Are We ready for a Black President?

[Shamrockgirl60 1]

My husband and I are retired, after working 30 years and more on our careers. We give to charities and help when we have the extra money. We pay our fair share of taxes. There may be some poor who use the system, but the majority of the poor I have met hate being poor and don't' want handouts. I abhor anyone rich or poor who tries to beat the system. I have no contempt for hard working people I am one of them. But I know that I have been lucky to have a good job over the years and a good income, not rich by any means.

I said it's a tax write off for the wealthy among us, not the middle class. Or are you very wealthy? If you are and you do what you say your an exception.

I see a lot of people here who have to go into debt to pay for their surgeries I think that is horrible. I am lucky to have good insurance, and my husband and I pay a lot for it. No vacations for us, the money goes to our health right now. We are too young for medicare.

You have a right to your opinion and even though I don't agree with it. It's your right. I have a right to mine.

We agree to disagree on this.

Too many people have been bamboozled by the right, while they laugh at us "common folks"

[laurigee 545]

I guess some are bamboozaled by the right and some bamboozaled by the left. I guess it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. The world is what it is and all we can do is our best to have a clear consience when we put our head on the pillow at night. God bless

[Melolo 0]

My husband and I are retired, after working 30 years and more on our careers. We give to charities and help when we have the extra money. We pay our fair share of taxes. There may be some poor who use the system, but the majority of the poor I have met hate being poor and don't' want handouts. I abhor anyone rich or poor who tries to beat the system. I have no contempt for hard working people I am one of them. But I know that I have been lucky to have a good job over the years and a good income, not rich by any means.

I said it's a tax write off for the wealthy among us, not the middle class. Or are you very wealthy? If you are and you do what you say your an exception.

I see a lot of people here who have to go into debt to pay for their surgeries I think that is horrible. I am lucky to have good insurance, and my husband and I pay a lot for it. No vacations for us, the money goes to our health right now. We are too young for medicare.

You have a right to your opinion and even though I don't agree with it. It's your right. I have a right to mine.

We agree to disagree on this.

Too many people have been bamboozled by the right, while they laugh at us "common folks"

Now I do agree with you on going into debt to pay for surgeries... I'm a hard worker but I'm also a twice cancer survivor. And if it wasn't for the support of family and my now husband I probably would have lost my house. I found out I had cancer for the second time three weeks after moving into my house. GOD is truly good. I was one of the fortunate people to be able to work while going through chemo treatments bald and all. It was tough and of course I wasn't prepared financially. I didn't receive any financial aid either.

Rich and poor abuse the system and I hope that President elect Obama can find away to stop such abuse.

[TheWatcher 1]

I can honestly say that I could care less what race Obama is. I truly do care that he is instilling the wrong message to our young children. If you succeed in this world it is your job to take care of others that may choose not to work at all. And if you have never paid into taxes a day in your life, we will reward you by giving you more money. If to succeed you work 12 hours a day you should give your money to those who choose to work 8 or less hours a day or not at all. No matter what I make it should be mine to choose what I do with it. Does the government have a right to give it to someone else? What have those of you who believe in REDISTRIBUTING THE WEALTH done to earn a portion of my paycheck? I realize that free money sounds good to everyone, but those of us that have sacrafised many things to get to where we are today may be a little upset or synical. Remember, without big business having an incentive to stay in the United State (highest tax) , that no one has jobs. We need to give big businesses tax breaks. Why should they stay here and not go to China. They don't owe you a living. But in Todays America to many people think they do.

well since you make so much money you don’t need the tax breaks that bush gave you.... that’s the way i see it....i wish i made money like you so i could pay more too.... one day i hope to makes so much money i can be worried about Obama’s tax plan too.... i can be just as selfish as the top 10% or Americans like you.:rolleyes2:

[TheWatcher 1]

What is a fair share? Do the middle class not care about taking care of the sick and poor that are dying? No matter what your income you should be christian. I would love to be nieve enough to think that all the money goes to those who are deserving and needy. But the truth of it is as many loopholes that the rich find the poor find as many to receive money dishonestly. Not very christian. Trust me you do not pay the majority of taxes. There are those of us that are honest and work hard for 12+ hours a day and deserve what we have. It seems that you may have some contempt for people who have worked hard and earned their success. I give to local schools, police, cancer society(am a cancer survivor), hopital, ect. And also volunteer my time(what little is left) and am insulted that you would say that is mainly for a tax write off. How christian of you!

Wow your wealth must be mind boggling... its finny how you are arguing this somuch it makes me wonder are you like Joe the plumber:

Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com

watch that i think its interesting

[green 6]

But big business does have an incentive to stay within America and to employ its fellow citizens. If Americans are not working then they will not have the money to buy the products that big business produces.

