who supports right to choose

[gadgetlady 4]

Then why do you think this girl didn't deserve medical care afterwards?

It was my understanding, and I may be wrong, that she wasn't in need of medical care. However, if I am wrong and she was in need, of course she should have received it! I never said she didn't deserve medical care; I would never deny anyone medical care for a botched abortion (or any other ailment), regardless of whether I think the procedure is wrong or not.

[gadgetlady 4]

You know, on reflection, I am astonished by how calloused and cruel you perceive me to be. What do you think I think here -- "it's her own damn fault she had complications with an abortion so to hell with her"? When have I ever, ever portrayed such a cynical and cruel approach to mothers who abort? I've never expressed anything but compassion for them. I believe they are true victims of an industry and a world that tells them that by killing their children, everything will be all better. I've never pointed fingers at anyone on this board or anywhere else who has chosen to abort. It's just not who I am. It seems from your posts that you harbor disdain for me and my position, but now you're the one twisting my words.

[pattygreen 5]

The problem, especially with this issue, is that when you make abortion a religious issue, those who don't believe in God dismiss it as an issue that doesn't impact them because they don't subscribe to your beliefs. I don't disagree with you that God impacts every area of our lives, but many people do, and in today's culture that means something. When Christians led the fight against slavery in the 1800s, they were able to attach the fight to Christian principles about human beings -- because it was commonly understood and people didn't reject that reasoning. But that is less and less the case these days.

This is the same in other areas of life as well. "Don't kill someone because it is a violation of basic human rights": everyone understands that. You understand basic human rights to be Divinely granted, but not everyone does. So if you attach the issue of killing to solely Biblical reasoning, you lose a lot of people -- both philosophically and emotionally.

You are right in what you say. I agree, and will try to keep that in mind.

[Oregondaisy 2,020]

That's nice. It's a good thing when people can agree to disagree.

[rodriguezequal 3]

I just wanted to say something about the lady with all the kids. She has now set up a website where people can send her donations or clothes, toys, diapers and of course money. Now the tax payers may be paying for them even more in California. I saw this article about her today...

A big share of the financial burden of raising Nadya Suleman's 14 children could fall on the shoulders of California's taxpayers, compounding the public furor in a state already billions of dollars in the red.

Even before the 33-year-old single, unemployed mother gave birth to octuplets last month, she had been caring for her six other children with the help of $490 a month in food stamps, plus Social Security disability payments for three of the youngsters. The public aid will almost certainly be increased with the new additions to her family.

Also, the hospital where the octuplets are expected to spend seven to 12 weeks has requested reimbursement from Medi-Cal, the state's Medicaid program, for care of the premature babies, according to the Los Angeles Times. The cost has not been disclosed.

[BJean 16]

I heard that there were over 40 medical personnel that were needed to take care of the delivery and subsequent medical attention that the preemies needed. That can't be an insignificant amount that they're asking Medicaid to pay.

The woman's Quest to have all these children is irresponsible at the very least. However we don't want to be like some countries where the government actually controls women's reproductive decisions.

Having said that, I believe it is incumbent upon the state to put limitations on how many children the taxpayers are required to pay for in an household that is depends on welfare programs as their sole source of income. I would never want children to go hungry or be without medical care. But there should be limits so that this kind of thing is discouraged.

When my mother worked for the city+state run health center, there were limitations at that time. I believe the max number of children a woman could have and get additional support from welfare programs was 5. After that, she had to make do with the amount she was getting and no more from the taxpayers. It had the effect of many single parented jobless women having 5 children. Interestingly, the birth rate dropped promptly after 5.

Abortion was illegal at the time. However counseling about birth control and birth control meds and devices were dispensed. Everyone was relieved when the single mothers of 5 started using those devices.

It should have been, after all, primarily about the use and abuse of children.

[rodriguezequal 3]

What's sucks is that my son is disabled for the rest of hie life from things noticed at birth and now my husband makes $200 over what he could make to allow us to get my son SSI. So now we have to make do and struggle from pay check to paycheck. It sucks that we can't get any help because my hubby makes just enough, even though it's not enough for everything we need as a family and that my son needs as an individual. It sucks...

[gadgetlady 4]

What I don't understand is who paid for the IVF. It's not a cheap procedure. If the gov't paid for it, that's unconscionable. It's an elective procedure and shouldn't be covered by taxpayer money.

[rodriguezequal 3]

Yeah, I have no idea how she managed to pay for it, but not for all of her own kids. It drives me crazy...I just hope that those kids get the health care, love, and time that they need...I feel bad for the kids...I really do!

[Carrie_C 9]

What I don't understand is who paid for the IVF. It's not a cheap procedure. If the gov't paid for it, that's unconscionable. It's an elective procedure and shouldn't be covered by taxpayer money.

She said in the interview that when she was working she worked all the time, double and triple shifts to save for the treatments. But she couldn't have made very much at the job she did, and I still don't see how she saved enough for so many. I think there is more going on than we know.

[BJean 16]

I agree Carrie. I'll bet it is a complicated and very interesting story and what we know is the tip of the iceberg. On the news tonight they said that she's getting death threats. Aren't people just plain weird!?

[gadgetlady 4]

She said in the interview that when she was working she worked all the time, double and triple shifts to save for the treatments. But she couldn't have made very much at the job she did, and I still don't see how she saved enough for so many. I think there is more going on than we know.

There probably is. I actually haven't watched any of the interviews, so I'm only hearing stuff from other people (who knows how much of it is exaggerated or untrue). But still -- if she could save that much from her job, she shouldn't have been receiving government assistance.

[coltonwade 27]

I have been away for a while so im jumping back in to this.

I heard in an interview that she paid for the IVF from a settlement she got in a workers comp case. in my opinion the doc who implanted her needs his lisecense revoked.

He , from what is being said, knew her situtation , she was unemployed already had 6 children , 3 are disabled and did this anyway . Its unethical .

This woman is NUTS. There is no way in HELL the tax payers should pay for these children . NOW She has the "Nuts" to go online and ask for donations. Her "publicist" was on Dr Phil the other day Dr Phil said " how does she think she's going to raise these kids " the publicst said " that's why im here WE need help we need the help of the people" WTF ? My husband works out of town during the week , we are barely making ends meat right now , we dont have health insurance , we too make more money than qualifies us for ANY assistance , i cant find a job but i am not on TV asking for help to pay for kids I CHOSE to have and cant take care of . I call BULLSHIT on this one BIG TIME !!!

This woman In my opinion has some serious issues and now she's expecting everyone else to pick up the tab ? NO way .

NOW The problem is NOW is the children . They are the one's who are going to pay in the long run for their mothers Stupidity !!!

CPS needs to step in and at least investigate this woman .

that's my 2 cents !!!

Mindy

[Carrie_C 9]

I agree, I think CPS needs to get involved as well.

[OneHotMama 0]

She needs to be investigated for work comp fraud! She has been collecting work comp and disibility for being in "constant pain" since she was caught in a riot in the psych hospital where she worked. Problem is, if you're collecting money for being in constant pain how the hell have you dealt with pregnancy every year at the same time?