Can real muscle growth be achieved when on a post-op 650 calorie diet? I am just over three months post-op, have lost 74 lbs, 94 lbs total. I do strength training with a trainer three times a week and cardio five times a week. Because my target weight loss was 225 lbs, I am still on a diet of 600-650 calories, 100-125 grams of protein,15-20 grams of carbs and 15-20 grams of fat per day. During my weight loss, I have lost over 17 total inches but almost 40% of that is muscle loss. I am prone to stalls that last for two weeks. I work out extremely hard but am completely frustrated that I have no muscle growth to show for it. Any thoughts or suggestions are most welcome.

Can you recommend how to lift while in this state? I'm a sleeve vet but after some recent autoimmune issues/illness and a procedure, I have to be on a very gentle very light diet for awhile, basically returning me to post-op eating. That, plus what with everything I haven't been to the gym in 2 months, what regimen do you recommend? I have access to free weights and a few basic machines.

"Globe"......I would recommend sticking to the compound lifts such as shoulder press, dumbbell bench press, squats, pull ups, dips, T-bar rows and even some light deadlifts if your back is in good shape. These compound lifts are really all you need to do to help retain the muscle (along with your protein). Make sure you get your form/technique down with light weights before doing heavier weights. The isolation lifts, for me anyway, are more for muscle building mode (along with the compound lifts) when you are at maintenance calories or slightly higher. How many days do you think you can lift a week? You can probably get by with just twice a week (say a Monday and a Thursday for example), if you are fairly thorough during your lifting session.

I wish you the best in regards to your autoimmune issues and a speedy recovery!

Keep this coming...I'm taking notes. I have yet to start at the gym. I know I should at 6weeks out. But I've been debating on joining the standard gym..circuits, etc. or joining an impact fitness gym that relies more on total body muscle challenge and switching up the routine routinely with a trainer. Love this discussion!

It sound like you have a couple of good alternatives there. I think the most important thing is choosing something that will keep you motivated, and working out on a regular basis.

You need a program that will both accommodate your unique needs due to the surgery, and at the same time push you to do your very best. The most important thing is to avoid injury. Since you haven't been working out, this means that at first you will do more reps at a lower weight than you will do later on. If you work with a trainer and they aren't willing to recognize that you've had the surgery and that your caloric intake is severely limited, you need to find another trainer.

The next most important thing is to be in a program that you can stick with. You need something that motivates you to keep with it month after month and year after year. For me personally, I enjoy going to a gym and working out the way I want to, when I want to, at the pace I want to, etc. I've been doing this for over 20 years. Other people need the motivation of classes or the guidance of a trainer. Whichever of those works for you is fine, as long as it keeps you going to the gym.

What do you all think is better...lower weights and more reps or higher weight with less reps, or is it a wash? Or does it depend on the type of results you are looking for?

What do you all think is better...lower weights and more reps or higher weight with less reps, or is it a wash? Or does it depend on the type of results you are looking for?

Depends on your goals or what you want from lifting and the type of lift. I know, can't always get a straight answer out of me Shiela.

Depends on your goals or what you want from lifting and the type of lift. I know, can't always get a straight answer out of me Shiela.

Well, as you know Mark my goal is to not be a slacker... hahaha! I guess my gut (no pun intended...) tells me to do the heavier weight and even if I can't do the required amount of reps, to keep doing as many as I can to push myself harder. I just want a strong fit body, no illusions of being a bodybuilder.

Well, as you know Mark my goal is to not be a slacker... hahaha! I guess my gut (no pun intended...) tells me to do the heavier weight and even if I can't do the required amount of reps, to keep doing as many as I can to push myself harder. I just want a strong fit body, no illusions of being a bodybuilder.

You're definitely not a slacker! Lifting goals of mine.....

#1 - The lifting high/de-stressing I get

#2 - Strength, moving heavy stuff

#3 - Physique, or at least not puny looking

#4 - Gets me out of the #%!$# office

So for your strength goal, I would recommend a rep range of 4-8 reps each set....depending on the lift. That's the approach I generally take at the gym. Now if you do something like a set of deadlifts, power cleans, etc, I would stay 2-4 reps a set since that's a full body lift.

What do you all think is better...lower weights and more reps or higher weight with less reps, or is it a wash? Or does it depend on the type of results you are looking for?

There are many different viewpoints on an optimal workout. Here's mine:

When you are first starting out you want to do less weight and more reps. This minimizes the risk of injury. After you have been working out for a couple of months you want to transition to more weight and fewer reps and be working any exercise to failure. Let's take a bicep curl as an example.

Let's suppose that you might start out with a 5 or 10 pound dumbbell and do maybe 20 or 25 reps. And you do that for a week, then you maybe go up to the next larger size dumbbell. Let's say 15 pounds, and let's say that you can do 15 reps on it. Do that weight for a week or two and once you can get up to 20 reps, then go to the next weight, say 20 pounds. Let's say that you can only do 12 reps with it. Work out with that weight for a week or two, and let's say that you can now do 18 reps with it. Now you've been working out for 6 weeks. Take the next weight up, which would be 25 pounds and see how many reps you can do with it. For simplicity, let's say you can do 10 reps with it. Continue to work out with that weight until you can do 12 reps with it. At that point you go up to the next weight, and repeat this over and over. If you can't do at least 8 reps then go to the next lower weight.

If you ever miss working out for more than about 10 days you need to drop down to the previous weight for a few sessions before going back up and using the 8 to 12 rep rule.

After the first 6 weeks of so, you want to be working every exercise to "failure." That means that you do as many reps as you can until you can't do even one more. A partial rep is OK for the last rep, but just don't count it. In these exercises, most of the benefit comes from the last one or two reps. In other words, if you can do 12 reps, the 1st 10 reps don't really do much to help you build muscle. All they do is properly fatigue the muscle. Most of the benefits come from the last 2 reps. That's why it's important to get every rep that you can. But you can't do that when you first start out because the risk of injury is too high. You have to work your way up.

So the way that I describe this is to do 8 to 12 reps to failure. If you can't do 8 reps then you are using too much weight, and if you can do more than 12 reps you need to use more weight. Aroundhky advises between 4 and 8 reps. This is a perfectly valid strategy and is used by many bodybuilders to maximize muscle gain, but I think for people who are going to be more casually working out (3 - 5 hours of resistance training per week) the best benefit will come from 8 to 12 reps, plus I think it has a lower risk of injury. If you do decide to go with 4 - 8 reps then I recommend that you take 3 or 4 months to work up to that.

There's all sorts of things to consider about varying your workouts, using freeweights vs. machines, how often you work out each muscle group, etc.

Edited October 9, 201312 yr by ItsMe2033

Where are you from gamer girl?

This was very helpful Jane. I too think HIIT will be the way I want to go. It's the most efficient for weight loss and for conditioning from what I can tell. I think as I get thinner and fitter, my desire for more will ramp up automatically and it will happen as long as I stay focused on it.

I'd love to learn belly dancing! Need to look on YouTube for it. Funny for me to see it in this country because the women who dare to bare their stomachs here are so skinny! For us, stomachs are not sexual, legs are. Here, people wear shorts without thinking about it. First time I saw a skinny chick belly dancing in this country I about died laughing at cultural differences. Where I'm from, a woman has to have some meat on her bones before she starts up with all that! I think I satisfy the meat on bones criteria anyway

You have amazing muscles in your arms and back. That's what I want too!

I have tried it all,,, nothing gave me results like cross fit/bootcamp style. No heavy weights just lots of pushups, burpees, lunges, etc etc. and perhaps light to mid free weights. Of course nothing like trying to heft your own weight around,,,haha,,,, youd be amazed at how hard that can be!

What do you all think is better...lower weights and more reps or higher weight with less reps, or is it a wash? Or does it depend on the type of results you are looking for?

Where are you from gamer girl?

I was born in India. Moved here when I was 20 so have lived here longer than there really so not sure where I'm really from

I asked myself this question. I've lost a total of 80lbs..230 to 150, which is my goal weight. And I'm still loosing a pound here and there. When I had the sleeve done, I was 200lbs and I didn't exercise during this 2nd time around because I didn't want to lose weight too fast. Now, I'm flabby. I've alway been solid, I look smaller than I actually weigh. I've lost a lot of muscle. My butt is sagging, my thighs have more cellulite than I did before surgery..kinda depressing.

I doubt I'm getting in the recommended protein intake. I'm 9 mos post-op and still don't eat much..

I guess I'll get some muscles back one day :/

What are compound lifts?

What are compound lifts?

There are two types of lifts. Isolation lifts involve only one joint, and are designed to mostly work one muscle group. The classic example of this would be a bicep curl, which not surprisingly works primarily the biceps. When you do a bicep curl, you are only moving at the elbow, so this is considered an isolation lift.

The other type of lift is a compound lift. In that case you are working multiple muscles and more than one joint is moving. For example, bench presses are a compound lift because they stress the chest (pectorals), shoulders (front deltoids) and upper arms (triceps).

Some people do mostly compound lifts, some people do mostly isolation lifts, and some people do a combination of both. Generally speaking, if you are going to do compound lifts, you should have at least a few sessions with a trainer to make sure that you learn the proper form for these exercises.

Sorry "Globe".....I should've elaborated some. Yeah.....what "ItsMe" said. Also, if you don't have many days a week you can lift or can't spend a lot of time lifting, the compound lifts are also very efficient and help with time constraints. Basically, get a lot of muscle work, or more muscles worked in a shorter amount of time.

Edited October 10, 201312 yr by aroundhky

I hope the OP doesn't mind that the rest of us have completely taken over the thread and appreciates the fact that good dialog was initiated, because I want to brag, and I need to brag so that I can see the positive in what is a frustrating situation.

I'm stuck at the same weight for 10 days. whine whine, bad bad, cry cry whatever. Here's the good news.

My body composition has changed. I've put ON 1 lb. of lean mass! Now my very same 34 lbs of weight loss? is only 3 lbs of muscle and 31 lbs of fat! What this means is that although the scale says the same thing, I've actually lost 2 lbs of fat.

yeah I think i'll take it

(before anyone chastises me for math, there is some rounding going on here so I've lost .5 on the scale, and I've rounded the decimals out but the principle is still the same)

Edited October 10, 201312 yr by gamergirl