holy hell **Confrontation or Enabling ?**

[VEGAN ME 117]

yep I agree, maybe we can change this site for the better

I feel if you don't want to help in a sincere and thoughtful way keep your thoughts to yourself. If your gonna drag up others mistakes on a forum over n over again then why waste your time stressing yourselves out? Idk how long Alex is going to allow you to keep giving your 2 cents when u carry it to another post that doest involve them. I hope you get your vet forum soon. I don't see where you really want to help. Hurting people's feelings when they own up to a mistake usually makes things worse. It's easy to take disapproval from your parents and feel it again in some of these posts you call hard love. You can say it in a posotive encouraging way. If your so over it you can't keep quiet. I'm not saying this out of guilt. I'm saying it with empathy and compassion. Never make someone who comes here and admits and takes accountability feel lower then they already do. We are all people. We all are imperfect. People come here for help it doesn't have to be this way. I've learned a lot from reading here everything but I don't like what you call hard love. It's more sarcasm and str out rude at times.


Sent from my iPhone using the BariatricPal App

[Healthy_life2 8,319]

@@summerset

I see your surgery date is May 2016. I was hoping the us against them conversation would stop. Both newbies and vet's give great support on the site.

you posted:

This. A "follow your program" doesn't require (or isn't) any "vet wisdom". I'm not sure what is regarded as "vet wisdom"on here.

(1) Support from vet's is simply support from others that have been through the process. They have been a newbie and now goal

"I also think of it as strange that people who're only 12 months out are already regarded as vets."

(2) When anyone reaches goal, I consider them a veteran. I reached goal around 6 months.

Support can be:

cheer each other on.

give our experiences with struggles and what worked for us to overcome.

refer any medical questions to professionals.

Suggest resources.

Confront if needed. Don't enable if behavior may cause an negative outcome.

[KeepCalm 223]

That being said, my new motto is :

Bacon/pizza/ Coke Zero/ steak for everyone, all the time, whenever you want!

That's definitely been my motto around here lately!! Do what you want, get what you get. If it works for you -- AWESOME! If it doesn't, choose to change it or don't. Not my circus, not my monkeys.

Oh, and you forgot the popcorn.

NO, popcorn!!! I've been very good, do not bring it to my attention! I'm getting better at walking right past all those awesome looking bags, and not even giving them a second glance... but then I'm staying away from movie theaters for a little while longer too and I'll probably dump the bag on one of my sisters should they have the misfortune to make some...

One sister already did something loco, invited me over for dinner, and I mean she actually made it a point to call and ask me to come over - something she VERY rarely does, so I was like absolutely I'll be over! and she does know I am not supposed to eat certain things.

Guess what she made - homemade mac and cheese with chicken in it and potatoe chips baked on top - not a veggie in sight, and I just sighed, and picked out the chicken.< /p>

[summerset 5,261]

This is not a matter of "n00bs" against "vets". I would still like to know what exactly is considered vet wisdom on this board.

@@summerset

I see your surgery date is May 2016.

First surgery was March 2001 (see my signature). I'm over 15 years out in the end with all ups and downs, so beg your pardon that I'm not automatically considering someone who is only 12 months out a veteran.

(2) When anyone reaches goal, I consider them a veteran. I reached goal around 6 months.

I've seen quite a few people reaching "goal" and I've seen quite a few of them regain a good portion or all of the weight later on. Do users lose vet status once they regain a few pounds and are no longer at goal weight? I've also seen a lot of arrogance around various boards during the years, only to watch people fall from grace later on. I'm talking about 5 years out or more here.

I also disagree with having to be at goal weight to be considered a "veteran". Not only people at goal weight have valuable insights to offer. You can learn a lot of things from people who are not as successful as someone who reached "goal weight". Of course you won't see much "non-successful vets" posting out there - they're feeling too much like failures and they're ashamed of it.

Not me.

Support can be:

cheer each other on.

give our experiences with struggles and what worked for us to overcome.

refer any medical questions to professionals.

Suggest resources.

Confront if needed. Don't enable if behavior may cause an negative outcome.

I never considered these things not being supportive. I only doubt the "wisdom" in advice like "follow your program".

The wisdom starts where the common sense ("follow your program") stops working.

[LipstickLady 25,682]

I think the definition of veteran is up to the reader.

[summerset 5,261]

Without knowing the person's health background, medicines they are taking and any medical conditions or conditions they are at a higher risk of, it is best to answer them with "follow your plan", etc..

For example, someone writes they have leg cramps and someone tells them to take large doses of potassium supplements because it worked for them and they read it can help those symptoms. Unfortunately the person asking for help has kidney problems -that could be medically unsafe.

There is "advice" and "medical advice", e. g. there is a big difference between giving out medical advice how to probably resolve leg swelling (that could be caused by various conditions) and advice how to adhere to a certain kind of eating or exercise plan.

