Enabling

[Butterthebean 8,146]

I've got a sad story about enabling. It starts with my FIL...as most sad stories do. He's an 80 year old, rural, southern baptist preacher. And he strongly believes that overeating is a sin. My MIL is overweight so he hasn't missed a day in the last 50 years to make a snarky remark about her weight. My wife and her 2 sisters listened to these remarks everyday of their lives so it's no wonder they all have exercise/eating/body image issues.

Ironically, my FIL who is obesity biased, has a sheltie that is grossly overweight. It is 5 years old and can barely walk. I think it weights 75 pounds.....that's massive for a sheltie. The reason is....my in laws live a very traditional country life which includes 3 home cooked meals a day. And each of these meals usually contains something fried, something starchy and the main course is usually gravy. And the dog gets a plate full at each meal. He doesn't eat dog food. Plus, every time my FIL goes anywhere near the kitchen the dog gets a piece or 2 of bologna. And the topper is, twice a week FIL makes a whole pan of cinnamon rolls, complete with icing, which he hands out to the dog as treats.

Finally the vet got fed up and accused my FIL of animal cruelty. She forced him to put the dog on low cal dog food and no more human food. This worked for about a month and the dog lost weight and started to regain some of the pep in his step. Unfortunately, after about a month the FIL gave in and went back to feeding the dog the way he always had. His reasoning was he couldn't bare to see the dog unhappy. I couldn't make this **** up.

So here's my FIL....a highly educated, spiritual, principled, moral man (albeit misguided) who is basically killing his dog with junk food because he thinks it makes him happy. Obviously the dog returns his efforts with unconditional love. What dog wouldn't? But the bottom line is the FIL is clearly having some need for unconditional love met by feeding this dog anything and everything. Obviously the dog is going to eat whatever is given him. He can't make the choice to watch what he eats. But my FIL knows better....and in spite of his obesity bias in humans, thinks it's ok to make his dog obese because it's making them both happy.

Unreasonable.

But it got me thinking.....my grandmother would have been the same age as him. And she fed me the same way when I was a kid. Basically I could have anything I wanted, and it usually started with biscuits and ended with pie. And of course I loved her dearly. Why not? She never said no to me. But I'm wondering was she also fulfilling some need to be loved by her young grandson...the same way my FIL is doing with the dog? And I'm wondering do parents do this today with their kids? Or was it just that older generation? Is this why childhood obesity is so high? Parents equating happily fed kids with loving kids? But also setting them up for a lifetime for obesity?

[Fluffnomore 1,235]

Interesting. I have an obese son, and I definitely DON'T do that with him. He has a series of food-related behaviors that we are working on, but I don't reward him with food. Plus we began CrossFit together in August and I've had a big talk with him about why I'm sleeving it.

Now, my husband might. Because my husband had a similar experience early on with food=love. His family had a nanny/maid who used to bring him donuts…they called it "The Sneaky Donut Factory." Great message: let's get you junky stuff, and let's keep it a secret! Add that to his parents both being secretive binge eaters with a flair for public fat shaming, and you have a blueprint for disaster.

My father is one of those blustery guys who says things like, "Food should hurt." And he is no lightweight.

The truth is, when my son's diet was completely under my control (when he was younger) he was slightly overweight but not obese. This has developed over the last couple of years. Interesting, interesting.

[No game 14,436]

Good thoughts and posts butter and fluff!

Families and food. Families and enabling.

Sometimes I feel like my husband is enabling me when I'm going through a rough patch.

But not purposely. When I'm battling carb demons he seems to go through the same cravings which is funny because he's very fit and athletic. But he will come home like he did last week with tortilla chips (my downfall) rustic breads.. And Nutella!! Ugh..

Kids??

I feed them healthy for the most part and my son takes after his father. He is underweight so we try and keep him fed.

Now my 17 almost 18 year old? I've feed her well and don't get me wrong she is fit. I mean downright buff. Crossfit daily, army and the wrestling coach at school just tried to recruit her last week!

But her eating? It's getting worse and worse.

Her best friend is obese. And I notice they eat a lot together. I mean a lot.

I try and talk to her about it, but she gets pissed and spits at me why would I take diet or nutrition advice from you

Her body type is mine. I see her going up a little.

I worry but I can't change what she wants to do.

Edited November 4, 2013 by laura-ven

[Butterthebean 8,146]

Good thoughts and posts butter and fluff!

Families and food. Families and enabling.

Sometimes I feel like my husband is enabling me when I'm going through a rough patch.

