I just read this article on the "Quiverfull" movement where the idea is to have as many kids as possible and that "God is the only one who can open or close the womb". Some of these idiots have 12, 18 and 20 kids.

Dumb, dumb, dumb.

I'll just assume that everyone on this forum is intelligent enough to know the reasons why this is a really bad idea, such as our severely dwindling environmental resources, for one.

On a more mundane level, every time someone complains about a new development going up behind their house, or long lines at the supermarket, or horrible traffic, I feel like screaming "that's because people are having too many *bleeping* kids!

It makes me so mad that people are so dumb.

I didn't say that..Nor did I go into any detail. If you don't believe what I do fine, but don't try to be condescending. I am not doing that to you or your beliefs. Thank you!!

NO i am VERY serious. If any of the religious types had a son shot themselves would you continue your religious practices knowing that he was "denied heaven"? We have no control over our lives or others. it is just something to think about. I was not being condencending to you at all i really dont understand and it is something this religious family is currently struggling with.

Wheetsin is nothing if not clam!

No fair....she has to be clam. She's a Moderator. Moderators aren't allowed to be controversial. Which is why most of us aren't....Moderators, that is.

Sorry...miscommunication. I thought, when you said I was quoting stuff like I was a Baptist, that you meant I was impersonating one. I was not trying to tell you what Baptists believe - only that the Baptists I know do not believe suicide is unpardonable. Maybe you are a different breed of Baptist than the ones I know. If memory serves me correctly, there are different types of Baptists, correct? One group, as I recall, are called "Feet Washing Baptists". And there are "Hard Shell Baptists", "Southern Baptists"....probably many more.

I meant no disrespect to any member of any Baptist congregation. The information about the KJV of the Bible was in response to your posts. You initially said that maybe my (Baptist) friends used a different Bible and I said not likely, since they are a bit rabid on the subject (that the KJV is somehow more "holy" than any other, in spite of its history). You, in turn, said I needed to explain my remarks, so I did.

Whew! I hope we have that all cleared up!

No, problem. I could see how you were thinking I was saying that. I was typing fast like I talk and trying to work @ the same time.

Yeah, I kind of get a kick out of people telling me that I am going to hell for being an atheist, since I consider doing that to be against the Christian ideal of "love thy neighbor." I think to myself, "If there is a hell, I'll meet you there."

I am an atheist, but I think that if I was completely wrong and there is a God, he would be compassionate instead of hard and grudge-bearing. I think that he would see into the hearts of people and judge them based on the type of person they currently are and the type of person they have been in the past. If that's the case, there are a lot of so-called Christians that wouldn't be going through the Pearly Gates. If you are a good person, you are good whether or not you believe in a higher power. I personally believe that child molesters, rapists, and murderers can't be reformed. If God is the sort of power that would allow them to reside in the same place as good, moral people, then I don't want to be in his heaven. Even if those rapists, murderers, and child molesters "repent" and believe in God, that doesn't change the fact that they are rapists, murderers, and child molesters.

I don't agree...Only b/c there are a lot of different religions/non-religions. If someones religion belief is that you are going to hell for being an atheist then that's their belief. How is that being a hyprocite? Maybe what they study says atheist will go to hell.

Your grown and know what you believe...So, what does it matter? You don't even think there's even a hell that you will go to. I know my bestfriend thinks that I won't go to Paradise Earth (what she believes) b/c I am not of her faith. Who cares, that's what she believes. I don't think she's a hypocrite. If I stressed it I would probably have an ulcer over something that doesn't effect me one bit.

And no one is perfect b/c they say they are a Christian or believe in God. I wish people would understand that. I literally think some people think that if your a Christian you should be perfect.

People love negative stuff (ie: to gossip, the Inquirer, Star Magazine). Who says look @ Miss Clara she goes to Church every Sunday, teaches bible study, feeds the homeless. But I guarantee you someone will mention, the person they see @ the club and slipping w/someone's husband.

Everyone wants to know about Brittny Spears wearing no panties, but very few even know what's going on in the world.

...And actually I was more worried about another member flaming me, ...

Me? I don't think I'd ever flame anyone for telling me what they believe. I'd flame someone for telling me that what they believe is the only possible way to think and that everyone else will be lost in an eternal micro-convection oven. And I'd also flame someone for making a statement that they seem to think is true when all the evidence in the world points to the opposite conclusion. And then, maybe I'd...well...at least we know why no one ever asks ME to be the moderator.

Funniest (to me) part of all of this is that I used to be very quiet and very private about my regligious/areligious beliefs. Even my Army dogtags said "declines to state" under religion, instead of the more in-your-face "atheist." But then I went to this (nice, quiet, pacifist) Quaker school and , of all places, THAT's where I learned to speak up on this issue...essentially, a religious school made me an out-of-the-closet atheist. Strange, I think.

