Can tolerate more than I think I should?

[LivDee 12]

I am able to eat a bit more than recommended and I’m worried about it. I’m week 3-4 post op and can currently have eggs, toast, tuna etc. a stage let purée. I can eat about a cup and a half of strained Soup in a sitting. I can eat a whole egg and a half a piece of toast in a sitting as well. Is this abnormal? Should I be concerned?

[catwoman7 10,870]

I'm too far out from surgery to remember, but as far as Soup goes, liquids go right through you - so I wouldn't be super concerned about being able to handle 1.5 C of soup.

[LivDee 12]

Yeah, I’m less concerned with the Soups and more concerned about the soft foods and solids.

[Arabesque 6,488]

How much does your plan recommend? If they didn’t give you portion size recommendations I’d ask ask for some that will meet your needs especially if you feel more comfortable & confident with them. Best advice then is to follow your plan. Remember all because you can doesn’t mean you should.

As you know there are differences with plans. Like I was told 1/4 - 1/3 cup from purée slowly increasing to about a cup near goal. I was never given calorie goals. Some are advised a larger portion because they are given a higher caloric goal. (I wasn’t given calorie goals just portion size recommendations.) I’d think everyone is able to eat/drink more Soup, shakes & broths because they’re liquids & go through our tummy more quickly. I’d sip on them for hours … until the soup got too chunky.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Arabesque

[summerseeker 1,853]

Once you get onto real foods your restriction will kick in. Its really hard to get a feel for it before that. I sometimes got a runny nose or began sneezing when it was time to put the spoon down. At other times I missed the signal and would get the foamies. Its a tough learning curve at the beginning. Are you allowed toast on a pureed diet? Remember your stomach has to heal together and if you are eating off your plan it can be dangerous. Contact your team

[summerset 5,261]

On 1/17/2023 at 2:58 AM, LivDee said:

I am able to eat a bit more than recommended and I’m worried about it.

Who made the recommendation? Also is it s "recommendation" or a "rule"?

Quote

I’m week 3-4 post op and can currently have eggs, toast, tuna etc. a stage let purée. I can eat about a cup and a half of strained Soup in a sitting. I can eat a whole egg and a half a piece of toast in a sitting as well. Is this abnormal?

Stop the comparing!

Comparing is the surefire way to insecurity, worry and anxiety and the death of self-esteem and happiness.

Also who defines what a "normal" amount is or not?

Quote

Should I be concerned?

If you should be concerned or not is something only your treatment team can answer.

[SpartanMaker 676]

I concur with @summerset. I'm not really following what you mean by "more than recommended" or why you find it worrying? If you're eating more than your team said you should, stop doing that. Problem solved.

Keep in mind that early on after surgery your stomach is inflamed and multiple nerves have been cut. In short, it's unlikely that you'd be able to feel all the appropriate signals to tell you when you're full. This is why most team's have recommendations on specific foods and volumes you should be eating at every stage. These are not only for the safety of your healing stomach, but also to keep you from eating so much you make yourself sick. They are NOT hard "limits" of exactly how much your stomach can hold.

Please tell me if I'm wrong, but my suspicion is you were expecting surgical restriction to keep you from overeating and you're testing the limits. Because you are able to eat more than what your team suggested you eat, you are worried that this means you're going to fail later.

This is an important point, so I'm going to bold it:

Success or failure post-surgery probably has more to do with your ability to follow your team's recommendations than it does with you being restricted by a smaller stomach. Once you get past the initial stages, it's can be as easy to overeat as it was before surgery. If you are headed down this path, I highly recommend working with a therapist that specializes in disordered eating because surgery alone may not be enough.

[LivDee 12]

I wasn’t expecting it to keep me from over eating as in, I could eat whatever and still lose the weight. I feel my restriction when I eat a little more, no restriction prior to. My directives were very vague, the sheet I was given reads “You should be able to tolerate a fourth, to a half of an egg.” So When I was able to eat a whole egg, I was just a bit worried that it wasn’t normal. But thank you for your feedback.

