A friend emailed me this letter concerning Obama's trip to Montana. It is sickening to me all that he is doing to our once wonderful nation. Please read it and comment if you please.

Hello All,

By now you have probably heard that President Obama came to Montana last Friday. However, there are many things that the major news has not covered. I feel that since Bill and I live here and we were at the airport on Friday I should share some facts with you. Whatever you decide to do with the information is up to you. If you chose to share this email with others I do ask that you DELETE my email address before you forward this on.

On Wednesday, August 5th it was announced locally that the President would be coming here. There are many groups here that are against his healthcare and huge spending so those groups began talking and deciding on what they were going to do. The White House would not release ANY details other than the date.

On about Tuesday, Bill found out that they would be holding the "Town Hall" at the airport. (This is only because Bill knows EVERYONE at the airport). Our airport is actually located outside of Belgrade (tiny town) in a very remote location. Nothing is around there. They chose to use a hangar that is the most remotely located hangar. You could not pick a more remote location, and you can not get to it easily. It is totally secluded from the public.

FYI: We have many areas in Belgrade and Bozeman which could have held a large amount of folks with sufficient parking. (gymnasiums/auditoriums). All of which have chairs and tables, and would not have to be SHIPPED IN. $$$$$

During the week, cargo by the TONS was being shipped in constantly. Airport employees could not believe how it just kept coming. Though it was our President coming, several expressed how excessive it was, especially during a recession. $$$$$

Late Tuesday/early Wednesday the 12th, they said that tickets would be handed out on Thursday, 9am at two locations, and the president would be arriving around 12:30 Friday.

Thursday morning about 600 tickets were passed out. However, 1500 were printed at a Local printing shop per White House request. Hmmmm......900 tickets just DISAPPEARED.

This same morning someone called into the radio from the local UPS branch and said that THOUSANDS of Dollars of Lobster were shipped in for Obama. Montana has some of the best beef in the nation! And it would have been really wonderful to help out the local economy. Anyone heard of the Recession?? Just think...with all of the traveling the White House is doing. $$$$$ One can only imagine what else we are paying for.

On Friday, Bill and I got out to the airport about 10:45am. The groups that wanted to protest Obama's spending and healthcare had gotten a permit to protest and that area was roped off. But that was not to be. A large bus carrying SEIU (Service Employees International Union) members drove up onto the area (illegal) and unloaded right there. It was quite a commotion and there were specifically 2 SEIU men trying to make trouble and start a fight. Police did get involved and arrested the one man but they said they did not have the manpower to remove the SEIU crowd.

The SEIU crowd was very organized and young. About 99% were under the age of 30 and they were not locals! They had bullhorns and PROFESSIONALLY made signs. Some even wore preprinted T-shirts. Oh, and Planned Parenthood folks were with them.....professing abortion rights with their T-shirts and preprinted signs. (BTW, all these folks did have a permit to protest in ANOTHER area)

Those against healthcare/spending moved away from the SEIU crowd to avoid confrontation. They were orderly and respectful. Even though SEIU kept coming over and walking through, continuing to be very intimidating and aggressive at the direction of the one SEIU man.

So, we had Montana folks from ALL OVER the state with their homemade signs and their DOGS with homemade signs. We had cowboys, nurses, doctors you name it. There was even a guy from Texas who had been driving through. He found out about the occasion, went to the store, made a sign, and came to protest.

If you are wondering about the press... Well, all of the major networks were over by that remote hangar I mentioned. They were conveniently parked on the other side of the buildings FAR away. None of these crowds were even visible to them. I have my doubts that they knew anything about the crowds.

We did have some local news media around us from this state and Idaho . Speaking of the local media...they were invited. However, all questions were to be turned into the White House in advance of the event. Wouldn't want anyone to have to think off the top of their head.

It was very obvious that it was meant to be totally controlled by the White House. Everything was orchestrated down to the last detail to make it appear that Montana is just crazy for Obama and government healthcare. Even those people that talked about their insurance woes...the White House called our local HRDC (Human Resource and Development Committee) and asked for names. Then the White House asked those folks to come. Smoke and mirrors...EVERYTHING was staged!!!!!!!!!!!

