What would happen if Barack Obama were Assasinated?

green · October 18, 2008

As has been pointed out, William Ayres was a radical when he was a young man and Obama was only 8 years old. He is now a professor at a respected American university, the University of Chicago. Does this mean that those who sit on the hiring board of this university are also traitors to your country? Or does this mean that William Ayres has in some fashion redeemed himself over the years? I am inclined to think that the second guess is more likely.

Also, I see nothing particularly wrong in Obama's association with this man or his rather unusual pastor. Your own Jesus Christ associated with quite an array of folk who could not be considered to fall into the mainstream of society at the time that He was alive. It is utterly idiotic (and grasping at straws) to consider Barack Obama a traitor merely through association.

green · October 18, 2008

As for Palin, her husband was a member of a party which desires independence for Alaska. Ain't he a traitor?

luluc · October 18, 2008

The "terrorist" was William Ayres... Yes, he did acts of terrorism, as did many during the vietnam era. A sad but true fact. He is now a distuingished professor. Another true fact. His association goes as far as being on a board of directors with him. (As I have sat on several boards - often times with people who I have no outside association with). I sware, I wish people would quite acting as though Obama were sitting next to him making bombs... geez
The "Radical' was Rev. Jeremiah Wright. And he is so radical that he, while preaching God, actually expects that America would look at what it does instead of expecting that God will bless us just because we're americans. How radical is that. I may not like the way that Rev. Wright says things, but if you really think about it, he makes some great points. (If a white, middle class man in Texas who is proud to be in America, and proud to have served his country in the US Navy, even if it was in the peace time can agree with such radicalism).

And just so we can be clear, if you go to a United Methodist church, a Lutheran church, a Disciples of Christ church, an Episcopal church, or the Catholic church in the United States, then your pastor is probably a radical, since in seminary, the most likely studied the works of James Cone, the Liberation Theologian that had such an influence on Jeremiah Wright. As a professor at Union Theological Seminary (A United Methodist seminary), his books are widely studied. After all, it is a well accepted theolgoical approach.

steve - i really enjoy your posts.

i've stayed away from the political convos lately - because of the sheer nonsense discussed.

i am voting for obama, i am pro choice, palin is the joke that will disgrace mccain's political career....there i feel better.

continue the debate...

LoneStarLoser · October 18, 2008

I'm sorry that you speak for others when you say "some like to discuss other things as well... in short... We dot care. " I'd like to think they do care.

And as I mentioned in my post " But right or wrong, just MY opinion."

Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

Martin Luther King

Have a nice day TheWatcher.

gadgetlady · October 18, 2008

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gadgetlady · October 18, 2008

As has been pointed out, William Ayres was a radical when he was a young man and Obama was only 8 years old. He is now a professor at a respected American university, the University of Chicago. Does this mean that those who sit on the hiring board of this university are also traitors to your country? Or does this mean that William Ayres has in some fashion redeemed himself over the years? I am inclined to think that the second guess is more likely.

Would you feel the same way if McCain had launched his political career from the home of someone who had bombed an abortion clinic 30 years ago, and said 7 years ago that he wished he had gone further? Or would you be OK if he had political and financial connections to someone who used to be a member of the KKK but wasn't any longer (and not only never denounced what he did, but said he wished he had done more)?

stevegoad · October 18, 2008

Don't be upset, lonestarloser. There is an off-topic sub-forum that's just meant for fun - of course, when you get into politics, fun gets pretty serious.

Edited October 18, 2008 by stevegoad

stevegoad · October 18, 2008

Would you feel the same way if McCain had launched his political career from the home of someone who had bombed an abortion clinic 30 years ago, and said 7 years ago that he wished he had gone further? Or would you be OK if he had political and financial connections to someone who used to be a member of the KKK but wasn't any longer (and not only never denounced what he did, but said he wished he had done more)?

If the person had (somehow) become a top professor at a major university, and had shown him to be a pillar of his community with no current charges over his head, and was not in any way partaking in said crimes, I would try to look at the person who they had become.

gadgetlady · October 18, 2008

Don't be upset. There is an off-topic sub-forum that's just meant for fun - of course, when you get into politics, fun gets pretty serious.

I think what upset him/her wasn't the existence of a sub-forum, but the less-than-respectful explanation of the existence of that sub-forum.

gadgetlady · October 18, 2008

If the person had (somehow) become a top professor at a major university, and had shown him to be a pillar of his community with no current charges over his head, and was not in any way partaking in said crimes, I would try to look at the person who they had become.

Really? If someone used to be a member of the KKK, NEVER denounced their actions, SAID recently that he wished they had gone further, still held radical and troubling positions, but had somehow managed to effect a position at a major university, you wouldn't doubt their motives? You wouldn't question whether they were still a radical and had just managed to weasel their way around the system, navigate the system, manipulate the system, etc.? I don't know. We are all very practiced at hiding the things we don't want others to see. I believe very strongly in redemption, forgiveness, and giving people second chances, but when the person who committed the crimes doesn't denounce them but rather praises them and whose only regret is that he didn't do more, I have to question his current motives and state-of-mind -- regardless of what his current job is.

green · October 18, 2008

Would you feel the same way if McCain had launched his political career from the home of someone who had bombed an abortion clinic 30 years ago, and said 7 years ago that he wished he had gone further? Or would you be OK if he had political and financial connections to someone who used to be a member of the KKK but wasn't any longer (and not only never denounced what he did, but said he wished he had done more)?

Stevegoad has done a nice job of answering your question of how I feel about William Ayres. He was a radical when he was a young man. He is now a respected professor. Obama seems to know him - and only slightly, I gather - in this, his current role. And no, I would have no problem if McCain launched his political career from the living room of someone who had at one time been responsible for bombing abortion clinics but who had become a respected member of society by the time that McCain was associating with him. I do admit that I would be ill at ease with a politician who had associations with KKK members, former or otherwise. I would certainly want to know more about the association.

But in general, I believe that it is a good thing for anyone to make the acquaintance of a wide variety of individuals in one's life. It is a way of deepening and broadening one's understanding of others. It is, for instance, only thanks to the internet that I have met so many Christians. I don't tend to run across them in my "real" life. The folks I know are either atheists or have a weak and ill-defined belief that there is something out there.

stevegoad · October 18, 2008

Really? If someone used to be a member of the KKK, NEVER denounced their actions, SAID recently that he wished they had gone further, still held radical and troubling positions, but had somehow managed to effect a position at a major university, you wouldn't doubt their motives? You wouldn't question whether they were still a radical and had just managed to weasel their way around the system, navigate the system, manipulate the system, etc.? I don't know. We are all very practiced at hiding the things we don't want others to see. I believe very strongly in redemption, forgiveness, and giving people second chances, but when the person who committed the crimes doesn't denounce them but rather praises them and whose only regret is that he didn't do more, I have to question his current motives and state-of-mind -- regardless of what his current job is.

Thank you for restating the same argument as before...

Yes. Really.

Jesus told the woman - "Go and sin no more." Not, "go, but we'll be watching you like a hawk, and never trust you again."

I don't know if in his heart he is repentant. No it doesn't sound like it, but maybe he has... I have not heard anyone ask him since the election process began.

Do I like what he did... no. Do I like what he said on Sept. 11... No. Nor do I like Jerry Falwell's statements about God's wrath on New Orleans after hurricane Katrina. And I am completely opposed to people shooting moose for fun and profit (although Sarah Palin might be a good one to teach Dick Chaney how to shoot without hitting a fellow hunter).

And further, I don't like little baby ducks, old pickup trucks or onions.

But facts are facts, and the fact is, he is currently living as a law-abiding, upstanding citizen in Chicago, IL (last I checked, that's still in America).

gadgetlady · October 18, 2008

And no, I would have no problem if McCain launched his political career from the living room of someone who had at one time been responsible for bombing abortion clinics but who had become a respected member of society by the time that McCain was associating with him.

I would. I'd have a problem if someone launched his political career or had numerous ties both socially and professionally to an unrepentant abortion-clinic bomber, an unrepentant KKK member, or an unrepentant terrorist bomber.

green · October 18, 2008

I have or have had ties with people who have done things I wouldn't do. And there are people who have ties with me, an individual who has done things that they wouldn't do. I believe that adults can associate with other adults, even enjoy and value their company, and yet still maintain their own intrinsic standards of behaviour. One of my closest friends for many years was a Communist and an ardent trade unionist. She tried for many years to get me interested but the "magic" never ever did rub off! For 9 years I went to a boarding school run by nuns but belief never rubbed off, either.

By the way, I really do find it impossible to believe that Obama is quietly knitting bombs thanks to his association with Ayres.