But not purposely. When I'm battling carb demons he seems to go through the same cravings which is funny because he's very fit and athletic. But he will come home like he did last week with tortilla chips (my downfall) rustic breads.. And Nutella!! Ugh..

Kids??

I feed them healthy for the most part and my son takes after his father. He is underweight so we try and keep him fed.

Now my 17 almost 18 year old? I've feed her well and don't get me wrong she is fit. I mean downright buff. Crossfit daily' date=' army and the wrestling coach at school just tried to recruit her last week!

But her eating? It's getting worse and worse.

Her best friend is obese. And I notice they eat a lot together. I mean a lot.

I try and talk to her about it, but she gets pissed and spits at me why would I take diet or nutrition advice from you

Her body type is mine. I see her going up a little.

I worry but I can't change what she wants to do.[/quote']

I've got a niece who is an MD. 30 years old....beautiful and built perfectly....but her mother was also built the same her whole life until she hit mid 40s....then she started battling her nosediving metabolism. Unfortunately by then....she'd been eating whatever she wanted with no consequences for so long, it's hard to reign it in.

Anyway the niece was berating her husband because he needs to go on a diet. Only he keeps researching crash diet quick fixes and she lectures him about making sustainable changes.....all the while she's eating an entire bag of tortilla chips and cheese dip.

They asked me and my advice was to do a little of both....the same approach I took after being sleeved. It's the approach I believe in. Major changes initially to get the weight off....then a more moderate approach to maintain.

[gamergirl 4,609]

Butter's post got me thinking. I think the difference between our generation and that of our grandparents is that many of us are aware of childhood obesity and actively guard against it.

I have two boys, 23 and 13. The first one is biologically mine and the second one is mine through adoption. Both their dads are thin, esp the younger one's birth father who is Kenyan and seemed very tall and skinny in his pics. But the younger one, although he didn't eat too much, wasn't getting enough exercise and was living on bread and Pasta and cheese. So we needed changes.

i was raised by a mother who couldn't spend as much time with me as she thought she should. So she spent money on me instead. I didn't want the stuff, I wanted her time and attention. It taught me early on that love is about time with our loved ones, and about giving them what they need, not what we can give easily without making any change in our own life.

Exercising doesn't come naturally to me. But when we thought the younger one needed to be more active, we all went swimming more. When we thought he didn't get out of the house enough, we all went walking. When the kids were eating all the junk we had in the house, we stopped eating it ourselves so that they wouldn't see it around in the house.

Let me tell you, when you're tired and just back from traveling or stressed, and want to just be left alone to read your book, getting up to go swimming is a PITA. Three hours gone with swimming showering etc. But if we didn't do it, we could hardly insist he should.

That, to me, is how I love and nurture my kids.

They do love me a lot, but I don't stress about being popular with them. I stress about being fair to them, and giving them their share of the family''s resources which includes time and attention from everyone to whomever needs it.

Also I think that competent kids are happy kids. The type of happiness that comes from achievement on their own, from capabilities they build, that stays with them lifelong. It can't ever be matched by cake-happiness. So if I have a choice on the type of happy I try to get for them, it's the "I'm loved, I'm capable and look what I just did" type of happiness. Not the "my mom feeds me" happiness or the "i can do whatever I want" happiness.

Sorry for the long post. I'm avoiding the real work I need to do and this thread is so dang thought-provoking!

[BKLYNgal87 503]

I have been reading this thread the last few days, and I want to thank all of you who contributed from the bottom of my heart. It's made me realize (yet again - we all need reminders sometimes) that I need to stop kidding myself. I'm yet another food addict. I always have been, and sleeve or no sleeve, fat or thin, I always will be.

There's definitely a lot of enabling that goes on on these forums. A lot of judgment too, and I'm certainly no exception. Me going on about binge drinking as a bad life decision last week is really rather hypocritical now that I think about it, being that right around the same time I was sneaking trips to the office kitchen for halloween candy my co-workers brought in. Blech. I feel disgusted with myself on so many levels. He/she who is without sin, cast the first stone. It doesn't have to be a cliche.

My coworkers are horrible enablers. They are always bringing baked goods and candy into the office (especially around the holidays) and plopping them in the office kitchen (RIGHT NEXT TO MY DESK). Not a soul can see me walk into the kitchen. I hate it. I hate them. I hate my boss for saying I couldn't move to the other bank of offices down the hall. I hate myself for not being able to resist. Grr.

But I'm going to do something productive about it this time, rather than give in again this week. Heading out to an OA meeting tonight for the first time in forever. It's not ideal because I'm not a religious person and the OA meetings near me seem to stress certain steps over others, but I can't afford private therapy right now. I'm an addict, and I need help. I really want to and need to succeed this time, at more than just weight loss. So time for me to take responsibility. I am not going to fail at this, unless I let myself.

[Fluffnomore 1,235]

The other thing that our kids have that we didn't have is 24/7 access to electronics…says the woman who has spent the last 10 days recovering on her couch with a laptop, iPhone and TV remote within reach.

It is HARD but not impossible to sandblast them out of their complacency, particularly when my example (working from home) is that I'm usually hanging around using a laptop. That's one reason we signed up for CF together. I brought him to a kids' class and he turned to me and said, "Only if you do a class after me." Couldn't very well say no.

And sure, some of this is genetic, maybe a lot. But that doesn't completely explain why one is thin/normal and the other is chubby. My daughter is not particularly more active than my son. And he is thisclose to puberty hitting, so some of this will likely straighten out as he grows (he's 11 and about my height, so he is going to grow a lot taller.) But that doesn't solve how he LOVES to eat fast, and until it hurts. (Thanks, Dad.) As a matter of fact, when I was pre-op I went out to dinner with the three of them (husband, daughter, son) and was almost sickened watching them shovel food down their gullets while I was eating broth. I am really interested to see how the sleeve changes my husband for this reason. And how, in turn, that might affect the way my kids approach food.< /p>

Edited to add: It sounds like I am blaming my husband for everything and I'm not. I cook the meals, I run the household, and I was known for sitting on the couch in my (figurative) underpants with a glass or six of wine of an evening. There are lots of behaviors to modify here. If I'd been the goddess of health and good fortune, I'd still have that 85% of my stomach.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Fluffnomore

[AuriP 420]

This post made me cry. Not the bad way though. I am the sneaky eater. My drug of choice was oatmeal cream pies, or cheese cake. I could eat those until I got sick. I often ate them inprivate after my husband and kids would go to sleep. After the box would be gone I'd feel crappy, depressed, and ashamed. Then I got the lap band and did everything I could do right but was constantly hungry. Then it got to the point that the band stopped helping me and I would get sick and hurt eating meat and veggies foods. I turned to sliders to beable to eat, gained weight, became more ashamed. I am planning on finding a psych that deals with food addictions. It is sad and encouraging to know that I'm not the only one to deal with this.

[NMJG 1,266]

(sigh) http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/topic/99211-birthday-%f0%9f%98-no-cake/

[Seela 1,187]

They make me feel a lot of things....

Sick' date=' scared, angry, concerned.

And for some of us. It gives the green light.

For me It does not get easier with time..

if anything it more challenging! Easier to become complacent.

I come here for support and to support.

But there are days when I question whether I should be here.[/quote']

All things asside I think you absolutely should be here! Most of your posts are very informative and/or inspirational. I for one am a food addict. I never had any problems with eating in front of people, but when I felt I ate a "normal" amount I would hide food and eat it in private, thoroughly enjoying it and being discussted with nyself the whole time. You said something about it being easier to be complacent. .. yes, but you don't strike me as the kind of person to take the easy way. I can tell by your posts that it helps you to help others. You belong here. /(gulp)/.

[Bombs 353]

I am a food addict and I only ate in private! I would eat very little around people. I would wait until I was alone.... Then I would relax and sooth myself by stuffing food.< /div>

. Took the words out of my mouth!!! I used to hide always.

Sent from my iPad using VST

[MichiganChic 3,262]

I've got a sad story about enabling. It starts with my FIL...as most sad stories do. He's an 80 year old, rural, southern baptist preacher. And he strongly believes that overeating is a sin. My MIL is overweight so he hasn't missed a day in the last 50 years to make a snarky remark about her weight. My wife and her 2 sisters listened to these remarks everyday of their lives so it's no wonder they all have exercise/eating/body image issues.

Ironically, my FIL who is obesity biased, has a sheltie that is grossly overweight. It is 5 years old and can barely walk. I think it weights 75 pounds.....that's massive for a sheltie. The reason is....my in laws live a very traditional country life which includes 3 home cooked meals a day. And each of these meals usually contains something fried, something starchy and the main course is usually gravy. And the dog gets a plate full at each meal. He doesn't eat dog food. Plus, every time my FIL goes anywhere near the kitchen the dog gets a piece or 2 of bologna. And the topper is, twice a week FIL makes a whole pan of cinnamon rolls, complete with icing, which he hands out to the dog as treats.