[SalOdyssey 441]

I made a comment about the vets staying because most newbies need the help and the reply I received was ... Follow your program. Something to that fact. ... I'm not offended. But I think that as a newbie ,I may have a question or enjoy reading their success stories .. So to just say follow my program is not what a group forum is for. It's for support ...

This. A "follow your program" doesn't require (or isn't) any "vet wisdom". I'm not sure what is regarded as "vet wisdom"on here, but IMO "follow your program" or "talk to your NUT" or "you need to change your relationship with food" isn't valuable vet advice. That's only common sense. I also think of it as strange that people who're only 12 months out are already regarded as vets.

Advice from vets is necessary when your individual program doesn't get you the spectacular results you were hoping for or when you're severely struggling with following your program down the road.

Advice doesn't have to be anything fancy, it can be as simple as pointing out the title of a book that helped someone get their cravings under control.

Ultimately your surgeon or NUT is THE BEST person(s) to seek advice from. Yes, here we can all kick around ideas and what worked for one verses another. But most importantly few to none of us are Dr's here. Just because our plan may allow something, another Dr or NUT may balk at the idea.

As for what defines a vet, I can't answer that. Because although I am only 6 days post-op I did a ton of research, reading, video watching, etc. So I think my personal knowledge on VSG and weight loss surgery is pretty high. Would I consider myself a vet? No, but rather someone very well knowledgeable with WLS.

[VSGAnn2014 12,992]

@@summerset -- I realize you're fascinated by this veteran forum dealio, but as a Super Veteran (someone who's had two WLSs), you must have a lot of good advice to share with everyone -- both newbies and mere "veterans."

I'd love to hear your WLS pearls of wisdom.

What do you think will help those who have WLS become healthy long-term (or any other definition of "WLS success")?

[summerset 5,261]

Oh oh, sensing lots and lots of sarcasm here... lol.

I'd love to hear your WLS pearls of wisdom.

Man, why do I doubt that you really want to hear my honest opinion on this?

Look, obviously I offended you. I'm sorry I did. I realize in your opinion one needs to be at goal weight to be taken really seriously. I can accept that. No problem here, hon.

*plonk*

[VSGAnn2014 12,992]

No, seriously -- given your prior comments about who REALLY qualifies as a veteran -- you have really been around a long time.

Seriously, seriously, seriously -- what do you think helps people conquer obesity through WLS?

SERIOUSLY!

[summerset 5,261]

@@VSGAnn2014 Do you really think I'm interested in a debate with you after that sarcasm you hurled at me? Why should I? It's obvious you're only looking for an opportunity to dis me. I'm not interested in blood pressure raising quarreling. *shakes head slowly*

Look, I understand you're angry because you seem to think I somehow doubted your status as a "vet" on this board or something like this. I didn't. Actually I don't care about "status". People either make sensible suggestions/posts or they don't, regardless of some status or not, regardless of how many posts they have already made or not.

[VSGAnn2014 12,992]

@@VSGAnn2014 Do you really think I'm interested in a debate with you after that sarcasm you hurled at me? Why should I? It's obvious you're only looking for an opportunity to dis me. I'm not interested in blood pressure raising quarreling. *shakes head slowly*

Look, I understand you're angry because you seem to think I somehow doubted your status as a "vet" on this board or something like this. I didn't. Actually I don't care about "status". People either make sensible suggestions/posts or they don't, regardless of some status or not, regardless of how many posts they have already made or not.

(sigh)

You have completely misunderstood me. To my knowledge, we don't have any other veterans around here with 15 years of WLS experience.

There's got to be so much knowledge to be gleaned from so many years of WLS experience.

If you don't want to respond here, I hope you will share your knowledge elsewhere at BP on other threads.

Peace.

[LipstickLady 25,682]

@@summerset

EEEEK! I am guilty, too! I didn't realize you were banded 15 years ago. You really DO have a lot to share.

What do you think is a good definition of a vet? I mean, we are all going to interpret it in our own way, but as a long timer, you can definitely give an interesting perspective.

What caused you to have revision surgery?

[Healthy_life2 8,319]

@@summerset

Congratulations on 15 years out!

Here I am repeating the obvious. Both newbies and vet's give great support on the site. Both are valued...(even if they have a gain )

Take what is of value to you from any forum. You can always ignore posts or block user's

summerset

Expert Member

• Posts: 131
• Joined:Jan 2016
• Gender: Female
• Location: DE
• Surgery: Mini Gastric Bypass (MGB)
• Surgery Date: May 2016
• Height: 168 cm
• Weight Lost: 37 kgs
• BMI: 33.1

[summerset 5,261]

Take what is of value to you from any forum. You can always ignore posts or block user's

Thanks for reminding me.