Someone recently passed this article on to me, which I posted on another board. It was promptly removed. So sad . . .

Frightening News from France

Once again, the real news in France is conveniently

not being reported as it should. To give you an idea

of what's going on in France where there are now

between 5 and 6 million Muslims and about 600,000 Jews,

here is an email that came from a Jew living in

France. Please read! Will the world say nothing - again - as it did in Hitler's time?

"I AM A JEW -- therefore I am forwarding this to

everyone on all my e-mail lists. I will not sit back

and do nothing." Nowhere have the flames of

anti-Semitism burned more furiously than in France:

Lyon, a car was rammed into a synagogue and set

on fire. In Montpellier, the Jewish religious center

was firebombed; so were synagogues in Strasbourg and

Marseilles; so was a Jewish school in Creteil - all recently.

A Jewish sports club in Toulouse was attacked with

Molotov cocktails, and on the statue of Alfred

Dreyfus in Paris, the words "Dirty Jew" were

painted. In Bondy, 15 men beat up members of a

Jewish football team with sticks and metal bars. The

bus that takes Jewish children to school in

Aubervilliers has been attacked three times in the last 14 months.

According to the Police, metropolitan Paris has seen

10 to 12 anti-Jewish incidents PER DAY in the past

30 days. Walls in Jewish neighborhoods have been

defaced with slogans proclaiming "Jews to the gas

chambers" and "Death to the Jews."

A gunman opened fire on a Kosher butcher's shop

(and, of course, the butcher) in Toulouse , France;

a Jewish couple in their 20s were beaten up by five

men in Villeurbanne , France . The woman was

pregnant; a Jewish school was broken into and

vandalized in Sarcelles , France . This was just in

the past week.

So I call on you, whether you are a fellow Jew, a

friend, or merely a person with the capacity and

desire to distinguish decency from depravity, to do,

at least, these three simple things:

First, care enough to stay informed. Don't ever let

yourself become deluded into thinking that this is

no t your fight. I remind you of what Pastor

Neimoller said in World War II: "First they came for

the Communists, and I didn't speak up, because I

wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and

I didn't speak up, because I wasn't a Jew. Then they

came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up,

because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me,

and by that time there was no one left to speak up

for me".

Second, boycott France and French products. Only the

Arab countries are more toxically anti-Semitic and,

unlike them, France exports more than just oil and

hatred. So boycott their wines and their perfumes.

Boycott their clothes and their foodstuffs. Boycott

their movies. Definitely boycott their shores. If

we are resolved we can exert amazing pressure and,

whatever else we may know about the French, we most

certainly know that they are like a cobweb in a

hurricane in the face of well directed pressure.

Third, send this along to your family, your friends,

and your co-workers. Think of all of the people of

good conscience that you know and let them know

that you and the people that you care about need

their help. The number one best selling book in

France is "September 11: The Frightening Fraud,"

which argues that no plane ever hit the Pentagon."

I have to say that I agree with Weetsin and Alexandra. When I have lost loved ones, I also think that the people who do believe in heaven or an afterlife have it so much easier than we who are atheists. You mourn and remember the loved ones you lost, but you also realize that they are gone and that you will never see them again. You celebrate the time you had with them and you learn to never waste a single day with the loved ones you have left. In short, you deal with it. It's a part of life, no matter how unpleasant it is.

This always sounds like, "I believe just in case, because I'm afraid of the consequences that might come with not believing."

I didn't say that's WHY I believe, just that the consequences of not believing are potentially much worse.

If I believed that there was no hope of ever seening my loved ones again, it would make the loss so much harder.

You are so right, Ron. The last words my late husband heard were mine. The nurses had been telling me that I needed to give him permission to "go". They urged me to talk to him. They said hearing is the last sense we lose before death. So I told him, "You don't have to stay for me. I'll be alright. I love you and I will see you again." He took one long breath and let it out, like a sigh of relief, and then he was gone.

I didn't come to believe because I was afraid of the consequences of not believeing or because of "blind faith".

Once I started to investigate the claims of the faith, I weighed all the evidence and was convinced beyond a reasonable doubt that there was a God and that the Bible we true.

For me, it was an intellectual decision for which I believe God provides real, substancial evidence.

I didn't say that's WHY I believe, just that the consequences of not believing are potentially much worse.

I believe in an afterlife of some kind. Energy can't be created or destroyed, so I believe that the energy does live on in some way we don't understand. It's this belief that helps me through the tragic losses I have endured. I do feel that atheists must have it rougher than people who believe in some sort of higher entity, because they believe that once a person is gone, that's it. I think that must be more difficult to deal with loss as an atheist. While I do believe in some higher power, I also wonder from time to time if I am wrong and that perhaps there is no higher power, and so I can completely relate to atheists. I guess I go back and forth somewhat about it. I guess when it comes down to it, no one really knows for sure, and so all possible scenarios must be examined and thought out. When I examine the evidence, I do think that there are forces more powerful than the human being, but I don't think there is some "thinking" entity who is guiding things. Just by looking at the night sky I can see that there is energy, matter, and activity more powerful than human beings, so in a sense, nature, or the universe, is a higher power in itself. Maybe when we die we become one with the universal energy. That being said, from time to time I do have my doubts, which is why I relate to atheists.

I, like most of you have been faced with the loss of a loved one. Although I do not believe they are in heaven I have no concern that I will never see or be with them again. They continue to live in me, in my memeories and in my heart. I see them on regular basis, in my thoughts, my dreams and my day dreams. We all live on in the people we leave behind. I visit my Sisters grave on a regular basis and I talk to her, not because I think she can hear me but because I can hear me and these moments make her memory more vivid.

I take great comfort in those visits because she exists in me, not believing in God or heaven has no impact on my ability to spend time with my memory of her.

:nod: :nod: Very nicely said, Sunta.

I'd like a bumpersticker that says: I believe in God, I just spell it N-A-T-U-R-E.

At least you are leaving yourself open to the possibility of there being a "higher power", which is a place that I used to be at.

I reasoned that if God wqas real, then there had to be some real evidence of His existance. For me, when I investigated all the evidence, especially evidence that the Bible is devinely inspired, I became convinced that it not only had merit, but was true and that higher power was God.

I believe in an afterlife of some kind. Energy can't be created or destroyed, so I believe that the energy does live on in some way we don't understand. It's this belief that helps me through the tragic losses I have endured. I do feel that atheists must have it rougher than people who believe in some sort of higher entity, because they believe that once a person is gone, that's it. I think that must be more difficult to deal with loss as an atheist. While I do believe in some higher power, I also wonder from time to time if I am wrong and that perhaps there is no higher power, and so I can completely relate to atheists. I guess I go back and forth somewhat about it. I guess when it comes down to it, no one really knows for sure, and so all possible scenarios must be examined and thought out. When I examine the evidence, I do think that there are forces more powerful than the human being, but I don't think there is some "thinking" entity who is guiding things. Just by looking at the night sky I can see that there is energy, matter, and activity more powerful than human beings, so in a sense, nature, or the universe, is a higher power in itself. Maybe when we die we become one with the universal energy. That being said, from time to time I do have my doubts, which is why I relate to atheists.

Sunta - I agree with you. To think that humans are as good as it gets is a bit - unnerving. My husband is a hobby physicist, and all I have to do is hear him talk about quantum theory for 5 minutes and it becomes quite clear that there are some things we just aren't capable of understanding. I've made reference to the Law of Thermodynamics before, and that yes - it could be used to explain a parallel between science and religion. A very different parallel, but parallel nonetheless. But I can completely believe that everything we know is the result of amazing coincidences over almost incomprehensibly long periods of time. As far fetched as that might seem to some, it's much easier to believe than some omnisicent, omnipotent "being". God = space alien would be easier to credit than god = omniscient, omnipotent diety.

At least you are leaving yourself open to the possibility of there being a "higher power",

Most atheists contemplate that possibility, and then reject it. As I would suspect some christians contemplate the possibility of "no god", and then reject it. There's no difference there. Noth parties have made considerations and made a decision. It's odd to see "praise" for someone being on the fence, when one side rejects the other's side with equal regard.

The praise for being "on the fence" is because they are open minded enough to consider the possibility of God. From my perspective, it is more positive than being closed minded about it.

I don't think that most Believer start from a place of faith, consider there could be no God, and then reject it. Most that I know started from a place of not believing, or having strong doubts, and then came to believe for various reasons.

Most atheists contemplate that possibility, and then reject it. As I would suspect some christians contemplate the possibility of "no god", and then reject it. There's no difference there. Noth parties have made considerations and made a decision. It's odd to see "praise" for someone being on the fence, when one side rejects the other's side with equal regard.

If considerring the possibility there is a God is more positive than being close minded. Is not being able to consider the possibility that there is no God negative and close minded?

I never said non-believers start at a place of faith. I said that at some time they consider the possibility and then reject it. We apparently know very different people.

If you will credit someone for being open-minded enough to consider the possibility of god, would you also credit someone for being open-minded enough to consider the possibility that there is no god?

I think to be open minded enough to consider one position is being open minded enough to consider the opposite position.

I never said non-believers start at a place of faith. I said that at some time they consider the possibility and then reject it. We apparently know very different people.

If you will credit someone for being open-minded enough to consider the possibility of god, would you also credit someone for being open-minded enough to consider the possibility that there is no god?

From my vantage point, not being able to consider there is a God, is as closed minded as never have ever having a doubt. To make a decision for either position you would think one would have to weigh the evidence to come to a colclusion.

If considerring the possibility there is a God is more positive than being close minded. Is not being able to consider the possibility that there is no God negative and close minded?