[amylittlelbs 10]

I concur with [mention=270931]summerset[/mention]. I'm not really following what you mean by "more than recommended" or why you find it worrying? If you're eating more than your team said you should, stop doing that. Problem solved.
Keep in mind that early on after surgery your stomach is inflamed and multiple nerves have been cut. In short, it's unlikely that you'd be able to feel all the appropriate signals to tell you when you're full. This is why most team's have recommendations on specific foods and volumes you should be eating at every stage. These are not only for the safety of your healing stomach, but also to keep you from eating so much you make yourself sick. They are NOT hard "limits" of exactly how much your stomach can hold.
Please tell me if I'm wrong, but my suspicion is you were expecting surgical restriction to keep you from overeating and you're testing the limits. Because you are able to eat more than what your team suggested you eat, you are worried that this means you're going to fail later.
This is an important point, so I'm going to bold it:
Success or failure post-surgery probably has more to do with your ability to follow your team's recommendations than it does with you being restricted by a smaller stomach. Once you get past the initial stages, it's can be as easy to overeat as it was before surgery. If you are headed down this path, I highly recommend working with a therapist that specializes in disordered eating because surgery alone may not be enough.

Whilst I agree ... The majority of us get the surgery because we're not able to have the die-hard willpower to not overeat. We're sold by surgeons our stomach will stop us from over eating so it's fair to say that's what we would expect

I'm experiencing the same issue but I've had to really focus and remind myself this is the honeymoon phase of weight loss. Doesn't make it any less difficult when you're not as strong as others with willpower

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using BariatricPal mobile app

[SpartanMaker 676]

1 hour ago, amylittlelbs said:

Whilst I agree ... The majority of us get the surgery because we're not able to have the die-hard willpower to not overeat. We're sold by surgeons our stomach will stop us from over eating so it's fair to say that's what we would expect

I'm experiencing the same issue but I've had to really focus and remind myself this is the honeymoon phase of weight loss. Doesn't make it any less difficult when you're not as strong as others with willpower

I certainly understand why you'd say that, however I do worry that you and others are beating yourselves up over this concept of "willpower", when self control/willpower isn't actually what separates those that are successful at weight loss and those that aren't successful.

I mean, I get it. We've been told this over and over again, but there is a growing body of research that shows it's not self control that's actually at work here. In reality, your ability to resist that tempting food is no different than successful dieters, or even people that have never had a weight issue at all. What those folks do differently is reframe the problem. For example, instead of thinking resisting a particular food comes down to "being strong", they might mentally tell themselves that it actually tastes bad, or maybe they visualize the lousy feeling they tell themselves they'll feel after eating it. Over time, these sorts of approaches help them develop new habits that replace the old unhealthy ones. It's not an instant process, but it is something that anyone can do. For those that need the help, this is something a qualified therapist can assist with.

I mention all this, because beating yourself up for being "weak" is counter productive and just makes the problem worse. Obese people are not weak or lacking in self control. Some of us just lack good strategies for replacing bad habits with good ones.

[Arabesque 6,488]

I don’t believe will power plays a long term major role in your success either.. I have decades of evidence that my stubbornness & pig headedness meant I could stick to any diet & lose weight. But I always put weight back on because i always went back to eating exactly the same way. Sound familiar? I never dealt with the why I ate. I never permanently changed my relationship with food. My will power couldn’t compete with those old, strong habits & thinking.

Many of the benefits of the surgery don’t last. Your hunger comes back. Your restriction isn’t as strong. You can physically eat more, etc. (People can & do eat out around their restriction & their smaller tummy.) What the surgery does is give you time. Time to lose weight. Time to examine what, why & how you eat. Time to change your relationship with food, to establish new habits & routines around eating. Time to do the head work. The surgery alone doesn’t do all the work for you. If you think it will you won’t be as successful.

Reframing the problem, as @SpartanMaker suggested, certainly worked for me.

For many years I managed my reflux through dietary choices. Cut out daily carbonated drinks. (Limited how much soda or tonic Water or champagne I’d had when socialising.) I cut out caffeine (except green tea). No spicy food (helped I had a sensitivity to chilli). Avoided rich, creamy, fatty, oily food. If I ate/drank them I would experience severe hiccups & other reflux symptoms. It became it didn’t matter how much enjoyment/ pleasure/comfort I got from eating/drinking them, they made me sick so it wasn’t worth it.

