Is this really better than band?

[sam30204 0]

My mom is really hounding me to do the band instead. Here are her arguments please help me to counter:

#1 says its safer that if anything goes wrong you can just have it removed. (she is worried about leaks and peritonitis)

#2 she says that the sleeve will relax some and maybe stretch some (she watched a youtube video of the surgery and that MD did an xray test on the day of surgery and then 4 yrs later and you could clearly see the stomach was bigger, still small but bigger none the less) so with the sleeve later you are stuck but that if I have the band it can be tightened if you are not losing, basically she is saying that you are stuck with whatever size you end up with after the sleeve but the bands can be adjusted

Help

[erh92 1]

You need to show her all of the problems that can go wrong with the band. I was originally going to get the band, but decided against because off all of the side effects. If you are willing to go through with surgery to lose weight, you are already putting yourself through tons of risks regardless of what type of surgery. You need to tell her this. From the research I did, the band actually had a lot more risks and side effects than the sleeve did, even though the sleeve seems more drastic.

[Maddie 9]

I too had originally planned on getting the band. But, after lots of research, I found it's not so great and definitely not risk free. Plus, if the band was so great, how come so many get revisions from the band to the sleeve?

[educationrulz 18]

Here are a couple arguments to counteract what seem to be perfectly normal concerns on your mom's part:

Some stretching with the sleeve is probably normal and I'm actually hoping that it will occur to a small degree. There are some people who are having difficulty with maintaining after reaching goal - meaning they are continuing to lose weight. Maybe if the stomach stretches a little over time, you will be able to eat enough to STOP the weight loss. This is with the added benefit of NOT having a foreign body strapped around your stomach.

Also, there is a new type of revision surgery that I think would fix excessive stretching of the sleeve. Nobody wants to go into this thinking they'd need a revision of their sleeve, but worst case scenario, the option is there. The surgery is called Stomaphyx and I'm pretty sure it works with the sleeve, but I haven't done a lot of research on this.

You may not be able to convince your mom that this is the best option for you, but you can give her as much info as possible. Ultimately it's your decision so follow your heart.

[citygal 0]

Hi there. I believe you have to totally do your research and decide what is right for you,. I am someone who has had a band to sleeve revision and will only tell you my expeirience. Take is as intended...more data.

Here's somethings that are important to know with the band.

1. You need to be sure your surgeon will provide you with "fills" for your band. I had my surgery done in Mexico in 2007 and when I moved to Philadelphia NO DOCTORS in Philadelphia would do a fill on a band they didn't do the surgery on. So if you move or plan to move...keep that in mind.

2. I had such horrible acid reflux I lost my voice for 6 weeks. I had acid reflux induced laringytis. The damage can become permanent.

3. It was very difficult for me to find a "sweet spot" for my fills. If you band is too loose you will not lose weight and too tight you can't even get down a sip of Water.

4. I had an uncomfortable tightness in my throat the entire time and had severe vomiting after many meals. I can't tell you how many times I had to run to the bathroom in a resturant becuase I was going to throw up suddenly.

Again...please do your homework....there are people who have good luck with the band...I was not one of them. Whatever you decide. I wish you good luck and good health.

[mp8btpc 32]

I actually started my search looking for lap band information and had never heard of the VSG procedure. I came across it while on the lap band talk web site. I started viewing this site and was sold (along with looking up the difference in the procedures). I know too many people with the band and all it's fill issues...the unfill issues, the slipping and eroding that this procedure seems more straight forward and once the initial wounds heal...is a done deal. IMO.

Scares me a little about the cutting through the stomach but with the leak tests etc. I feel it should be a manageable variable.

[lmmore 0]

This is from Tiffykins........she has the best research. Hope this helps.

The first links are other VSG patients that are further out.

Long-term Sleeve Experiences - 2 Years

on January 15, 2010 9:11 pm

Diligence-is-always-required

Stalls-Happen

Update-from-a-2-Year-Post-Op-VSGer

2-year-surgiversary-and-feeling

Two-and-one-half-years-post-op

TWO-YEARS-YALL

Just-Passed-My-2-Year-Surgiversary

questions-for-post-ops-2-years-out-or-more

2-years-out-food-amount-info

anyone-2-years-out

Happy-2-year-anniversary-to-me

2-years-post-op-TODAY

2-5-Years-After-a-VSG

Everday-life-at-2-5-years-out

2-1-2-year-update

Has-it-really-been-2-years

2-1-2-year-update

Two-Year-Surgiversary

2-year-update-portrait-of-a-heavyweight-a-bit-late

Two-year-surgiversary

2-and-1-2-years-later

2-years-since-my-surgery-any-advice-on-face-lift

2-year-post-op-pics

Two-Years-Before-amp-After-Pic

2-year-update-portrait-of-a-heavyweight-a-bit-late

Thought-you-might-enjoy-an-update-with-a-few-pics

Busybusymom-is-back-2-years-post-op

TWO-YEARS-BABY

Any-old-timers-still-lurking-the-boards

Long-term Sleeve Experiences - 3 Years

on June 8, 2009 10:43 pm

Three years out

Three and a half years after Vertical Gastrectomy My Story

A quick 2 year and 3 year VSG update

Third Year Surgiversay

Not always easy but always worth it

Very Discouraged 3 years out

Links for researching the VSG

on March 15, 2009 11:18 pm

Here are some links I've collected when I was researching the sleevehttp://www.asmbs.org/Newsite07/resources/Updated_Position_Statement_on_Sleeve_Gastrectomy.p df. - includes reports of early studies

LapSF Educational presentation to FACS - includes some 2 year results

LapSF Two Year Study

LapSF Five Year Study - abstract only

LapSF Five Year Study - presentation (requires Windows to play)

Literature review on the sleeve - requires $$ to get the full text unfortunately (Totally worth the money)

Sleeve best for over 50 crowd

Video of a sleeve with lots of education discussion

Video of a sleeve that is more about the operation

Ghrelin levels after RnY and sleeve

Ghrelin levels after band and sleeve

Diabetes resolution in RnY vs. Sleeve

Comparison of band to sleeve - literature review

I used this website a lot. I paid for some of the full articles that grabbed my attention based on the abstracts. There are several articles that you can comb through that interest you. Once you read an abstract, on the right hand side of the page, there are other related articles listed that you may find interesting.

SpringerLink - All Content Items

SSAT - SSAT 2008 Annual Meeting Abstracts - Laparoscopic Vertical Sleeve Gastrectomy for Morbid Obesity: a Report of a Five-Year Experience with 750 Patients</b>

Laparoscopic Sleeve Gastrectomy (LSG) In Morbid Obesity: Review

https://www.highbeam.com/reg/reg1.as....html&full=yes

This was recommended to me for post-op options for meals, and just a guide.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0061242853?ie=UTF8&tag=mybiglife-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=0061242853]Amazon.com: Before & After, Revised Edition: Living and Eating Well After Weight-Loss Surgery (9780061242854): Susan Maria Leach: Books[/ame]

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0061242853/][/ame] [ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0061242853/]Amazon.com: Before & After, Revised Edition: Living and Eating Well After Weight-Loss Surgery (9780061242854): Susan Maria Leach: Books[/ame]

This one is cool because it shows a significant decrease in ghrelin with VSG patients vs. RNY patients.

Weight loss, appetite suppression, and changes in ... [Ann Surg. 2008] - PubMed result

Abstract on diabetes/glucose/insulin regulation with VSG vs. RNY stating that at 3 months out with the patients studied, RNY and VSG had no marked difference in improved lab results with their glucose showing that rerouting is not always necessary for resolution of this particula co-morbidity.

Improvement in glucose metabolism after bariatric ... [Ann Surg. 2009] - PubMed result

Laparoscopic sleeve gastrectomy: an innovative new tool in the battle against the obesity epidemic in Canada

Edit to add: If my insurance would not have come through with my revision, I would have traveled to Mexico, and my choice in surgeon was also Dr. Aceves as a revision surgeon. There are a lot of really great surgeons in Mexico and the U.S. it really all depends on your comfort level, and what you want and need from a program.

[goodlife 3]

It looks like you've been given tons of good information so I'll only add that you couldn't PAY me enough money to have the band. NO WAY NO HOW!

I'd rather have stayed fat than to subject myself to that thing.

[sam30204 0]

Wow thanks guys!! I knew I could count on you!! Excellent info:) Will let you know how it goes!!

