BJean

Yeah, I agree. And maybe having her legs tattooed as well as her arms would appear to be too freakish for American Idol. I saw a guy once who had his entire legs tattooed with a solid design except for the back of his calves. There he had an opened zipper tattooed where there were creepy round bugs appearing to tumble out. A little unnerving, I must say.

I love you too Aphrodite. gadget: Yes, the fetus has a circulatory system unique to it, but the mother's blood is used to make the baby's and they share the same body. That's why my DIL had to take shots to keep her baby from killing her.

Gosh yes, it's back! And now it's gone. Frustrating for sure!!! They finally figured out that the medical mystery part of the show is what makes it unique and special. And the pumped up drama. Whoo hoo! All that whinning and carried-over silliness was getting old already. Love the story line about Callie and what's her name - putting McSteamy about right where he should be. The two kids having their close encounter of the 1st kind. The freaked out not really prego.... etc. George putting his foot down - really? George putting his foot down? Changes, that's what I'm talking about!~ I for one am thrilled that Meredith is, at least in one aspect, finally seeing the light. (so to speak) Of course McDreamy is a little out on a limb here, walking off after she has made such an impressive effort to show she's worthy. Now I'm beginning to wonder about HIS sanity.

If we're looking for miracles, we can find any number of unexplainable events that we can choose to believe are miracles. History is full of them. If you are a believer in miracles, you don't find it hard to accept something that can't be explained by conventional wisdom or science, as being a miracle. If on the other hand you aren't a believer in miracles, you don't find it difficult to believe that unexplained events are just that, unexplained. Events that defy the norm aren't events that can't happen given the right circumstances. So it is understood by non-believers that they are not miracles, just random events that aren't expected. IMHO, of course.

Thanks Devana. Just about what I figured, only surprisingly even worse. I appreciate your input here. Your pediatrician story made me remember mine. When our DD was a baby and had "colic" and cried a lot because her tummy hurt, our pediatrician advised us to allow her to cry in her bed for at least 30 minutes at a time, rather than try to hold her or continually comfort her - since holding her might condition her to demand attention even when she was not in pain. He said she needed to learn to comfort herself and that sometimes babies just need to cry it out. He said that 30 minutes, or even 45 minutes of crying alone in her bed would not physically harm her. And he added that sometimes that's the only way parents can keep their sanity with a colicky baby. I asked him if that was how he handled his 5 children. He said, no, he could never listen to his children cry without trying to figure out what was wrong and if he coundn't find anything wrong, then he would hold them, rock them and comfort them. I said then why are you telling me that I should let her cry? He said because that's the current conventional wisdom and he can't dispute it. I asked him if we would be spoiling her by giving her that much attention and he added that babies can't be spoiled. Their behavior is generated by instinct. Man IMHO, if we don't use common sense and logic to tend to our children's needs, we're not doing them or ourselves any favors.

Susan he was my favorite from the get-go too. I was very disappointed when he was voted off and I was really happy that he did so well last night too. I agree. David Cook seemed thoroughly in his own skin when performing with ZZ Top! I wouldn't let my DH delete the tivo either. I want my DD to see it too.

The baby is absolutely part of my body. There's no other way to interpret it. Those addtional arms, legs, lungs, brain, etc., are mine and entirely my responsibility. It is not a separate individual until it is a separate individual. It cannot survive without me. As an individual it has no automatic right to life unless I give it life because it cannot live without me. My blood it its' blood, my oxygen is its' oxygen, etc. It is emcumbent upon me to determine what will happen to my fertilized egg. You and others have no rights to my eggs, fertilized or not. You could become involved if my fertilized egg were to be implanted into your womb. Then it would be your responsibility to grow it into a human being. You could provide nourishment through your blood and other organs. You could give it life. Or if it didn't live, you would be responsible for not giving it life. If someone presented the idea that all embryos should be removed, become the property of the government and subsequently implanted into donor uteruses chosen by the government or implanted into women, like you, who insist that they have the right to save each and every fertilized egg in this world, then that's a whole 'nuther ball game and set of beliefs to argue about. I'm sure that the lines would still be drawn with some people believing that they can tell other people what they should believe and what they should do with their fertilized eggs. There's no need to state that "we must agree to disagree" because that was determined hundreds of pages ago. Where's the icon beating its' head against a brick wall when you need it? :crying:

