Catholic Sleevers Please!

chilo1 · April 28, 2011

It's an older thread . . . but I am a practicing Catholic . . . we plan to use NFP. My husband and I like to leave the creation of life decisions up to God . . . I trust Him completely with every single aspect of my life . . . why would I think that He doesn't know what he is doing with regards to this issue?

No one makes me be Catholic . . . but I am . . . and I don't pick and choose what aspects of my life to trust to God. I trust Him completely. To do otherwise would make me a giant hypocrite.

I too trust Him completely, but I don't think it makes me a hypocrite to not follow what the Catholic Religion dictates as the rule. I believe in a loving and comprehensive God, not a God of punishment and confusion, and I rest my case about religion

chilo1 · April 28, 2011

Oh and I have my tubes tied, after 3 C-sections it's a medical contraindication to have more pregnancies, womb scar can stretch and cause deadly complications, I wouldn't want to leave my 3 girls without a mother-which is why I chose to have my sleeve as well

red_delicious · April 28, 2011

I too trust Him completely, but I don't think it makes me a hypocrite to not follow what the Catholic Religion dictates as the rule. I believe in a loving and comprehensive God, not a God of punishment and confusion, and I rest my case about religion

I wasn't making a judgement . . . that's not my job. But this IS a thread about how religion plays a role in this . . . and I was simply stating the Catholic viewpoint.

I don't think it's confusing at all . . .

I just wonder why some people insist on calling themselves Catholic when they state quite plainly that they don't believe in what the Catholic church teaches. Why not just be Episcopalian? They have "easier rules" to follow.

Anyway . . . the reason I even chimed in here is because I, too, wondered if this was justification for using artificial birth control . . . and according to our bishop (whom I consulted, and whom, by my following of the Catholic faith, I acknowledge as an authority in matters of Catholic doctrine) said that it is not. Therefore . . . I will not be using artificial contraception. I was responding to the original poster . . . not attempting to call anyone a hypocrite . . . except to say that "I" would feel like a hypocrite if I went against my faith on this.

That is all!

Tiffykins · April 28, 2011

After being around the WLS forum world for over 2 years, let me just say, trusting NFP is like trusting the "pull and pray" method. During my rapid weight loss phase, my cycles ranged from 16-32 days, SO there is NO set time for your ovulation when you body is dumping hormones as fast as it's dumping fat and pounds. I've seen more women relying on charting, ovulation charting within the rapid weight loss phase, and BAM 3-4 months post-op, they're knocked up and then struggling with trying to deal with the physical and mental strains on being pregnant.

I'm not Catholic, I'm a good ole' Southern Baptist, we believe in snipping, tucking, every form of bc out there, but I do have several Catholic friends that have their own personal convictions on birth control. I can attest to the fact that even though being pregnant is a glorious, beautiful, joyous occasion for me, it is also the most difficult part of my "post-op journey" mentally that I have ever endured. My complications and extremely difficult recovery is NOTHING in comparison to what I'm enduring on a daily basis with being pregnant, and all the changes I'm going through emotionally and mentally.

chilo1 · April 28, 2011

I wasn't making a judgement . . . that's not my job. But this IS a thread about how religion plays a role in this . . . and I was simply stating the Catholic viewpoint.

I don't think it's confusing at all . . .

I just wonder why some people insist on calling themselves Catholic when they state quite plainly that they don't believe in what the Catholic church teaches. Why not just be Episcopalian? They have "easier rules" to follow.

Anyway . . . the reason I even chimed in here is because I, too, wondered if this was justification for using artificial birth control . . . and according to our bishop (whom I consulted, and whom, by my following of the Catholic faith, I acknowledge as an authority in matters of Catholic doctrine) said that it is not. Therefore . . . I will not be using artificial contraception. I was responding to the original poster . . . not attempting to call anyone a hypocrite . . . except to say that "I" would feel like a hypocrite if I went against my faith on this.

That is all!

I don't insist on calling myself a Catholic, I AM a Catholic

red_delicious · April 28, 2011

I'm editing my comment . . . because I was unnecessarily snarky. I'm getting all defensive, and I definitely didn't mean to.

I certainly did not mean to offend anyone . . . I should have just said that if someone is in doubt as to whether or not something is "allowed" in their faith tradition, then perhaps a forum full of laypeople with no authority within that tradition isn't the best place to receive that kind of specialized guidance. I know that I am in no way an authority . . . and I would hate for someone to take my advice on matters of church doctrine as in some way definitive. I talked to my bishop. He told me what I need to do.

What other people choose to do is really up to them. I just know that the Catholic stance on this is not a matter of my opinion . . . but one might be better served by consulting with their priest or bishop if one is truly seeking spiritual guidance on this.

I hope everyone can forgive my snarkiness . . . I was just trying to offer a more orthodox viewpoint for those who might have been interested. No disrespect of anyone else's beliefs were intended. Honest.