[jrosewell100 0]

I had the sleeve done because it has the least risk of the three surgeries in my opinion. The band can cause skin erosion and ulcers. Having a second surgery to remove it is risky as well. Weight loss is slow. I know others who have been very dissatified with the band and have had it removed and the sleeve done after all. The band requires a lot of trips to the doctors office for fills and maybe even unfills. Getting poked in the belly each time you need a fill is a risk for infection. It is a foreign object in your body. No way to know how your body will react to that as well. Just the time it takes out of your life. I don't know about you, but I work at keeping as many minutes of my personal time as possible for the fun stuff. My surgery was done by Dr. Nick Nicholson here in Dallas. He is the best. He teachs other doc's to do this surgery. I don't know how old you are. I am assuming over 18. Mom has no say in what you have done. You get to make that decision. She is worried, I get that. I have six kids of my own. Sometimes you just have to step away and respect the child's (your an adult) decision. Good Luck:thumbup:

[Tiffykins 672]

I've shared my band nightmare so I won't repeat it here. I'll stick with the 2 issues your mom is wondering.

1) She's right, if something does go wrong with the band, you can have it removed. But, what about any damage it may cause while it's in there? The risks of the band causing permanent damage are on the rise. Just because the band can be removed doesn't mean that the damage it may cause is reversible. The damage that was done to my stomach was not reversible. I lost stomach tissue because of it, and was chronic, daily pain until I got it out of my body. The scar tissue and adhesions alone caused major issues not only around my stomach, but in my abdominal cavity with the port and tubing.

2) Those pictures she viewed are very telling. But, the day of surgery, after dissecting and excising a major organ, there is going to be extreme swelling. It takes several weeks to months sometimes for the sleeve to relax especially after sometimes 6 weeks on a liquid-full liquid diet between the pre/post diets. It takes several weeks for the stomach to even relax enough to be able to eat dense Protein. So, within 4 years, the stomach has obviously relaxed and has been accustomed to the patient eating. I can obviously eat a lot more today than I could at even 3-4 months out. But, I still have amazing restriction. The stomach tissue that is left (as long as your surgeon fully dissects the entire fundus) is the muscular portion of the stomach. The best way I've heard it described is comparing it to a man's leather wallet. When you first buy the wallet, it's thin, and not used to carrying all the money, credit cards, id cards etc. After a few months, the wallet does give a little to the items in there. But, at some point, there is no more "give" for even another credit card, and we have to trash all the receipts and crap that takes up room. I know that seems stupid, but for me, it gave me a visual because that's how my husband leather wallet is right now. He couldn't fit another receipt in there if he needed to do so. My surgeon told me that my sleeve was probably at maximum capacity at this point. I can eat more today, and have learned little tricks that allow me to eat more so I can maintain my current weight. If I stick to the "sleeve losing rules" I easily lose weight.

I've had both the band, and now the sleeve. I can tell you that my quality of life with the sleeve is exponentially better than my life with the band. Here are the most recent information released by the lapband manufacturer. The highlighted portions are the ones that are the main points.

http://www.lapband.com/en/learn_about_lapband/safety_informa tion/

Patients can experience complications after surgery. Most complications are not serious but some may require hospitalization and/or re-operation. In the United States clinical study, with 3-year follow-up reported, 88% of the 299 patients had one or more adverse events, ranging from mild, moderate, to severe. Nausea and vomiting (51%), gastroesophageal reflux (regurgitation) (34%), band slippage/pouch dilatation (24%) and stoma obstruction (stomach-band outlet blockage) (14%) were the most common post-operative complications. In the study, 25% of the patients had their band systems removed, two-thirds of which were following adverse events. Esophageal dilatation or dysmotility (poor esophageal function) occurred in 11% of patients, the long-term effects of which are currently unknown. Constipation, diarrhea and dysphagia (difficulty swallowing) occurred in 9% of the patients. In 9% of the patients, a second surgery was needed to fix a problem with the band or initial surgery. In 9% of the patients, there was an additional procedure to fix a leaking or twisted access port. The access port design has been improved. Four out of 299 patients (1.3%) had their bands erode into their stomachs. These bands needed to be removed in a second operation. Surgical techniques have evolved to reduce slippage. Surgeons with more laparoscopic experience and more experience with these procedures report fewer complications.