Finally the vet got fed up and accused my FIL of animal cruelty. She forced him to put the dog on low cal dog food and no more human food. This worked for about a month and the dog lost weight and started to regain some of the pep in his step. Unfortunately, after about a month the FIL gave in and went back to feeding the dog the way he always had. His reasoning was he couldn't bare to see the dog unhappy. I couldn't make this **** up.

So here's my FIL....a highly educated, spiritual, principled, moral man (albeit misguided) who is basically killing his dog with junk food because he thinks it makes him happy. Obviously the dog returns his efforts with unconditional love. What dog wouldn't? But the bottom line is the FIL is clearly having some need for unconditional love met by feeding this dog anything and everything. Obviously the dog is going to eat whatever is given him. He can't make the choice to watch what he eats. But my FIL knows better....and in spite of his obesity bias in humans, thinks it's ok to make his dog obese because it's making them both happy.

Unreasonable.

But it got me thinking.....my grandmother would have been the same age as him. And she fed me the same way when I was a kid. Basically I could have anything I wanted, and it usually started with biscuits and ended with pie. And of course I loved her dearly. Why not? She never said no to me. But I'm wondering was she also fulfilling some need to be loved by her young grandson...the same way my FIL is doing with the dog? And I'm wondering do parents do this today with their kids? Or was it just that older generation? Is this why childhood obesity is so high? Parents equating happily fed kids with loving kids? But also setting them up for a lifetime for obesity?

I think this conversation is one of many considerations for why so many of us end up with weight issues. Even though I am a Yankee ,my grandparents migrated from the hills of Kentucky to Michigan, and I was very close to them. They had a typical southern diet as you mentioned, and the more I ate, the more they loved it. My Granny taught me to cook, and had an apron on me from the time I was 2. I spent so many wonderful days with her, and I still cherish those memories. As I got married and had kids, I carried on the tradition. My family applauded me for my cooking and wonderful family gatherings - it was part of who I was. I spent so much time focuing on food and preparing it, I was missing my life!!!! I would vaguely recognize this as I was doing it, but didn't know how to stop.

Now fast forward almost a year, and things have changed. I had my family over for my daughter's 18th birthday last weekend, and I barely thought about the menu. I had enough food, but not an overwhelming abundance. And guess what, we all had a good time anyway. It made me think about how much time I've wasted over the years.

As for my kids, I "tried" to give them the best opportunity to be healthy and thin. I spent lots of time dieting and preparing healthy meals (in between all those parties) trying to set a good examle for them. But I could never let go of the way I was raised and the need to feed them. I baked all the time, took treats to school, and did all the things I thought "good" moms did. So, two of the three grils have weight issues, and the third one will just as soon as she stops playing sports. I wish I had not done that to my kids. Also, we lived next door to my parents who spoiled my kids in much the same way as I had been - only with fast food and junk becasue my mom doesn't cook

So, I will be a grandmother in a few weeks. I'm going to try to get it right this time. While I would not trade or change one thing about the way my grandparents were with me, I'm hoping to make the same impact on my grandson, but not with food or stuff. I don't want to be the enabler. This is new and unchartered territory for me....hope I can do it!

[lsereno 2,525]

Grandkids love me time. Crafts, indoor games, reading, walking the dog, riding bikes, playing games outside, watching TV together, reading. All fun and no food. My youngest grandkid is 11 now and the oldest is 19.

Lynda

[AuriP 420]

Reading this post more has me thinking about my children and how I do with them. We typically don't have a lot of junk in my house, either because I have eaten most of it or we don't have enough money to buy it with the things I do buy. I buy fruits and veggies to give to them. They have no qualms about eating a veggie or fruit. It would go easier if my husband would eat fruit or veggies. He pretty much doesn't and him being diabetic isn't helping him much either. We most likely enable each other and he's a little nervous of me going through something so drastic(as he says) but I have to do it for us and our children. He exercises and has lost 60lbs as a result of his diabetes but his diet is still pretty crappy. I also give my oldest son fruit as a reward for doing good in therapy (he's 3 with a severe speech delay) , I'm sure I'm doing him no favors. This is hard especially when all you see on television or in magazines is food or super skinny peopleeating big macs.

[PdxMan 4,292]

Wow! What a great thread. As one of the people who is consistently blamed for being non-supportive and stirring pots, it is so nice to see and read this thread. I vote that it be stickied.

It is hard for me to stay away from "enabling" threads because I feel my silence is just another means of enabling. Of course, it is seen otherwise and it is something I struggle with myself and my family. I am by no means perfect. I practice progress, not perfection. Awareness, honesty and willingness to change are keys for me.