I approached my post surgical weight loss & the way I eat now the same way. I’ve put my health & well being above any emotional benefits I got from eating. I feel so much better by not eating in my old way. I don’t get bloated & windy everyday. I don’t have those little white pimply bumps on my arms & they aren’t dry & scaly either. My thighs don’t rub together so no more heat rashes. I sleep better. My feet don’t ache when I wear heels or stand for any length of time. I have more energy. I didn’t have any comorbidities before my surgery so I can’t claim I don’t have those anymore but my chance of developing them is extremely low. I’m maintaining my weight. And so on. Initially it was my physical well being that motivated the change of thinking but now there’s also a emotional & mental well being component. And yes, part of that is vanity. The old maxim of eating to live not living to eat resonates strongly with me.

I’m trying to apply this thinking to the stretching exercises I do now. (I really don’t enjoy exercising.) I feel better & body parts are looking leaner & more defined.

Sorry for the long post.

[summerset 5,261]

14 hours ago, amylittlelbs said:

Whilst I agree ... The majority of us get the surgery because we're not able to have the die-hard willpower to not overeat. We're sold by surgeons our stomach will stop us from over eating so it's fair to say that's what we would expect

This seems to be part of the package, that's right. I don't know if things are beginning to change or not.

[summerset 5,261]

On 1/18/2023 at 3:00 PM, SpartanMaker said:

Success or failure post-surgery probably has more to do with your ability to follow your team's recommendations than it does with you being restricted by a smaller stomach.

My qualms with this is that the recommendations are different from country to country, even from team to team.

And please don't tell me that everything is "highly personalized". Because at least in the beginning it's usually not. It's a one size needs to fit them all approach, unless you ask for more form the beginning on.

[summerset 5,261]

12 hours ago, SpartanMaker said:

I certainly understand why you'd say that, however I do worry that you and others are beating yourselves up over this concept of "willpower", when self control/willpower isn't actually what separates those that are successful at weight loss and those that aren't successful.

I don't believe in the concept of "willpower" as well. White knuckling something doesn't work long term, doesn't matter if we're talking weight loss/maintenance or something else.

At some point it needs a certain vigilance about portions or food choices - however, I practically don't know a person my age and above who doesn't need that vigilance and it shows. I know quite a few people (usually guys) who started gaining weight in their mid thirties, early forties at the latest so this is not a WLS specific problem. It's a people problem. That much seems to be willpower-related. However, a lot of stuff in our lives is willpower related to a certain point (like getting up early to go to work despite you being tired because you didn't get enough sleep).

Reframing definitely does help. People might not even be aware of the fact that they're reframing but they're doing it anyway.

However, I guess what should be mentioned as well is the fact that patients seem to have very different caloric needs in regards to maintaining their weight and that seems to be at least partly by shear luck and not (only) by copious amounts of exercise.

[SpartanMaker 676]

11 hours ago, summerset said:

My qualms with this is that the recommendations are different from country to country, even from team to team.

And please don't tell me that everything is "highly personalized". Because at least in the beginning it's usually not. It's a one size needs to fit them all approach, unless you ask for more form the beginning on.

Fair point.

I mostly put it that way to keep from going down the rabbit hole regarding whether it's okay to deviate from the plan you were given. Especially since advice given here on this forum (or elsewhere online), may well be even less beneficial than the admittedly sometimes marginal plans many of us received.

I look at it like this: Can you eat off your particular team's plan and still be successful? Absolutely. Can you also be successful if you follow their recommendations closely? Certainly. Unfortunately what is also true is that if you don't know what your doing, or not monitoring closely, you can also get into trouble eating off plan.

Thus my real point is stick to the plan your were given and your odds of success are good. Deviate from that plan and you may or may not be successful depending on your own personal experience and knowledge regarding nutrition and your ability to keep from falling into old bad habits.

Simply put, following the plan you were given is the safe choice.