Adverse events that were considered to be non-serious, and which occurred in less than 1% of the patients, included: esophagitis (inflammation of the esophagus), gastritis (inflammation of the stomach), hiatal hernia (some stomach above the diaphragm), pancreatitis (inflammation of the pancreas), abdominal pain, hernia, incisional hernia, infection, redundant skin, dehydration, diarrhea (frequent semi-solid bowel movements), abnormal stools, constipation, flatulence (gas), dyspepsia (upset stomach), eructation (belching), cardiospasm (an obstruction of passage of food through the bottom of the esophagus), hematemsis (vomiting of blood), asthenia (fatigue), fever, chest pain, incision pain, contact dermatitis (rash), abnormal healing, edema (swelling), paresthesia (abnormal sensation of burning, prickly, or tingling), dysmenorrhea (difficult periods), hypochromic anemia (low oxygen carrying part of blood), band system leak, cholecystitis (gall stones), esophageal ulcer (sore), port displacement, port site pain, spleen injury, and wound infection. Be sure to ask your surgeon about these possible complications and any of these medical terms that you dont understand.

Back to Top What are the specific risks and possible complications?

Talk to your doctor about all of the following risks and complications:

• Ulceration
  
• Gastritis (irritated stomach tissue)
  
• Gastroesophageal reflux (regurgitation)
  
• Heartburn
  
• Gas bloat
  
• Dysphagia (difficulty swallowing)
  
• Dehydration
  
• Constipation
  
• Weight regain
  
• Death
  

Laparoscopic surgery has its own set of possible problems. They include:

• Spleen or liver damage (sometimes requiring spleen removal)
  
• Damage to major blood vessels
  
• Lung problems
  
• Thrombosis (blood clots)
  
• Rupture of the wound
  
• Perforation of the stomach or esophagus during surgery
  

Laparoscopic surgery is not always possible. The surgeon may need to switch to an "open" method due to some of the reasons mentioned here. This happened in about 5% of the cases in the U.S. Clinical Study.

There are also problems that can occur that are directly related to the LAP-BAND? System:

• The band can spontaneously deflate because of leakage. That leakage can come from the band, the reservoir, or the tubing that connects them.
  
• The band can slip
  
• There can be stomach slippage
  
• The stomach pouch can enlarge
  
• The stoma (stomach outlet) can be blocked
  
• The band can erode into the stomach
  

Obstruction of the stomach can be caused by:

• Food
  
• Swelling
  
• Improper placement of the band
  
• The band being over-inflated
  
• Band or stomach slippage
  
• Stomach pouch twisting
  
• Stomach pouch enlargement
  

There have been some reports that the esophagus has stretched or dilated in some patients. This could be caused by:

• Improper placement of the band
  
• The band being tightened too much
  
• Stoma obstruction
  
• Binge eating
  
• Excessive vomiting
  

Patients with a weaker esophagus may be more likely to have this problem. A weaker esophagus is one that is not good at pushing food through to your stomach. Tell your surgeon if you have difficulty swallowing. Then your surgeon can evaluate this.

Weight loss with the LAP-BAND? System is typically slower and more gradual than with some other weight loss surgeries. Tightening the band too fast or too much to try to speed up weight loss should be avoided. The stomach pouch and/or esophagus can become enlarged as a result. You need to learn how to use your band as a tool that can help you reduce the amount you eat.

Infection is possible. Also, the band can erode into the stomach. This can happen right after surgery or years later, although this rarely happens.

Complications can cause reduced weight loss. They can also cause weight gain. Other complications can result that require more surgery to remove, reposition, or replace the band.

Some patients have more nausea and vomiting than others. You should see your physician at once if vomiting persists.

Rapid weight loss may lead to symptoms of:

• Malnutrition
  
• Anemia
  
• Related complications
  

It is possible you may not lose much weight or any weight at all. You could also have complications related to obesity.

If any complications occur, you may need to stay in the hospital longer. You may also need to return to the hospital later. A number of less serious complications can also occur. These may have little effect on how long it takes you to recover from surgery.

If you have existing problems, such as diabetes, a large hiatal hernia (part of the stomach in the chest cavity), Barretts esophagus (severe, chronic inflammation of the lower esophagus), or emotional or psychological problems, you may have more complications. Your surgeon will consider how bad your symptoms are, and if you are a good candidate for the LAP-BAND? System surgery. You also have more risk of complications if you've had a surgery before in the same area. If the procedure is not done laparoscopically by an experienced surgeon, you may have more risk of complications.

