trying a very runny scrambled egg. I know I will only be able to eat a few bites. Anything has got to be better than how sick whey protein is making me.

Keep your chin up as your taking a beating.

I giggle when I read some of the post. I have learned if your head tells you no than don't go

There! Thanks for your post.

My doc's office (he & his staff) have said: be 90% good' date=' 90% of the time.

I think it's fabulous advice & will help to not obsess over slip-ups.[/quote']

I like that Susan:)

Well said Neilsleeve! I enjoyed your post. I am only a week 2 days post op and I'm not getting in much' date=' I know I need Protein, but my body no longer tolerates whey protein. As soon as it goes in, right back out. Well I need protein to heal, today I'm trying a very runny scrambled egg. I know I will only be able to eat a few bites. Anything has got to be better than how sick whey protein is making me.

Keep your chin up as your taking a beating.[/quote']

WHOA!!!! You are 2 days post op. are you getting in all your Water? I'm talking 64oz/day. The reason you can't tolerate whey right now has nothing to do with it being whey. It has to do with the fact that there is so much restriction in your stomach right now that in all likelyhood it's too thick right now.

Scrambled eggs shouldn't even be considered at this point. Do you have a doctors prescribed diet, or a nut? 2 days post op protein isn't even a priority yet. In almost every diet I've seen you would still be on Clear liquids for at least the first week.

I never saw anybody in this thread advocating eating soft foods 2 days post-op. please take everything in context.

That's a week and 2 days I've already spoken to my NUT, I'm good. Staying right on with what I'm allowed. Today I've switched to a pre made Atkins shake and I've had half of it with no issues other than a lot of belly noise. Had some Greek yogurt (2.5 oz) and my sleeve is much happier. Fingers crossed the pre made works. Next step will be isopure. (Too expensive at over 5 a bottle)

Don't buy too many. It is also known as IsoPuke here on VST. It just doesn't work for some folk.

away. i was sleeved through kaiser if you want you can follow thier plan. you need the protien to heal your wounds also. here is the link www.kp.org/misg.

i think kaiser has the best program yes they are strict but i found a site from the original dr that started the baratic surgery and the diet is very very simiular. remember your tummy is healing and swollen at this point. take it easy at least a week. i dont know whos care you are under but im 4 weeks post op lost 17 lbs dont know how many inches and i didnt follow it to the t, i would go to the next phase a few days before the next phase i just go with how im feeling and what i can tolorate. and isopure try the grape. those things are nasty when drinking slow.

My doc's office (he & his staff) have said: be 90% good, 90% of the time.

I think it's fabulous advice & will help to not obsess over slip-ups.

I really like this advice! The most important part is to not obsess and beat yourself if you eat 1 thing bad. It wasn't the one small ice cream that got us here, it was the extra large smothered in chocolate every second day. You have to make changes and have a better lifestyle to be successful, but it doesn't mean you can ever eat another cookie again!

Personally speaking, I think it was the "love it" size cold stone that did me in originally.