Another Phony E-mail Refuted

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

More and more, the term "pro-life" is the translation for "I have no sense of humor and I know what's best for YOU."

GeezerSue

How about "Pro-Life means, I want every baby to live until they take their first breath and then they are on their own."

The congressman that the Pro-Life groups support:

Cut food stamp program

Cut Medicaid program

Support Capital punishment

Support the war in Iraq

None of the above are "Pro-life" in my book.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

One thing I have never been able to understand is why do so many people in this country think Condi's "brilliant"? She merely does as she's told.

I think we have a double standard in this country. I think she may be brilliant but she is such a hard-head, that she can not picture things from any other point of view than BuSh's. She even describes herself as a "True Believer".

Colin Powell could never run on the Republican ticket - even tho he is one - because he wouldn't want to cowtow to the powers that run that machine. I don't think he is greedy enough or corrupt enough. He is a fine figure of a man, but he's a Republican, pure and simple.

I don't really see him as a Republican. He is the consumate officer. He will swear that he believes what ever plan the leader decides on is the way he believes.

When I was a aircraft mechanic, I spent 3 of my 35 years in management. When upper management would come out with a new plan, we would have these elaborate parties (known as road-shows) in which the CEO or some other over-paid muckity muck would tell us of the new direction that our company was going to take to fly us into the world of profitability. We were allowed, at the meetings to disagree, complain, explain and tear away at the plan's underpinnings to the CEO. I usually shot holes in the plan and was seldom wrong because invariably we did an about face within a year.

However, after all the debate was over, we were supposed to go back to the troops and act as if we were in 100% agreement with the plan. When mechanics told us that the plan would not work because...even if they used the exact argument that we had used to our superiors, we were supposed to refute their argument.

Some of us did a half-way job of selling the programs we didn't believe in. Some of us actually brainwashed ourselves into thinking the CEO makes 10 times what we make, so they must know what's right.

Then there were the Colin Powell types: They argued like tigers with the CEO, but argued just as forcefully the opposite side of the debate when they explained the company's plan to the workforce. I believe that Colin Powell was in a debate with Rumsfeld, Rice and Cheney, but when BuSh made his decision against Powell's advice, Powell like the good soldier that he is, then sold the UN and the US public the same bill of goods, with the same dedication as Rumsfeld, Rice, Cheney and BuSh.

I don't think he is further to the right than a moderate Republican or a Moderate Democrat. I don't think he is further right that either Bill or Hillary. He is just a better soldier.

[Carlene 12]

More and more, the term "pro-life" is the translation for "I have no sense of humor and I know what's best for YOU."

I think this is a pretty powerful message...

[BJean 16]

I like T.O.M.'s take on it: "Pro-Life means, I want every baby to live until they take their first breath and then they're on their own."

It also isn't pro-life when a woman's life is at stake and the "pro-lifers" believe she must be compelled to carry and bear that fertilized egg until it is born, even if it means she could die.

And like GeezerSue said, (I'm paraphrasing) pro-lifers have no sense of humor and they think they know what's best for all of us.

[Carlene 12]

And like GeezerSue said, (I'm paraphrasing) pro-lifers have no sense of humor and they think they know what's best for all of us.

How can you possibly make a generalized statement like that? What does being pro-life have to do with anyone's sense of humor? Surely you aren't suggesting that abortion is humorous, are you?

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

It also isn't pro-life when a woman's life is at stake and the "pro-lifers" believe she must be compelled to carry and bear that fertilized egg until it is born, even if it means she could die.

The epitome of the hypocrisy of the "Pro-Life" extremists are the ones (like some ex-coworkers of mine) who told me that killing a "Planned Parenthood" doctor is not murder because it saves the lives of "unborn babies".

When we heard on the radio news-broadcast that a man was arrested for "murdering" a "Planned Parenthood" doctor, my ex-coworker told me that the story illustrated the liberal media. I asked why, since I heard no commentary or editorializing. He told me that it was not "murder". It was killing, but not murder.

Saving Life Through Killing

sort of like

Peace Through War

Bombers to Promote Life

[Carlene 12]

Here's MY sign...

[green 6]

How about "Pro-Life means, I want every baby to live until they take their first breath and then they are on their own."

The congressman that the Pro-Life groups support:

Cut food stamp program

Cut Medicaid program

Support Capital punishment

Support the war in Iraq

None of the above are "Pro-life" in my book.

Very nicely said, TOM. Up here in Soviet Canuckistan (as one of your congressmen once called us) many of us have wondered why the very states which are the most concerned about maintaining the life of the foetus (at all costs) are the same ones that are the least concerned about the quality of its life: poor medicare, poor nourishment and poor education means that these states are raising an underclass, one that doesn't have a hope in hell. Apart from humanitarian principles, you would think that self-interest would dictate that this is poor policy; afterall, these folks aren't going to contribute to the local economy, are they?

[GeezerSue 7]

Ya know..until it's a frog...it ISN'T a frog; it's a pollywog.

And until it's a baby, it just ain't a baby. It may be a POTENTIAL person...a HOPE of a person...a DREAM of a person...but it is NOT a person until, you know, it's a person. (The IRS--a branch of our government--will explain what is child is to anyone who tries to claim a "potential child" on his or her taxes.)

Abortion is not funny. The morons who stand around outside the clinics telling other people what to do and killing doctors (who ARE people) come closer to tragedy than comedy.

I've BEEN to clinic defenses. Those idiots try to attack people coming in for things totally unrelated to pregnancy. They are a scourge on humanity. They are no different that the Taliban who blew up the Buddist statues because they didn't mesh with Taliban beliefs. No different at all.

I didn't wear MY uniform to protect the rights of those who would dictate that I should live by their standards.

[Carlene 12]

Ya know..until it's a frog...it ISN'T a frog; it's a pollywog.

And until it's a baby, it just ain't a baby. It may be a POTENTIAL person...a HOPE of a person...a DREAM of a person...but it is NOT a person until, you know, it's a person. (The IRS--a branch of our government--will explain what is child is to anyone who tries to claim a "potential child" on his or her taxes.)

Abortion is not funny. The morons who stand around outside the clinics telling other people what to do and killing doctors (who ARE people) come closer to tragedy than comedy.

I've BEEN to clinic defenses. Those idiots try to attack people coming in for things totally unrelated to pregnancy. They are a scourge on humanity. They are no different that the Taliban who blew up the Buddist statues because they didn't mesh with Taliban beliefs. No different at all.

I didn't wear MY uniform to protect the rights of those who would dictate that I should live by their standards.

There are people on this forum, I believe, who have marched in anti-abortion demonstrations. Please do not call them names. It is unnecessary and unbecoming.

[GeezerSue 7]

There are people on this forum, I believe, who have marched in anti-abortion demonstrations. Please do not call them names. It is unnecessary and unbecoming.

I spoke of people "who stand around outside the clinics telling other people what to do and killing doctors." They are what they are...I believe the word I used was "morons." Works for me.

[BJean 16]

Carlene: Let me get this straight. You're critisizing me for making a point by paraphrasing something GeezerSue said? No one that I know thinks abortion is humorous. However, when some people totally freak out when others talk about the bad side of the "pro-life" debate, one might definitely call them humorless. Perhaps that term was less objectionable than others that came to mind.

We ARE trying to keep this thread civil, aren't we?

[Wheetsin 714]

How can we start more imperialist wars when the Canucks keep arresting terrorists? :heh:

[Carlene 12]

Carlene: Let me get this straight. You're critisizing me for making a point by paraphrasing something GeezerSue said? No one that I know thinks abortion is humorous. However, when some people totally freak out when others talk about the bad side of the "pro-life" debate, one might definitely call them humorless. Perhaps that term was less objectionable than others that came to mind.

We ARE trying to keep this thread civil, aren't we?

First of all, the "bad" side of the pro-life/pro-choice debate depends entirely on which position you agree with. And there are plenty of pro-choice folks (notice I didn't call them "pro-abortion") who "totally freak out" when their beliefs are challenged, too. Does that render them "humorless", as well? Be fair, now.

Secondly, I was not criticizing you for stating your opinion. I simply disagreed. I don't think humor has one single thing to do with the abortion issue. It's like saying if you can't take a joke about 9/11, you have no sense of humor. Death is not funny - ever. But that's just my opinion. Feel free to criticize it.

As for keeping the thread civil.....ABSOLUTELY. That's why I asked that the name-calling cease. Name-calling is counterproductive to any civilized argument. It is anti-intellectual and attacks the speaker, rather than his/her position. It's also against the LBT rules.

As I have said in earlier posts, I do not demonstrate against abortion rights. I do not harass doctors. I don't call them "baby killers" and I do not bomb clinics, and I certainly would never assault anyone. I am not without sin and, therefore, I do not judge anyone else.

You are preaching to the choir when you say, to me, that people who use violence to further their beliefs are no better than those they oppose. I took exception to two things, and two things only:

1. The implication that people who are not in favor of abortion on demand have no sense of humor.

2. Name-calling of those who post here -by anyone, for any reason.

This is why I hate debating this issue. It always gets ugly. And it doesn't have to. Really, it doesn't.

[missy4gordon 0]

Ya know..until it's a frog...it ISN'T a frog; it's a pollywog.

And until it's a baby, it just ain't a baby. It may be a POTENTIAL person...a HOPE of a person...a DREAM of a person...but it is NOT a person until, you know, it's a person. (The IRS--a branch of our government--will explain what is child is to anyone who tries to claim a "potential child" on his or her taxes.)

Just wondering, who gets to decide when a baby is in fact, a baby? At what point does that transformation take place? Once it is delivered? Once you can count the little fingers and toes? Or, perhaps once you can hear the heart beating through the womb?

I didn't wear MY uniform to protect the rights of those who would dictate that I should live by their standards.

So who did you wear your uniform for, people who only believe the same things you believe??

One of my very best friends had an abortion a few years ago. Yep, she cheated on her husband and had to "take care of it" for fear he would find out it wasn't his. I let her know my feelings about it, but we remained friends and I was the shoulder she cried on for months after the "procedure". It haunted her, she couldn't look at a baby without bursting into tears, well she cried daily anyway. We have since drifted apart so I don't know how she is anymore, but I'm wondering how people can tell themselves that is ok. I was careless so the baby has to die. In my opinion, abortion has become just another form of birth control. Of course there are exceptions to every rule, if the mom is at risk, etc., and I don't dispute that there are times when it may be medically necessary.

And as for the argument that they will be a drain on society, life for the unwanted children that would have been otherwise aborted, will mean they will have no insurance, taxpayers paying for them, a horrible life.....HOW THE HELL DO YOU KNOW?? Can you see into the future? Let's not even give these kids a chance because of what COULD happen. Don't give me statistics, cuz kids aren't statistics, they are KIDS, innocent babies. UNFORTUNATELY, this type of life happens whether or not abortion is legal or illegal. Some people might even intentionally have kids for the extra money from the gov't, right?

It is a neverending argument. People will never agree and that is how the world goes 'round. I am not a Conservative, or a Liberal, or a Republican or Democrat. I watch Bill O'Reilly and Jon Stewart, I agree with both on certain issues, disagree with both on certain issues. I do not lump myself in with groups. I am ME and I have my own morals, values and beliefs that guide me through life and hope that on judgment day, I did the right thing.