I read some interesting comments today and I wanted to make something really clear.

Out of all these people around the globe that are on this website, there are going to be some of us that have found post op, that this surgery was the wrong decision.

If you want this website to be honest and truthful, a source of good solid information for people considering surgery and a source of support for people post op, then everyone's experiences should be welcome.

The reason's I think this surgery was wrong for me has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with my post op complications!

And as for comments about people who regret their surgeries and have complications because:

• "houses were dirty"

• "they didn't follow instructions"

• "they haven't seen the great results yet"

• "they are just negative people and negative people are more vocal

So, just let me tell you this, some of us simply made a mistake.

We thought this was a good plan, we took advice, did our research, attended the seminars and weigh ins (in my case, two years attending).

We met our surgeons, we discussed our pre existing conditions, we spoke to our family and friends.

I myself have a counsellor, did CBT counselling for the entire two years pre op and am deemed emotionally and mentally sound. (just as an aside, my NHS CBT counsellor did not agree with this surgery).

I checked with my pain mgt team about the efficacy of my medications post op.

And it was still a mistake!

And so what?

It happens. And people like me should be able to explain these things without others trying to negate our admission of this mistake by offering excuses as to why we are unhappy with our decision.

I could have floated onto a cloud, had magical unicorns lick away my stomach, and woke up in paradise fully healed, sipping a cocktail in the sun and I would still tell you that this was a mistake for ME. And for many of my friends.

It doesn't matter how many years post op I get, I will consider this a mistake.

My house is not dirty, I followed instructions to the letter, I consider my bariatric discharge booklet my life guideline and I never variate.

I keep in touch with anyone and everyone in my medical care stream that might be helpful.

And complications happened. And yes, to many of us in our bariatric system. But again, it was not the complications that disturb us.

We all have different reasons for regretting it.

Most of us feel that we were misinformed, which doesn't help. My neighbour regrets her bypass because of her now permanent diarrhea and no improvement in her diabetes. She tells me that she has to think about food most of the day just to keep herself fed (choosing the right foods so as not to vomit), and she could have simply dieted harder if she had known she would have to think of food all day. She is three years post op and she still struggles with dehydration. Her hair never grew back after the initial drop out.

I myself am only 9 weeks post op and have had complications so I can't know what my future holds.

I miss eating quickly and simply in a way that doesn't have to be well thought out.

I want to be able to eat a full salad, maybe even with dressings, without worrying about which component might not agree with me.

I want to be able to eat any kind of meat I want cooked how I want in the quantity I want.

I want to drink beverages with my meals.

I miss a morning coffee or afternoon tea. I miss ice tea. (I know other people can drink it but I can't now).

I don't want to have to plan my food day meticulously or be different from others around me eating.

I want my medications to work again in the way they did pre op to control my fibromyalgia symptoms.

And I have definitely seen weightloss results. As I was lying there starving to death for seven weeks, I have lost all but 20lbs of my expected and required excess weight to satisfy my healthcare team. ( I am still only getting around 500 cals a day in, but have constant diarrhea so who knows how much stays in).

I now look "normal" except for the grey pallor in my skin and the nappy I now have to wear because of fecal incontinence (my IBS-d was totally controlled before surgery).

I am six dress sizes smaller but can only leave my house if I don't eat anything and wear adult protection in case of Water causing an "accident". Or in case I become faint from lack of food and fall.

So I do actually feel that had I read a forum entry like this, I might have thought twice.

And that's a good thing. If people are scared, that's okay. Let them hear more than just "don't worry, I was fine, you will be too!" Because maybe they won't!

So this is not about complications, it's about people.

One size does not fit all. Some of us should have simply accepted our weight, or worked harder to diet it off. Had I taken in only 300 to 500 calories a day for 9 weeks pre op, I would have lost all this weight anyway.

If you are happy, well done! If you are dead set on going ahead, ignore this. If you are a high BMI person (think 600lb life), God bless you, this may save your life, if you are a food addict, I feel your pain.

You will still have to diet post op! You will still have to exercise.

If you are undecided, then simply take a breath, think about it, really examine your food issues. Could you do more to lose weight? Could you move a bit more and eat a bit less?

Anyway, I am where I am and I plan to make the best of what I have left. And I intend to keep making sure that pre op people have a good think and post op people like me have someone they can talk to.

Thanks to everyone who is supporting me.

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@@GinaCampbell I've read all the posts on here and am impressed with how masterfully and swiftly you managed to dilute the goodwill that has always been extended to you on these boards. Bravo.

People showed up to support you yet again on this thread and one by one you slapped them away, picking on words that were never meant to attack, harm or 'bully' you. Perhaps you should have prefaced in your original note that you were not looking for compassion or support and that might've effectively kept any love coming to you, at bay.

What's been phenomenal to see however, is the continued decency and patience showed by most of the responders on here, even in the face of serious vitriol spat out by the person you were doing your best to support. I thank these people for showing that nastiness can be responded to with grace - that's what I'll taking away from this mess of a thread.

Thank you!

I am here to continue to help the people who feel as I do.

For everyone who stops by to be insulting, it highlights my objective.

Education

Please feel free to unsubscribe and ignore if you have no fear of or experience with post op regrets or issues.

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It is not your desire to 'educate' others that offends me; it's your frankly baffling treatment of well-meaning people that were sincerely trying to lift your spirits and give you another perspective.

I have a niggling feeling that self-awareness might not be a forte of yours, so I'm not going to waste my time trying to put up a mirror for you see what you're doing (like others have tried to do, in a much more articulate and decent way than I can muster).

I wish you well.

Look I am very sorry that you are dealing with all that you are. I think everyone who has posted in this thread has said something to that effect....at least in their first posts, before they were attacked for offering words of encouragement.

This is a support forum. Typically, when people post about their complications others are there to encourage them and let them know that it does in fact, get better. That's the very nature of a support forum such as this. Your inability to take those words as encouragement is what's baffling here.

Not only do you accuse those people of "attacking" you, but you've made it abundantly clear that you don't want support or words of encouragement if those words include anything about it POSSIBLY GETTING BETTER. This is clearly evident in your responses and immediate defensiveness to anyone who dares trying to help you.

You said "we don't know you" and you're right. I don't know you. The only way to get an impression of you is through your words posted on this forum. So my analysis based on that has me scratching my head wondering what it is you exactly hope to achieve here? You claim you want to educate. What is it exactly you want to offer by way of education? You've shared your experience. People telling you that it may get better shouldn't be taken as a threat to the message you're trying to send, yet you're clearly taking it that way. Why?

Anyone who does even a day (as opposed to 2 years) of research can clearly see the complication possibilities, both short and long-term, as well as the percentages to which they are possible. It's great that you've shared your experience here, and some of the responsibility certainly seems to reside with the medical team that was involved, but you are not open to suggestions or the possibility that it could (and for most of us, does) get better!?!?!?!

So to me, reading this thread from start to finish, I would see that your "method" of education includes telling people about the negative possibilities of this procedure (which is good, as I said), but then you go further and this is where you lose me (and probably everyone else), you go above and beyond to try it make it perfectly clear that not only is it bad, but in your infinite wisdom (of 10 weeks), you can clearly say that beyond a shadow of a doubt it absolutely will never get better, and damn anyone for even suggesting that it might. This is not a good message to send to those researching the surgery, because it's simply not true and you do not have enough post-op time in to make any long-term claims.

You have to realize how small of a percentage you are in with any complications, and you are CERTAINLY NOT far enough along to make the determination that you have long-term complications, and making that claim now only damages your credibility with anyone here who is, I'm sure. Not only that you could possibly be preventing people from getting a potentially life-saving procedure because they read this and see comments like "it will never get better", which is a comment that you just simply aren't far enough along to make, which makes it unfair to those people.

If you want to offer your experiences (on a support forum), then you should absolutely, unequivocally be open to those wishing to help by offering encouragement and suggestions. Otherwise, you are not trying to educate, you are trying to dictate.

I truly do hope things get better for you, and I also hope that one day you will re-read this thread and see why the overwhelming majority takes issue with the way you are projecting your story onto others. Nobody is challenging the fact that you are having a bad experience, but to make absolute comments like "it will never get better" is just misleading and again, a comment that you are not far enough along to make, yet you're making it over and over. That could be damaging to people who adopt that mindset without first qualifying that the source of it has the experience to make it. 10 weeks is not long-term....not by a long-shot, so making that claim is not only misinformation, it's downright dangerous to others who are still in their research phase.

Best of luck!

@@smg so well stated. Thank you.

@@GinaCampbell please post a pic of the pink eyebrows!

ImageUploadedByBariatricPal1470848154.337654.jpg

Can you see it (inside photo)

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Looks a bit mauve.

@@GinaCampbell I've read all the posts on here and am impressed with how masterfully and swiftly you managed to dilute the goodwill that has always been extended to you on these boards. Bravo.

People showed up to support you yet again on this thread and one by one you slapped them away, picking on words that were never meant to attack, harm or 'bully' you. Perhaps you should have prefaced in your original note that you were not looking for compassion or support and that might've effectively kept any love coming to you, at bay.

What's been phenomenal to see however, is the continued decency and patience showed by most of the responders on here, even in the face of serious vitriol spat out by the person you were doing your best to support. I thank these people for showing that nastiness can be responded to with grace - that's what I'll taking away from this mess of a thread.

Thank you!

I am here to continue to help the people who feel as I do.

For everyone who stops by to be insulting, it highlights my objective.

Education

Please feel free to unsubscribe and ignore if you have no fear of or experience with post op regrets or issues.

Sent from my iPhone using the BariatricPal App

It is not your desire to 'educate' others that offends me; it's your frankly baffling treatment of well-meaning people that were sincerely trying to lift your spirits and give you another perspective.

I have a niggling feeling that self-awareness might not be a forte of yours, so I'm not going to waste my time trying to put up a mirror for you see what you're doing (like others have tried to do, in a much more articulate and decent way than I can muster).

I wish you well.

As you don't know me personally, you can't possibly know what my "fortes" are.

My spirits are fine. Remember, I have a counsellor. I don't come here for that sort of emotional support because we are all simply words on a page.

If you feel "offended" because of something I write, then the issue is with you and you need to look in the mirror.

There is nothing wrong with my prospective. We are all allowed to have our own.

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Look I am very sorry that you are dealing with all that you are. I think everyone who has posted in this thread has said something to that effect....at least in their first posts, before they were attacked for offering words of encouragement.

This is a support forum. Typically, when people post about their complications others are there to encourage them and let them know that it does in fact, get better. That's the very nature of a support forum such as this. Your inability to take those words as encouragement is what's baffling here.

Not only do you accuse those people of "attacking" you, but you've made it abundantly clear that you don't want support or words of encouragement if those words include anything about it POSSIBLY GETTING BETTER. This is clearly evident in your responses and immediate defensiveness to anyone who dares trying to help you.

You said "we don't know you" and you're right. I don't know you. The only way to get an impression of you is through your words posted on this forum. So my analysis based on that has me scratching my head wondering what it is you exactly hope to achieve here? You claim you want to educate. What is it exactly you want to offer by way of education? You've shared your experience. People telling you that it may get better shouldn't be taken as a threat to the message you're trying to send, yet you're clearly taking it that way. Why?

Anyone who does even a day (as opposed to 2 years) of research can clearly see the complication possibilities, both short and long-term, as well as the percentages to which they are possible. It's great that you've shared your experience here, and some of the responsibility certainly seems to reside with the medical team that was involved, but you are not open to suggestions or the possibility that it could (and for most of us, does) get better!?!?!?!

So to me, reading this thread from start to finish, I would see that your "method" of education includes telling people about the negative possibilities of this procedure (which is good, as I said), but then you go further and this is where you lose me (and probably everyone else), you go above and beyond to try it make it perfectly clear that not only is it bad, but in your infinite wisdom (of 10 weeks), you can clearly say that beyond a shadow of a doubt it absolutely will never get better, and damn anyone for even suggesting that it might. This is not a good message to send to those researching the surgery, because it's simply not true and you do not have enough post-op time in to make any long-term claims.