Anti-inflammatory drugs that may irritate the stomach, such as aspirin and NSAIDs, should be used with caution.

Some people need folate and Vitamin B12 supplements to maintain normal homocycteine levels. Elevated homocycteine levels can increase risks to your heart and the risk of spinal birth defects.

You can develop gallstones after a rapid weight loss. This can make it necessary to remove your gallbladder.

There have been no reports of autoimmune disease with the use of the LAP-BAND? System. Autoimmune diseases and connective tissue disorders, though, have been reported after long-term implantation of other silicone devices. These problems can include systemic lupus erythematosus and scleroderma. At this time, there is no conclusive clinical evidence that supports a relationship between connective-tissue disorders and silicone implants. Long-term studies to further evaluate this possibility are still being done. You should know, though, that if autoimmune symptoms develop after the band is in place, you may need treatment. The band may also need to be removed. Talk with your surgeon about this possibility. Also, if you have symptoms of autoimmune disease now, the LAP-BAND? System may not be right for you.

Back to Top Removing the LAP-BAND? System

If the LAP-BAND? System has been placed laparoscopically, it may be possible to remove it the same way. This is an advantage of the LAP-BAND? System. However, an "open" procedure may be necessary to remove a band. In the U.S. Clinical Study, 60% of the bands that were removed were done laparoscopically. Surgeons report that after the band is removed, the stomach returns to essentially a normal state.

At this time, there are no known reasons to suggest that the band should be replaced or removed at some point unless a complication occurs or you do not lose weight. It is difficult, though, to say whether the band will stay in place for the rest of your life. It may need to be removed or replaced at some point. Removing the device requires a surgical procedure. That procedure will have all the related risks and possible complications that come with surgery. The risk of some complications, such as erosions and infection, increase with any added procedure.

[sam30204 0]

Thank again guys!

I guess her "points" were getting inside my head making me rethink myself.

I have this HUGE fear I will be the ONE person that this surgery doesn't work for. I fear I will lose 30lbs and that will be it and I will struggle to keep it off like so many times before. Thanks for everyone's help

[pnw218 14]

Thank again guys!

I guess her "points" were getting inside my head making me rethink myself.

I have this HUGE fear I will be the ONE person that this surgery doesn't work for. I fear I will lose 30lbs and that will be it and I will struggle to keep it off like so many times before. Thanks for everyone's help

note to self: while in Dothan, kidnapp Sam and put her on the plane a few days early with a note to her dr: sleeve only, no lapband! lol

I am also one of those who intended to do the band, primarily because it "was reversible". I do have my doubts about that now. I had even scheduled my surgery as the band, and then switched to the sleeve a few days later - thank goodness!!

Our area is inundated with band commercials right now (or maybe I am just now noticing them??). I haven't seen a single one for the sleeve. I am working on an article that I will try to get published ..... the only thing that is holding me back is going "public". I don't mind it on a one on one basis and freely tell those I come in contact with. Just not sure I want the entire Puget Sound area to know! LOL And not so sure it would get published if I don't use my name.

Seriously Sam, I understand wanting your familys' blessing, but in the end, it is your decision. You are trained in the medical field so have alot of knowledge and experience that others should respect : )

[sam30204 0]

Yes do kidnap me, I may need it.

Cant wait to see you! Thanks for your post!

note to self: while in Dothan, kidnapp Sam and put her on the plane a few days early with a note to her dr: sleeve only, no lapband! lol

I am also one of those who intended to do the band, primarily because it "was reversible". I do have my doubts about that now. I had even scheduled my surgery as the band, and then switched to the sleeve a few days later - thank goodness!!

Our area is inundated with band commercials right now (or maybe I am just now noticing them??). I haven't seen a single one for the sleeve. I am working on an article that I will try to get published ..... the only thing that is holding me back is going "public". I don't mind it on a one on one basis and freely tell those I come in contact with. Just not sure I want the entire Puget Sound area to know! LOL And not so sure it would get published if I don't use my name.

Seriously Sam, I understand wanting your familys' blessing, but in the end, it is your decision. You are trained in the medical field so have alot of knowledge and experience that others should respect : )

[pnw218 14]

you got it girl!

I could always bring you out to the PNW for a few days and then send you south for surgery! I do have an extra room! : )