1-4-Many

Has any one used Alli after being sleeved? The subject of extreme constipation came up tonight with a group that gets coffee after the support meeting. The one woman is about 3 years out and she said she started taking Alli with one meal every other day for the last 6 months and that it helps hugely with the constipation. She has not been back to her bariatric but her primary said taking it at that low of a level with just 1 meal every other day would not be an issue. She had done well on her weight loss but is not underweight. She may be 20 to 25 pounds over ideal at this point. Just wondering if anyone had any thoughts or had asked about this. For those unfamiliar, this is the over the counter med that bonds with the fat in the meal you eat and passes it through your system instead of digesting it. She takes it with her "fattiest" meal, which isn't that fatty, but she said it's really "softening" things on the flip side of the meal. I'm really hoping I don't have this issue but it almost sounds like it's universal to WLS.

Have you tried any other liquid sources of calories? Something more palatable? I know the mantra is healthy foods, but there are better tasting liquid options out there than opti-fast. My real life friend uses Boost on the weekends and blends in 1 or 2 teaspoons of peanut butter. She needs a little extra in the liquid range too to keep her at a steady weight.

I'm the EXACT same way. I didn't get it. Everyone says it's about digesting fat but it's something like eating a fresh piece of fruit with skin on it that sets me off. I told my doctor and he just sort of grinned. He said it's more complicated than saying just fat. It's about how much work your system has to do to digest something. And some of those healthy foods take as much effort as fat. But I guess for the average person, fat will cause issues. The rest of us are the sometimes ones. Glad to know it's not just me! And, an attack happens when those stones leave the gall bladder so it's probably best to get it out. If you know it's full, it would just be a good way to avoid having a full blown attack which can be agony.

A lot of people have gall stones. Unless they become a problem by leaving the gall bladder and causing an attack or, as mine is doing, become so full it's an issue you often don't know you have them. Obesity causes stones for a variety of reasons but ironically, one of the main reasons is from the dieting. And as people lose weight quickly they often have gall bladder issues. I told my surgeon from jump I wanted mine out at the same time. It's the anesthesia that bothers me, not the surgery itself so if I can save being put under, I'll do it. I had to provide my ultrasound 2 weeks before surgery (it was done 2 years ago but they don't expire from an insurance point of view -- stones don't go away) and he will do it at the same time. He said it adds 15 minutes to the operation and the person can't really tell any difference. However, the process of eating foods again can be a bit different as the gall bladder is a part of the digestive system and another part you've jacked up. I'm planned for 4/27. Hoping I get to drop at least 1 pound by losing the organ. It's packed with stones, one larger than a golf ball. I'm wondering if he'd be allowed to give that to me as my souvenir.

Would you have been allowed to use mouthwash? Did they tell you that? If so, why would you not have been allowed to just swish and spit Water? Dry mouth is one of my concerns. I actually gag if my mouth gets too dry. And, when you talk about having the dry mouth, do you mean while you were waiting for the surgery? Or after also?

Thanks. I'll look into this one.

This is good to know. The Cleveland Clinic was on my list but when I called and talked to them about 3 months ago they said I would need to plan on a pretty long wait to get to actual surgery in their program. Was that the case for you? Due to insurance issues I need to have this done in the next 8 months. CC acted like 11 months (at the time) wasn't reasonable since I would have been a long commute for appointments and they said that tends to drag things out. ????

Do you have any idea what was botched? And how long ago the surgery was that went bad? I think you're right that every surgeon will have bad results at times. But in this case I'd like to know what caused the issue. I have heard one story about Dr. Meyer already. That alone does not scare me off as things can happen. But the story behind what happened concerned me. I don't want to get into details publicly because the issue is not resolved but it did not give me warm and fuzzy feelings.

I would be very interested in talking to you after your trip to Mexico. Please let me know if we can talk. I have insurance but would still consider Mexico because I've talked to three people locally who went, had this doctor and a very positive experience. Thanks.

They said it was the clear ones that were the issue. I don't know exactly why but I know that I'm 50+ and could not be certain that I could see them all in spite of common sense telling me not to eat them. But bless youth, until you experience the ravages of age, it's hard to imagine.

1) I found this post very ironic because last Wednesday my dietitian gave me a list of absolute no-no's that people had tried testing their program and one was watermelon. You know those almost clear seeds, the ones that have not yet become black seeds. Those can be very dangerous while still healing. Unless you used a magic bullet on the watermelon, you're probably not getting those chewed up. (This list was meant to apply to the first 30 days after surgery. Chunky Peanut Butter was on the list too. I can't imagine but someone's done it.) 2) What does the comment "don't have any appetite for protein shakes" mean? Do they make you ill? I understand it being an issue for those who say they feel sick by them but if you mean they're just are not something you desire to eat, I really do think that's a bad sign you should take note of. I think you're being told that your desires are still in full control. I am pre surgery so I can't say for sure, but I imagined this time as being one where I think of myself as still healing and, for right or wrong, as someone who is still "post op". While that may make me sound sort of sissy like, I think it might be the way to go on this one.

Thanks very much for the info. I've found that gastric bypass is the very, very dominate surgery here and even the couple I've found who offer the sleeve end up trying to sway me to gastric bypass. I think it's human nature that they want what they are more comfortable with, not what might be right for you. I'm trying to find that gastric surgeon who is confident with his ability to sleeve and I think that starts with them NOT trying to convince me that gastric bypass would be a better choice.

I am looking for a surgeon for the sleeve in central Ohio. I'm fine with traveling a few hours in any direction to get someone who comes highly recommended not only as a surgeon but for their program. Obviously, since I would be long distance I'd need a program that's flexible with "distance learning". Anyone with recommendations from Ohio, Pittsburgh, Detroit, I've love to hear. Thanks.

Dr. Jossart: In the event the sleeve size is too large, isn't it still significantly different for it's new owner? As of today, I feel like I could eat two full plates of food. Even if I am sleeved with the "too large" sleeve, won't it still have a significant impact (therefore improvement) in my weight management? I don't mind some of this being my job but I'd love a smaller stomach to be a part of the tool kit. Is it possible you could have this surgery and not even notice restriction the sleeve is so large? Thanks.

I'm sorry you have having such a difficult time but this is a great example of how people are so different. My Sweetie had his gall bladder out a while back and he never took the first pain pill. It was outpatient and he had me stop on the way home and he went into a grocery store to get a couple of things he'd forgotten. I was with him of course but he didn't seem phased by the whole thing. Did the doctor tell you the pain level was similar before the surgery? Or did he tell you that after he knew the level of pain you were having? I've actually been sort of banking on my VGS being at least similar to the GB surgery. But I want my guy's version, not yours! : ) Hope you are feeling better soon.

Pamela: Thanks you for your story. My surgeon has actually tried to talk me out of the sleeve. He says gastric bypass, while having more long term issues, is a much "gentler" surgery and he sees about 75% less nausea and much shorter term fatigue. This is pretty obvious to me since I started attending the pre-surgery support meetings. The Gastric By pass folks are there the week after their surgeries. The sleeve people miss at least one meeting, sometimes even the meeting of the second month! Can I ask for a detailed answer? As in graphic please. Not just your experience but anyone else who wants to chime in. Is this nausea the same as having a stomach flu? Or is it different? The dietitian told me it was different. You feel bad, you are queezy but when you actually vomit it's not as violent as a flu or food poisoning situation. Would you agree or disagree with that statement? Secondly, was it pretty much non stop? Or did it come and go in waves? Thirdly, and most importantly, were you taking the anti nausea meds? If so, were they helping none? I'm set for 10/18. I start my all liquid tomorrow and I am turning into a wreck quickly. I am ALREADY feeling sick to my stomach. I am so anxious I've not been able to enjoy any "last meals". I went to my favorite salad bar today. I love salad and I hate that it will have to be out of my life for a while. Well, I ate one small plate (they actually serve it on salad plates) and that was it. I actually got nervous because I was feeling to queezy and the woman was not bringing my check. I finally left cash on the table and hit the door. This does not bode well for me I think. To be honest, I am very angry at the surgeon for telling me this and trying to change my mind on the surgery. I think ignorance would have been bliss. BTW, the one thing I've been told my multiple people is that how tight you are sleeved relates strongly to the level of sickness. If you can easily drink your liquids by the end of 1 week, you will pull out of any nausea quickly. But if you are sleeved so tight that you are still fighting to get liquids in, your stomach is struggling more. If the doctor hits that perfect sweet spot on the sleeve, you will be a very happy camper. Makes sense to me. Thanks.