I am very dismayed about what I learned about our current White House. The amount of control and manipulation was unbelievable. I felt I was not living in the United States of America , more like the USSR. I was physically nauseous.

Bill and I have been around when Presidents or Heads of State visit. It has NEVER been like this. I am truly very frightened for our country. America needs your prayers and your voices. If you care about our country please get involved. Know the issues. And let Congress hear your voices again and again! If they are willing to put forth so much effort to BULLY a small town one can only imagine what is going on in Washington DC. Scary.

K.

Bozeman , Montana

Thanks patty, for pointing out at least one ambiguous bit of writing in the Bible.

You're welcome, bjean. Is their any other ambiguous writing in the bible that you may need clarified?

I didn't need clarification. I just thought it was big of you to help me make my point by observing that ambiguity exists in the Bible. Particularly since you generally argue against that fact.

I didn't need clarification. I just thought it was big of you to help me make my point by observing that ambiguity exists in the Bible. Particularly since you generally argue against that fact.

I don't believe I ever said that there wasn't any figurative speech in scripture. For there is much of it. But if one actually 'reads' the scripture, it is easily recognized. Just picking out a verse or two to hand someone doesn't reveal the whole package.

Backing up a little bit, you argue in some of your earlier posts, above, that the Bible says something but that it doesn't mean what is written - it means something else. That's not just figurative speech - that's ambiguity. And yes, I'd agree that one will find that throughout the Bible. And one doesn't need to justify that by saying the Bible will only be found to be ambiguous by lifting a verse or two out of context.

You've studied the Bible, and you know all this. You've chosen to believe and interpret a certain way. Which is perfectly find by me. But I do take issue with your insistence that your interpretations and beliefs are the only real truths and that if one doesn't believe as you do and become "born again" one is going to endure hell for enternity.

Backing up a little bit, you argue in some of your earlier posts, above, that the Bible says something but that it doesn't mean what is written - it means something else. That's not just figurative speech - that's ambiguity. And yes, I'd agree that one will find that throughout the Bible. And one doesn't need to justify that by saying the Bible will only be found to be ambiguous by lifting a verse or two out of context.

Yes. I am saying that the bible will only be found ambiguious by lifting a verse or two out of context. One who has read it all as a whole can easily see that there are 3 kinds of languages in the bible. Figurative, Symbolic, and Literal. Figurative language has meaning that is made clear by the context. Symbolic language is explained either in the same chapter or somewhere else in the bible. The rest of the language in the bible is to be interpreted literally, according to the customary rules of grammar and rhetoric. That is, we are to read the bible as we would read any other book, letting it say what it wants to say and not allegorizing or spiritualize its meaning. It is this false method of of interpreting scripture that has led to the origin of so many religious sects and denominations. We should never misinterpret, misapply, or dislocate the scripture. The trouble is that men are not willing to let the scriptures say what they want to say. This is largely due to their training, environment, prejudice, or desire to make the scripture teach some favorite doctrine.

You've studied the Bible, and you know all this. You've chosen to believe and interpret a certain way. Which is perfectly find by me. But I do take issue with your insistence that your interpretations and beliefs are the only real truths and that if one doesn't believe as you do and become "born again" one is going to endure hell for enternity.

There is only one way to interpert this saying of God:

"I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again." John 3:3.

It's not like being born again is such a difficult thing. Put your faith in God to save you through his son, Jesus, who gave his life to take the punishment for your sins so you wouldn't have to. That's all. Believe it and you will go to heaven. The sad thing is that so many let this life slip away and refuse to be a part of their own creators family. Why? I don't know.

The reason you don't know, can't understand, is because you are not open to other knowledge or truth than the one you are convinced is singularly correct.

Not true. I have studied most of the major faiths in the world. Only the Christian faith could be true. It's the only one that when I embraced it, the living God came to dwell within me.

Not true. I have studied most of the major faiths in the world. Only the Christian faith could be true. It's the only one that when I embraced it, the living God came to dwell within me.

When you say "studied", what exactly do you mean by that? Read some brochures? Went to meetings? Read the Torah/Koran/Book of Mormon/etc?

Just Curious.....

I heard that rumor. I think it is something some good humored Dems floated out there just to be funny. I'm not sure that the Republicans are THAT dumb. But geez, they did run her for V.P. and actually used him for V.P., so nothing's impossible. You know a photo with those two with shotguns is a true dream ticket for the neocons.

I think it’s just a rumor. For it to be true it would have to be Palin for Pres and Cheney for VP. He has a proven record of being the brains behind the jacka$$.

When you say "studied", what exactly do you mean by that? Read some brochures? Went to meetings? Read the Torah/Koran/Book of Mormon/etc?

Just Curious.....

I have read the book of Mormon, I have read the Jehovah's witnesses bible. I have read many, many, many books on all faiths. I have researched Islam. I have read parts of the Quaran? Did I spell that right?....I have personally known a follower of Buddah and have come to understand his beliefs through him and his practices. I have a very close indian friend who converted to christianity from The Hindu religion and have spoken with her extensively on the Hindu religion amny times. I was raised in the Catholic church, and fully understand their doctrine. I ahve read books entitled "all the religions of the world".

The fact that you're convinced that your faith is real to you is not in question as far as I'm concerned. Nor is the fact that you've read various other religious literature or spoken with people of other faiths.

People who believe they have been abducted by aliens is very real to them as well. Doesn't mean that they didn't experience an event in their head that was a few synapses short of normal brain function though. Just like folks who see ghosts. There are even ghostbusters that go about chasing out the little devils. There are priests who are summoned sometimes to cast out the devils and ghosts and demons when there's been an infestation. So there are all kinds of situations that we could discuss here and argue the validity of people's personal experiences.

I have no doubt that when I hear someone say they have talked with God and he has spoken to them and people who say they have seen him, that it is perfectly real to them. But it is a condition (IMHO) that is present in their brains that makes it so real.

For those who talk to and see God, the elation they feel is real, the peace they feel is real. Just as the fear someone experiences when they've seen a ghost; the fear and the terror they experience is real. But they are feelings. Mentally induced feelings. Convincing to be sure, but not actually REAL. All IMHO, of course.

Totally agree Bjean. I too believe that people really do believe in their own hearts that their own religious experience are real.

Patty, with all due respect to your beliefs, I have to agree with BJean. You see, for me, faith or someone else’s account of a miracle is just not enough for me. It’s not that I am cynical (well maybe a little:sneaky:), it’s just my analytical nature. Please don’t make another analogy about not seeing air, yet believing in that or asking me to prove the existence of Abe Lincoln based on old history books. You know that those are hollow comparisons and really do a disservice to your argument.

The fact that you're convinced that your faith is real to you is not in question as far as I'm concerned. Nor is the fact that you've read various other religious literature or spoken with people of other faiths.

People who believe they have been abducted by aliens is very real to them as well. Doesn't mean that they didn't experience an event in their head that was a few synapses short of normal brain function though. Just like folks who see ghosts. There are even ghostbusters that go about chasing out the little devils. There are priests who are summoned sometimes to cast out the devils and ghosts and demons when there's been an infestation. So there are all kinds of situations that we could discuss here and argue the validity of people's personal experiences.

I have no doubt that when I hear someone say they have talked with God and he has spoken to them and people who say they have seen him, that it is perfectly real to them. But it is a condition (IMHO) that is present in their brains that makes it so real.

For those who talk to and see God, the elation they feel is real, the peace they feel is real. Just as the fear someone experiences when they've seen a ghost; the fear and the terror they experience is real. But they are feelings. Mentally induced feelings. Convincing to be sure, but not actually REAL. All IMHO, of course.

I also agree with BJean here as well.

I also could care less if that belief is wrong, too. Even if you really did talk and see God, it doesn't change my own personal beliefs. And I still think it's ignorant to think that there is only one right way, and anyone who doesn't believe is wrong.

I heard that rumor. I think it is something some good humored Dems floated out there just to be funny. I'm not sure that the Republicans are THAT dumb. But geez, they did run her for V.P. and actually used him for V.P., so nothing's impossible. You know a photo with those two with shotguns is a true dream ticket for the neocons.

Oh man, I can only hope this is true. That would be my dream ticket.

Oh man, I can only hope this is true. That would be my dream ticket.

Mine, too! :thumbup: