Someone recently passed this article on to me, which I posted on another board. It was promptly removed. So sad . . .

Frightening News from France

Once again, the real news in France is conveniently

not being reported as it should. To give you an idea

of what's going on in France where there are now

between 5 and 6 million Muslims and about 600,000 Jews,

here is an email that came from a Jew living in

France. Please read! Will the world say nothing - again - as it did in Hitler's time?

"I AM A JEW -- therefore I am forwarding this to

everyone on all my e-mail lists. I will not sit back

and do nothing." Nowhere have the flames of

anti-Semitism burned more furiously than in France:

Lyon, a car was rammed into a synagogue and set

on fire. In Montpellier, the Jewish religious center

was firebombed; so were synagogues in Strasbourg and

Marseilles; so was a Jewish school in Creteil - all recently.

A Jewish sports club in Toulouse was attacked with

Molotov cocktails, and on the statue of Alfred

Dreyfus in Paris, the words "Dirty Jew" were

painted. In Bondy, 15 men beat up members of a

Jewish football team with sticks and metal bars. The

bus that takes Jewish children to school in

Aubervilliers has been attacked three times in the last 14 months.

According to the Police, metropolitan Paris has seen

10 to 12 anti-Jewish incidents PER DAY in the past

30 days. Walls in Jewish neighborhoods have been

defaced with slogans proclaiming "Jews to the gas

chambers" and "Death to the Jews."

A gunman opened fire on a Kosher butcher's shop

(and, of course, the butcher) in Toulouse , France;

a Jewish couple in their 20s were beaten up by five

men in Villeurbanne , France . The woman was

pregnant; a Jewish school was broken into and

vandalized in Sarcelles , France . This was just in

the past week.

So I call on you, whether you are a fellow Jew, a

friend, or merely a person with the capacity and

desire to distinguish decency from depravity, to do,

at least, these three simple things:

First, care enough to stay informed. Don't ever let

yourself become deluded into thinking that this is

no t your fight. I remind you of what Pastor

Neimoller said in World War II: "First they came for

the Communists, and I didn't speak up, because I

wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and

I didn't speak up, because I wasn't a Jew. Then they

came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up,

because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me,

and by that time there was no one left to speak up

for me".

Second, boycott France and French products. Only the

Arab countries are more toxically anti-Semitic and,

unlike them, France exports more than just oil and

hatred. So boycott their wines and their perfumes.

Boycott their clothes and their foodstuffs. Boycott

their movies. Definitely boycott their shores. If

we are resolved we can exert amazing pressure and,

whatever else we may know about the French, we most

certainly know that they are like a cobweb in a

hurricane in the face of well directed pressure.

Third, send this along to your family, your friends,

and your co-workers. Think of all of the people of

good conscience that you know and let them know

that you and the people that you care about need

their help. The number one best selling book in

France is "September 11: The Frightening Fraud,"

which argues that no plane ever hit the Pentagon."

Exactly! So you agree with that then??

I don't know. I admit, I'm very confused. You seem to be saying that if I say I don't take every word of the bible literally, I don't believe in it, yet also saying that context matters where the bible can't be taken literally. Honestly, I'm stumpted here. :help:

It's not confusing!! My question is an honest and legitimate question! If you are basing your faith on what is in the book, how do you know what to believe if you can't take it to mean what it actually says?

Let me give you an example! Jesus said "no man comes to the Father except through the Son"! Do you believe that literally? Jesus also spoke of "the days of Noah", referring to the Old Testament account. Do you believe Jesus there? Many here who profess to believe the Bible, but not literally, say they don't believe the Noah account. How do you pick and choose what to believe. It's a real question, and we are not talking about context here.

I don't know. I admit, I'm very confused. You seem to be saying that if I say I don't take every word of the bible literally, I don't believe in it, yet also saying that context matters where the bible can't be taken literally. Honestly, I'm stumpted here. :help:

It's not confusing!! My question is an honest and legitimate question! If you are basing your faith on what is in the book, how do you know what to believe if you can't take it to mean what it actually says?

You keep saying that I pick and choose what to believe, while you seem to just know when context affects meaning. That's what confuses me. I'm doing the same thing you are, and yet you question me for it. I'm not trying to sarcastic or anything here, I am really and truely baffled.

Here is an example of what the context makes it clear that the meaning is not literal. Jesus said. "I am the bread of life"! Taken literally, that would mean that Jesus was actually a piece of bread. The rule of thumb in interpreting is what the contect clearly indicates that the meaning can not be literal, you look for another clear meaning. We know that Jesus was a human and not a loaf of Wonder breat, so we look at what was said, to whom, under what circumstances, etc. to determine what He was speaking about. We do this all the time with everything we say, read and do, but people have a hard time grasping this when it comes to the Bible. That is where context comes into play. According to so many here, if we take the Bible literally, then Jesus would actually be bread! Does this make any sense to you?

You keep saying that I pick and choose what to believe, while you seem to just know when context affects meaning. That's what confuses me. I'm doing the same thing you are, and yet you question me for it. I'm not trying to sarcastic or anything here, I am really and truely baffled.

It's not confusing!! My question is an honest and legitimate question! If you are basing your faith on what is in the book, how do you know what to believe if you can't take it to mean what it actually says?

Let me give you an example! Jesus said "no man comes to the Father except through the Son"! Do you believe that literally? Jesus also spoke of "the days of Noah", referring to the Old Testament account. Do you believe Jesus there? Many here who profess to believe the Bible, but not literally, say they don't believe the Noah account. How do you pick and choose what to believe. It's a real question, and we are not talking about context here.

The part that you don't get Ron is that it is human beings who are the ones reading and interpreting the Bible. Let's assume that the Bible is the word of God and it means exactly what it says and it should be taken literally. Even with that assumption each human being will understand the Bible to mean something different. That's because a) humans are different, have different backgrounds and different levels of experience and intelligence, and words have different meanings, can be ambiguous and are subject to interpretation. This is true even if each person intends to read the words literally and give them a literal interpretation. That's why it is totally meaningless to argue that the Bible should be taken literally. That argument means nothing when it is humans -- fallable, varied humans -- who are doing the reading.

Here is an example of what the context makes it clear that the meaning is not literal. Jesus said. "I am the bread of life"! Taken literally, that would mean that Jesus was actually a piece of bread. The rule of thumb in interpreting is what the contect clearly indicates that the meaning can not be literal, you look for another clear meaning. We know that Jesus was a human and not a loaf of Wonder breat, so we look at what was said, to whom, under what circumstances, etc. to determine what He was speaking about. We do this all the time with everything we say, read and do, but people have a hard time grasping this when it comes to the Bible. That is where context comes into play. According to so many here, if we take the Bible literally, then Jesus would actually be bread! Does this make any sense to you?

I'm not really looking for more examples Ron, I get the idea. But what I don't get is why you tell me I can't pick and choose, or you ask what I base my beliefs on? When from where I'm standing, we have pretty much the same approach.

I disagree! Understanding the Bible is a growing and learning process. If you were studying and trying to learn biology, you could open the books, pull out a few sentences or paragraphs and they would make little sense to you. After a certain amount of study and learning, you can understand those sentences and paragraphs. You could also say, every human being will interpert the biology books differently, therefore they can't be taken literally. That makes no sense at all. I have been studying scripture for over 30 years, so I would not expect someone with only a passing understanding to know what I have learned. The Bible is a book(s) of literal fact, and understanding the whole of scripture takes time and effort. It is not like reading comic books!

uote=marjon9;403669]The part that you don't get Ron is that it is human beings who are the ones reading and interpreting the Bible. Let's assume that the Bible is the word of God and it means exactly what it says and it should be taken literally. Even with that assumption each human being will understand the Bible to mean something different. That's because a) humans are different, have different backgrounds and different levels of experience and intelligence, and words have different meanings, can be ambiguous and are subject to interpretation. This is true even if each person intends to read the words literally and give them a literal interpretation. That's why it is totally meaningless to argue that the Bible should be taken literally. That argument means nothing when it is humans -- fallable, varied humans -- who are doing the reading.

No, I don't! I believe the Bible is 100% true, accurate and literal in the proper context. If I can't believe and rely on the whole book, I might just as well throw it away, because it's worth then becomes what I choose to make it. That is the difference. You either take the whole package, or leave it. There are ho half measures with scripture.

I'm not really looking for more examples Ron, I get the idea. But what I don't get is why you tell me I can't pick and choose, or you ask what I base my beliefs on? When from where I'm standing, we have pretty much the same approach.

Understanding the Bible is a growing and learning process. I have been studying scripture for over 30 years, so I would not expect someone with only a passing understanding to know what I have learned. The Bible is a book(s) of literal fact, and understanding the whole of scripture takes time and effort. It is not like reading comic books!

Ron, you make my point for me better than I did. Even if the Bible is a book of literal fact, it will mean different things to different people at different times, depending on their level of experience, intelligence, etc. In other words, if 10 intelligent human beings study the scripture intently for 30 years, each will come away with a different understanding of the meaning of this book of "literal fact." That is exactly the point you just made, and I agree with you.

That is why God, in his wisdom, called some to be Pastors, teachers and evangelists so that others could also learn, just like colleges provide professors to teach the rest of us. It's when you don't pay attention to the professor that you fail to grasp the course! Should we abandon all sore of learning because everyone understand according to their intelligence or it may mean something different depending ofd where they are in life? There is no difference here!

Understanding the Bible is a growing and learning process. I have been studying scripture for over 30 years, so I would not expect someone with only a passing understanding to know what I have learned. The Bible is a book(s) of literal fact, and understanding the whole of scripture takes time and effort. It is not like reading comic books!

Ron, you make my point for me better than I did. Even if the Bible is a book of literal fact, it will mean different things to different people at different times, depending on their level of experience, intelligence, etc. In other words, if 10 intelligent human beings study the scripture intently for 30 years, each will come away with a different understanding of the meaning of this book of "literal fact." That is exactly the point you just made, and I agree with you.

No, I don't! I believe the Bible is 100% true, accurate and literal in the proper context. If I can't believe and rely on the whole book, I might just as well throw it away, because it's worth then becomes what I choose to make it. That is the difference. You either take the whole package, or leave it. There are ho half measures with scripture.

I guess I just don't know how to get across what I'm trying to figure out, so I'll drop it. Thanks Ron.

She certainly has a way with words,

http://www.netscape.com/viewstory/2007/03/01/ann-coulter-let-the-libs-eat-tofu/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.humanevents.com%2Farticle.php%3Fid%3D19625&frame=true

That is why God, in his wisdom, called some to be Pastors, teachers and evangelists so that others could also learn

And each of those Pastors, teachers and evangelists will have a different understanding of this book of "literal fact." Just like every good Christian.

I get the impression that you are genuinely confused and I can understand that. I was trying to simplify it, and not being a wiseguy about it. Let me leave you with this for what it's worth . . .

If there is a God, which I believe there is, and if God were to communicate with His creation, which I believe He does, then an infallible, all knowing, all loving God would do so in a perfect, infallible manner. Can you conceive of God giving us information about Him and what He wants from us that was not literal, understandable, that was open to private interpetion and something that could not be comprehended? To provide us with a Bible that cannot be taken at face value is against the very nature of a perfect God.

I guess I just don't know how to get across what I'm trying to figure out, so I'll drop it. Thanks Ron.

I wish somebody would give Bush a BJ so we could impeach him! Any volunteers?

It might be worth it. One moment of pleasure for him, almost two years of sanity for the USA.

Of course, Cheney would have to leave office for it to make it worth while for me to volunteer..

Nancy Pelosi might do a fine job as president, she might not, but she can not do anything to top the BuSh fiasco.