Health Care

[BJean 16]

Well I'm not sure who you're talking about but he would probably be surprised to know that millions of Americans feel like you and I do. You know what they say about denial...

I hope you and Leisha will keep bringing good information to the attention of everyone here even for those who just lurk but don't post.

[Cleo's Mom 257]

I certainly understand the liberal logic behind it all, it's just that It is not Constitional for the Federal government to force people to purchase something they don't want.

Mandates to purchase health insurance are a REPUBLICAN idea. They were first proposed by republicans when Hillary Clinton was working on healthcare - it was their idea. And also under REPUBLICAN Romney with his healthcare in his state.

I wonder why no one brought up the issue of being unconstitutional then? Hmmmm.

[BJean 16]

Well it isn't unconstitutional if it is done to ensure the rights that other Americans have to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

Relevant word being "life." Same with car insurance, as I said before that someone pooh-poohed. When we learn through human behavior, that people need to have rules to protect themselves and others, we have seen fit to enact legislation or pass local laws to do it.

Helmet laws are similar and nut balls everywhere, who ride motorcycles without helmets are still up in arms about that one. Live free or die, eh? Well if your motorcycle slams into my SUV, and gets blood all my ride, that just ain't right. Duh, Bubba.

[KartMan 58]

Where did you get the idea that this land belonged to the indians? Merely living on a land does not confirm ownership. The indians had lived here for hundreds of years but were still living in crude homes; eating and warming themselves over an open fire; and letting their old people die alone without help. They had access to all the gold, silver, Iron, Water, trees, etc. that the white man had, yet it was the white man who built the greatest, most advanced society in the world. Their record is not a clean one, but nevertheless, saying that the land belonged to the indian and was taken by the white man is not true. The only land the indians owned was was the land they cleared, lived on and cultivated. To suggest that the indians owned the whole country cause they rode around on it on horseback is bull. Most, if not all, Indian tribes did not believe in a personal ownership of land. They did not consider a plot of ground theirs to be passed on to a son, but ground that was owned by the tribe for the good of all. This same attitude was held toward food. If a brave took a bison or deer in a hunt, it did not belong to him, but the tribe. The shallow thinker says, "That's magnanimous and unselfish." but it is also socialism and could be one reason why the indians were living substantially the same way when Columbus arrived as they had lived five hundred years earlier.

My goodness Patty. That is quite possibly those most ignorant one sided view of history I’ve ever heard. First let me clarify one thing from my perspective... I am not on the retributions bandwagon, what’s done is done – we can’t fix it now. I’m not advocating all non natives leave this land, nor do think we should be handing out 40 acres and a mule. I do however firmly believe we should recognize that the way we built this country was by destroying and forcefully removing the natives and on the backs of slave labor from Africa. Instead of trumpeting how wonderful our forefathers were, we should learn from the parts of history that are less heralded. Rather than paying retributions we should be striving for a more equal society for our non-white brothers and sisters.

[Cleo's Mom 257]

My goodness Patty. That is quite possibly those most ignorant one sided view of history I’ve ever heard. First let me clarify one thing from my perspective... I am not on the retributions bandwagon, what’s done is done – we can’t fix it now. I’m not advocating all non natives leave this land, nor do think we should be handing out 40 acres and a mule. I do however firmly believe we should recognize that the way we built this country was by destroying and forcefully removing the natives and on the backs of slave labor from Africa. Instead of trumpeting how wonderful our forefathers were, we should learn from the parts of history that are less heralded. Rather than paying retributions we should be striving for a more equal society for our non-white brothers and sisters.

Well, I can see, ,that you will never get a job re-writing history for the Texas school books. :thumbup:

Additionally, the lifestyle of the Native American Indians worked very well for them. They had no need to "progress" to something else. They were healthy and self-sufficient. It was the white man who brought diseases, like typhus, measles, scarlet fever, etc.. to them.

[pattygreen 5]

Patty you call him a liar a lot. Can you please expand on this? Not just what you think are lies, but please list the lie he told and then list the truth and where you got the truth from.

Thanks.

Obama and the L-Word - Reason Magazine

[pattygreen 5]

Another lie Op-Ed Columnist - The Emotion of Health Care Reform - NYTimes.com

[pattygreen 5]

Obama Lies, Quotes Lincoln 2x saying "I am bound to be true" | CentristNet

[pattygreen 5]

Al Sharpton: 'The American Public Overwhelmingly Voted for Socialism When They Elected President Obama'

By Jeff Poor (Bio | Archive)

Mon, 03/22/2010

Some of the American people probably thought they were voting for hope and change when they voted for President Barack Obama on Nov. 4, 2008. But according to Rev. Al Sharpton, they were voting for socialism.

Sharpton, the founder of the National Action Network and talk radio host told Fox News on March 21, during their special coverage of the House of Representatives' passage of health care reform legislation, this victory for President Barack Obama and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi would begin "transforming" the country.

"I think that the president and Nancy Pelosi get credit," Sharpton said. "I think this began the transforming of the country the way the president had promised. This is what he ran on."

And if that transformation is socialism, then so be it, he explained. That is what the American public "overwhelmingly" voted for.

[pattygreen 5]

Obama Transparency A Transparency Of Lies

Posted on January 10th, 2010

Last year during the campaign, Barack Obama was all over the map about transparency. He was going to be the number one show on CSPAN. Everything that his administration and the Congress who bowed under him was going to be broadcast on the cable channel. He stated that his would be the most transparent administration in history.

Well he has kept one portion of that very hollow promise. Obama’s administration is the most transparent administration in history but it is a transparency of lies. One lie right after another beginning with the fact that rather than being transparent this is the most secretive administration and Congress in history. I’m not even sure that the secrecy of the Nixon administration compares with all that has been hidden behind closed doors since last January under Obama.

All of the negotiations for every piece of legislation that has come before this Congress at the behest of Obama has been done in secrecy with Rahm Emanuel, Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi and a chosen few Democrats who could help ram legislation through a lock step Democrat majority that follow what they are told like zombies. That is except for the few who only vote as a result of million dollar bribes.

Bills with a massive impact such as the trillion dollar stimulus package and the health care debacle were crafted in secret and kept from being read by both members of Congress and especially the American people in this, “transparent,” administration. Yet at every turn Pelosi, Reid and their dear leader Obama have whined before the cameras about their utter transparency thinking that they can dupe the American people into believing their lies.

Obama also promised a totally bipartisan approach to governing like never before in our history bringing with it a new, “tone,” in Washington. Yet at every turn Republicans have been blocked from any participation with all of their legislative initiatives ignored and not once have GOP members been allowed to be part of any negotiations for any legislation.

But before the cameras Democrats accuse the GOP of being obstructionists, blocking all of their legislation while both chambers of Congress have large enough majorities to pass anything they like without any GOP participation. The obstructionist claim is nothing more than a snow job to the American people to try and hide the inner bickering between Democrats as they craft their bribery schemes to buy votes from those who fall in line only after being paid for their prostitution services.

I will admit that there has been some actual transparency in the Obama administration. A transparency which has not only harmed America but threatens the security of the American people. In his move to change American policy about terrorism from an act of war to the pre - 9/11 mentality of being nothing more than a criminal act, Obama has been very transparent in revealing to the enemy our interrogation procedures and screening procedures for airline passengers.

Earlier this year in an obvious move to try and set up the Bush administration for prosecution by the Attorney Generals Office for anti-terrorism policy under the former President, Obama allowed the transparent release of detailed information of who and how intelligence information was gathered and used in combating terrorism. All to the advantage of the enemy as the entire world became privy to our procedures and other important intelligence gathering operations.

In response to the Christmas Day attack to blow up an airliner bound for Detroit the Obama administration in an attempt to cover their tail for the massive failure in preventing this terrorist attack released detailed procedures of how passengers are screened before boarding a plane including how the system and the equipment works making it completely transparent to our enemies so that they could see exactly how to beat our security.

Assisting our enemies in finding ways around our intelligence gathering and our security has been the ONLY transparent thing that has taken place since Obama took office last January. Transparency in governing which was one of the hall marks of his, “hope and change,” campaign for the Presidency has been nothing more than an long series of lies to the American people.

The very things that should be available to the people by our government are hidden and performed in secret while only a smitten of information is given by the inept Robert Gibbs in vague and laughable press conferences. And almost all of what Gibbs says is questionable at best aggravating even the very liberal Helen Thomas among others in the press corps.

Nothing that this inexperienced and under qualified pretender to the Presidency promised during the campaign has taken place. Even the ridiculous promises such as the closing of GITMO one year after he took office has happened though Obama is still pushing for this asinine move even after we have been attacked on the Homeland three times since he took office by the same type of people who are securely held in Cuba.

One of Obama’s favorite catch phrases is, “make no mistake,” which he uses in almost every speech as an attempt to sound resolute and strong. His administration has been a mistake from the very beginning and even the lefties who voted for him are seeing the light as they are abandoning the, “hope and change,” theme for one, that at least for them is more, “fear and despair,” as true leftist liberalism is being shown in all of its failure by the Obama administration and the Reid, Pelosi circus in Congress.

Eloquent speeches and perceived charm do not a President make. The glimmer of both have long worn off with Obama and the American people are getting more and more fed up with his dog an pony show with each passing day. Yet this Chicago thug and his Windy City mafia in The White House continue with their form of business as usual with the like minded assistance of Pelosi and Reid who can’t even stand before the cameras in pressers with our making complete fools of themselves.

Never has their been such a display of arrogance by any administration and this arrogance is being called transparency. It is Obama’s arrogance which makes him believe that all he need do is stand before a camera and say, “make no mistake,” and the awe and wonder of his over blown presence will inspire the American people and the world into believing his lies. Those days are long past but Mr. Arrogance has no clue that his no substance persuasion no longer works. The Flim Flam Man is no longer getting away with his scam.

The whole debacle he calls an administration and the circus that Reid and Pelosi call a Congress both of which would not know transparency if it was thrown directly in front of them, is so pathetic it would be laughable were it not for the fact that it is destroying our country and weakening our security to the point that we are once again as vulnerable as before 9/11.

This is the real danger of what these amateurs and children are doing to our country and the major problem in this is that in their arrogance it has become obvious that they could care less about the ramifications of their actions and their policy. The agenda and their ideology is all that matters and the demise of the Nation and the safety and security of the American people is of no consequence.

Ken Taylor

[pattygreen 5]

OBAMA: He called for action by the White House and Congress "to do our work openly, and to give our people the government they deserve."

THE FACTS: Obama skipped past a broken promise from his campaign — to have the negotiations for health care legislation broadcast on C-SPAN "so that people can see who is making arguments on behalf of their constituents, and who are making arguments on behalf of the drug companies or the insurance companies."

[pattygreen 5]

OBAMA: "Because of the steps we took, there are about 2 million Americans working right now who would otherwise be unemployed. ... And we are on track to add another one and a half million jobs to this total by the end of the year."

THE FACTS: The success of the Obama-pushed economic stimulus that Congress approved early last year has been an ongoing point of contention. In December, the administration reported that recipients of direct assistance from the government created or saved about 650,000 jobs. The number was based on self-reporting by recipients and some of the calculations were shown to be in error.

[pattygreen 5]

[pattygreen 5]

STATEMENT: “These negotiations will be on C-SPAN, and so the public will be part of the conversation and will see the decisions that are being made.” January 20, 2008, and seven other times.

EXPIRATION DATE: Throughout the summer, fall, and winter of 2009 and 2010; when John McCain asked about it during the health care summit February 26, Obama dismissed the issue by declaring, “the campaign is over, John.”

[pattygreen 5]

STATEMENT: “We've got a philosophical difference, which we've debated repeatedly, and that is that Senator Clinton believes the only way to achieve universal health care is to force everybody to purchase it. And my belief is, the reason that people don't have it is not because they don't want it but because they can't afford it.” Barack Obama, speaking at a Democratic presidential debate, February 21, 2008.

EXPIRATION DATE: On March 23, 2010, Obama signed the individual mandate into law.