I'm going to have surgery in June with the likelihood my date is moved up. I had joined a Facebook bariatric group thinking I'd find support and possibly friends there, but unfortunately left the group due to the outrageous number of posts regarding how soon people could eat pizza, drink alcohol, eat I cream or drink soda pop, etc., etc. then the myriad of unhealthy recipes that were posted was upsetting, even as I scrolled past them. Then, I came here. It's the same difference. The people who have knowledge are vastly outnumbered by the addicts and self indulgent. What's worse is if anybody speaks the truth, which is that the vast majority of people here are seeking a quick fix, don't want to put in the work, are food addicts and compulsive over eaters, and even lazy, then they risk the wrath of people who disagree and want to mess up for their own ignorant and selfish reasons. Stupidly and indulgence win out the day.

I'm always from the school of thought if I know something or have information I ought to impart that to others. Knowledge is power and the truth is always better.

It pisses me off to have to keep my mouth shut so that stupid or misinformed people win out the day spreading their crap all over these forums and ruining it for those of us who actually can use the encouragement and not use this site as a crutch for our self indulging.

I was thinking of leaving.

Then I realized I'm not alone after reading a post on here expressing the same outrage. Plus, I'll stick around for the few people who actually can use the help and viable info, not to mention have real issues with support outside these forums for reasons beyond what is normal, either they have limited net access and funds, or get a doctor that isn't up to par, plus I feel it's my duty to give out the correct information. And yes, there is actually correct information about this stuff. It's really easy to find and a great doctor will give it.

Some of what I read is preposterous. Reading stupid crap such as it's okay to drink soda or pop because the stomach muscle left over from the surgery won't stretch - B.S! NOT TRUE, and if that isn't the worst if it, not acknowledging what sugar and fake sweeteners do to our bodies is the icing on the cake. Nobody is that daft in 2017.

Rather than attack and change the nature of the addictions, people seek any excuse to indulge them. It's tiresome and boring. Have some guts, and stop spreading stupidity to others.

Believe it or not, some of us want to be healthy and actually live longer by correcting the habits that got us here in the first place.

If you don't like it, fine. It's not my job to encourage bad behavior, not for myself or anyone else. Leave a rude comment or not, that's your bit. At the end of the day it's about adding years to our lives and making the best out of a tool that not everybody has an opportunity out to use.

You can also gain weight from your dieting, not eating, and consuming unhealthy proportions of healthy foods. When you don't eat your starving your body, so when you do eat (healthy foods or not) your body will store food rather than let you burn the calories. You can be the greatest nurse on earth, but a dietician you need to speak to. Bottom line we got here from over eating. I never thought I ate allot because I would skip meals too, making the deficit up on the meals I do eat normally a home cooked meal.

Exactly. Why do some people assume that every one got fat because of "unhealthy food" ? I happen to come from a place where the staple is Tubers and leafy soups. Believe me, you can still gain a huge amount of weight from eating food that in moderation is considered balanced. I got sleeved to help with portion control. I sometimes have the odd bagel here or a few spoons of rice there, as long as I monitor what I eat, and make up for it, no big deal.

So many people ask about Pizza and some other 'unhealthy' food. Immediate post op, several cravings happen. I remember craving red velvet cheese cake for some reason. You may be surprised that their interest in those foods may disappear when they start eating solids. As for recipes, one can only hope that folks are smart enough to ask for important information like calories or carb/protein content, e.t.c

Going forward, there are so many posts about unhealthy food and eating too soon after surgery. There are even too many posts complaining about there being 'too many posts about unhealthy food". One principle I use is that "we are all adults". Anyone seeking advice should be told the truth. If the person refuses to listen, then move on. Before they joined the forum, you had no idea about their existence, so why allow yourself to be so perturbed? If you feel the information is dangerous, drop your facts and move along. Everyone will eventually learn.. and if they don't, it's not on you.

Edited April 6, 20179 yr by Middus

3 hours ago, MBird said:

Some of what I read is preposterous. Reading stupid crap such as it's okay to drink soda or pop because the stomach muscle left over from the surgery won't stretch - B.S! NOT TRUE, and if that isn't the worst if it, not acknowledging what sugar and fake sweeteners do to our bodies is the icing on the cake. Nobody is that daft in 2017.

Well honestly a properly formed sleeve won't stretch from carbonation from soda. Just even thinking about that in a scientific context sounds ridiculous and like an old wives tale. So telling people that soda will stretch their sleeve is idiotic in my opinion. I gave up soda years before having surgery and I think it is terrible and pox on society but I don't think it will stretch a sleeve, science and logic just don't support it.

You would be more likely to stretch your sleeve with steak than with soda. Liquids don't even stay in your stomach long enough to stretch it, they immediately pass through and anyone that has had a live swallow test pop-op can confirm this. Steak and any other dense protein takes a very long time to pass through your sleeve and a long time for your stomach to digest. Just by the sheer amount of time that dense protein is in your stomach, it would stretch your stomach, except with a properly formed sleeve and restriction, you can't eat enough steak to stretch your sleeve.

The reasons people shouldn't drink soda is because soda is trash, especially diet soda. It is a gateway to other stuff, and if people are drinking soda they are probably doing worse.

Sleeve stretching is a myth perpetuated by WLS failures and medical malpractice. It just doesn't happen with a properly formed sleeve and people need to stop using it a s crutch to support their bad habits and failed food plan.

2 hours ago, Wchild22 said:

It's all about food portions now, controlling how much we eat and what. A calorie is a calorie you choice if you want a healthy 100 calorie snack or an unhealthy snack. I just totally forgot where I was going with this. Ah well!

A calorie is not a calorie. There is so much science that dispute this. There are different metabolic responses to different foods, that is just pure science that can't be disputed.

There are studies backing both sides of the argument.. so its more like: "A calorie is a calorie until it is not just calorie"

A stopped clock is also right 2x a day.

Don't really care about the rest of the rant, but this needed to be addressed (yet again).

Depending on the surgery, the stretchy part of of the stomach (the fundus) is removed (sleeve) or bypassed (bypass). Therefore it is not possible to stretch the stomach again.

However! Once the scar tissue has fully healed, the stomach that remains does regain some pliability. I would liken it to a garden hose in the winter versus the same hose in the summer. On a properly performed surgery, when people say that their stomach has stretched, most likely what has happened is that the pylorus (for sleeves) or the created opening to the intestine (bypass) has been weakened and/or stretched and food can move from the stomach or pouch into the intestine quicker allowing for more food to be consumed.

To make the myth worse is the fact that doctors/surgeons will put the above into "laymans terms" for their patients. Thus perpetuating the belief that you can stretch your sleeve by eating poorly or too much or drinking carbonated beverages.

I recently watched a surgery on here of a sleeve conversion to a mini bypass. The stomach looked obviously bigger than sleeve surgeries that I've seen and the doctor noted how a little stretching like that over time was normal with the sleeve.

How do you explain a visibly larger sleeved stomach like that if stretching of the stomach isn't possible?

Not trying to be rude or say that you're wrong, I'm just curious where your information is coming from. Especially when surgeons who perform these surgeries and physically see the stomach over time in situations like this claim otherwise.

33 minutes ago, soccermom2 said:

I recently watched a surgery on here of a sleeve conversion to a mini bypass. The stomach looked obviously bigger than sleeve surgeries that I've seen and the doctor noted how a little stretching like that over time was normal with the sleeve.

How do you explain a visibly larger sleeved stomach like that if stretching of the stomach isn't possible?

Not trying to be rude or say that you're wrong, I'm just curious where your information is coming from. Especially when surgeons who perform these surgeries and physically see the stomach over time in situations like this claim otherwise.

Medical Malpractice

All surgeons are not created equal. That is why people usually qualify their statements with "properly formed sleeve". If the surgery is done right it doesn't stretch.

There are a lot of surgeons not doing it right. At least once a month someone posts here about being offered a modified sleeve where less of the stomach is removed. That is not a properly formed sleeve.

Also, by the time people are fully healed and recovered. The size of their stomach shouldn't matter. They should be weighing or at least measuring all their food and eating proper portions. If you are eating proper portions the size of your sleeve doesn't matter.

A stretched sleeve is just a cop out. Surgeons are willing to encourage it because most of them are just in it for the $$$$$$$ especially with medical tourism.

Edited April 6, 20179 yr by OutsideMatchInside

Exactly, there are so many posts about people wanting to eat unhealthy foods as little as three weeks post op. It's ridiculous.

Not really ridiculous. Yes, our stomachs got smaller but our brains are still the same. It takes a while for the brain to catch up with the stomach.

The sleeve isn't a quick fix. It's learning a whole new lifestyle & habits when it comes to eating. It won't be a quick fix to "change" or "adjust" the brain right away after surgery either.

I believe people make posts about missing bad food because we're only human. It's okay to miss things you can't have anymore. People shouldn't be ashamed of asking questions even if you don't like the question.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 174.2 lbs
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

4 minutes ago, CocoNina said:

Not really ridiculous. Yes, our stomachs got smaller but our brains are still the same. It takes a while for the brain to catch up with the stomach.

I remember having insane cravings post-op for stuff I don't even like. Not chewing or having solid food for weeks will do that to anyone.

The biggest issue I have is people insisting they are actually hungry and it isn't head hunger. If you can't recognize the difference between head hunger and real hunger, man you have a rough road ahead.

Medical Malpractice
All surgeons are not created equal. That is why people usually qualify their statements with "properly formed sleeve". If the surgery is done right it doesn't stretch.
There are a lot of surgeons not doing it right. At least once a month someone posts here about being offered a modified sleeve where less of the stomach is removed. That is not a properly formed sleeve.
Also, by the time people are fully healed and recovered. The size of their stomach shouldn't matter. They should be weighing or at least measuring all their food and eating proper portions. If you are eating proper portions the size of your sleeve doesn't matter.
A stretched sleeve is just a cop out. Surgeons are willing to encourage it because most of them are just in it for the $$$$$$$ especially with medical tourism.

What I was wanting to know though is where did you get this information from? Modified sleeves aside, I have a hard time believing that highly regarded US surgeons who have performed thousands of bariatric surgeries can't properly form a sleeve. I personally know two people whose sleeves were ineffective because they refused to change their dietary patterns and they no longer feel any restriction. I know other people who used the exact same surgeon and have had great results.

Also the stomach is elastic. It does relax and expand when we eat, and just like with most things if you continuously stretch anything to its max it's eventually not going to snap all the way back. Maybe the proper term isn't stretched, but becomes more elastic? Able to hold more?

I do not see how a stretched sleeve is a cop out for surgeons. With that logic if you're not eating proper portions is it the surgeons fault that you're able to eat bigger portions? Are you saying that anyone who does not have success with Bariatric surgery is a victim of medical malpractice? I don't think so. Any surgeon will tell you the sleeve is a tool and it will not work if you don't work with it. The stomach does expand to hold more food over time. If it didn't then we would physically be unable to eat more as time passes without experiencing dumping syndrome.

A couple of things I found from a quick google search:

"If you continually overeat, the stomach may stretch. If your stomach stretches, you will not benefit from your surgery." http://www.northwestdavinci.com/health-library/hw-view.php?DOCHWID=hw252781

"However, when we prepare to eat, our brain sends a signal to our stomach that food is on the way. In anticipation, the stomach muscles relax and the stomach gets ready to be filled with food—a process known as "gastric accommodation." While eating, the average human stomach can stretch up to five times its normal fasting state. "The human stomach can actually hold 48 ounces, or roughly one liter, at its full capacity," says Leslie Bonci, a registered dietitian who works with the Pittsburgh Pirates and Kansas City Chiefs."

"Rather, eating patterns change the amount of food the stomach can expand to hold. Think of it more as "increasing stomach elasticity" than "permanently stretching your stomach." The scientific term for this is "distensibility"—defined as "the ability of something to become stretched."

http://www.stack.com/a/does-overeating-actually-stretch-your-stomach-the-answer-might-surprise-you

Sleeves don't stretch though, they aren't really that elastic, I know because I can still eat/drink too fast and feel the pain. So many doctors will tell you that. Sleeves are really not that flexible, I know I live with one.

I don't even know how to drill it home more than that. It won't stretch if it is done right, that is basically the cornerstone of the surgery. A stretched sleeve is a complication or a failure. It defeats the purpose. The sleeve has 2 major parts that help with weight loss, removing the stretchy part of the stomach reducing portions and creating restriction and also removing the stretchy part of the stomach removes ghrelin the hunger hormone. The part we are left with is more muscular than pouchy or stretchy.

The last link you posted is about a full regular stomach (did you even read it, or look at the picture? It is written by an English major for a BroScience website). A full regular stomach will stretch because the whole stomach is stretchy. The stretch part of the stomach is removed with the sleeve. It is not with RNY or the Band. Most WLS information lumps all these surgeries together.

It really does not seem like you understand how the sleeve works or what the surgery involves. It looks like you are still pre-op, if you are going to have the sleeve, you should do more research so you can understand how it works.

If you have a sleeve you won't stretch it, you risk other complication like ruining your esophagus creating a pouch at the top of it that food is getting stuck in. This happens because a sleeve doesn't stretch. Like @BigViffer said, you can damage the valve at the bottom of your stomach and make it open fast but a sleeve does not stretch.

Many sleevers confuse healing with stretching. The restriction you have at the beginning is not the restriction you will have forever. That is because it is not true restriction it is swelling. It takes a long time for internal swelling to go down and to be fully healed, 6 months at least, and this even applies to other things like a lot of plastic surgery. My restriction at 21 months is the same as 12 months. If I don't eat for a day or two my sleeve can get tight as a drum, or it can just randomly be tight.

Most people complaining about stretched sleeves are eating sliders not dense protein. If they ever listen to advice and eat dense protein, of they discover they have restriction again.

Finally the sleeve wasn't covered by insurance just a few years ago in the US and a lot of people with complications now went out of the country to have their surgery done. They have complications from bad sleeves and are having revisions in the US now because WLS is covered by insurance more than it used to be and also everyone is currently is required to have insurance in the US.

A correctly formed sleeve will not stretch. A RNY pouch will stretch, the pouch created by the band will stretch and bands can slip. A properly made sleeve will not stretch. Healing is not stretching. Eating sliders is not stretching.

Edited April 7, 20179 yr by OutsideMatchInside

Not really ridiculous. Yes, our stomachs got smaller but our brains are still the same. It takes a while for the brain to catch up with the stomach.

The sleeve isn't a quick fix. It's learning a whole new lifestyle & habits when it comes to eating. It won't be a quick fix to "change" or "adjust" the brain right away after surgery either.

I believe people make posts about missing bad food because we're only human. It's okay to miss things you can't have anymore. People shouldn't be ashamed of asking questions even if you don't like the question.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 174.2 lbs
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

It's okay to miss things, you can dwell on the loss of your dead pet, but you can't reach out and succumb to the desire to have your dead pet alive again.

Missing those foods equates to focusing on them and when you focus on them, you're more likely to give into them. It's better you just miss being unhealthy and fat, but by focusing on the other bad foods you're focusing on being unhealthy and fat again.

Just understand it's a lifestyle change.

I remember having insane cravings post-op for stuff I don't even like. Not chewing or having solid food for weeks will do that to anyone.
The biggest issue I have is people insisting they are actually hungry and it isn't head hunger. If you can't recognize the difference between head hunger and real hunger, man you have a rough road ahead.

BINGO.

@OutsideMatchInside pretty much hit all facts for me. As I said in my post, correctly formed sleeve, fundus removed, no stretch. Healed sleeve is more pliable than a fresh scar tissue sleeve.

Add to that surgeons speaking lay terms to people and it perpetuates a myth. Honestly, it means nothing to me what anyone else believes or does. If someone wants to believe they can stretch their sleeve back out into a normal sized stomach, it affects me not at all. However; I only notice the people who are failing at post op life talking about stretched sleeves/pouches.