I just read this article on the "Quiverfull" movement where the idea is to have as many kids as possible and that "God is the only one who can open or close the womb". Some of these idiots have 12, 18 and 20 kids.

Dumb, dumb, dumb.

I'll just assume that everyone on this forum is intelligent enough to know the reasons why this is a really bad idea, such as our severely dwindling environmental resources, for one.

On a more mundane level, every time someone complains about a new development going up behind their house, or long lines at the supermarket, or horrible traffic, I feel like screaming "that's because people are having too many *bleeping* kids!

It makes me so mad that people are so dumb.

if they live far enough from any metropolis to make communiting undesirable then there is very little threat.

Wait, there are places that are far enough away from any metropolis to make commuting undesirable? I thought it was wall to wall people from east to west and north to south. There's uninhabited land out there in the US and {gasp} possibly other countries? I thought we were all out of land. Thanks for opening my eyes.

To all the people who live in the country and state that nothing is crowded, etc:

The effects of overpopulation are coming to your area, just give it time...

Don't worry, I won't say "I told you so", but maybe you could remember this thread and how up in arms some got when that first development rears its gray and ugly head where the woods used to be.

I live in the RTP area and believe me if you know anything about that area w/the companies, universities, etc. that alone brings a lot of people here. I grew up in Cary/Raleigh, N.C. (small town, I believe now 3rd safest city in the U.S.) and it looks nothing like it did 15 years ago. I am okay with that though. My parents live in the country and have people offering to buy their land all the time. The old field two doors down is now a small neighborhood w/$350K & up houses that are seperated by pine trees, lol. Even my parents are pretty okay with it. They understand that one day they will have to leave. Sure we will all miss it, but times are changing and sometimes it is sad, but the change can be good too. There are some benefits as well.

I think my area tries to be prepared for the growth. When I graduated from high school in 97' Cary only had one public high school and now they have 3.

At 6-7 weeks, the genitalia have been clearly formed in the unborn baby, but they can't be seen clearly on an ultrasound.

Most people don't know this, but at 8 weeks the formation of all organs is complete and everything is present that will be found in a developed adult. All the baby has left to do is grow. At 8 weeks, details as small as fingerprints are present. So the sex of the baby at 6 or 7 weeks is not unknown, just unknown via ultrasound.

Ok, if the fetus is about 1" long at the end of the 8th week (yet alone 6th), (according to webmd) then I'm assuming you'd actually have to physically examine it w/somekind of magnifaction device. I doubt the sex would be actually visible to the naked eye....Like I said, any OB professionals out there? If I read the original post correctly, and the Dr. broke the membranes early w/o her authorization and saying the fetus was dead, did he do an ultrasound to check for sure? I certainly hope he was disiplined by the medical board or a complaint filed....

Posts regading the Duggers were interresting. I still think her && JimBob are out there crying for attention. Are they out to break a record or something? Must be nice to have stuff donated to you from "sponsors". PLease. Yes, I'm still a Christian, raised strict Catholic, and believe in God's teachings!

I just got here and I'm still stuck on the "what's-wrong-with-the-Jim-Bob's" issue.

and that owning a Cabbage patch Kid will make your daughter weird, mostly because CPK's have Satanic middle names. (Run-on sentence much?)

And then the Jim-Bob's, using books authored by this genius, expose their children to each other and NO ONE ELSE. Is this a recipe for creating normal people? (Uh...no.)

The good Reverend Got-hard, used to sell out the tents, but what with the sexual corruption charges he's admitted to...need I continue?...SSDD.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Gothard

Ok, so now we know that the Dugger kids will never have a CPK. Geez, you'd think they were "Chuckie" or something....Interresting facts on the fam....

Gadgetlady....what the hell!!!! Did my comment really deserve such a sarcastic response from you.....geesh!

Carol

Carol, my sarcasm was directed at those who portray the earth as an overpopulated ball of massive urban sprawl. I live in the greater LA area and have driven from LA to Vegas only to see hundreds of miles of vacant and perfectly usable land. I have flown over the US and seen thousands and thousands of miles of empty land. I have driven through Los Angeles at rush hour and seen how many people there are. Those who live in big cities sometimes don't understand that the claustrophobia they feel is a result of their choice of location.I'm sorry that my sarcasm, which was not directed at you, offended you.

I know for a fact, only the larger cities are over-run by too many people. Lots of them are here illegally. Most of them go there because the wages are so much better than the smaller, more rural communities. As for me, I live north of the DFW area and I can attest to the sprawl going north of Dallas. I don't like it and you're right. They're knocking down beautiful trees, etc for the sake of the almighty dollar. I'd much prefer to be home in west Texas where I can see the sky and breathe the air and trust the people I live with. There is no danger of that area being overpopulated, but I long for the simplicity and morality it provides.

Leatha, I know exactly how you feel. I live in North central Texas also, and have done for the better part of nearly 30 years. I can remember when there was NOTHING between Denton and Ft Worth but pastures.

And when the drive from Dallas to Austin on I35 was "quiet".

And my family (both parents, grandparents etc), were born and raised in West Texas and I still have lots of family there and lived there til the age of about 10. Now even I-20 west of Abilene is getting busy.

I am not angry about it, but I do mourn the quiet beauty of the rural areas that have disappeared in my lifetime already.

Overpopulation is a worldwide concern, not a United States concern. You have to think in terms of everyone, and not just some.

No one is saying it's only a problem if you place every living being on land, and if they don't have 2 feet of personal space. Land area isn't the entirety of "natural resources". The conversation has seemed to really focus in on land area, and there's just so much more to it than that. Could everyone on the planet have 2 feet of space if we started using the open land areas? Who cares. Is Wyoming crowded? Who cares. I think the point being made is more along the lines of, "If we can't find other ways to power our cars, clean up after ourselves, and maintain productivity - then it doesn't matter how wide open Texas is." But I could be wrong.

Leatha, I know exactly how you feel. I live in North central Texas also, and have done for the better part of nearly 30 years. I can remember when there was NOTHING between Denton and Ft Worth but pastures.

My grandmother and my mother were raised on the "home place" in Argyle, TX. It was so rural, my mother and her sisters could not have gone to high school, let alone college, had their family not bought a car and taught "the girls" to drive. The closest high school was in Denton. The area is now highly developed. (Anybody know if Gibbons Road is still there? It was named for my mom's family many, many years ago.)

There are 5 generations of my family buried in a small "country" cemetery in what is now Flower Mound, TX - right smack in the middle of some very pricey real estate. That makes me very nervous on behalf of my interred relatives. I'm afraid some greedy developer will try and pave over them!

What percentage of people die yearly? I am not expert, but that smog down in California has to be doing something for those poor people. The 1st day I was there I kept thinking it was going to rain. Even though we can save a lot more lives now a days, there are a lot more than that cause deaths that in the past. Cars are faster, smaller and therefore less safer. We have horrible gang violence and school shooting in some areas. They keep saying more and more stuff may cause this or that (cancer, etc.). We have AIDS!!! This is just a few that I thought of, but there has got to be many more factors. I am probably way off base, but whatever, just a thought. Not trying to sound like The Lottery (anyone else remember reading that) or anything.

Aren't there laws against throwing out aluminum cans and things. The gov't could do more to enforce these laws...More tax write-offs for people doing recycleable items, hybrid cars, electronic cars, whatever.

I think people need to come up with more ideas than keeping on saying that we have a problem.

I'm assuming you'd actually have to physically examine it w/somekind of magnifaction device

Wait, I thought the mantra of all men was that size doesn't matter . . .

IMO - the poster who shared their abortion story was probably not looking to have the scientific accuracy of the fetus' gender scrutinized.

Aren't there laws against throwing out aluminum cans and things. The gov't could do more to enforce these laws...More tax write-offs for people doing recycleable items, hybrid cars, electronic cars, whatever.

I fully support tax breaks for such things.

I think people need to come up with more ideas than keeping on saying that we have a problem.

OK, I have an idea. I was surfing the web a few months ago looking for a modest bathing suit for my 9 year old (a relative gave her a string bikini for her birthday, but that's a whole other thread) and I came across an Amish website. One of the products they were selling was a reusable pad for women who are menstruating. My first reactions was, "Wow, women still use these things? That's a little gross." But then I realized that it wasn't for me to judge, and I'm sure they have their reasons.

So instead of using disposable sanitary napkins that are thrown away and fill our local dumps, maybe some of the women on this board could test out the ones you rinse out instead? If anyone wants the link, I'd be happy to hunt for it.

Gadgetlady, thanks for pointing out an example of conveniences that most of us are not willingly going to give up, but it is good to be reminded that we could.

It reminds me of something posted earlier about disposable diapers...

It's ironic how many conveniences have actually led to some pretty significant inconveniences in the long run. Still, we may think of the consequences of our actions 100 years from now, but we will usually act on what works for "right now." Not always, since recycling has been made fairly convenient, but if it came to reusable feminine products....well....

So instead of using disposable sanitary napkins that are thrown away and fill our local dumps, maybe some of the women on this board could test out the ones you rinse out instead? If anyone wants the link, I'd be happy to hunt for it.

Re-usable pads sounds like a great way to spread infection, such as bacterial vaginosis and yeast. Why would anyone use those when they could use biodegradeable tampons like this:

http://www.mamasearth.com/feminine_care.htm

or biodegradable diapers like this:

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/12/gdiapers_the_ne.php

There are plenty of earth-friendly options out there that are neither disgusting nor inconvenient.

Or is it just more fun to be snarky about it?

Last night I watched "The New Adventures of Old Christine". Anyone watch that? It was a particularly funny episode. Christine is a self-proclaimed environmentalist who makes a big deal out of driving a Prius. Her car is in for repairs so she has to rent another. The only thing the rental company has left is a tricked-out SUV. She objects, but then relents but only with "no leather seats." Her brother comments that she has a nice collection of "free-range shoes and belts at home." (She ends up loving the SUV despite herself.)

My point was that we all have our own level of comfort with our own lifestyle choices. I suspect most of you own cars (not necessarily the most environmentally friendly thing in the world) and go through your share of to-go food in styrofoam containers. It is not for me to judge your choices, nor for you to judge mine.

Every election, our city has one or many anti-expansion, anti-development measures. I always vote against them. Would I like it more if everyone moved out and I had the beautiful landscape to myself? Of course I would. Would it be hypocritical of me to be the last one to enter and then lock the door behind me? Absolutely, yes it would. And therefore I don't do it.

As to snark, I live for it. Snarkiness is the spice of life.