NO i am VERY serious. If any of the religious types had a son shot themselves would you continue your religious practices knowing that he was "denied heaven"? We have no control over our lives or others. it is just something to think about. I was not being condencending to you at all i really dont understand and it is something this religious family is currently struggling with.

Question: How would they know if he was denied entrance into heaven? I'm confused...What religion are they? I don't believe that people die and go straight to Heaven anyway so I don't know what there question or thought process is. I can't answer for them.

And my personal belief....I am not speaking for all Baptist, but I think that killing yourself out of spite or malice is different than people that are mentally ill. Not to say they are fools, but one of my relatives always says that God looks out for babies and fools. I believe that God is fair and merciful.

OOOOOk girls:

If God is sending the children..welcome, but even God things thet the RYTHM method is a good idea.....If the problem is a religious one.

The priest that married my husband and I made the comment "If my mom had decided that having already 7 kids was enough..who would be here maring you two??? (So .....what to think...?????

Yes, if you take care of your children, feed them , clothe them and love them ...is your bussines, but as a teacher I know that is extremely hard to be able to pay attention, keep track and have energy for more then 3 kids is suuuper hard!!!

OOOOOk girls:

If God is sending the children..welcome, but even God things thet the RYTHM method is a good idea.....If the problem is a religious one.

The priest that married my husband and I made the comment "If my mom had decided that having already 7 kids was enough..who would be here maring you two??? (So .....what to think...?????

Yes, if you take care of your children, feed them , clothe them and love them ...is your bussines, but as a teacher I know that is extremely hard to be able to pay attention, keep track and have energy for more then 3 kids is suuuper hard!!!

LOL, someone else would have done it...:faint:

Question: How would they know if he was denied entrance into heaven? I'm confused...What religion are they? I don't believe that people die and go straight to Heaven anyway so I don't know what there question or thought process is. I can't answer for them.

 

And my personal belief....I am not speaking for all Baptist, but I think that killing yourself out of spite or malice is different than people that are mentally ill. Not to say they are fools, but one of my relatives always says that God looks out for babies and fools. I believe that God is fair and merciful.

 

I THINK they are Catholic. But whatever they are they are going thru alot. I am not damning religion by any means. As i have said before i am very curious about and want to understand it.

 

Also understnad that i was born to a sicilian catholic father and presbyterian mother.

 

I went to :

 

a presbyterian church for 3 yrs

a catholic church for 2

a quaker meeting for 5

a baptist church for 4

A black baptist (*very different then white baptist and the most fun of them all ) for 1

 

This was so i could see how different people study religion. So i am not religionless as you may think, i am more agnostic after the whole thing. I see it more as a pissing contest on who can love someone/something more. But as far as religion itself i am sorry if anyone here gets the idea that i dont respect people with religion. to me it is nothing special. I dont belive there is a heaven or hell. I think my flesh rots and i am gone.

 

Say i am wrong and go to hell.... well! i know there will be alot of people there that i would know. If there is a heaven and i happen to pass the test then score for me. But i am not dedicating my whole life on this earth to something that i can not see, touch, hold or enjoy. I would rather have a pet. But that is just how i feel. I do not feel that you are bad or stupid bc you like god. What ever floats everyones boat! Just dont make laws that are religious soaked that mean i have no control of my body.

I THINK they are Catholic.

Many years ago the Catholic church denied suicides the right to be buried in hallowed ground. They no longer do that. Now they recognize that people who take their own lives are emotionally disturbed and not in control of all their faculties. The Catholic church is very compassionate to the families of suicide victims in this day and age. However, if the boy has grandparents or great grandparents from the "old church" (pre Vatican II), they might have voiced the opinion that he wasn't going to heaven. Fortunately, they don't get to make that call. Only God does.

Thank you Carlene. That makes a lot of sense. And who know what and how has sad anything. they are all so distrught right now. But i can say ( and this is a PLUS that i see with church)

Is they have ALL come out to care for the family. The food, support and such has been immense. And i appreciate that churches can be such a support network.

Thanks for clearing it up alittle.

Wow! I go away scuba diving for one day and this whole thread changes! Pam, I am very much impressed with your calm, thorough presentation of the Gospel. Kudos to you. I don't know if I could add anything except one thing, to whoever it was that commented that because there are more Christians than non-Christians around the world, therefore the Christians can't be right. The quantity of people who believe in something doesn't always determine correctness. Just speak with Galileo or Columbus about that.

I agree with Carlene...Only God does.

As a catholic I can tell you that the church is very different now.....my 90 year old grandmother (Bless her heart) keeps saying that is wonderful how now ,all religions view each other as brothers and sisters in Christ...when before we were all about attacking each other

Well ..It was a pleasure being here with you.......see you some other time.

God Bless...Maro

I agree with Carlene...Only God does.

As a catholic I can tell you that the church is very different now.....my 90 year old grandmother (Bless her heart) keeps saying that is wonderful how now ,all religions view each other as brothers and sisters in Christ...when before we were all about attacking each other

Your grandmother obviously does not spend much time hanging out here....LOL