female only Tired of not being picked

[Jane_J 117]

I'm not sure if men are allowed to post, and I don't know if this will help, but...

The "you're great, but... [you're too fat]" thing goes both ways. I can't count the number of times that I -- naturally a fairly shy man -- finally got the courage up to ask out a girl I was attracted to, and was told something like "I like you, like a brother" or "let's just be friends." It's more polite than the "radio silence" you mention, but still the message is the same: you're a great person, but because you're so fat, you're unacceptable.

It even goes further, for me. When I was a good deal younger -- but still pretty heavy -- there was a very beautiful girl who, for some bizarre reason, seemed fairly fixated on me. In retrospect, she was sending me EVERY sign that she wanted some kind of intimate relationship with me, but I was so sure that I was fat and unattractive, that I "froze up" and didn't reciprocate, and the opportunity was lost (one of my "normal" weight "friends" swooped in on her). In retrospect, it turns out that she wouldn't have been good for me, but still, it makes me wonder how many experiences I missed out on because I didn't think I was good enough.

In a weird way, I sorta get why we don't get picked for the mating dance when we're fat. Despite all the Disney films in the world telling us that "it's what's inside that counts," the bottom line is that in many ways dating and marriage are about breeding and genetics. On many unconscious levels, we are attracted to someone because we think we would make good, strong, smart, healthy children with them (well, maybe not explicitly, since that wouldn't explain homosexuality, but you can't deny that basic health is almost always a prerequisite for attraction). So, it's unsurprising that we obese people might not get "picked" because let's face it, who'd want unhealthy, obese kids?

But even knowing all of this evolutionary psychology stuff, it's hard to be the one who's constantly waiting by the sidelines in life. Even knowing that there's a biological basis for it, that doesn't make it any easier when you feel like you're defective because you're fat.

And that may be the worst part -- not just the rejection from society, but the internalization of it. Once you start to buy into it, once you start to buy into the idea that you're defective and undesirable because of your weight, you really start to live your life differently -- you stop taking chances, and you avoid situations where you just "know" you won't be accepted. And that may be the biggest tragedy of all.

Ultimately, it would be great if society didn't reject fat people, but like I said, I think a good portion of it is wired into our biology. And with the sleeve surgery, we finally have a chance to escape the physical trap; it's up to US to learn how to escape the mental trap.

Ouroborous if I was single and a lot younger I would want you. You are intelligent and kind. What's not to like here?

I hope you get some confidence to take chances soon, and catch up on what you may have been missing. Then settle down with someone wonderful and have a few lovely kids too! :thumbup:

[Jane_J 117]

I don't have much to add...but I just wanna give everybody a big fat hug!

**hugs**

Me too! :thumbup:

[deletedsally 8]

I agree that there are a lot of biological roots to attraction and mating choices. But for most of us, if we are honest, the social reasons for partner attractions/choices extend beyond our simple visual perceptions of beauty. This isn't going to sound very romantic, but when we are dating, we take ourselves to market, just like someone who wants to sell a steer. The kid who has worked hard to raise a healthy steer knows what a fair price is when he takes that steer to auction. The same thing is true when we look at relationships. How many times have we heard someone say, "Oh he/she can do better than that!" What do they mean? They mean that on the internal scale that we automatically use to compare people's assets, this match is not equal. As a highly gifted woman, what's the possibility that I am going to choose a partner who is mentally handicapped? None.

It is true that some people have assets that outweigh their increasing age or physical unattractiveness. (Why do beautiful young women get involved with someone like Larry King?) But for most of us, being overweight is a huge deficit in the relationship marketplace. Our weight impairs our ability to perform most activities as well as "normals". As a kid, I couldn't run as fast, I couldn't climb a rope, I fell off the monkey bars. As a teen, I lost weight and began taking ballet, but still being on the heavy side, I couldn't leap as high, partners couldn't lift me as easily, and I had to stop wearing toe shoes because my teacher said my weight made it dangerous to my feet. I tried to play raquetball, tennis, and volleyball--but I couldn't compete as well, because I couldn't move as quickly and I got out of breath more easily.

What kind of physical things do adults do for fun that the typical obese person enjoys or does well? Cycling? Jogging? Hiking? Kayaking? Skating? Water skiing? Snow skiing? I can't enjoy dancing because feet hurt and I can't wear regular shoes. I can't even enjoy traveling because I don't have the energy to walk around to enjoy sightseeing. And to be perfectly blunt, when I was married, our sex life was directly impacted by my obesity. Yeh, I know...where there's a will there's a way...but the reality is that sexual possibilities become more restricted as your body gets larger and heavier. Additionally, pleasure can be greatly diminished when there's a lot of fat that gets in the way. That's not even to beginning to address the additional impact that diabetes and other health problems can have on a sexual relationship.

People may not think about that stuff on a conscious level when choosing a partner, but most of us know it to be true. Being fat affects our ability to participate freely and equally in relationships in ways that extend far beyond our our outer appearance and general health.

Edited May 15, 2010 by katt

[Bonne M 0]

Men are men. They don't think the way we do. Don't look for a relationship more than friendship. If it is ment to blossom to something else it will. That doesn't mean that will be forever. Cultivate friendships with everyone.

Every relationship is a compromise. You are the only one who can determine what you can live with. Society states we need to be thin, and as a women, need to be in a "love" relationship. Don't rush into a relationship because you are lonely. Remember every experience may be trying to teach us something. And sometimes you need to buy a vowel. (I always buy the wrong one).

There will be some one to love you when the time is right and when you are ready for one. Be patient and love yourself, your new life. And it is always alright to have a small pity party.

[ouroborous 519]

Ouroborous if I was single and a lot younger I would want you. You are intelligent and kind. What's not to like here?

I hope you get some confidence to take chances soon, and catch up on what you may have been missing. Then settle down with someone wonderful and have a few lovely kids too! :wink0:

Thanks for the compliment (I just noticed this, so sorry for the delay).

I have my fair share of baggage, just like everyone else. I think perfectionism is another trap we fall into, just like insecurity (of course, as a fat man, I always felt like I had to "settle" for whoever would want me; it's going to take a big adjustment to realize that I can -- and should -- be with the person I WANT to be with).

But the bottom line is that there are a lot of things that aren't fair in life -- younger, healthier, slimmer people have more romantic opportunities. People reject us before they get to know the "real person" inside. Society tells us that we're lazy and slovenly because we're overweight. All of those things are based partly or fully upon a lie, and all of those things are unfair, and ultimately all of those things simply are what they are, and we have to deal with them.

I think that what I, at least, am still learning, is how not to internalize these negative messages. I'm a good person, even if I'm heavy. I have desirable qualities even if not everyone can see them. And ultimately, just like everyone else, I have the right to at least try to be with the person I WANT to be with, not just whoever I think I can "get."

BTW, I have to shake my head sometimes at how different male and female psychology is when it comes to dating -- reading Chancie's post about how men will smile and look at her, but not approach her, my instinctive response is, "well, why don't you go talk to THEM?" It's not 1950 anymore, women are actually allowed to pursue men they find attractive. I think that sometimes, women waiting for men to approach them is just a way of making sure they're interested before taking a chance, just like men not wanting to make the first move until they're sure the woman is interested. The end result, on both sides, is nothing -- no moves are made, no chances taken, no lessons learned. But hey, it's safe, right?

I've learned the lesson for sure that it's not really better to be safe than sorry; usually, playing it "safe" will make you more sorry than just taking a chance and leaping out into the blue without a net. In fact, I can't think of a single time where I took a chance and, in the long term, regretted it. Every single time, even if the outcome wasn't what I thought I wanted, I at least learned something.

On the other hand, I can think of hundreds of times where I decided to "play it safe" and truly, deeply regretted it -- often for the rest of my life.

Edited June 7, 2010 by ouroborous

[Chancie 65]

ouroborous-

Hi! I just got done reading your post.

Sometimes I just don't come across "clearly" on here.

I agree. it isn't the '50's anymore!!

Here is something that happened to me.. that goes to approaching a man.. and meeting a "heavier" man...

I belong to a singles site that I'm not a paying member of, but can send a "flirt" etc.

So in my profile... I stated that and what chat room I would be in and if you see me and want to talk.. say "hello"

Well. i got a few "flirts" and one from a guy who yes, was a big man... 6'7" and I can't tell weight, but was "bigger"

I finnaly seen him in the chat room and he never said anything.. so I did. Added him to my yahoo and we talked a few times. I even gave him my phone # Then he came to see me where I work. Nice guy.

I don't want to be "shallow" I Know what thats like when it has happened to me. I want to KNOW somebody for who they are. NOT just their looks or weight.

And. to top it all off. he's younger than me....... would I do this before?? NO.

My weight loss has made me more confidant, but it has also given me a new perspective on what I want out of life.

I want a friend and companion.. someone I can talk to thru good times and bad.

I have sharred my weight loss with a few, and some I will when the time is right.

I have had people at work tell me how skinny I am, and I have those on line tell me I look good.. but is that what I want to hear?

Sure........... it's a GREAT ego BOOST...... but...... I want them to know me for ME. The same as when I was "heavy"

So it really is a "double edge sword" the weight loss......... and I can see where people would and could lose who they really are.

I don't want to lose my princibles, my morals or myself in all of this... but I can see it happening to some.

I kinda rambeled on...... hope I made some sence....

[ouroborous 519]

I'm sorry, I didn't intend to be mean or rude. That was just a "gut feeling" of mine -- I'm sure a lot of my reaction is colored by the fact that I'm male and we're "expected" to make the first move (if that makes any sense).

[ouroborous 519]

Oh, and, you made perfect sense

[Jane_J 117]

Hi Chancie,

It made sense to me too. I think we are all feeling our way here.

The initial attraction between man and woman is just that. If there is no understanding or commonality the relationship should not progress. Sometimes people force it because they are scared of being alone and they want the relationship succeed.

The butterfly in the tummy attraction thing passes quite quckly and then you have to see what you are left with. Often absolutely nothing.

I am weird maybe because I never find men attractive on looks, although nice looks are a bonus. It's the quality of mind, wit and kindness that floats my boat. I married one too :scared0:

All the very best,

Jane

[Oregondaisy 2,021]

Chancie, you were talking about putting in your profile what chat room you're in.

Which dating site can you do that? At match they seem to find any hints I put in on how to find me cause I am not a paying member. also, where do you chat?

thanks, I'd love to find a good site and also chat with someone!

[SouthernSleever 236]

To be honest, I don't see a guy and think, "I want to date him!". I think females don't make the first move because we aren't attracted primarily by looks. Now, I am not saying that looks don't matter they certainly do. But when I find myself attracted to men it is because their personality, intelligence, humor, self esteem, and ability to provide. It takes time for me to figure these things out. I am the type of person where if I see someone I might like I will flirt and then leave it to him to make the next move. Touching someone's arm while talking to them or just smiling can give the guy confidence enough to show interest if it is there.