Edited April 28, 2011 by red_delicious

apple-saucy · April 30, 2011

Oh and I have my tubes tied, after 3 C-sections it's a medical contraindication to have more pregnancies, womb scar can stretch and cause deadly complications, I wouldn't want to leave my 3 girls without a mother-which is why I chose to have my sleeve as well

That's actually not accurate. Yes the risks of uterine rupture increase with each c-section, but it it minimal. The Latest research indicates that even after 3+ cesareans the risk of uterine rupture (during labor...not for elective repeat c-sections) is still right around 1% and of those less than half will result in major morbidity or death. ACOG (American Congress of OBGYN's) has actually stated recently that VBAmC (vaginal birth after multiple c/sections) is a safe and reasonable choice. The bigger risk with multiple c-sections is the risk of problems with the placenta namely acretta in which the placenta grows through the scar the worst versions being complete infiltration of surrounding organs. Which is why is so important for women to A) work to prevent the first c/s and VBAC.

Sorry stepping off my "Birth Junkie" soap box

chilo1 · May 3, 2011

That's actually not accurate. Yes the risks of uterine rupture increase with each c-section, but it it minimal. The Latest research indicates that even after 3+ cesareans the risk of uterine rupture (during labor...not for elective repeat c-sections) is still right around 1% and of those less than half will result in major morbidity or death. ACOG (American Congress of OBGYN's) has actually stated recently that VBAmC (vaginal birth after multiple c/sections) is a safe and reasonable choice. The bigger risk with multiple c-sections is the risk of problems with the placenta namely acretta in which the placenta grows through the scar the worst versions being complete infiltration of surrounding organs. Which is why is so important for women to A) work to prevent the first c/s and <img src='http://cdn.verticalsleevetalk.com/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> VBAC. Sorry stepping off my "Birth Junkie" soap box <img src="http://cdn.verticalsleevetalk.com/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" />

In my particular case I was advised by my Consultant not to have any more pregnancies, as my last 2 C-sections (she did both) were very difficult due to a lot of scar tissue between bladder and uterous, I wouldn't risk it, even if there was a 0.001 %, as much as I'd love another baby

Tiffykins · May 3, 2011

That's actually not accurate. Yes the risks of uterine rupture increase with each c-section, but it it minimal. The Latest research indicates that even after 3+ cesareans the risk of uterine rupture (during labor...not for elective repeat c-sections) is still right around 1% and of those less than half will result in major morbidity or death. ACOG (American Congress of OBGYN's) has actually stated recently that VBAmC (vaginal birth after multiple c/sections) is a safe and reasonable choice. The bigger risk with multiple c-sections is the risk of problems with the placenta namely acretta in which the placenta grows through the scar the worst versions being complete infiltration of surrounding organs. Which is why is so important for women to A) work to prevent the first c/s and VBAC.

Sorry stepping off my "Birth Junkie" soap box

I am with Chilo. Because my body likes to make hoards of scar tissue, they won't even allow me to attempt a VBAC. Not that I want a VBAC, and haven't considered it, and wouldn't because I know what is best for my body regardless of what research shows. I have zero desire to risk any further complications from pushing a child out of my vagina. I don't feel the need or want to experience natural child birth. So, even if there were zero risks for me, I'd choose a c-section without second thoughts.

For me, regardless of the "numbers' Murphy's law lives in my house, and if it's going to go wrong, it'll go wrong for me. Plus, I'm a "cut to heal" person. Hence the decision to have 80% of my stomach removed so I would put the fork down. It may make me sound cold, and frigid, but the reality of it is that everyone has to do what is best for them.

apple-saucy · May 4, 2011

Do what you feel is right for you and your baby. I just wouldn't be doing my "job" if I didn't speak up FWIW I've had 4 c-sections all of them unwanted 2 of them unnecessary (the first two, the 2nd two I attempted to vbac labored to complete but poor positioning (one face presentation one persistant posterier) neither of which would move after many hours of pushing in many different positions making a repeat cesarean a prudent choice. Cesareans are great tools when used with prudence and care. Unfortunately in many parts of the world including the US they are used far too frequently. We currently have a 33% cesarean rate in the US more than double what the WHO says is safe and healthy for the average industrialized nation...we are seeing all sorts of fallout from the increased cesarean rate. Complications that used to be exceedingly rare are popping up more and more frequently, the maternal mortality rate is climbing, and post birth complications are increasing. It makes me

Gah sorry on my birth junkie soap box again.

I am with Chilo. Because my body likes to make hoards of scar tissue, they won't even allow me to attempt a VBAC. Not that I want a VBAC, and haven't considered it, and wouldn't because I know what is best for my body regardless of what research shows. I have zero desire to risk any further complications from pushing a child out of my vagina. I don't feel the need or want to experience natural child birth. So, even if there were zero risks for me, I'd choose a c-section without second thoughts.

For me, regardless of the "numbers' Murphy's law lives in my house, and if it's going to go wrong, it'll go wrong for me. Plus, I'm a "cut to heal" person. Hence the decision to have 80% of my stomach removed so I would put the fork down. It may make me sound cold, and frigid, but the reality of it is that everyone has to do what is best for them.