After having done over 2 years of research on bariatric surgery, and months worth on my surgeon options- I found myself very impressed with Dr. Ramos Kelly's qualifications and experience. I verified all the information on his work experience and education (this is essential, as anyone can claim a great professional track record on the internet!). My surgery went great, the staff at his hospital checked on me virtually every hour and were extremely detailed. Beyond all that, I felt cared about. Dr. Kelly visited me at the hotel with his wife and Sara (personal coordinator) early because I was doing great and wanted to take off a day early.

I was happy to refer a good friend who confided her desire to have WLS, I'm so glad my research and experience could allow my friend to have the best WLS ever (in my opinion!) with an extremely skilled surgeon.

A couple weeks ago, ALM called her up and told her that after much deliberation and meeting, that they decided they would no longer be coordinating for Dr. Kelly. Normally, a professional break up wouldn't be alarming- these relationships can go sour all the time, and clearly from some of the things we see on the board, coordinators and coordination services can get quite competitive to downright nasty (not accusing ALM or anyone in particular of that). I'll just say, the honesty track record with coordination services does not seem to always be spotless.

The concerning part is that they indicated their choice to no longer work with Dr. Kelly was due to a safety/practice issue. This struck me as odd- they continued to work with him after his first lost patient in August of 2011, and some of their other Dr.'s they coordinate for don't have the experience or positive track record Dr. Kelly does. I have been operated on by Dr. Kelly merely 2 months ago myself, and though my recovery has gone better than anticipated, I am very concerned if there is something unsafe about the surgery that was done on my new stomach.

They urged my friend to book with a different surgeon with them, but told her she had the option of getting her deposit back if she chose to stay with Dr. Kelly, but that they would not be able to book her with him in good conscience due to an undisclosed safety concern. After talking to me, I told her I didn't want her to wonder what (if any) the safety concern was, and I thought it would be wise to go with one of there other surgeons (Dr. Garcia is who she chose, seems to be a great choice).

Obviously, it can deeply cut into a coordinators business to no longer coordinate for one of your most popular surgeons (dare I say, Dr. Kelly may be the most popular!), I would assume to cut into the $ of your business during this economy, the safety concerns must be quite significant, or the relationship went extremely sour somehow.

I'd like answers. I was operated on by Dr. Kelly not too long ago, and I hope "safety concerns" are merely just something they have chosen to say to assure that they keep the patients they've already booked with him to move to a different surgeon of theirs. I don't want to worry.

My friend pressed them for information, but they made it pretty clear they could only say it was a safety concern and that they wanted to encourage her to book with another surgeon.

My gut tells me my surgery went fine, that Dr. Kelly is a good person and extremely skilled- we have so many happy patients that post on here as it is. At the same time, I don't think a major coordinator like ALM would mislead patients, this would be a detriment to their business as so many of their patients chat on boards like this.

Dr. Kelly is a cut-rate Tijuana surgeon with now at least two hospitals that will no longer have him working at their facilities for safety issues. He has been proven to have caused complications, first denying and then lying about what caused them. These experiences have been reported by reputable people on these boards. What do you expect? His low, cut-rate price means that he is going to have cut services somewhere: proper staffing, the best equipment and good surgical procedures at the very least to make a profit. He recently had a death, not THAT uncommon among extremely obese patients, but he LIED about the cause of death to try and escape any responsibility for it. For all those indignant women who didn't have a bad experience, and I can see you now with your nostrils flaring, realize that even a BAD surgeon in a BAD facility with get it right 94 to 95 percent of the time. But a really GOOD surgeon at a GOOD facility will get it right 99.75 percent of the time. So, is it worth saving the extra four or five thousand bucks if you wind up in the losing 5 percent? You decide.

Oh geez.... Here we go again.

Of course, here we go! A doctor has been caught lying, taking back door patients, not reading medical charts, having patients die and lying to cover it up. Sounds like a horror story to me. Just because you made it through with flying colors does not make Debbie any less dead. Do you people truly believe that this is a business issue only? Why on earth would a coordinator turn on their top surgeon just to drum up business for another? Why would they risk people not using their services at all, due to the fact that their highly favored surgeon that most people have researched and been impressed with, by turning people away from him? How do they profit from that? Why are people so worried about their pride that they have to defend the surgeon who performed their procedure? This is a very potentially dangerous thing...having surgery alone, but to do it in a foreign country where people are not held to the standards our doctors are here. We have to research and when we find out that someone's life may be at risk by going to a particular doctor it is our responsibility to let them know. Why would ANYONE be offended?!

By the way, skinnycow, I spoke to a surprised Dr Kelly back in December. You spoke to a surprised Dr Kelly in January. See the discrepancy? After being totally surprised by all this he then claimed in an email to me that he dumped them first....

SMkeller has been passionate about putting down Mexican surgeons on this site in many threads- I recall a few on the topic, including one where he said he would not go to any Mexican surgeon.

The reality is, I had surgery with Dr. Kelly 3 months ago, and as someone who works in high end hospitals in Beverly Hills all the time, I can tell you there was nothing "low end" or cut rate about florence Hospital/Oasis of Hope, the care I received was amazing from the nurses and staff that came to check on me. It's not a fancy place with super state of the art machinery, but they are right next to the beach and have better equipment than plenty of places I've been to in the USA (and yes, I know what I'm looking at when I see medical equipment).

I had a great experience in Mexico, I was happy with Sandy and Linda at A Lighter Me, and I loved the Lucerna Hotel which they put me up in.

As much as I loved my experience with Dr. Kelly, I know ALM has severed ties with Dr. Kelly for some legitimate reasons regarding his medical practices. I also am sure that some of the reasons are simply internal/personal things that don't concern us as patients, and I'm guessing there are speculations that are exaggerated or just rumors. If you're considering Dr. Kelly, call around to the hospitals he's worked with, check his record out, and PM real patients who have seen him recently.

The truth is usually some where in the middle in these cases, I don't think it's fair for me to assume because my experience was good that there is no way that Dr. Kelly could be having issues now, and to jump to defend any accusations. I also feel as a happy patient of his, that I owe his practice some defense too- I can say first hand, I had a quick, easy surgery and received a lot of love and care.

Right, smKeller HAS cut down every MX surgeon, except for the one he went to, who has also had a death in his past. And if ALM has cut their ties with Dr Kelly, why is he still on all their websites? That's because they WANT people to think he's affiliated with these other surgeons who weren't even bariatric surgeons a yr ago. They are using Dr Kelly on their websites to get interest and draw people to them and then getting patients on the phone to schedule their surgeries, and then pulling the old switcheroo. We can't in good conscious book you with Dr Kelly because he had a questionable death a half a yr ago, but we've been booking for him with good conscious all these months, but we suddenly have a conscious. They are stealing Dr Kelly's patients and giving them to other inexperienced surgeons by using lies and scare tactics, because they know people will trust them over the surgeons, because they're patient coordinators/advocates. It's pathetic, unprofessional, and unethical.

Here's the website I just went to a few sec's ago. There's Dr Kelly right under Dr Garcia!

http://www.alighterme.com/doctors.html

And here's an article in May of 2011 where ALM is adding 3 new new surgeons. The article is dated May 2011 and Dr Garcia was still studying to be a bariatric surgeon!!! This is from that article.......

Mexico.html" rel="external nofollow">http://www.prlog.org/11475485-alighterme-add-three-new-bariatric-surgeons-and-operates-in-guadalajara-mexico.html

Dr. Fernando Garcia started his academic career earning a physicians degree in 1999. In 2003 he progressed to medical school, after completing a one-year postgraduate internship (1999-2000) and a one-year social service clinical (2000-2001). In 2007 Dr. Garcia graduated as a general surgeon. Dr. Garcia is committed to his field with continual education in numerous bariatric surgery courses.

Here's Dr Kelly standing beside Sandy and Linda when he was initiated and recently became a member of the prestigious American College of Surgeons, this was just a few months ago:

http://www.prweb.com/releases/2011/10/prweb8910330.htm

Do you're research people, all I did was take 5 mins on google and found the above info. Now that I posted this, I expect Dr Kelly to be removed from the site, but as of today, he's there.

As a surgeon, how would you feel if you found out that your patient coordinators were stabbing you in the back, telling potential patients they weren't booking for you any more and using your good reputation and giving your potential patients away?

I am going with Kelly, and don't have any doubts. I was scheduled with Garcia but changed my mind after looking more into his credentials.

I don't really care about bedside manner or how "Christian" my doctor is. I look for a good record, one death is not a big deal, and experience.

Some of the best doctors in the world are rude and liars but when they cut someone open they know what to do.

Just what I look for in a surgeon....

For mesaucedo,

I'm glad you know exactly what you want when looking for a surgeon. I know also what I am looking for. People are asking questions and there are those on here that seem to think that if their doctor made a mistake its somehow a reflection on them. So they jump to his defense. All I have done is brought to light the things I know. Even if I had an amazing experience, I can't see jumping in and stating things I know nothing about. My personal experience with this man is not good. I don't want a loose cannon operating on me.

What I look for may be different. I absolutely researched his credentials. That is important. I looked at patient testimonies. That is very important. I checked out the facilities that seem to be ever changing. It's important. I also researched the anesthesiologist. He is equally important as the surgeon. I want someone with a good rep. I saw he was a fellow at ACS. He had residencies in my hometowns. I was super excited about this doctor....until I spoke with him personally. He sounded like he was from the ghetto. I caught him in lies. That is a big deal. He has covered up a death that he caused calling it an embolism when in fact he nicked an artery. I understand making mistakes. But the humility to admit it and not cover it up is important. Unfortunately you say one death is no big deal. That death was a human being with a family. I have six kids. If I die it's a big deal. My family should at least know what happened. They should be able to grieve. . If he is able to lie like this and try to cover up the fact that he killed a patient, who knows what length he'd go to without the same accountability he had in this case. This is not the only nicked artery. There have been many, and increasingly so in recent months. I don't understand jumping to his defense. Perhaps he is going through something...? We all do. And we all make mistakes. Except in the case of this doctor. People seem to think he's God.

You may not see being a Christian as important. I do. I wasn't imposing my views on anyone, (not that I wouldn't. Iknow it is not God's will that any should perish but that all come to repentance.) Just stating the discrepancies between what he said and what he did, and what he stated on two separate occasions and how they contradicted each other. I didn't not schedule with him for this reason alone. Even if he was not a Christian I probably would have schedule with him. He's dishonest. He no longer has the reputation he once had. Call the hospitals he's worked at. He lost all his priveledges to three hospitals.But the reason I want a Christian, and no, that is not my only consideration, is because I want God's blessing on all I do. I want a surgeon who is not only skilled but Spirit led. I want divine intervention. I do not expect you to understand.

An excellent surgeon does not lie and is not a jerk. He needs to work well with his team and others around him to be truly effective. I'm glad you're confident. I'm sure, as with most of his patients, you will be fine. I, on the other hand, just want more. I don't want to be cut open by someone I don't trust as a person. I can't separate the person from the surgeon. I will be going with someone else...

Donna,

I did not mean to offend. I wasn't trying to imply that her death was not important, of course it was sad. But from a medically statistical standpoint not too bad of a morality rate.

Furthermore, I am not a religious person so that is why it is not a big deal to me. I can understand why it would be to you.

Lastly, I want to apologize to you. I today spoke with Dr. Kelly and too was put off by his attitude.

I am sorry if I upset you in anyway.

Donna,

I did not mean to offend. I wasn't trying to imply that her death was not important, of course it was sad. But from a medically statistical standpoint not too bad of a morality rate.

Furthermore, I am not a religious person so that is why it is not a big deal to me. I can understand why it would be to you.

Lastly, I want to apologize to you. I today spoke with Dr. Kelly and too was put off by his attitude.

I am sorry if I upset you in anyway.

Mesaucedo

I accept your apology. I'm sorry too that I misunderstood.

I am so impressed by your humble words.

Thanks and blessings,

Donna

Of course, here we go! A doctor has been caught lying, taking back door patients, not reading medical charts, having patients die and lying to cover it up. Sounds like a horror story to me. Just because you made it through with flying colors does not make Debbie any less dead. Do you people truly believe that this is a business issue only? Why on earth would a coordinator turn on their top surgeon just to drum up business for another? Why would they risk people not using their services at all, due to the fact that their highly favored surgeon that most people have researched and been impressed with, by turning people away from him? How do they profit from that? Why are people so worried about their pride that they have to defend the surgeon who performed their procedure? This is a very potentially dangerous thing...having surgery alone, but to do it in a foreign country where people are not held to the standards our doctors are here. We have to research and when we find out that someone's life may be at risk by going to a particular doctor it is our responsibility to let them know. Why would ANYONE be offended?!

By the way, skinnycow, I spoke to a surprised Dr Kelly back in December. You spoke to a surprised Dr Kelly in January. See the discrepancy? After being totally surprised by all this he then claimed in an email to me that he dumped them first....

How do you know the patients name was Debbie?

Hm.... OK, I have not been here for AGES for personal reasons. However I had a surgery booked with Dr Kelly via A Lighter Me for back in the beginning of November. Went there and was, like, mere hours away from surgery before pulling out. I can't help but wonder if all of the issues on BOTH ends that I personally experienced might have been a small reason that led to this split.

If I have the time or energy to type my ordeal up, I most certainly will.

There have been lots of things said, lots of accusations (founded or unfounded), lots of conclusions (just or unjust) lots of hot tempers in this thread. I don't have any inside information about any of the physicians. But I would like to offer one suggestion to any individual doing research to help them make a decision regarding who will preform their surgery and where they will have the surgery done.

JACHO is the Joint Commission for Hospital Accreditation in the United States. Any hospital that is JACHO certified meets at least the minimum standards to be considered a safe facility. JACHO also does accreditations outside the United States (internationally). If you are researching to decide who will preform your surgery, don't forget to research the facility that will be used! Check to see if they are JACHO accredited. Regardless of WHO is doing your surgery, you want the facility that is going to be used to be SAFE. It the facility is not safe, it does not matter how good the surgeon is, he can only control his portion of the whole experience. You (I) want a facility where everything is certified to be SAFE, the lab, the nursing staff, the radiology department, the housekeeping department, medical records, the surgery department, the central supply department that sterilizes the instruments used in surgery, etc., etc., etc.

So when you talk about researching a doctor you are considering to preform your surgery, check out the facility where he practices. Is it JACHO accredited? If not maybe you want to address this issue with the surgeon you are considering to preform your surgery.

Wow, this has definitely been heated... I am completely impartial as I had my surgery with Dr. Aceves, who I would personally recommend.

I think there is some fishiness going on, on the part of the coordinators. Gottago has only posted in response to bashing Dr. Kelly or advertising Dr. Garcia. Definitely suspect that isn't just some random poster who had or wants wls. Again thats just my opinion.

As far as Dr. Kelly being angry and saying what was perceived as a lie. He essentially did drop them when he took on Trish. However he still used them in addition, as they were referring him patients. For them to not notify him, was very dishonest imo for them to contact patients before letting him know. They wanted to cut it off from there end at this point obviously but it is quite possible from his perspective it was him cutting it off by taking on Trish.

To me the dishonesty comes from the coordinators I do not know anyone with great integrity that would contact the patients before even letting him know they were not referring patients anymore, and converting ones they already booked. Also the fact that they are still advertising him as a surgeon it ridiculous! I will never perceive a bait and switch to be an honest thing to do.

I am not saying go with Dr. Kelly because I have no personal experience, but clearly with what the coordinators have shown they aren't to be completely trusted either.

I don't understand this. People sound unstable.

The man has lost his practice credentials at THREE hospitals. You have to seriously mess up, not just one death, to lose your credentials.

A patient has died and there was no good reason given.

MANY COORDINATORS are no longer willing to refer patients to him anymore.

A woman who wanted him to be her doctor wrote a post about him LYING to her.

And instead of being thankful that you made it through ok, and running for the freaking hills if you're not a patient yet, you all accuse ALL THE COORDINATORS of trying to ruin his business?

The coordinators AND the hospitals?

What is wrong with you people????!!!!!!

Maybe the man is on drugs, maybe he's had a mental breakdown, whatever. The medical profession in Mexico is leaving him alone and yet Americans, based only on the reports of other Americans, with absolutely no inside knowledge of what's going on in Mexico, have said THEY'RE ALL WRONG.

I'm speechless. It's like the great guy that's caught molesting his daughter and everybody refuses to believe it until he confesses. There is something wrong here.