marjon9

Just for the record, I do not agree with this statement at all. I believe that it is entirely within my control to lose weight through diet and exercise. I do not agree that it is a proven fact that morbidly obese people can never lose weight through diet and exercise. Yes, it's "hard" to lose weight through diet and exercise, especially living in this country with a McDonalds on every corner. But the fact that it is hard does not make it impossible. I mean, to take an extreme example, if 10 morbidly obese people moved to North Korea, in 2 years they would all come back thin. Diet and exercise work, it's just that it is really hard to apply those remedies in this society. But it is still my choice. And I will use the lap band for "a little help" as you put it, but I totally disagree that it is out of my control to do it any other way. laurend, I'm not asking you to agree with me. I just refuse to feel like a victim of circumstances in relation to something I know I have the power to change.

Let me just speak for myself, personally. I'm a 53 yo morbidly obese man. I've been fat most of my life. I consider this to be my responsibility. I don't blame anyone else for it, or any medical condition for it. Losing weight for me is unbelievably difficult, but that's my problem. I don't care what the statistics say, I know I can do what it takes to lose weight if I choose to. I don't ask society to "understand" how difficult it is for me to lose weight. I don't consider anyone a "bigot" if they don't like fat people. I know that I will pay a price for being fat, and I know that it is within my control to do something about it. Fortunately, the lap band now exists. In fact, my surgery date is set for 1/16. That band is going to make things much easier for me. I'm so grateful for it. I don't feel like a cheater in any way for using it. It would be dumb not to use it. Human beings use tools, right? That's what makes us human. I mean, we have an opposable thumb and all that, right? This is just another tool. Now, more than ever, there is no reason for society to "understand" why I'm fat. I have no interest in any "movement" designed to encourage society to "support" me in my condition of obesity. I don't want anyone calling me a "person of size" when I'm actually just a fat man who is perfectly capable of doing something about it. And I also want to make clear that I don't expect to make other people view the world the way I do. I like to express my thoughts and views, but I don't expect to change anyone else. If other people generally feel that losing weight is realistically impossible for an obese person, and that society should learn to understand that and accept obese people, then that is fine with me. It's just that I'm not able to look at the world that way. As I view the world, this is my life, I'm responsible for it, obesity is something I can do something about, and if I choose not to do it then I deserve the consequences, and I accept the consequences. But then, that's just me.

laurend, there may be a small number of people for whom obesity is an actual unavoidable medical issue, and obviously your points are valid for those people. Anyone with such medical issues has my complete sympathy. But that is not really the topic of my post. The topic of my post is whether it makes sense for society to "accept" obesity in the same way society should "accept" someone's dark skin. I think that, as a general matter, there is no way that these two physical conditions are comparable. In the vast majority of cases people who are obese can do something about it. Whereas people with dark skin, even if they wanted to, cannot. Perhaps there are a very small number of obese people who cannot do anything about their obesity for medical reasons. But that is really a very, very small percentage of the people out there who are obese. In almost every other case, obese people have the ability to change their lives. If an obese person has the ability to change his or her life, then "accepting" that person's obesity may, in certain ways, provide support to that person for not changing. To the extent acceptance of obesity provides that kind of support, I don't think it is helpful to anyone.

I don't think it is honest or appropriate to equate "people of color" and "people of size." The two types of characteristics are not the least bit comparable. If you are a person of color you a) were born that way, :girl_hug: have no choice about it, and c) are just like any other human being in any way that matters. If you are a person of size you a) were not born that way, do have a choice about it, and c) are not just like everyone else because you are willing to die young for the right to overeat. I do think it is good to recognize your worth and value even if you are fat. For many people this is the first step to starting to deal with it. In that sense I think the "size acceptance" movement is a good thing. But if the "size acceptance" movement ends up providing an excuse for self-destructive behavior and early death, I don't think it is such a good thing.

I have no doubt that being overweight plays a negative role in hiring decisions. But I have point of view about that which is probably different from that held by many others on this forum. I think weight should have a role in hiring decisions. (Don't take this personally, Transformer. My comments are not directed to you personally. I do sympathize with you for not getting the job. And everything I say below I direct to myself completely). I think weight should have a role in hiring. If someone is 20 lbs overweight that should not be an issue. But if someone is morbidly obese then the employer is perfectly justified in considering that. Morbidly obese people have less energy, they have more medical problems, they take more sick days, and they raise costs to the employer for medical insurance benefits. And, in addition, when a person is morbidly obese it says something about who they are inside. A morbidly obese person is willing to die for food. This shows that they do not love and respect themselves. Who would want to hire someone like that? Who would want someone like that in a supervisory role, or as the public face of the company? Yes, some people have a genetic tendency to gain weight. This is a legitimate issue. But not everyone who has a genetic tendency to gain weight is morbidly obese. It's no excuse. If life deals you a lemon, you don't have to make lemon meringue pie. When looking at myself, sitting here at age 53 in a condition of morbid obesity, I find it very difficult to entertain points of view that shift blame to others for the damage I have done to myself. I've treated myself very badly, and I'm ashamed of it. This has taken a toll on my wife and family as well, and I'm ashamed of that too. I'm now ready to take responsibility for my actions, and fix the problem. Everyone else here on this forum is doing the same thing, and I think we deserve a lot of credit for that. When people treat themselves with love and respect, it's a beautiful thing.

I think the main thing that makes something a "protein drink" is the amount of protein it contains. If Kirland brand chocolate slim drink has a lot of protein, then it would count as a Protein Drink. You can check out the amount of protein by looking on the nutrition information on the container. I don't fully understand why we all need so much protein, but for now I'm just going on trust based on what my nutritionist says. She works with the lap band doctor. It seems like the "good" Protein Drinks seem to have at least 15 or 20 grams of protein per drink. I've decided to try the Adkins shake low carb protein drink which I hear tastes pretty decent. It has 20 grams of protein and 170 calories. You can also make anything into a protein drink by adding Protein Powder to it. You can make Water into a protein drink if you add protein powder. Some protein powders claim to be "better tasting," "cleaner," "more complete," "more concentrated," etc. I'm not sure what to believe. I've decided to try the unjury brand protein powder which seems to have a strong following here (although not unanimous by any means). I'm also trying a brand of soy protein powder to see if I like that better. But in any case, even if Kirkland brand chocolate slim drink is not a protein drink, you can make it into one by adding protein powder. Run a few searches on this topic in this forum and you'll find lots of info.

Jason, I think a journal is a good idea for anyone who feels motivated to write one, but it seems like a particularly good idea in your case since you are so good at expressing yourself with the written word. I hope you do a journal and I look forward to reading it. Mark

I know nothing about your situation but just from what I read here I would wonder if your surgeon is a little sadistic. You might want ask if he/she was cruel to animals as a child. I'd also ask your surgeon if perhaps he/she owns a pair of thigh-high black leather boots and whip. :whip: If I were you I would ask the surgeon directly the questions you are asking here, and ask for an explanation for your extreme diet requirements compared to others. ;)

Bandiva: For use next time the in laws come over: :frusty:

Good post 1bunni4me. I think the key to resolving the issues we all have is to acknowledge our own responsibility for our physical condition. By our own choices we have turned ourselves into physically unattractive, disabled people. To blame others as "shallow" because they don't find us attractive is to blame others for our own destructive choices. If people are not attracted to us when we are morbidly obese it is not because there is something wrong with them. To tell you the truth, if someone were attracted to me in my present condition of morbid obesity I would seriously question whether I would ever want to date them at all. I would have to question why this person would be attracted to someone who is obese and disabled. Do they have a control complex? Do they have a savior complex? Why would someone choose this? I'd be very skeptical about ever dating them at all.

I've had a few "last straw" moments, but another one came to mind, so I thought I'd pass it along. About a year ago my wife and I went to an all-inclusive beach resort for a few days and we went out on a snorkeling trip. We all jumped in the Water and snorkeling was good, we had fun. Now the bad news: When it was time to go back in to shore they lowered a sturdy ladder over the side of the boat and everyone climbed in. But I could not make it. I was about 320 at that point and when I got near the top of the ladder the boat tipped toward me and I could not get over the top. People tried to help me when I was near the top of the ladder and even with their assistance I could not get over the top and into the boat. They had to call another boat to bring a bigger ladder. With that ladder I was barely able to get over the top and when I made it I had to roll into the boat, flopping onto the deck like a beached whale with snorkel gear around my neck. It was not a pretty site. My wife was not proud of her husband on that trip. Now it's a year later and I'm up to 340. Can anyone say "lap band"?

That's good news about people eating fruits and veggies, and the doctor's comments. Please let us know how it goes with the band when you start trying these things.

