You all know how I would vote. So lets see how many like me are out there.

He should have "come into ye" before he committed the crime. Thats what i cant stand, people find god after committing hanus dispicable crimes, find god after the fact. Look at child molesters, they do it, get out and do it again and all these kids that get taken and end up dead. These people should die a slow,painful, horrifying death like the innocent kids did. Id be more than happy to assist in any way. Also rapists, for some reason these crimes arent condidered as serious as murder, if you ask me both crimes are just as bad because both women and children suffer permanent scars for life. And both should be punishable by death because they are definately pre-meditated. My opinion on abortion is im personally against it, but its not my right or anyone elses to tell a woman who was raped or incest what to do with their body. If I had to experience either i might change my mind. I look at it in very simple terms when i say im against. I look at my kids and think i could never do that to a kid but like i said i look in simple terms, its very complex and i wouldnt judge someone either way(abort,keep)in situation of rape or incest. My wife worked with a girl i believe was around 22 years old. She told my wife she was pregnant from 1 night stand and was going to abort the kid. I judge her as an irresponsible piece of you know what! She said she was going to have a hard time meeting men at 22 with a baby(I dont mean this seriously) but maybe the baby was better off, rather than being raised by selfish mom. Hi again Cleosmom, a few more topics that i have strong opinions on. Oh im definately not a holy-roller although ive worked with alot, very annoying, they seem to believe theyre better than most and always want you to see it their way. Cleosmom im rambling again but heres a good example. Ive told you i have my own plumbing co. I was helping a buddy of mine who works for a plumbing co.(Cleosmom will know,Westmoreland Affordable Plumbing). In their add and on their vans they say theyre "Christian Owned". My buddy laughed when i asked him about the sticker on the van, and he said "John(owner) laughs, customers call because this add and when he hangs up he calls them dumb a%$es,etc for calling because the add(customer, "I called because your add said christian owned"). I worked for a guy, we where at a customers house selling a furnace, when my boss thought he was going to lose the sale he said "watch this, "maam, i just want you to know we are a christian run business", and thank god i think it turned the customer off, we left without a sale. When i told this same boss i witnessed one of his salesmen deliberately ripping a customer off he said, oh so-n-so wouldnt do that i keep him on a tight leash(salesman uses scare tactics to sale,(republican im sure) and preys on old people and women) mistake to prey on women, i find women know more about my field than men,I explain to women because i deal mostly with women.Men just act like they know and i can tell by talking to them that they dont,haha.Anyhow this same boss would buy fruit by the case and take it to his church(actually i drove it there),he told me he only does it so the minister tells the congregation and they use his plumbing heating business. (Hes born again and an ordained minister) How hipocrytical is that. I probably shouldnt say this but these holy roller fanatics turn me off. They use Christianity for monetary purposes and they usually have money.Just to be clear, i dont have any problem with people who practice religion, my kids go to catholic school and i go to church once in a while. I just dont like when others try to force their beliefs on eveyone else.On the other side there are hypocrits at my church(catholic). I was leaving church one sunday morning and i heard a guy behind me(a group of older folks)say"lets get to eat-n-park(resturaunts in pittsburgh area)before the "made-up religions let out".Act all nice in church until the minute your foot hits the sidewalk outside. Very hypocritical! Sorry for long post i kept thinking of new "stuff" as i was going along, i hate to read long posts, sorry have a good night.

The thing with the salesman was(i feel i need to explain)I was replacing a residential sewer from the house to the street. Where it ties into the street is like i tee. That tee fitting is a part of the city sewer called the "tap". To replace the tap is alot of money). I had the old sewer removed from the ditch. I saw the salesman shoveling dirt into the tap so he could tell the customer it was bad and needed replaced, also.(i saw him doing this after i came back from using the phone). I `went back to the office and told my boss,thats when he said "so-n-so wouldnt do that etc. I was scheduled to go back to replace tap(4500.00 more).Iquit the day before i was scheduled to go back and thats when i started my own business. My reason for this post was to show you how evil money makes people,even the "most religious people". HYPOCRITS!!! Thanks and have a good night

Money and power corrupt, absolutely.

It's part of our capitalistic society, unfortunately.

Your stories are interesting, bob. I can identify with them. They're a little hard to read because you don't use a lot of punctuation, but a lot of people think I use too many commas.

Very hypocritical! Sorry for long post i kept thinking of new "stuff" as i was going along, i hate to read long posts, sorry have a good night.

Well, you spoke a lot of truth. It is obvious that you THINK. I don't agree with everything you say but I do appreciate honest appraisal. I intentionally avoid patronising businesses that advertise "Christian Owned" because I believe that is missuse and abuse of religion when it is obviously for monetary gain. Sort of reminds me of the story of the money changers in the temple.

I am glad you are there and if I were in your area, I would have a job for you today as I just called a plumber, lol!

Corliss

Edited January 18, 201016 yr by Corliss
another thought

I leave punctuation out because im not the best typist, im always in a hurry and i cant find some of the punctuation keys, believe it or not (this topic)these posts are really the first posts on computer other than 2-3 on regular lap. forum. Arent you guys lucky! or as we say in pittsburgh "arent yins lucky".

Bob if I disagreed with everything you say, I'd probably give you a hard time about it, but you do make some interesting points and you bring another viewpoint to the discussion. It's all good!

PG...The reason I interpret it like that is because the death penalty is not taking care of a prisoner.

Thank you, BJean! This is totally off topic, but I love your name. Only because I show American Saddlebred show horses and Road Ponies, and my favorite Road Pony is named Beaulah Jean (who is the current and 2 time World Grand Champion, the highest title you can get). Random..I know lol

The death penalty is not for ALL prisoners. Only those who bring about death. Jesus said to remember those in prison because there are many who have committed crimes that are not deserving of the death penalty.

Patty: I know the death penalty is not for all orisoners. Here is a great example of how people interpret a Bible verse differently. You think it means one thing and I think it means something else. And don't tell me I'm wrong because your mind works differently than mine and I have the right to interpret that verse on what I believe it says. If you shouldn't interpret things differently than pastors would not preach them differently.

Yes, as in telling the truth. Specifically, "thou shalt not bear false witness." The blanket statements you make about liberals are false witness. You are not the only one, there are loads of folks who go about ranting this drivel. As far as fear goes, you are obviously afraid to examine evidence which is contrary to your precious belief system. You don't have to make choices you can just go right along and do as you are taught. You don't have to test your faith, because you never seriously consider any alternatives. There is lots of security there.

What about feeding the hungry and comforting the sick? Visiting the prisoner? Clothing the poor? How high on your list of priorities are those things. Many religious conservatives feel that these very actions are sinful and result in "taking care of those who won't take care of themselves."

I said earlier I don't generally bother to discuss this with people who claim Biblical authority, and I probably should not go any further here.

This forum is a "rants and raves" forum. That is what we do here. On this forum there are many controversial issues being discussed. The debate is about those issues. When I speak about them, you hear my point of view on them, whether right or wrong, not necessarily my of view on what people should be doing in life, like good deeds, caring for the sick and feeding the hungry. Conservative do not feel that taking care of the sick, feeding the hungry or those other things you mentioned are sinful. Where do you get that? But, if you want to know how I participate in these things, I will share them. They are high on my priority list. I contribute to my church food pantry and local food pantry often. I have taken in children to care for them. (I did 20 years of Foster care) And have adopted 3 abused and neglected children. I teach a local girls club class. I have taught Sunday school. I write weekly to a young man in prison, and I give to the prison ministry that is set up by men in my church. I donate to the clothing drives. I support missionaries in many countries. I support the Teen Challenge Program in CT that helps drug and alcohol addicted people. I have cared for the elderly for many years and bring entertainment and services to them. I am not a sit back and complain Christian. I try to do what I am able to do for my community.

I do not believe that I am lying when I make a blanket statement about liberals. Jesus called the pharasees and Saducees 'hypocrites!' in a blanket statement. Did he mean 'all' Pharasees and 'all' Saducees were hypocrites? Or was he giving a generalization of them?

As for being afraid to examine evidence that is contrary to my belief sytem, there is none. The bible is God's word and I believe it. I will never put any of man's writings or words ahead of or above His. I have looked at many things that people have written that they feel out trumps what God has to say, but I don't believe any of it. I am not afraid to look into it at all. I just don't believe it over what the bible says.

Patty: I know the death penalty is not for all orisoners. Here is a great example of how people interpret a Bible verse differently. You think it means one thing and I think it means something else. And don't tell me I'm wrong because your mind works differently than mine and I have the right to interpret that verse on what I believe it says. If you shouldn't interpret things differently than pastors would not preach them differently.

I understand that people interpret verses to mean different things. But you can not just take a verse out of the bible and make your own 'doctrine' out of it. You must take the bible as a whole and consider all the verses that speak of the death penalty and God's judgement and his just charachter and his laws and reasonings to form a biblical truth about an issue.

Just as we said. People have their own interpretation and no ones is better or more accurate than the next.

Different people have lifted verses from the Bible since its' inception and have eventually developed church doctrines based on them. Seventh Day Adventist is just one example of that. Christian Science is another. There are hundreds more, perhaps thousands.

Yet you believe that you can read the Bible and have all the answers. In fact, you believe that so strongly you go about telling everyone exactly what is right and what is wrong based on your beliefs. And you make judgements about everyone else based on those beliefs.

Your faith should be a personal relationship between you and God. But you preach from this Lap Band pulpit. And the part that is so distasteful to others is that you don't take responsibility for your beliefs, your Biblical interpretations or your faith. Instead you claim that you get your authority through the Bible and that it is literally God's word. You make broad statements, generalizations and judgements and claim that YOU are not saying it that it is God who is saying it.

It doesn't matter what any other person believes or what any church doctrine puts forth based on the Bible. If their beliefs differ from your very specific, single-minded beliefs, they are wrong. And if one is not "born again" they're going to hell.

We would be delighted if you had the ultimate answer to all life's questions. Unfortunately you do not. But the most unfortunate part is that you know not that you know not.

I believe that you think you are on a mission from God here but I believe that you are actually on a quest for higher learning. I hope that you will eventually open yourself up to expanding your spirituality and that you won't have to depend so much on this blind faith that keeps you nailed to the ground.

It doesn't matter what any other person believes or what any church doctrine puts forth based on the Bible. If their beliefs differ from your very specific, single-minded beliefs, they are wrong. And if one is not "born again" they're going to hell.

No. It doesn't matter what they believe or what their church doctrine puts forth, if it doesn't line up with the word of God, it is wrong.

The catholics say that Mary was a virgin all her life but the bible teaches that Jesus had brothers and sisters. This is their doctrine, yet it is WRONG. It does not line up with God's word. The Jehovah's Witnesses say that Jesus is not God. This does not line up with the word. The baptists feel that you can't lose your salvation, ever. This is in contradiction to the word of God. So, you see, there are many people who feel they have it right, and do not. I am sure there are things that I feel strongly about, but may have wrong. But at least I admit that if it doesn't line up with God's word, I'm wrong about it.

Now, what have I said about homosexuals, abortions or any other issue we are posting about here that is not correct as far as the bible is concerned? I will tackle them one issue at a time and show you through God's word that he is against them.

Im not trying to take sides here but i believe some people make religion a big part of their lives and thats what makes them feel comfortable. When discussing issues no matter the subject, thats what they know and its probably easier for them to relate it to everyday life. Sometimes I actually wish i could be more into religion. I dont mind if people refer to religion in conversation. I just dont want others beliefs pushed upon me. I had a work aquaintence, we went to plumbing school together. One day i sat down and he started talking about god and telling me i should become born again so i can go to heaven. He told me i needed to read and believe in the new testament to be born again. He started telling me , although he found god he was a sinner but the difference was god forgave him. Not only did it turn me off, it pissed me off! Like i said i dont have any problem with the religious beliefs of others as long as it stays with others. Like someone else said before (i dont consider myself overly religious, but i choose to keep it to myself.