Do you know that just today I was wishing eDiets or something like that offered a post bariatric plan. I know they can't because all you have to do is read here for 15 minutes and you know that every doctor's plans/orders are different. But I think this is a great idea. I know that I'd be there. It would be nice to have a place where you fit it without explanation.

Lee - I think the thing that worries me is this: To me, everything you have described and my experience w/ head hunger are two completely different things. I can do all those "right" things now. But my having a lovely meal with a good Protein, couple of veggies and maybe a whole grain roll does not stop me from "head hunger" a couple of hours later. That's my fear. Head hunger, for me, is a LOT about triggers. I envy people who can eat 1 bite and be happy with it. One time, years ago, we were at a football game and my BF bought a 4 pack of Reese Peanut Butter cups. He took one, his daughter took one, his son took one. (I don't like chocolate.) They threw the 4th one away. That was like watching someone walk up and preform open heart surgery in the grandstands. I mean, who does that? Who takes 1 cup from the pack and passes it on? Who throws the last one away because you've had one? This was years ago and it's still a vivid memory. I really worry what will happen when my head is pulling the trigger and my stomach cannot answer the call. Head hunger is my only fear in this whole situation. I have no clue if I will be able to cope or not.

You really need more than 20 oz of liquid. If that continues, please contact your doctor. They might want to give you an IV to rehydrate you. It can be easier to start up again into the liquid if they sort of re-set the meter. 20 oz. is a very small amount. And Pam, are you taking meds for the nauseous? Folks tell me it really helps.

How much walk do they actually mean? I keep hearing walk, walk, walk but I don't know how to mix that with rest. My knees are shot. I want to get enough walking in but I don't want to over do it. Sounds like everyone is really struggling in this group. : (

So I've been doing a very good job of working the chew habit. I'll be honest, I do not eat my entire meal doing the chew to dust but I do enough that I know I will be eating the equivalent of my post sleeved meal that way. So here's what I'd like to know. This evening's snack is a Special K Protein bar. I don't even really want a snack tonight but I've been cleaning like a maniac this weekend and my knees are killing me. So Special K and Advil. Well if I bite of a small bite and try to chew 30 times, by the time I get to about the 20-22nd chew, the bite is pretty much gone from my mouth. I haven't really swallowed, at least I don't think so. If I keep chewing on the bit of grit left to get to 30, it makes me cough. Then I can't have Water. Does this happen to anyone else. Do you chew to the point that you don't need to swallow for the food to go down? I'm assuming that's actually a good thing. It certainly couldn't have been chewed any more. If someone post sleeved reads this and has something like a bar to try, can you eat it as you normally would and tell me if I'm actually doing it right. It seems to me that if I need to be able to chew to 30, I need to be biting off a slightly larger pieces. And this may seem silly but I actually worry if this bar is enough to protect my stomach on the advil. It got chewed into non existence so it seems it might not provide the buffer it normally does.

Are you still on the anti nausea meds?

That was my main reason for choosing the sleeve over gastric bypass. I know I will be afraid of food to begin with ....the last thing I needed was to add the fear of dumping into the mix. Does everything make you feel bad? Are you okay with the liquid drinks? I'm 2 weeks away from being sleeved and I've talked to about 8 people in our local support group. Most of them had very little trouble adding foods back into their diets but they did it very slowly, adding 1 bite at a time. Most of them are in the 4 to 6 month stage and say they are just now getting back to feeling "normal".

Will be interested in the answers. How are you doing on liquid? If 2 hours after a 3 bite meal you are still full, are you able to start sipping Water then to keep hydrated?

Thanks. They keep emphasizing the 60 grams of protein like you'll keel over and die if you don't get that protein right away. I know there have been many windows of a week or two in my life where I was not getting that much protein. I'm an October date. I want to get in as much protein as I can but if I only get 30 grams but enough Fluid in those first days, I'll be happy. By 10-12 days or so I'll start to get serious about the 60 grams, but it's nice to have someone who's been there say there will be time to get the rest of the stuff in order.