I'm no doctor but from what I've heard it seems that there is a risk of dehydration when you are banded and you have to be deliberate about avoiding that. For one thing, your stomach is much smaller, so you can't just down a couple tall glasses of Water to "catch up" with your water consumption. If you don't drink little bits constantly, you can get dehydrated. And since you are not supposed to drink with your meals, you need to drink other times. So just generally, you have to pay attention to drinking fluids in a way that you never had to before. Dehydration is bad for a number of reasons, but one of them is kidney stones. Some people find that they get kidney stones after being banded. Apparently this is not caused by the band itself, but rather is caused because people have a tendency to get dehydrated when they are banded. I have never had kidney stones, but from the description provided by some members of the group, I am perfectly happy to avoid them. There may be certain experiences a person just "has to have" to feel that they have really lived. Kidney stones is not one of them.

If you don't like the Western look for your bathroom you could consider a "Benihana" motif.

My plan for the flight home is just to bring matches. I'll carry them in my shoe.

Audree, have a look at this thread. It's a good start http://www.lapbandtalk.com/post-op-checklists-t14814.html

It does seem sort of odd that all the things we were taught to eat as the most healthy are all of a sudden potential dangers. Apples, oranges, salad, carrots, etc. I admit that sometimes I do question the wisdom of packing my gut with Protein powder and skipping all the fresh fruits and vegetables. I know we are able to eat fruits and vegetables to some degree, but the odd balance of nutrition with the band seems unnatural in a way. But then, I'll have time to worry about all that once I lose 100 pounds. For now, I know that the first priority is to shed the extra weight.

My wife has made very plain to me that she never would have gone out with me if I was morbidly obese (as I am now) when she met me. Yet she has stuck with me through this weight situation. I feel very bad about the fact that I have inflicted my grotesque body on my dear wife for the last few years, and I am very grateful that she has continued to love me. So my question is, now that I realize how shallow she was at the time I met her (since she would not have dated me if I was morbidly obese), should I leave her now? After all, who would want to be married to someone who was so shallow that they would not want to date a morbidly obese man? After reading this thread I feel like my only viable option is to file for divorce immediately, now that I realize how shallow my wife was at the time I met her.

Thanks everyone for your responses, I really appreciate it. Robin, I agree, I don't want to go alone, but I may have no choice. If I do go alone I won't try to come back for at least a few days. I'll hang out in a motel in Denver and watch "General Hospital," "As the Stomach Turns," "Bands of Our Lives," and other appropriate programming as I glaze out on broth, popsicles and vicadin. Actually, it sounds pretty good when I think of it. :sick :faint:

Shesha, I spoke to them about that. The doc's office said that I can stay the first night in the hospital if I must travel alone. The fee for that is $500. I don't want to travel alone, believe me, but my wife is having a hard time arranging the time off, so I may have no choice.

Hi Shesha, I did not ask what size band. It's an interesting question. I'll ask next time I talk to the doc. Also, I'm wondering, you mentioned that your surgery date is 1/16. Originally I thought it was 1l25. Did you change the date? Mine is 1/16 also. That would be pretty amazing to have the surgery in the exact same time and place. Maybe we can play Monopoly while we are waiting in pre-op. It's getting close. I'm starting to get obsessed. Sometimes it's hard to concentrate on my job when I'm at work. I'm really looking forward to the time about a month after surgery where I'm pretty well healed up and able to eat a little bit of real food. But I guess there are no shortcuts on that path. Just one foot in front of the other.

Once you sign up Paula Pierce, the nutritionist, will send you some info and contact you to discuss it all. Here's the general rundown. · Post-surgery Diet Weeks1: Clear liquid diet Weeks 2-4: Full Liquid/Pureed Diet My pre-op diet is basically just no-carb diet for 10 days. I'm doing it for two weeks just for the heck of it. All things considered this is a fairly humane program compared to some I've seen. I have no idea which is better, but you know what they say, trust your doctor. I'm glad Kirshenbaum has a relatively painless program. I also like the fact that he has no psych exam. I prefer to be treated as if I am presumptively competent to make my own decisions.

Hey DrewsLou, does that mean us guys should still stress about the weather?? Just kidding. :pound: Mark

I've taken a week, and I also said I might have to work from home for a bit after that. I see that most people recover fine within a week, but a few seem to need longer, so I'm trying to cover myself. I must say I'm a little worried about working full time while on a liquid diet, but I'm sure it will work out.

A hamburger smoothie. Wow. It's hard to believe but in a couple weeks that will probably sound really good to me too. :hungry: