How many vets are actually AT goal and staying there?

[Butterthebean 8,146]

Butterthebean' date=' like you, I'm finding with some things abstinence is preferable to moderation for me. I've done a TON of thinking about this, because a lot of folks feel like "denying" yourself is just setting yourself up for a binge when you're a binge eater. On the other hand, keeping to high Protein low carb gets SO much easier for me a few days into it that it's become clear to me that the "eating carbs makes you crave more" phenomenon is a large part (but not all) of my struggle. [/quote']

Yes, I think this has either got to be one of the biggest myths on VST, or you and I are freaks because all my slip ups are the result of enjoying things in moderation. I hear it all the time...everything in moderation. But when I think back to my failed weight loss attempts before surgery, or my nasty carb binge that I just recently squashed, they all resulted from slowly trying to incorporate small treats into my life. Small rewards for a job well done....which lead to bigger, more frequent rewards which lead to throwing the rule book out the window and eating crap everyday. For me...it's sweets. I cannot indulge myself. My alternative is a chocolate Protein shake. I actually am a freak because I love my Protein shakes. Closest thing to chocolate milk I've found. So when I feel a need for something sweet, if I'll make myself a shake it takes care of my need, but in a guilt free healthy way.

Clearly, others do well with the moderation approach. I wish I did. But it's clear to me now that moderation is one alternative....but not the only one. Abstaining can be very liberating....much in the same manner that fasting is liberating. You free yourself from the pressure of thinking about how much can I have and when.

[Supersweetums 1,164]

Yes, I think this has either got to be one of the biggest myths on VST, or you and I are freaks because all my slip ups are the result of enjoying things in moderation. I hear it all the time...everything in moderation. But when I think back to my failed weight loss attempts before surgery, or my nasty carb binge that I just recently squashed, they all resulted from slowly trying to incorporate small treats into my life. Small rewards for a job well done....which lead to bigger, more frequent rewards which lead to throwing the rule book out the window and eating crap everyday. For me...it's sweets. I cannot indulge myself. My alternative is a chocolate Protein shake. I actually am a freak because I love my Protein shakes. Closest thing to chocolate milk I've found. So when I feel a need for something sweet, if I'll make myself a shake it takes care of my need, but in a guilt free healthy way.

Clearly, others do well with the moderation approach. I wish I did. But it's clear to me now that moderation is one alternative....but not the only one. Abstaining can be very liberating....much in the same manner that fasting is liberating. You free yourself from the pressure of thinking about how much can I have and when.

At least you realized it before it became a real problem. I know there are things that I can't eat. And I never keep them in my house. The worst for me is chips. It they are there, I eat them. We were out last night, and they had some at the party we were at. I did eat some, and they tasted so good. But I know that I can leave them there. If they were withing reach, I would have no control.

When I say I eat things in moderation, for me, moderation is food not in my house that I do not have access too. I don't eat bread, except the odd occasion we are out and there is garlic toast, then I will have a small amount. Same goes with any other food that I have restricted from my diet. And sweets are a trigger for me as well, once I have some, I start wanting more and more and it is difficult to get back on track.

I think everyone needs to find what works for them. You have done phenomenal Butter and you are an inspiration to many

[lsereno 2,525]

Here's an interesting blog post from Gretchen Rubin about abstaining:

http://www.happiness-project.com/happiness_project/2013/01/want-to-be-free-from-french-fries-or-why-abstaining-may-be-easier-than-you-think/

Shelly of World According to Eggface is an abstainer. She doesn't do Pasta, rice, bread or potatoes and here's her post about that:

http://theworldaccordingtoeggface.blogspot.com/2009/06/fear-enemy.html

As for me, I'm still trying for moderation. That means keeping some foods out of the house and only eating them when I'm out. And limiting other foods. For example, someone asked about pizza on another thread. For me, pizza wasn't a fav food and it's easy to limit it to a few times a year because hubby doesn't want it that often either.

We'll see how that works as time goes by. If it doesn't work, I'll be trying something else! I'm terrified of the infamous post-three year gain.

Lynda

[Georgia 2,908]

Here's an interesting blog post from Gretchen Rubin about abstaining:

http://www.happiness...than-you-think/

Shelly of World According to Eggface is an abstainer. She doesn't do Pasta, rice, bread or potatoes and here's her post about that:

http://theworldaccor...fear-enemy.html

As for me, I'm still trying for moderation. That means keeping some foods out of the house and only eating them when I'm out. And limiting other foods. For example, someone asked about pizza on another thread. For me, pizza wasn't a fav food and it's easy to limit it to a few times a year because hubby doesn't want it that often either.

We'll see how that works as time goes by. If it doesn't work, I'll be trying something else! I'm terrified of the infamous post-three year gain.

Lynda

Read the blog and can relate. I TELL myself I will only do moderation but this only works with things I dont ABSOLUTELY LOVE and thus, it's abstainence! Ha!

[Escape_Pod 358]

I've spent a lot of time contemplating the moderation / abstinence choice. Fortunately, I'm finding a lot of good models for the abstinence route that convince me it's not as impossible as a lot of us may think.

What I haven't figured out yet, is whether substitutions for the "never" foods are a good idea (help fend off a feeling of deprivation), or a bad idea (keep the taste for the food alive). I had a very brief but torrid affair with a tiny bag of sugar free Chocolates that was my first smack up the side of the head about danger foods, even ones that don't spike my blood sugar. I don't do chips, but I do eat Protein chips and geni-soy crisps. So far so good, but risky. I don't eat potatoes, rice, or Pasta of any sort, and I almost never have bread, even low carb varieties. I suspect any of those I could enjoy the real thing in moderation (meaning I eat a bite or two, very occasionally), and I don't have any problem with my husband's supply in the house, or making them for him for dinner.

Anything sweet is a whole 'nother ball of wax. Bean, like you, I love my Protein shake, though mine is a protein hot cocoa, but it's not in regular rotation for me any more because it doesn't keep me satisfied as long as an egg or other more solid protein source. It sometimes makes a guest appearance in the afternoon as soft-serve "ice cream" (just the Protein powder, almond milk, and some thickeners) that has saved my butt any number of times when trigger foods were calling. Anything like the muffin bites, or mug cakes, or other low-carb, sugar-free options on blogs like Eggface are dangerous territory for me. Having the real thing in moderation (meaning, a few bites of dessert shared with my husband when we're on vacation) is a ticking time bomb - I might get away with it once, but most likely it will set off a whole new cycle of problems. That's where I'm coming to terms with abstinence.

For me, where it starts to get really complicated is that the flip side of abstinence can be that sense of deprivation that can be courting a binge. What works for me? I don't know, I haven't found it yet. But I keep trying, failing, brushing myself off, and getting back on track to try again. Gettin' a bit bruised from all the failures....

[Butterthebean 8,146]

It's weird. Before surgery, I lived on burgers, French fries, pizza, sodas....anything that could be obtained at a fast food window. Now I don't need or want that stuff. I rarely had desert, but when I did....I really did!

But now, a piece of pecan pie, or cheese cake or a donut....and it's like I'm ready to start a massive crime wave to get more. And I cannot get full on any of these foods....I've tried. There is no restriction. There is no satisfaction either....a little just makes me want more. What I wouldn't give for some dumping...or slimes! Anything to negatively reinforce those foods. But the only tool I have to deal with them is fear of how fast I can regain. After 14 months of doing this on my own, I'm now looking for a support group to help with this. I need a more positive tool.

[Georgia 2,908]

I've spent a lot of time contemplating the moderation / abstinence choice. Fortunately, I'm finding a lot of good models for the abstinence route that convince me it's not as impossible as a lot of us may think.

What I haven't figured out yet, is whether substitutions for the "never" foods are a good idea (help fend off a feeling of deprivation), or a bad idea (keep the taste for the food alive). I had a very brief but torrid affair with a tiny bag of sugar free Chocolates that was my first smack up the side of the head about danger foods, even ones that don't spike my blood sugar. I don't do chips, but I do eat Protein chips and geni-soy crisps. So far so good, but risky. I don't eat potatoes, rice, or Pasta of any sort, and I almost never have bread, even low carb varieties. I suspect any of those I could enjoy the real thing in moderation (meaning I eat a bite or two, very occasionally), and I don't have any problem with my husband's supply in the house, or making them for him for dinner.

Anything sweet is a whole 'nother ball of wax. Bean, like you, I love my Protein shake, though mine is a protein hot cocoa, but it's not in regular rotation for me any more because it doesn't keep me satisfied as long as an egg or other more solid protein source. It sometimes makes a guest appearance in the afternoon as soft-serve "ice cream" (just the Protein Powder, almond milk, and some thickeners) that has saved my butt any number of times when trigger foods were calling. Anything like the muffin bites, or mug cakes, or other low-carb, sugar-free options on blogs like Eggface are dangerous territory for me. Having the real thing in moderation (meaning, a few bites of dessert shared with my husband when we're on vacation) is a ticking time bomb - I might get away with it once, but most likely it will set off a whole new cycle of problems. That's where I'm coming to terms with abstinence.

For me, where it starts to get really complicated is that the flip side of abstinence can be that sense of deprivation that can be courting a binge. What works for me? I don't know, I haven't found it yet. But I keep trying, failing, brushing myself off, and getting back on track to try again. Gettin' a bit bruised from all the failures....

It's weird. Before surgery, I lived on burgers, French fries, pizza, sodas....anything that could be obtained at a fast food window. Now I don't need or want that stuff. I rarely had desert, but when I did....I really did!

But now, a piece of pecan pie, or cheese cake or a donut....and it's like I'm ready to start a massive crime wave to get more. And I cannot get full on any of these foods....I've tried. There is no restriction. There is no satisfaction either....a little just makes me want more. What I wouldn't give for some dumping...or slimes! Anything to negatively reinforce those foods. But the only tool I have to deal with them is fear of how fast I can regain. After 14 months of doing this on my own, I'm now looking for a support group to help with this. I need a more positive tool.

Oh, this is SOOO me! I dont HAVE to have bread - yes, the occasion biscuit in the morning or "pigs in a blanket" yep! And I love toast, though, i don't rarely indulge. But what derailed me this past winter was the sweet sliders! I could and did down a bag of little white powdered donuts with no problem and Hersheys kisses, well, let's just say it wasn't pretty!

I realized then there was still that little addict inside of me waiting to be unleashed! So, now, I MIGHT indulge in the rare sweet at a social event but not a habit and not frequently. I just have to abstain because one is NEVER going to be enough. I read Dr. Oz who and i quote, "Indulge yourself! Now if I want a piece of cake or pie, I cut me a slice and have one big bite and relish the taste of it. Then walk away!" YEAH, RIGHT! Raise your hand if after that bite, you could WALK AWAY! I thought so. No hands raised! lol

[gmanbat 5,889]

Right now I have a job working with my nephew on his seawall business here in Florida. I shovel and wheelbarrow all day in the brutal Florida steam with 20 year olds.

When I am off of work my one thought is recovery and avoidance of cramps. I eat as much Protein as I can get in which includes lots of milk. I am perpetually thirsty because of the copious sweat that drips from me all day. I drink constantly on the job but at night it feels like I have eaten the saltiest ham in existence. I am in amazing shape for a 64 year old as attested to by the "kids" I work with.

I won't have this job forever and am aware that this kind of eating could set me up in a habit that would put the blubber globules back on.

It is all a matter of what we give ourselves permission to do. Bean is honest with himself and knows what leads to something else. Awareness is just as important as restriction, and a supreme and life long hatred of getting back into the fat cage.

[CowgirlJane 14,259]

So, here is what i am finding.

I am active, I am not trying to maintain a "skinny" weight - just a nice normal looking size medium weight... and yet, I really cannot eat junky food AT ALL. I have to keep portions of even healthy food moderate. I do sometimes have carby foods, but on a daily basis I am definately in the no Pasta, no bread, no rice, no potatoto mode.

So, my conclusion is that for most women, over say 40, to maintain a "normal" weight requires activity and a pretty controlled diet. This is the reason that when I walk in the grocery store, i notice I am "thin" compared to many women my age. It is hard to keep this weight off when the body;s metabolism slows down.

[lsereno 2,525]

I am nearly 60 and still eating whole grains and doing well with that. So maintenance with starches is possible. But I do limit how much. I have one serving at Breakfast, lunch, and dinner on most days. And often I have a snack of a lower calorie grain, such as pretzels or Special K crackers, or graham crackers. On treat days, I have white bread if is good or occasionally Pasta.

But everyone is different. I do try to only eat sweets outside the house because like many others, once I go down that hole I want more and there isn't much restriction with those types of foods. And it really limits how often I have sweets because after we eat a meal out, I'm usually too full to order dessert.

Lynda

[lsereno 2,525]

Oh and I found some articles through Google news about carbs and addiction:

How Carbs Can Trigger food Cravings

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/06/27/how-carbs-can-trigger-food-cravings/

Study: Are Carbs, Sugars Really Like Drugs To Your Brain?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/alicegwalton/2013/06/27/study-are-cheap-carbs-really-like-drugs-to-your-brain/

Lynda

[Oregondaisy 2,019]

I am so glad this thread was started. When I first started struggling, all I could find were posts that said " I stay with in 5 lbs of my goal. If I see I am up, I just eat Protein for a few days I am right back at goal."

It made me feel like a complete failure.

That used to work for me to, and then one day, those few lbs would not come off!

Now it's a struggle every day not to eat the things I see everyone around me eating, who are not gaining weight. they are just normal people without the disease of obesity.

[Georgia 2,908]

You know, Oregondaisy, I just responded to you on the 5/2 thread and I feel your pain. I let myself get way off base and regained too. Working on it now and have much hope in what is working for me now. I don't think we truly realize that MOST thin people WORK on staying that way too! As they say, " it takes work to look this food!" It was so easy for me to lose the initial weight Nd reach goal that I got really lazy thinking I would be okay eating junk. Nope! The realization has finally dawned that it will have to become a true "thin" lifestyle. As they say, "nothing tastes as good as thin!"

[tparkerc59 334]

Getting ready to start the maintenance phase very soon and am terrified. Maintaining is always so much harder than losing!

[Georgia 2,908]

Getting ready to start the maintenance phase very soon and am terrified. Maintaining is always so much harder than losing!

Just start out right! No more than 2 lb bounce I'm told. So as I say not as I do! Lol. BUT in a few more pounds I DEF will. No more regain. They recommend 6:1 for maintenance too