BJean

What tha? Have they been censoring??? Well, we three need to come up with something really ghastly and contentious! I sure miss TOM. He always seemed to manage getting people's pants in a wad. :ranger:

newgirl07: Hey doll, I know I responded badly to your very sweet post. I think that aging is such a shock to me that I do not appreciate the idea of a 60 year old man with a much younger woman. Honestly there is absolutely nothing wrong with that relationship as far as I'm concerned. I am just jealous on 2 counts: the first is because you're 37 and have your head screwed on better than I did at that age, and second, if something should happen to my husband, I'd like to think that the available 60 year old men would find me an attractive mate. With someone like you around who finds a 60 year old male a viable and attractive mate, my chances are zero. The fact is, if something did happen to my husband, I doubt if I would want to hook up with a man again full time. But I might like to hook up with a man your age for a rowdy night or two though! :heh: Just don't feel too badly about our cantankerous posts here. Afterall, damnit, we're old and we don't accept it! It really isn't anger directed at anyone in particular, just the world in general for not appreciating our wisdom and wrinkled, blemished beauty. :phanvan

lauraj23: Please do not think that 85% of people with the band get cheated on by their spouses! It just isn't true. This is a thread for that particular topic, and you're reading many cases of it here, but it is a very small percentage of the people who post at LBT, certainly not the majority!! Good luck with your band.

zannie: Something you said a few posts back struck a chord with me. My Ex definitely wanted me to make the decision to split. I didn't realize it at the time because I was such a mentally beaten, emotional wreck. But the fact is, he SAID that he didn't want a divorce. He told all his friends and family that he didn't want a divorce. He told our pastor he didn't want a divorce. He said he couldn't understand why I wanted a divorce. Yet his behavior was a different story. He did everything he could to push me over the edge. Then when I finally did tell him I wanted a divorce, I was the bad guy - for all the world to see. He was able to convince himself and the people in his church that it was I who was incapable of making our marriage work. That was 40 years ago!! And a couple of years ago my former sister-in-law, still married to my ex's brother, came to town and invited me to lunch. I hadn't seen her in almost 40 years! Over lunch she asked me the question, "Please just tell me one thing... have you ever regretted divorcing him?" What??!! OMG, I was flabbergasted. I couldn't believe that after all these years and my practically total disconnect from him, that she could wonder if I regretted divorcing him. I have been happily married to my current DH for 34 years and he adopted her brother-in-law's biological son (with my ex's complete consent) and my DH and I have a gorgeous daughter. We have enjoyed a beautiful, solid family life for 34 years. What in the world would make her think that I regretted the divorce???!!! In case you're wondering if she asked because my Ex is wealthy, although my Ex has enjoyed a great deal of success as an architect, my current DH is a brilliant man who has had an extraordinary career and provided a wonderful lifestyle for us and our kids. After I picked my jaw up off the floor, I told her that I didn't want to seem callous or mean, but that frankly divorcing him was the best decicion that I have ever made! I told her that there were so many things that I could tell her that would help her to understand, but she very quickly said she didn't want to know any of that. Well, that was fine with me... she can continue to believe that he's a saint until the day she dies if she wants to. I am just glad that I had the opportunity to assure her that I very definitely made the right decision, period, end of story. I'm not trying to convince you that your course of action should be what mine was, but I am saying that I was up against the same thing (although different specifics) you're up against with him trying to get you to make the decision. If you do wind up making the same decision I made, be prepared for the whole world to think you're the bad guy. It was tough at the time, but for me, worth it a million times over. And although it may have taken a really long time, my son learned all on his own why I divorced the guy. I never had a bad thing to say about his biological father because I didn't think it was fair to my son. Thank goodness I didn't ever become so angry and bitter than I ran my Ex down or fought with him in front of our son - and man there were sure times that I wanted to. But I felt my responsibility was first and foremost to my child. It has paid off in spades over these many years. Btw, my Ex even went so far as to tell our son that "If it weren't for his mommie, we could live together as a family." That was when my son was 4 years old. He never paid a dime of child support unless I begged him. His child support debt was $85 a month. He wouldn't have even noticed a blip in his checkbook. He only saw our son when I suggested it because our son wanted to know if he could see him. And when he was with him, he was talking me down. And his sister-in-law wants to know if I regretted divorcing him - it boggles the mind!!!

laurend: Gawd that is so unfair!! I try really hard to make myself understand that when I go through the really tough stuff, it only makes me stronger. That's hard to keep in mind when someone is busting your chops, but some of the people who have had perfect childhoods are the most insufferable adults who think they are God's gift to the world. My DH had a very unfair and tough childhood and he's great about saying that they just didn't realize what they were doing and that they were a product of their own upbringings. He doesn't hold a grudge, fortunately. But then he doesn't spend much time around them these days either.

Green: Wow I can't believe it's almost September and then before you know it they'll be wheeling you in for surgery! How long is your expected recovery time? I do not have that kind of money lying around right now. Otherwise, I'd like to be roommates. Your doc sounds terrific. I've often wondered how painful it is. I've seen photos of people who have had a facelift and there's a lot of bruising involved. Personally I wouldn't be too concerned about the bruising as far as scaring the natives, but I'm not all that happy thinking about the pain. I too have roseacea and my new doc suggests a photofacial procedure that is relatively new. There is some pain involved and you do have to have that topical painkiller stuff applied an hour before the procedure. I don't think it does much for wrinkles and the jowls, but it is more for the color and texture and sun damage to your skin. A full facial is more appealing because of getting so much taken care of at one time. A friend of mine in Orlando was 82 and she had had 3 facelifts. She told me that I should go ahead and have one and that as far as she was concerned it was the best money she ever spent. She absolutely did not have that deer in the headlights look. She had a great doctor too. You're too cool using your monetary inheritance to take care of your genetic inheritance! I shoulda put mine in a Christmas Plan - and given me a big, beautiful Christmas gift! I'm thinking of you, grrl! Eh?

Glad to hear from you Zannie, we were all wondering how you're doing. The weight loss is going to help you be stronger and that's fantastic. Honestly it sounds like your husband has been a very good thing in your life before all this. It is so easy for people to get off track and go their separate ways in a marriage, long before a real separation or divorce occurs. And it's really hard to get back on track and start down a new path together with common goals. It takes a whole lot of work and it isn't easy. The psychologist who speaks at a meeting once a month for my bandster group says that if we stop communicating every day with our spouses and do not share most things that happen in our everyday lives, we are headed down separate paths in life and a split usually is in the horizon. I hope that your husband will come to his senses and realize what he's risking, the loss of you and your marriage, and he will beg your forgiveness and make it his job to do everything in his power to make it up to you. If that doesn't happen, you are an intelligent, strong woman and you will take care of yourself, for you and the children, and he will support you in getting your degree (or whatever path you want to take) and he will share totally in the responsibility of your children. Again, I know how difficult this is right now and I think you're getting great advice about not moving out or making him move out. Plus not making any major life-altering decisions while all this turmoil about the other woman is going on. She's obviously unstable and there's no telling what she's done to get her hooks in him (we already know of one major thing she was willing to do, the pregnancy) and he's probably inwardly feeling very flattered that he has two women who he thinks love him. So hang in there as best you can. Stay strong. And please know that we're all sure pulling for you with all our might!!

Look at the camera and say, "CHEESE!" I'm missing this thread already.

Angie: That former skinny friend who can't find a husband and wonders why, probably also wonders why she doesn't have any friends. Duh. With friends like her, who needs enemies?

Schemgie: Congratulations! That's great.

Hey, I'm having a difficult time wrapping my mind around the idea of "fish belly blue" as a skin color. Once when I was particularly perturbed about having to fill out a questionnaire, when it asked my ethnicity the choices were something like: White Black Asian Indian I checked White, but added "with brown dots". (I'm very freckled.)

green: I am so proud of you for how well you've done with your band. You've had a setback, but it sounds like you're healing now. I am sure it is scary to have the restriction taken out, but once you get rid of the irritation, you'll be able to get it back. A size 10!!!! Wow. You are definitely inspiring me!

The Curves franchises come from the same corporate office, but there is some discretion about how they handle various things. All 3 Curves that I went to had 30 minute work-outs, not 20 minute ones. The best one that I went to offered Pilates 3 days a week and they had a bar where you could by nutritious shakes, and they had a massage room with a masseuse, and there were mats available for floor exercises and cool downs. The reasons I didn't like exercising to "My God is an Awesome God" are because, 1) The music was way too slow, and 2) I thought it sounded like the singer was dissing other peoples' God. Like there is something unique about his God. That wasn't inspiring to me, it was distracting and off-putting. But for those of you who are belting it out here, more power to you... if that inspires you I'll bet you love marching around to it. Practically 100% of the women where I went, really disliked that particular song and when it came on, everyone groaned and asked the instructors to take it off. There was one time when one woman said she liked it and so everyone agreed that the instructors should leave it on for her. Afterall, it only lasts a few of minutes.

P.S. I used to love it when the edit function worked! I tried to remove the advertisement in the middle, I really did.... sorry about that!

The thing I am most sick of right now is the President of our country. Here is one example of why I am sick to death of him and his politics! This is an article from USA Today: President Bush's speech at the state capitol in Charleston, W.Va., on Independence Day in 2004, invoked the nation's highest ideals: "On this Fourth of July, we confirm our love of freedom, the freedom for people to speak their minds. ... Free thought, free expression, that's what we believe," Bush told the crowd. ADVERTISEMENT if(window.yzq_d==null)window.yzq_d=new Object();window.yzq_d['hxOoU0LEYpE-']='&U=13b7fmcki%2fN%3dhxOoU0LEYpE-%2fC%3d576395.11029866.11608433.1414694%2fD%3dLREC%2fB%3d4392855'; Ringing words. Unfortunately, the White House advance team didn't get the memo. Or the message. More than an hour earlier, the advance officials, working with local police, had confronted and ejected a young couple who had come to the speech wearing T-shirts that fit any reasonable definition of free expression. The front of both shirts bore the name "Bush" surrounded by a circle with a slash through it; the back of Jeffery Rank's shirt carried the slogan "Regime Change Begins at Home" and Nicole Rank's shirt read, "Love America, Hate Bush." The Ranks refused demands to take the shirts off, turn them inside out or leave. Though they were on public property and not being disruptive, they were handcuffed, arrested and charged with trespass. The charges were later dropped, and with the help of the American Civil Liberties Union, the Ranks sued the White House advance personnel for violating their First Amendment rights. Last week, the government settled the case, admitting no wrongdoing but agreeing to pay the Ranks $80,000. That avoidable expenditure of taxpayer dollars speaks volumes about who was wrong here. It would be one thing if the Charleston incident were an isolated case of overzealousness. But it's not. People have been kicked out of a Bush event in Denver because their car bore a "No More Blood for Oil" bumper sticker. Others have been kept out for wearing a Young Democrats shirt. Extraordinary efforts were made to prevent protests from marring the GOP convention in 2004 at which Bush was renominated. During the Ranks' suit, the White House was forced to cough up a heavily censored copy of its advance manual, which reads like something Venezuelan strongman Hugo Chavez would love. Among the advice: Advance personnel should ask the local police department to designate a protest area, "preferably not in view of the event site or the motorcade route." It's vital, of course, that the Secret Service protect the president from physical threats when he appears in public. And it's understandable that the White House wants to have the president speak without disruption from people who disagree with him. But it's important that cloistered presidents know that there are people who disagree with them, and there are disorderly conduct laws to deal with protesters who cross the line. Dissent is a bedrock of our system. The administration, with its penchant for secrecy and order, never quite gets that and repeatedly tries to draw the line too broadly. Even people who might be sympathetic toward Bush are tiring of this cavalier arrogance. When he returned to Charleston in 2006 for a fundraiser at a private home, the Secret Service demanded that the local police keep protesters off a bridge the motorcade would cross. Charleston Mayor Danny Jones, a Republican, refused. The Secret Service compromised, and protesters got onto most of the bridge. If you profess to love "the freedom for people to speak their minds," as Bush told the Charleston crowd in 2004, you have to assume you're not always going to love what they say. Instead of a lengthy manual on preventing and handling demonstrators, Bush's advance people need a refresher course on a somewhat older manual. It's called the Constitution of the United States. The White House declined to provided an opposing view to this editorial because, according to spokesman Tony Fratto, the Presidential Advance Manual is an issue in two other pending lawsuits.

P.S. As to the great New Mexico, Colorado and Utah mountains: my LB doc's 17 yr. old son was with a group scaling some mountains a couple of weeks ago. He contracted the Hanta Virus and nearly died. If his father weren't so saavy regarding medical stuff, he'd probably be dead right now. Fortunately, he survived after spending time on a respirator, etc. 50% of people who get it do not survive. It is an airborne illness - from Deer mice poop. Gawd, I would have much preferred not knowing about that possibility when considering mountain life.

The other night Letterman said they should make Michael Vick eat the tainted dog food from China instead of putting him in jail.

Denise- I totally agree about the music at Curves!! Fortunately I found one that did their own thing with the music. It was a younger crowd and they didn't put up with all those oldies and religious music. It was a huge improvement over the first Curves I joined! There was one particularly grating song, something like MY GOD IS AN AWESOME GOD. Oh puleeze...

Betseyjane: Man, I've had that fantasy! Or at least a similar one. I have thoughts of going to the New Mexico or Arizona desert, living in a cool, clean adobe. Soaking up the dry desert air, wandering up the mountains and finding a cool little stream, wading until my toes ache from the cold. Watching the wildflowers bloom in the high desert, peace and quiet with no one to say how I should look, think or paint. The whole Georgia O'Keefe experience... Screw aging!!

NANA: You are spot on with regard to how the public views chubby ladies and tans now, and back then. It's pretty ironic that women with some fat on them are actually more healthy than the bony models that we idolize. Women who work out too much and run marathons a lot can actually lose their menses and can't get pregnant. Their bodies know that they can't support a pregnancy or breastfeeding. Many of the celebrities who choose to adopt rather than physically bear children would like for us all to think it is just because they are humanitarians and being environmentally responsible, but don't we pretty much suspect that their efforts are not entirely pure? They don't want to ruin their money-makers and become like the masses of most other women in the world: misshapen from child bearing. Can you believe Heidi Klum??? What a genetic wonder she is! Candice Olsen does have good genes, obviously. And not just for the fact that she is naturally slender - she's got good decorator genes too! Btw, have you noticed how pale she is? :heh:

Nana: I was always the smallest of my two sisters and me. In fact, until I was about 42 and started gaining weight every year, I stayed within the 105-115 lb. range. When I was 9 mos. preggers with my first, I weighed 118. Pretty cool. Then with my second, 8 years later, I peaked at 162! I got back down to 110 within 6 months. Remember though, I'm only 5'2". My sister who was 13 mos. older than I, always used to love to ask people who they thought was older. Invariably they would say that I was. Well, she was fat and fat don't crack.:rolleyes Duh, I dunno, something like that. And my sister who is 8 years older than I am, and 350+ lbs. also wound up looking younger. Sigh. I need a face lift!! I gotta tell you both of them were thrilled when I started gaining weight. I thought they were proud of me for working so hard at staying slim, but no, they resented me. Sisters, yeah - you gotta love 'em! Let's don't be too hard on 'em. My sister who was 13 months my senior, died from breast cancer after a very horrible 3 years of fighting it. I'd give up my Lap Band if it would bring her back - and that's saying a lot!! I do love my band.

newgirl: I won't bash you for your refreshing outlook, but I would love to be around when you turn 60 and have you tell me how 60 is the new 40. However, I doubt very seriously that if I'm still around then, I'll be able to remember who the hell you are, much less this discussion. Sure, there are men who choose women who are close to them in age. However there are many more men who choose women who are much younger than they are. On the other hand, these days there are a lot of relatively young men who prefer the company of older women. Frankly, knowing what medical problems the age of 60 brings, if I were single I would probably choose a younger guy just so I wouldn't have to deal with all that in my mate. It's disgusting enough dealing with my own skin tags. I bring this up because I just had 27 of them all over my body painfully frozen off. I have jowls where my firm chin line used to be. My hair is thinning around my forehead. My knees are arthritic and the doctor threatens knee replacement. Believe me honey, botox doesn't begin to fix everything that age 60 brings. Botox is great for the 42 year old who is beginning to see laugh lines deepen and the forehead lines looking more permanent. I am thrilled for you that you've found your soul mate. I hope things work out well for you as a couple. The odds are sure stacked against you having a 20 year union though. You won't believe how different things get after the mid-70s. Then the 60s will look like a cake walk.

I went to Curves for 3 years. I felt much, much better and finally got my arse off the couch. It helped a lot with not being so depressed and disconnected to other people after a move to another state. The good things about Curves are that everything is low-impact, and it is easier and more interesting than most work out places where you just do everything on your own. You're in a big circle and it's pretty easy to start talking to the other women and everyone is usually in a good mood because they are getting some exercise. I wound up getting tendonitis which caused me to be immobile for a while. By the time the tendonitis was better (6 months!) my knees were shot. Don't ask me why the arthritic knees happened so quickly, but I have talked to other people who have had similar experiences. I wound up getting the band because I was desperate for relief!! I recommend Curves unless you are used to doing really strenuous exercises. If you are (like a friend of mine) it will seem way too easy for you. What I found after going to Curves for a couple of weeks, is that you will up your activity and intensity gradually. What seems so easy in the beginning can actually become much more difficult as you go along. Which is, of course, a good thing. Unless you damage something, that is.

Kat: My first husband convinced me to go back to him twice after our divorce. I realized later that I was doing it for my son, not myself, and because of what society thought of divorce. We wound up with 2 divorces, the last time I agreed to go back, I didn't have our previous divorce set aside, as I did the first time. I'm a real slow learner. But he was a very charming and very good looking guy, with lots and lots of potential for leading a charmed life. Too bad for me and our son that charm isn't a good substitute for substance. I won't bore you with the rest of the story, but as ugly as my life with him was, it doesn't hold a candle to what you went through. You can't go through things like that without learning a whole lot in the process. My first marriage to my Ex brought me to the place where I could love and appreciate my second husband, because I probably wouldn't have given him a second look if I had met him first. Not that he isn't good looking, it's just that he is such a solid rock, athletic, conservative guy and that was not appealing when I was very young and wanting to ride in fast cars, if you know what I mean.

Ah yes, now that you mention it, Green, I do remember that quote as having been said by dear ole' Wallis Simpson. The slut. I am sure that she probably impressed Rose Kennedy and that's why Rose adopted that skinny bitch approach to life. Did you know that Wallis Simpson and her abdicated royal had a place in the U.S.? Never having seen her in person, only photos, I can't understand what he saw in her. But then, that brings to mind a more contemporary someone who fell for that "horse" woman, doesn't it? I guess having a few extra lbs and being married to a commoner is not always so bad, by comparison.