Hi everyone,

I wasn't sure how to pull this together, because I'm thinking about experiences I have had as a black woman, and as a blind one.

I take paratransit, known here as Access Services, home from work. Basically, it's a curb to curb cab service (or van) for a very small fee.

Twice I have ridden with passengers who have not wanted to sit by me, either because I'm black, or blind, or both. The most recent incident was today. I was in a van, and a woman got in. She sat down next to me, all the while talking to someone outside the van. All at once, after what was a halfhearted attempt at trying to fasten her seat belt, I heard the driver put down a middle seat. After we took off, I reached over to see if there was anything wrong with the belt. There wasn't; it moved quite easily.

That has happened to me before in an Access vehicle.

When I rode the bus, there was a driver who refused to speak to me. He never told me if there was a seat in front, or anywhere, for that matter, but he spoke to a blind man who was not black. They had a rather animated conversation in fact.

At the risk of sounding shallow, using an old cliche, I have friends of all races and ethnicities. I went to school with predominantly white kids of necessity. I had to go where the resources for blind kids were. I'm glad I did. I think it taught me a lot about all kinds of people, and how dull my life would be had I not met so many different types.

But I have also had several experiences of people who either thought I couldn't possibly help them because I'm blind, or who simply refused to interact with me, sit by me, you name it, for the same reason.

If anyone cares to share experiences from any point of view, I welcome them, and thank you all for letting me rant.

Debbie

Hehehe, it sounds like it.

I did some volunteer work for a while with unwed mothers, and it was one of the most emotional jobs I have ever done. And at times the most unrewarding, sad to say.

Sadly, I do know what you mean. *SIGH*

I won't lie. At times it does become very difficult not to become upset with people at my job. I think I only have a few clients with jobs. Most are on welfare, subsidized housing, multiple children despite the fact that I give out free birth control. Did you know that you can actually live in section 8 housing and pay $0 rent for life? There is no time limit. I was very surprised to learn that. I have to remind myself at times that I'm there for the children. They need me and didn't ask for the situation they are in.

Except that simply being born into that environment makes it much much more difficult for them to "break the cycle" and go from total governmental dependence to personal reliance. That's how we get into the problems of multi-generational welfare....there is an incentive for people to stay in the system and not even try for a better life. But, since this is more a socioeconomical thing than a racial thing (IMO), I'll let the thread get back to its original topic.

A bunch of good posts!

Headhunter, your post at #112 was one I could sure agree with and identify with.

Thanks, ya'll.

plain: "That's how we get into the problems of multi-generational welfare....there is an incentive for people to stay in the system and not even try for a better life. But, since this is more a socioeconomical thing than a racial thing (IMO), I'll let the thread get back to its original topic."

I'm not sure that I agree with your humble opinion that this is more of a socioeconomic thing than a racial thing. Many brilliant sociologists believe that the welfare system has been a major factor in keeping black people beaten down in America. Whether by design or not, I do not know, but I do believe it has played a significant roll in the huge racial divide in this country.

plain: "That's how we get into the problems of multi-generational welfare....there is an incentive for people to stay in the system and not even try for a better life. But, since this is more a socioeconomical thing than a racial thing (IMO), I'll let the thread get back to its original topic."

I'm not sure that I agree with your humble opinion that this is more of a socioeconomic thing than a racial thing. Many brilliant sociologists believe that the welfare system has been a major factor in keeping black people beaten down in America. Whether by design or not, I do not know, but I do believe it has played a significant roll in the huge racial divide in this country.

I'd say I have to agree with you there. I believe it started as racial and maybe has progressed (regressed?) to spanning races and becoming somewhat more socioeconomic, but yes, I would agree that it was meant to keep blacks in line. Maybe still is.

I'm not sure that I agree with your humble opinion that this is more of a socioeconomic thing than a racial thing. Many brilliant sociologists believe that the welfare system has been a major factor in keeping black people beaten down in America. Whether by design or not, I do not know, but I do believe it has played a significant roll in the huge racial divide in this country.

I say it's more socioeconomical because you could plug in any race and have the same results......say, Native Americans and the rez system. With rez kids, college is paid for with the fed's dime. So why doesn't this "nanny state" program work for the Indians? Because, like I stated previously, there's a built-in incentive to do nothing...

So, of course the welfare system has beaten the black folk down. Whenever an activist comes along with the message that welfare is poison for most people, more times than not he / she is shouted down by those that choose to live in the system (usually followed by personal attacks about how the activist "isn't really black / indian / mexican" and how they've "sold out to the establishment / whitey / the man"). It most recently happened to Bill Cosby.

But then again, this is a thread about race (or, has been accurately observed, interaction).

palin: "So why doesn't this "nanny state" program work for the Indians? Because, like I stated previously, there's a built-in incentive to do nothing..."

Oh yeah. And the reservations are a huge part of keeping the Indians in their place. That whole system has been ruinous for American Indians.

Intrestingly, I'm part Native American. And from a part of the country where the reservations had some wonderful natural resources. Those Indians were smart. They held onto those resources and only gave them up for their price instead of allowing the white man to take them from them like they took everything else. Where I came from Indians were relatively wealthy and not looked down on. They were respected and lived in beautiful homes on beautiful land. However, I haven't been back for years and I have no knowledge of their current-day situation.

palin? Did I type that accidentally or was something in my subconscious poking through. Sorry to both you and Nanook, who I called Nanette. Sorry, I get in too big a hurry to post my pearls of wisdom. :thumbup:

Indio Gal, (sorry if I wrote it wrong) thank you for what you said. Racism can be subtle, and yes, you're right; it has been my experience over and over for the 54 years I have been on this planet. It's interesting that people have overlooked certain facts: That I said I feel sad when it happens to Anyone; no comment on my friend's mother--again, thank you Indio Gal--and, by the way, Barack is only half black, so I don't even understand why blacks are making it sound as though he was full black. The information I gave, I don't think, was limited at all. I don't like to think of racism happening anywhere, either, but it does, it has happened to me, and maybe always will. So I guess I have three strikes against me: I'm black, blind and fat.

Also, I was in a van when the woman moved. It's not as if I was touching her; there was plenty of room between us.

If I have a bias, so be it. It happened to me, and I don't mind people questioning, but what I do mind is people making me feel as though I don't know what the hell I'm experiencing

Debbie.

So I guess I have three strikes against me: I'm black, blind and fat.

That is exactly the victim mentality I am talking about, Debbie. I don't mean to harp on it, but if you LET people tell you -- worse, CONVINCE you -- that you are less than, then they win. And I find that very sad.

If I have a bias, so be it. It happened to me, and I don't mind people questioning, but what I do mind is people making me feel as though I don't know what the hell I'm experiencing

I'm not saying it for sure WASN'T racism. But even in a van, how far away can she get from you? And expecially because it was a van, how do you know it wasn't because it was tight?

Am I playing devil's advocate? Sure. But unless you tell me she called you a racial epithet, even if she mumbled it under her breath, or said or did something (other than just move) to show that it was absolutely-without-a-doubt racial, my naive self chooses to look at the least innocuous situation.

But sadly, Debbie, with what you said about yourself in this very post, I fear that you see yourself in a negative light and therefore feel that others do. From just reading your posts, I can tell you're a highly intelligent woman who I wish wouldn't let the bastards win. :sad:

palin? Did I type that accidentally or was something in my subconscious poking through. Sorry to both you and Nanook, who I called Nanette. Sorry, I get in too big a hurry to post my pearls of wisdom.

I missed the Palin thing! That's too freakin' funny! :sad:

You couldn't be more wrong. As I also said in my first post, I have not, nor have I ever been a victim. I don't go looking for crap to happen.

The fat, black blind comment was sarcasm

Debbie.

You couldn't be more wrong. As I also said in my first post, I have not, nor have I ever been a victim. I don't go looking for crap to happen.

The fat, black blind comment was sarcasm

Debbie.

My mistake. I'm sorry. It's hard to follow sometimes on message boards, especially sarcasm.

Oh yeah. And the reservations are a huge part of keeping the Indians in their place. That whole system has been ruinous for American Indians.

Ok, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that this is not sarcasm, and that you're agreeing with me. Because when I first read it, I thought you were being sarcastic and it blew. my. mind.

Intrestingly, I'm part Native American. And from a part of the country where the reservations had some wonderful natural resources. Those Indians were smart. They held onto those resources and only gave them up for their price instead of allowing the white man to take them from them like they took everything else. Where I came from Indians were relatively wealthy and not looked down on. They were respected and lived in beautiful homes on beautiful land. However, I haven't been back for years and I have no knowledge of their current-day situation.

So, where are you talking about where the reservations are nice and Indians live in big houses?? I'm Indian too (card and all) and have never, ever heard of what you're describing. Sure, there are a very few wealthy tribal members that have gained from having casinos on the rez, and I'm sure they probably have nice houses, but as for the rest......well.....you really have to visit. Where was that affluent rez again? You know, where the natives were well-respected by the whites??

Edited June 19, 200917 yr by plain

My bad, Beth. There should be an icon for sarcasm

:sad:

Debbie!