WOW!!! 12 Million votes!!! That's nothing to sneeze at. I was absolutely thrilled with the results. I have no doubt that David Archuleta will have a fine career so I'm not worried about that. David Cook is awesome and was more unique and he rocked. The ZZ Top performance was great!! Am I the only one who thought that the Seal/Syesha performance sucked? Actually their stage interaction was great but the song itself was bluddy awful. They murdered Seals great song as far as I was concerned. Was it just me or did anyone else get goose bumps during George Michael's performance? He claimed he had a cold, but I thought it was really fantastic. I was super-surprised! As for Simon, I couldn't help but think he got the results before hand. He's not one to ever want to be wrong and if he hadn't apologized to Cook and claimed to have changed his mind after reviewing the tapes, he would have looked like an idiot when the winner was announced - especially since Cook won by such a large margin. That Simon is crazy like a fox. I had thought that he and Paula were more impressed with Cook all along. And Randy seemed to favor Archuleta a lot of the time. Which I thought was interesting since Randy's such a rocker. But he produces all kinds of stuff now so maybe he was hoping to get a deal with David Archuleta and his dad. Great final show. I'm sorry it's over, but glad too. I've been glued to the screen too much too. Btw, I thought Brooke did really well last night and so did Michael Johns. Carly kind of overdid it a little. My DH thinks she must have a lot of leg tatts since she always keeps them covered up. It was fun seeing some of the earlier contestants like Chakeezie and the male dancer guy - can't think of his name. (They say the mind is the first thing to go....)

gadget since you believe that women do not have the right to choose what will happen to their bodies in the case of unwanted pregnancies, it means that we do not agree. Exclusions for any reason are not acceptable to me. I will never believe that it is right for other people to EVER tell a woman in peril that she does not get to choose what to do when she has become pregnant against her wishes. You've made your case many times about how abortion is killing and that there are no exceptions, I get that. I just don't believe that it is within your rights to tell me that you get to decide for me (and that my beliefs are subordinate to yours) regarding my own body and my embryo's body. I do understand that you believe that you must intervene in order to save unborn children. But I believe that you have no rights to my womb or my fetus - ever. Your beliefs do not trump mine - EVER - when it comes to my living tissue, including my blood, sweat, tears, bones, brain, fertilized egg or unfertilized eggs, or any other part of my person. You will have to incarcerate me and put me on a death watch 24/7 and keep me shackled in restraints in order to have your beliefs enforced on my person. It isn't likely that you will be able to do that and I would resist with my body and soul to keep you from forcing me to do your bidding.

Keep it up. I know it makes you feel good and important. I don't believe that you're fooling most of us. The bottom line is you believe that women should not have the right to choose what happens to them or their baby in utero. I think women do have that right - no matter what the circumstances or conditions. None of the stats or grisley photos or skewed numbers will ever change that for me. Everyone else can decide for themselves. Your purpose is quite clear here however and I am really exhausted from all the things your camp has brought up to try to influence people. I have to hope and believe that most women are not as gullible as some obviously are.

It is anti-abortion propaganda all printed up in a neat package for the purpose of shocking people and getting support to make it illegal for women to have the choice whether or not to have an abortion. Just because you like its' content doesn't mean it isn't propaganda.

I really enjoyed all three David Cook's performances. You just can't take it away from Archuleta though. The boy has some pipes. I hope someone gets 'hold of him and helps him create a better image. I wouldn't be surprised if David C. threw it so that he could be more independent, however isn't he going to be under the thumb of American Idol anyway? I mean once they agree to the terms and conditions in order to compete, they're committed to the tour, etc., and I would imagine that Idol gets part of the take of anything they wind up recording for a certain period of time. My DS used to be in the rock 'n roll biz and the powers that be are very, very adept at keeping most of the money. The artist is so thrilled to be able to perform, they wind up signing away lots of stuff that bands used to automatically get. It is a very tough business.

Aphrodite: Let's bail. This is not a discussion. This is one person taking an opportunity to post biased information that is offensive in tone and obvious in nature. It is disgusting to have someone pretend that they wish to discuss a topic when in fact, they wish to beat people up with all manner of propaganda. No one who disagrees has a chance of having their feelings be known or respected in an exchange like this.

Aphrodite: I appreciate your post very much. I was in the process of writing something when your rebuttal came up. This article is proof positive that anyone can and will write just about anything. Of course the purpose of this article is obvious, although it makes absolutely no logical sense. There is no way that the population today can know exactly how many illegal abortions were performed when abortion was illegal and furthermore the exact number of deaths from illegal abortions could not be documented. But it is interesting to see how one group can skew the stats and make subsequent claims and sound believable to those whose beliefs are supported by such misinformation. I don't blame you for not wanting to get involved here. I don't want to either, but it is just things like this that make me feel that I have to.

You know what West Coast? I am the one who said zip it. And the reason I did was because I have been in my head where it sounded like you were. I have tried to be supportive but frank when I wrote a post to someone who was whining about their band not working. But when I read Brandy's thread starter and some of the following posts, I thought this place was a little different than the usual "I was able to eat pizza and a load of bread yesterday" post. So I was defensive for everyone who had posted their heartfelt feelings on this thread and I didn't want any of them to be discouraged by having fingers pointed at them. The fact is, what you posted generated tons of great posts, including your second post! I mean these are some of the best and most honest things I've read in a long time. So I hope you'll never pay any attention to me and never zip it West Coast! You go boy. :wink2:

Devana it is comforting to know you're still around. I'll watch for your posts.

There are some very important differences between the two surgeries. But the physical aspects aside, the problem with people misunderstanding the two surgeries brings the thought that they expect both to result in the same amount of weight loss in the same amount of time. Under certain circumstances and with certain patients, that is definitely possible. But for most bypass patients, they are unable to eat, there are a whole set of physical reasons why they can be in serious jeopardy nutritionally, and GB is considered to be a non-reversible surgical procedure. Things are cut that can't be uncut. With LB patients, there are fewer risks and potential side effects nutritionally. If we ingest enough Protein, we're pretty much good to go. If the band is loose, we can eat lots of food if we want to. The weight loss is often more gradual than with GB patients. This is an over simplification, of course, and I'm no expert that's for sure. However, even though the LB patient can lose as much weight as quickly as a GB patient, it isn't always the case. And I do believe that LB patients must use more self-restraint than the GB patient who often has trouble eating enough food and getting enough nutrition. Also, the GB patient may gain some of the weight back, but usually not as much as the LB patient can. So to have your friends compare you to a GB patient, means that they're expecting you to have the same kind of quick and drastic weight loss as a GB patient. The conditions are very different so NO FAIR!

Congratulations on the wedding turning out so well, Karey! I hope your daughter is very happy. Good luck getting back into physical training. I know you'll take it easy and work into it gradually. It's great that you're determined to keep going!

I'm unfamiliar with their suggested method of discipline. If you have a moment, enlighten me.

That look of incredulity on Simon's face really was priceless! I wasn't sure if he was thinking, WTF, or if he was thinking, man she's blowing the roof off this place.

Plain I sure didn't read your post as highjacking. I read it and it sounds like very interesting and potentially helpful info. It fits quite well with the direction this thread had moved which still relates to the original topic.

WCFG: WTF, do you REALLY think that all of us who've complained on this thread believed that the band would do all the work? For most people what you've posted is absolutely true. I've read lots of posts where people say they've been able to figure out a way to eat pizza, drink cokes and perform other feats of band busting behavior. That's not what this particular post is all about. I notice that you don't get that. Okay fine. State your piece and feel all smug. That's to be expected from someone who has managed to figure it all out and develop into the lovely butterfly that I'm sure you're turning into. Congratulations! Do you feel better? Great. Now zip it. What we're talking about here is something out of the norm. And the reason we're talking about it is because we're hoping that we can figure out why we're in the spot we're in. We've already sucked it up and learned that we can't drink cokes and eat pizza and all that. But we sure don't expect to be genuinely hungry most of the time, be so restricted that we can't eat almost anything, be exercising and still not seeing our weight move in a negative direction. But what am I doing? I shouldn't be trying to explain something to someone who just thinks anyone who is having these kinds of problems is simply sabbotaging their band. I hope you never learn about it the hard way.

The mind is a powerful thang... I really don't think we've begun to understand what our brains are capable of.

kat: I just re-read your post about your friend. I am beginning to think that for many people, having too much restriction is totally counter productive. I was doing fine again, losing slowly but finally losing again. I went in for a fill 2 weeks ago and now I'm really restricted and have not lost an ounce and have probably gained a little. That's with being able to eat less food. It is so frustrating to try to eat and not be able to get much down without having an episode. Afterwards you're totally unhappy, you don't feel that you've eaten and you tend to graze on small things that don't bother you - a few nuts here and there, a little ice cream, whatever... and the next thing you know you're back sliding and gaining. AAAARRRRGGGGHHHHH! :biggrin:

Have any of you read anything about studies where they have tried to pinpoint differences in the brains of people who are very firmly religious vs. those who do not believe in God or a higher power? They're also considering the possibility that when people "witness" aliens, it is actually caused by a phenomenon that occurs in some people's brains. Am I the only one who has heard about these things?