A Crazy Question

[LapbandKAB 22]

Hi all. I had my surgery on Oct 17. I've had 3 fills so far and I'm currently at 5cc in the 10cc band. I had to take so many classes to be approved by my insurance company and I thought I had done my due diligence on the lapband but apparently, I don't know as much as I thought because I'm a little discouraged and confused. I've not yet ever had any feeling of fullness or satiety. I could mindlessly continue eating and eating which is what got me to be overweight in the first place. I do notice now that it is easier to get stuck and I've had two stuck episodes that were resolved by a PB. I know this was caused by my not chewing enough. I knew as soon as I swallowed that I'd probably get stuck. But here's my question and I know some of you will be shaking your heads because I should know this! Having a feeling of fullness and being stuck are two different things, right? Getting stuck is not what is supposed to stop me from eating more than I should, right? Had I chewed properly on my two sticks, I know I could have kept right on eating. But, what I'm looking for is the feeling that will make me want to stop eating, right? One of the reasons why I thought lapband was my best choice is because before I got it, I never had a feeling of being full so I could keep right on eating and eating. I wanted to feel full like other people did. I'm still so wanting to have that feeling. But, I just want to be sure that there is such a feeling with lapband and that getting things stuck is not what my signal is to stop eating. I hope this makes sense. Appreciate all the knowledge here.

[parisshel 1,892]

This makes perfect sense to me and is an excellent question. Please don't feel discouraged and it's normal to feel confused. My surgeon says it takes a good nine months to learn one's band.

Getting stuck is independent from the idea of satiety. I could get stuck on shrimp, have to stop eating, and still be very hungry. For me, getting stuck means I took a way too big bite, or ate too rapidly, or, in the case of shrimp, ate something whose texture my band doesn't tolerate. (Add to shrimp: bread, Pasta, anything sticky like Peanut Butter, rice, couscous or anything that can "pile up" in my stoma).

It may be that you aren't yet at optimal fill. (Getting stuck is not an indicator of optimal fill, nor should it be. I could be way overfilled but never get stuck if I chose slider foods.)

It may be that you want to have a look at the types of foods you are eating. For me, I would never fill full if I didn't favor Proteins before all other food groups. And in fact, if I bring in "appetite-inducing" carbs (in the form of chips or Cookies or something that slides easily through the band), my hunger seems to really crank up. Other bandsters can eat "just a little bit" of these foods and their band kicks in so they don't overeat them, but my band doesn't work that way. I could eat those things all day long. Sadly.

But give me a meal with Protein and veg and some fat (like butter on the veg, or dressing on my salad) and I'll have good satiety on a small plate.

So your question is a good one and the answer may be in 1) your level of fill or 2) the types of foods you are eating or 3)both. Or even 4)....something I haven't thought of here but someone else might!

[2muchfun 8,928]

Sounds like you're still in Bandster hell? I was in BH for 4 months. Not until my 3rd fill 4 months post surgery did I start to feel that satiety you speak of. Then by my 6th fill I was in the green zone.

The feeling of satiety can be elusive and sometimes non-existent for many banders. It's a subtle feeling for me and I have to look for it. This is the time we refer to as being one with your band. Or, getting in touch with your band. It's not really the band we want to communicate with, we want to look for that trigger that says, I'm no longer hungry? It's a difficult one since most of us have always thought the "full" feeling is when we can stop and sometimes it was the stuffed feeling before we felt we could stop.

So, look for triggers like burping, hiccups, runny nose to see if you're no longer hungry? Do not look for the full feeling. If you're looking for full, you'll eat too much.

tmf

[ADJL 685]

It took me 6 months and 4 fills to start to feel restriction. I just got my 6th fill and I'm pretty sure I'm smack dab in the green zone. I am not physically hungry, but even now often feel mentally hungry. There are trigger foods for me...chips and icecream make me "hungry" even when I'm not hungry....if that makes sense.

Anyhow...keep doing what you are supposed to do and as those pounds keep dropping it gets easier to forget that hunger.

[jennybean 175]

Hey, I am there with you. I still do not feel the satiety. I keep my meals small (1 cup) but need to snack because I don't feel full very long. I keep my daily calorie intake to around 1200 calories a day, but still not good enough to lose. I need to be at the 1000 calorie mark to lose. Looks like I need more fill(s) just like you.

I feel your frustration. Keep on trucking!

[chasingadream 1,311]

Hi....feel your frustration with just wanting to eat and eat and eat.....I have the band w/plication and have not had a fill yet but am feeling okay eating those 3 meals and one snack a day....but there are still times when i want that something and I am NOT hungry AT ALL...I feel those are learned habits I must break!

I'm still learning to stop at that feeling of "okay you've had enough--you dont need to eat more or clean your plate"...dinner is my tough meal...maybe because my others are portioned so well and Im eating at work....but even at dinner....im learning to stop eating when i feel "OK"...learning that it is okay to stop. I dont have a pronounced "soft stop" that some speak of like a hiccup or burp....so I just have to slow down and listen to how I truly feel...and that is SO DARN HARD because I just want to eat it all and more!

But even then I can continue to eat and eat and eat and eat....and once or twice I have until I got that uncomfortable feeling of pressure and even pain and learned my lesson....never stuck though...thank goodness.

So, in my opinion, and someone please correct me if I am wrong...the band is not meant or will not stop you from WANTING to eat and eat and eat....some of it is just self-control and a re-training of our brains...and yes, the lack of that self control is what got us to overweight in the first place. And Im not sure if self control is the best term.....maybe urge is better!!!!!

So even though I am at an ok place with the size of my meals and losing weight I STILL HAVE THAT "WANT" TO JUST EAT....thats when i need to find something else to do to keep busy. I dont think any WLS would help me with that....am I making sense???

I hope my experience lets you know that you are definitely not alone and I feel that having this band is hard work...but its hard work that Im willing to put in it...and there is a very very very big learning curve with it all....

Please dont be discouraged....we got here over a long period of time and it may take a long period of time to figure it all out and get it off...but as long as we NEVER give up we are ahead of the game.

Good luck!

Edited February 6, 2014 by chasingadream

[Jack 855]

These are great questions, and here' s what my own personal 'version of reality' is:

1) No, 'fullness' and 'stuck' are not the same sensation;

2) re: " I've not yet ever had any feeling of fullness or satiety. "

The really BIG discovery *for ME* was to discover the difference between "hungry" and "NOT hungry".

As basic as that seems now, the importance had escaped me for decades.

Metaphors and analogies may all have their flaws, yet to me here's the best way I can respond:

"Full" is the John Phillip Sousa Band blaring its way down the esophagus and marching in place in your stomach. That's the sensation I grew up to seek and justify whether I could/should/would continue eating. It had nothing to do with hunger. Such external controls as "is there any more"; "What can I have next"; "Here clean up this last little bit" and "of course I'd like another helping" until it was all gone.

"Satiety" is a bird song in a forest glade, while you enjoy the quiet away from the bustle & hustle. It is reflection and discover that 'no I'm NOT 'hungry' but could/would/might eat more given the opportunity.

'Stuck' is the nausea & discomfort of and Eating Error of too much/too fast/too dry/too poorly chewed/ etc.

It is wanting to get rid of the discomfort and 'PB' or urking or vomiting or throwing up or whatever your upper gullet does to rid the excess bolus of whatever you choked down. Slime & watery eyes & vague thoughts of never wanting to do it again are intensified depending on just HOW stuck with WHAT kind of food we have ingested.

My own 'first REALLY stuck' was about postOp 4th week or so, having nibbled a few triscuits somehow I launching into a swallow-them-whole-ALL-NOWWW!!! phase and, yes...."stuck". Didn't know whether to call EMTs or just lay down & die.

Second time was a month later, on solid foods.....took a single (small) bite scrambled egg & grits.....mistake...was on a road trip....managed to goo & drool & slime & slather my way over the next 200 miles hurling out the window about every 2 minutes.

Not so pleasant then either....yet it gave me a close look at the difference between 'full' and 'stuck' ....and yes, helped define 'HUNGER'.

So I would hope these experiences can help you define the answers you need for your questions.

And I encourage continueing to seek out the difference bewteen 'hunger' and 'satiety'. A most useful concept, in my ongoing journey.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Jack

[LapbandKAB 22]

Thank you all for your thoughtful responses. I'm going to hang in there and hope that maybe on the next fill, I'll get a closer feel for things and be more aware of full/satiety feelings. I will continue to watch what I eat, Protein first, and remember to chew. Sometimes I think my old habits come back and I just start mindlessly eating and drinking for a few seconds until I remember I have the band. Especially when watching TV or reading. That's a big reason why I got into weight trouble in the first place. I could watch a one-hour show and eat an entire bag of chips. I didn't do that when I was married because I'd be embarrassed, but once I got divorced, I just did whatever I wanted and ate and ate because no one was there to witness it. Jack-I nearly spit coffee on my monitor laughing out loud on my lunch break when I read your "didn't know whether to call the EMTs or lay down and die" comment. That's how I felt when I had my two stuck episodes. My latest was last night and I almost went into panic mode.

[gowalking 10,790]

If you know that the head hunger is bad while reading or watching TV, try to do something else instead. Some people knit, or paint their nails, take a bath, do a puzzle...go for a walk... All those things can help you to pass the time without mindlessly indulging. Good luck!