You have to realize how small of a percentage you are in with any complications, and you are CERTAINLY NOT far enough along to make the determination that you have long-term complications, and making that claim now only damages your credibility with anyone here who is, I'm sure. Not only that you could possibly be preventing people from getting a potentially life-saving procedure because they read this and see comments like "it will never get better", which is a comment that you just simply aren't far enough along to make, which makes it unfair to those people.

If you want to offer your experiences (on a support forum), then you should absolutely, unequivocally be open to those wishing to help by offering encouragement and suggestions. Otherwise, you are not trying to educate, you are trying to dictate.

I truly do hope things get better for you, and I also hope that one day you will re-read this thread and see why the overwhelming majority takes issue with the way you are projecting your story onto others. Nobody is challenging the fact that you are having a bad experience, but to make absolute comments like "it will never get better" is just misleading and again, a comment that you are not far enough along to make, yet you're making it over and over. That could be damaging to people who adopt that mindset without first qualifying that the source of it has the experience to make it. 10 weeks is not long-term....not by a long-shot, so making that claim is not only misinformation, it's downright dangerous to others who are still in their research phase.

Best of luck!

What is "dangerous" is the refusal by most people on this thread who disagree with my personal experience (go figure? How can anyone challenge my own experience?) regardless of how many weeks I am post op, and who try to keep inserting emotions into a factual situation.

Using words like "dictate"! Hilarious! It's an internet forum, not a political war!

It is not dangerous for me to state that our NHS bariatric program does not educate and inform pre op participants about long term complications, situations such as food aversion, food revulsion, non ingestion of Proteins, bowel conditions, gallbladder removal, malnutrition complications (some life threatening).

It is not dangerous for me to say, "Please look into this or that". Or to say "I don't like what I did to my body so you are not alone if you feel as myself and my friends do.".

I never ever said that my health would not get "better". What I said is that MY surgeon, post op, had informed me that my gallbladder won't get better, that my bowel condition is not expected to change (see all other people on BP who have diarrhea post op long term), that food revulsion/aversion can be long term.

Are you in England? Have you been through our program? What do you know about what our information program?

My "credibility" should not concern you. It doesn't worry me.

You don't read and comprehend my point.

You simply whine about how I am rejecting the "love".

Support is not telling me to shut up and get off this website. Support is not telling me that my points are not valid. Support is accepting that my point of view is as valid as yours.

Why not just go participate on a thread that you enjoy? Or unsubscribe, hit ignore and move along.

Thank you for highlighting this issue!

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@@GinaCampbell please post a pic of the pink eyebrows!

ImageUploadedByBariatricPal1470848154.337654.jpg

Can you see it (inside photo)

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Looks a bit mauve.

Even mauve is still a bit distracting to people who see them!

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Just a thanks to everyone who has messaged me and for the friend requests. Your support is appreciated.

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I just finished reading this thread and WOW, what a wild ride this was!

I know quite a few people who have had WLS. Most recently the sleeve but the ones who had it years ago had the bypass. I know at least a couple of them 100% regret the surgery even now, MANY years later (and when I say many, I mean MANY... one women had the surgery about 11 years ago). So is it possible to regret WLS? Yeah, I believe it is. Some people regret it right after surgery and then change their minds over time. Some people don't. The OP seems convinced she will never not regret it. Well I'm not her, who am I to say she's wrong? I hope she doesn't always regret it, but that's not my call to make.

As one who hasn't yet had surgery I want to read about both the good and the bad. Threads telling about complications and regrets are just as valuable as threads telling how awesome and life changing WLS is. So for that, thank you for this thread.

Also thank you for the entertainment. This was a hell of a read.

Hi Gina,

I have been reading through your story and am so so sorry to hear of the terrible experience you have had. I was excited to find someone else who had been through a sleeve gastrectomy on the NHS but then I was shocked to see how different our experiences were.

I think the way your bariatric team run their surgeries, based on what you have said, certainly sound like a dreadful mismanagement which I think is particular to them – I can only base that on a comparison to mine but it certainly seems like yours are (sorry for the language but..) totally crap!

I understand what you mean about not wanting to take legal action against them – things work differently here in the UK and that’s not the way things get fixed here generally. But I would urge you to lodge a complaint so that your treatment – and those of your friends who have also been given a terrible service in your area – can be assessed at a higher level. You may have already looked into that, and may or may not have decided to or not to. I don’t mean to tell you what to do but want to help if I can!

I’m also wondering if your GP can give you a referral to specialists for your bowel and other issues rather than asking your surgeon to continue to deal with them? When I moved home halfway through my assessment period for surgery I was glad to discover that as patients we now have more choice where we go to get treatments now and don’t just have to go wherever the GP thinks best to send us, or even within our home PCT. For me this meant sticking with the Bariatric team I had already begun to meet with although I moved to a new area – for you it may mean some travel but treatment somewhere that can help rather than hinder you further with your complications?

Anyway you are very likely to know all this already and I don’t mean to suggest you do anything other than what you have already chosen is the best treatment for you going forward. I would like to help though, if there is anything I can do please let me know.

And I am glad to hear that you have been able to keep your spirits up throughout, I hope your health improves and that your house move isn’t too difficult.

All the best

Jo x

@@GinaCampbell please post a pic of the pink eyebrows!

ImageUploadedByBariatricPal1470848154.337654.jpg

Can you see it (inside photo)

Sent from my iPhone using the BariatricPal App

Looks a bit mauve.

I saw a striking cater waiter at a visiting ballet company reception recently who had a closely shaved head of dark hair but electric blue eyebrows. For some reason, I was expecting something more like that!

As I said...it was my CHOICE to pay. No regrets/ jealousy or any other negative feelings about paying for it it was worth every single penny. So don't jump to conclusions. Just like you keep telling everyone else!

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Hi Gina,

I have been reading through your story and am so so sorry to hear of the terrible experience you have had. I was excited to find someone else who had been through a sleeve gastrectomy on the NHS but then I was shocked to see how different our experiences were.

I think the way your bariatric team run their surgeries, based on what you have said, certainly sound like a dreadful mismanagement which I think is particular to them – I can only base that on a comparison to mine but it certainly seems like yours are (sorry for the language but..) totally crap!

I understand what you mean about not wanting to take legal action against them – things work differently here in the UK and that’s not the way things get fixed here generally. But I would urge you to lodge a complaint so that your treatment – and those of your friends who have also been given a terrible service in your area – can be assessed at a higher level. You may have already looked into that, and may or may not have decided to or not to. I don’t mean to tell you what to do but want to help if I can!

I’m also wondering if your GP can give you a referral to specialists for your bowel and other issues rather than asking your surgeon to continue to deal with them? When I moved home halfway through my assessment period for surgery I was glad to discover that as patients we now have more choice where we go to get treatments now and don’t just have to go wherever the GP thinks best to send us, or even within our home PCT. For me this meant sticking with the Bariatric team I had already begun to meet with although I moved to a new area – for you it may mean some travel but treatment somewhere that can help rather than hinder you further with your complications?

Anyway you are very likely to know all this already and I don’t mean to suggest you do anything other than what you have already chosen is the best treatment for you going forward. I would like to help though, if there is anything I can do please let me know.

And I am glad to hear that you have been able to keep your spirits up throughout, I hope your health improves and that your house move isn’t too difficult.

All the best

Jo x

Thanks Jo! Not sure what will happen with the bowel referral now. I rang up and chased results and was informed that I have Clostridium Difficile and have had for weeks if not months! I hope that I haven't infected my family and other people along the way!

The surgeon knew in June that I had it, the infectious disease team knew I had it, even my GP knew I had it. But no one told me.

Massive amounts or huge tablets to take that can't be crushed.

I will message you Jo and thanks for your support! It means alot!

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As I said...it was my CHOICE to pay. No regrets/ jealousy or any other negative feelings about paying for it it was worth every single penny. So don't jump to conclusions. Just like you keep telling everyone else!

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It was you that made a big issue of how you paid and I didn't! Of course I have paid in contributions, military service etc.

It was you that made a big deal of the loan you took out.

Not me.

I am just dealing with Clostridium Difficile that the hospital "forgot" to tell me that I had at the moment.

And if you sling mud my way, expect your hands to get a bit dirty!

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I haven't made a big deal out of anything. Just stating facts.

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