[luluc 6]

What is a fair share? Do the middle class not care about taking care of the sick and poor that are dying? No matter what your income you should be christian. I would love to be nieve enough to think that all the money goes to those who are deserving and needy. But the truth of it is as many loopholes that the rich find the poor find as many to receive money dishonestly. Not very christian. Trust me you do not pay the majority of taxes. There are those of us that are honest and work hard for 12+ hours a day and deserve what we have. It seems that you may have some contempt for people who have worked hard and earned their success. I give to local schools, police, cancer society(am a cancer survivor), hopital, ect. And also volunteer my time(what little is left) and am insulted that you would say that is mainly for a tax write off. How christian of you!

i'm not going to pick apart your post entirely - i copied it to make certain references .... so there is no picking going on.

No matter what your income you should be christian - but i'm half jewish, - i really can't stand the religious angle when it comes to how politics/taxes/female judicial rights/GLBT rights are to be handled.

back in this thread, i was told that my contributions should be considered charity. i'm fortunated enough, in these times to have retired at a very early in age & not feel the crunch that others have. i don't sleep well, knowing if i can help - i should....i can have all the money in the world; but if my girlfriends who are struggling; cant' do or enjoy the things i do, are embarrassed i picked up the lunch tab again ... i just can't feel good about that. i grew up with the philosophy that those who have should give. i get many don't share that same thinking - my mom used to carry loose change in her pocket as we hit the streets of NYC as a kid. always passing out.

the reason i REPEAT this story; is because it's been the GOP and churches that constantly suggest those to do their part....if we "some" who can don't .., who the Heck does??

i can't take it w/me; i have no problem paying more taxes. none at all....DH calls it my jewish guilt built in..., i call it doing whats right. i realize not a popular opinion.

[green 6]

i'm not going to pick apart your post entirely - i copied it to make certain references .... so there is no picking going on.

No matter what your income you should be christian - but i'm half jewish, - i really can't stand the religious angle when it comes to how politics/taxes/female judicial rights/GLBT rights are to be handled.

back in this thread, i was told that my contributions should be considered charity. i'm fortunated enough, in these times to have retired at a very early in age & not feel the crunch that others have. i don't sleep well, knowing if i can help - i should....i can have all the money in the world; but if my girlfriends who are struggling; cant' do or enjoy the things i do, are embarrassed i picked up the lunch tab again ... i just can't feel good about that. i grew up with the philosophy that those who have should give. i get many don't share that same thinking - my mom used to carry loose change in her pocket as we hit the streets of NYC as a kid. always passing out.

the reason i REPEAT this story; is because it's been the GOP and churches that constantly suggest those to do their part....if we "some" who can don't .., who the Heck does??

i can't take it w/me; i have no problem paying more taxes. none at all....DH calls it my jewish guilt built in..., i call it doing whats right. i realize not a popular opinion.

Hey, Luluc, I am one half Jewish, too. Although my family were and are atheists we were raised to have a strong sense of civic commitment. This means that those who have should help out those who are in need. Unlike many of you, I really don't believe that those who are in need are all a pack of scammers. Some may be but you will find scam artists and cheapskates amongst all levels of society from the richest to the poorest.

I would rather contribute to the health of my fellow citizens by paying taxes than through giving voluntarily to charities though I do both. Charities will apply emotional judgements as to who will receive their help and those who are in need are forced to go cap in hand in order to beg for a hand-out or a hand-up. The government source of aid is much more neutral and thus much less humiliating for the recipient. If I were in need I would rather depend on the government than on private charity.

Also, not all of those who can afford to be generous are. I have heard it said by waiters, etc that some of their wealthy clients are real cheapskates when it comes to tipping. A fair taxation system is the one way of ensuring that everyone contributes.

I would also remind you that much of your tax money goes towards many other things.

[TheWatcher 1]

Hey, Luluc, I am one half Jewish, too. Although my family were and are atheists we were raised to have a strong sense of civic commitment. This means that those who have should help out those who are in need. Unlike many of you, I really don't believe that those who are in need are all a pack of scammers. Some may be but you will find scam artists and cheapskates amongst all levels of society from the richest to the poorest.

I would rather contribute to the health of my fellow citizens by paying taxes than through giving voluntarily to charities though I do both. Charities will apply emotional judgements as to who will receive their help and those who are in need are forced to go cap in hand in order to beg for a hand-out or a hand-up. The government source of aid is much more neutral and thus much less humiliating for the recipient. If I were in need I would rather depend on the government than on private charity.

Also, not all of those who can afford to be generous are. I have heard it said by waiters, etc that some of their wealthy clients are real cheapskates when it comes to tipping. A fair taxation system is the one way of ensuring that everyone contributes.

I would also remind you that much of your tax money goes towards many other things.

i think you nailed it ... why couldn't i say that??:rolleyes2:

[plain 12]

But big business does have an incentive to stay within America and to employ its fellow citizens. If Americans are not working then they will not have the money to buy the products that big business produces.

Well, that's a bit fallacious, Green. Big business doesn't care WHO buys their product, as long as it's being bought. If the price of doing business is too high in America, companies will relocate to, say for the sake of arguement, Mexico, or India (where they will increase the profit margin tenfold....because of the downgraded workers' wages). Most really big businesses market globally anyway. A good example of this is big tobacco.

[KyBandChick 3]

Well, that's a bit fallacious, Green. Big business doesn't care WHO buys their product, as long as it's being bought. If the price of doing business is too high in America, companies will relocate to, say for the sake of arguement, Mexico, or India (where they will increase the profit margin tenfold....because of the downgraded workers' wages). Most really big businesses market globally anyway. A good example of this is big tobacco.

Big buisness cares about 1 thing..stock price, as this drives everything else. Business will do whatever to drive value for their sharehold and so that they can always hit earnings targets. Wisely businesses who can go global do and build a very diverse portfolio. This way when times are tough in the US you can still make money with your foreign operations.

While many complain that our new president is going to raise taxes which will hurt big buisness stop and think how little big business really pays in taxes. While their tax rate may be 35%, I guarantee (assuming they have sharp tax professionals) they only pay in the low 20s to teens (so less than me personally). I work in international finance for a large global company and have sat in on many tax presentations on how you can significantly drive down your tax rates. Have you ever heard of the game six degrees of Kevin Bacon? Companies do the same thing with money, they shift earnings all over the world between low and high tax countries and finally end up back in the US. Companies also don't have to pay US tax on cash until they bring those earnings into the US so you are making $$ in China you keep your money in a tax free country like Bahrain and bring it in slowly when the time is good or better yet wait until times like now when Congress may grant a tax holiday on foreign cash brought in to the US. It's a very complex process but very impressive. Taxes are a game and if you are good you save your company millions. Bottom line big business will be just fine.

[plain 12]

Big buisness cares about 1 thing..stock price, as this drives everything else. Business will do whatever to drive value for their sharehold and so that they can always hit earnings targets. Wisely businesses who can go global do and build a very diverse portfolio. This way when times are tough in the US you can still make money with your foreign operations.

While many complain that our new president is going to raise taxes which will hurt big buisness stop and think how little big business really pays in taxes. While their tax rate may be 35%, I guarantee (assuming they have sharp tax professionals) they only pay in the low 20s to teens (so less than me personally). I work in international finance for a large global company and have sat in on many tax presentations on how you can significantly drive down your tax rates. Have you ever heard of the game six degrees of Kevin Bacon? Companies do the same thing with money, they shift earnings all over the world between low and high tax countries and finally end up back in the US. Companies also don't have to pay US tax on cash until they bring those earnings into the US so you are making $$ in China you keep your money in a tax free country like Bahrain and bring it in slowly when the time is good or better yet wait until times like now when Congress may grant a tax holiday on foreign cash brought in to the US. It's a very complex process but very impressive. Taxes are a game and if you are good you save your company millions. Bottom line big business will be just fine.

Yeah, it's not big business that will suffer from increased tax. They'll just pass that cost along to the consumer. It's smaller businesses that might get hit pretty hard by a tax increase.

[laurigee 545]

well since you make so much money you don’t need the tax breaks that bush gave you.... that’s the way i see it....i wish i made money like you so i could pay more too.... one day i hope to makes so much money i can be worried about Obama’s tax plan too.... i can be just as selfish as the top 10% or Americans like you.:thumbup:

You are a very, very sour person. I will attribute it to maybe your age or maybe YOUR LACK of security in the world we live and your uncertainty that you will never be able to achieve what the 10% of Americans have achieved. You have the same opportunities. It's strange how no one mentions that 40% of the 95% of the people have no tax liability after they take deductions and tax credits. Do you get a check back at the end of the year? I suggest all of you return it this year and let Mr. Obama send it to someone more deserving than yourself. We all obviously are doing well enough to have lap band surgery or pay the insurance premiums to have health insurance pay for it. And well enough to have computers to debate this issue.

luluc: If you would have read the earlier posts I am not the one who was playing the christian card. I was called unchristian because I don't have the same opinion as others. I was being sarcastic to the poster who used that card.

Opinions are different and that's what makes up this country we live in. It seems like the new prejudice in this country may be against the 10% of Americans that have been lucky enough to take advantage of what the U.S. has to offer.

[rodriguezequal 3]

We all obviously are doing well enough to have lap band surgery or pay the insurance premiums to have health insurance pay for it. And well enough to have computers to debate this issue.

quote]

My insuarance is free through my husband's work...(he's Army) and I got my LapTop for free through the technical college my parents sent me to when I was 18...lol I did self pay though...makin payments through CareCredit... :thumbup: Just wanted to share that...I'm not sure why though lmao

[luluc 6]

i understand - i copied your post, but didn't mean to attritibute mine 100% to it. the religious issue is out of hand here in these discussions. i apologize if you felt i was speaking directly to you.

lulu