Is my anger justified?

[emma4884 81]

I really, really hate to be treated like I am stupid; one of my "buttons" so to speak. So here I am on Rants and Raves asking for your help.

• I had gastric sleeve surgery a year ago. I have told no one that I had surgery. So posting this is my way of reaching out to someone besides my husband.

• After the surgery, my surgeon told my husband that everything went very smoothly. After a few hours my blood pressure was dropping below 70/30, the nurse called "a staff assist." About ten people suddenly yet calmly came into my room, surrounding my bed, attaching equipment etc. I was rushed back into another 2 and 1/2 hours of surgery. My husband and I were told that the surgeon checked and re-checked everything and never could find the cause of my internal bleeding. "It happens," we were told. We accepted that I was one of the few who have complications with gastric sleeve surgery.

• I was sent home on a step one, liquid diet for three weeks, gradually progressing to full liquids then mushies and so on.

• I was hospitalized about two weeks after my surgery when I experienced syncope, i.e. I passed out. I was taken off my bp meds. The hospitalist visited me in my room and casually mentioned that he'd been there when I went into surgery the second time. He said that he'd never seen anyone squirt blood like I did and that they used all the factor X coagulant on hand during my surgery.

• A year passes. I never see the surgeon again. I've been having follow-up visits and lab work at the bariatric center every three months.

• I recently went to my general practitioner to update my status with her as I haven't seen her since my gastric sleeve surgery. She calls up my surgical records on the computer and there I see what I expect with one big surprise - "Repair Perf Duod/gast ulc- wnd/inj." I was reading the computer screen, over her shoulder, at an angle and it didn't register clearly while I was sitting there. Wait! My duodenum is the beginning third of my small intestine. Gastric sleeve surgery shouldn't involve that part of my body. No wonder I was on a liquid diet for so long.

• My husband and I had directly asked both the surgeon and the PA why I needed the second surgery. Both told us the same thing, i.e. that I had unexplained internal bleeding.

• I haven't been back to this bariatric center of excellence since discovering the new information. Now I've poked around and found my online summaries of each follow-up visit. They bear little resemblance to what actually happened at the visits. We did not discuss mal-absorption, nor did I have Vitamin B-12 or Vitamin D deficiencies etc. It looks like "cut and paste" notes to us.

So now I know more about what really happened. What should I do with this knowledge? Thank God that the surgeon was able to save my life and just move on? Stay silent, keep up my bariatric exams, while relying on my GP for my real medical care? Call them on it and change doctors? (The PA always responds to my questions with a blank look and then a smile when I have questions. She usually has no answer and never offers to find out anything.)

I live in a remote rural part of the state and would have to travel many hours to see another bariatric doctor.

This bariatric center of excellence is the life blood of this small hospital as it is nearly empty otherwise. They ran every possible test that insurance would pay for including echo cardiogram and a scan of my gallbladder. There were no babies in the nursery and only a few patients hospitalized. When I was hospitalized with syncope, they sent my nurse home for lack of work when I checked out a day early. She was NOT happy with me and commented that it was a good thing her husband was the primary breadwinner.

I know I need to keep up my lab work for the rest of my life. Perhaps my GP cannot order those tests. She seemed really reluctant to be involved in any potential dispute with the bariatric center.

Thank you for reading this. Any constructive suggestions?

[LipstickLady 25,682]

I really, really hate to be treated like I am stupid; one of my "buttons" so to speak. So here I am on Rants and Raves asking for your help.

• I had gastric sleeve surgery a year ago. I have told no one that I had surgery. So posting this is my way of reaching out to someone besides my husband.

• After the surgery, my surgeon told my husband that everything went very smoothly. After a few hours my blood pressure was dropping below 70/30, the nurse called "a staff assist." About ten people suddenly yet calmly came into my room, surrounding my bed, attaching equipment etc. I was rushed back into another 2 and 1/2 hours of surgery. My husband and I were told that the surgeon checked and re-checked everything and never could find the cause of my internal bleeding. "It happens," we were told. We accepted that I was one of the few who have complications with gastric sleeve surgery.

• I was sent home on a step one, liquid diet for three weeks, gradually progressing to full liquids then mushies and so on.

• I was hospitalized about two weeks after my surgery when I experienced syncope, i.e. I passed out. I was taken off my bp meds. The hospitalist visited me in my room and casually mentioned that he'd been there when I went into surgery the second time. He said that he'd never seen anyone squirt blood like I did and that they used all the factor X coagulant on hand during my surgery.

• A year passes. I never see the surgeon again. I've been having follow-up visits and lab work at the bariatric center every three months.

• I recently went to my general practitioner to update my status with her as I haven't seen her since my gastric sleeve surgery. She calls up my surgical records on the computer and there I see what I expect with one big surprise - "Repair Perf Duod/gast ulc- wnd/inj." I was reading the computer screen, over her shoulder, at an angle and it didn't register clearly while I was sitting there. Wait! My duodenum is the beginning third of my small intestine. Gastric sleeve surgery shouldn't involve that part of my body. No wonder I was on a liquid diet for so long.

• My husband and I had directly asked both the surgeon and the PA why I needed the second surgery. Both told us the same thing, i.e. that I had unexplained internal bleeding.

• I haven't been back to this bariatric center of excellence since discovering the new information. Now I've poked around and found my online summaries of each follow-up visit. They bear little resemblance to what actually happened at the visits. We did not discuss mal-absorption, nor did I have Vitamin B-12 or Vitamin D deficiencies etc. It looks like "cut and paste" notes to us.

So now I know more about what really happened. What should I do with this knowledge? Thank God that the surgeon was able to save my life and just move on? Stay silent, keep up my bariatric exams, while relying on my GP for my real medical care? Call them on it and change doctors? (The PA always responds to my questions with a blank look and then a smile when I have questions. She usually has no answer and never offers to find out anything.)

I live in a remote rural part of the state and would have to travel many hours to see another bariatric doctor.

This bariatric center of excellence is the life blood of this small hospital as it is nearly empty otherwise. They ran every possible test that insurance would pay for including echo cardiogram and a scan of my gallbladder. There were no babies in the nursery and only a few patients hospitalized. When I was hospitalized with syncope, they sent my nurse home for lack of work when I checked out a day early. She was NOT happy with me and commented that it was a good thing her husband was the primary breadwinner.

I know I need to keep up my lab work for the rest of my life. Perhaps my GP cannot order those tests. She seemed really reluctant to be involved in any potential dispute with the bariatric center.

Thank you for reading this. Any constructive suggestions?

Travel. Ask that your records be transferred and have the new doctor explain IN DETAIL what the heck happened to you. Pursue this medically and if warranted, legally. Accidents happen. Repairs are needed. It happens, it sucks, with that, you move on.

It sounds as if they were grossly negligent, not just by medical error but by downright giving you misinformation about what happened to you.

YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO KNOW. YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO KNOW WHAT TO EXPECT. If you are ever in an accident or need further surgery, your doctors may not have all the information to treat you properly because YOU don't know what happened to you. THAT'S WRONG.

Travel. You are worth it.

[WLSResources/ClothingExch 3,443]

If you need blood work quarterly, make the trip to another practice I don't think I'd ever be able to have faith in that practice again.

Fyi, visit summaries that are available online to the patient are always sketchy regardless of specialty. You do have the right to full reports of your visits with no fuss. Just ask. The medical records are your property.

[AvaFern 3,516]

In reading your story, I'd be mad too, although why don't you just ask your surgeon specifically what happened? A duodenal ulcer is something you would have had before surgery and if it was torn, it wasn't necessarily a medical mistake. Ulcers in general can bleed, and where the duodenum is anatomically located, in theory they would have had to cross over it to get to your stomach. Just brushing against the area in a person who did not have a pre-existing ulcer wouldn't cause an issue, but for someone who may have an ulcer, which without being traumatized can bleed, a very minor surgical movement that would have had no effect on someone else could have caused the problem. Also, healing from a torn ulcer takes awhile, but isn't the same thing as if they had accidentally ripped open your duodenum and then told you it wasn't their fault. If they had known the ulcer existed, they could have taken extra precautions, but given they may not have, your complication may not have actually been a medical mistake as much as an actual complication where no blame would be assigned.

That being said, that could totally not be what happened and they could have absolutely lied to you entirely, but if you give them the benefit of the doubt and you ask for an explanation, it potentially saves you from having to switch doctors and from all of the anger you're feeling right now. Also, if they can explain it, then it saves you the money of a malpractice suit, because telling you that you had a complication, when you did in fact have a complication that had nothing to do with their "reasonable standard" of care, would not give you a valid claim.

I totally get that you're mad and I would be too...but maybe just double-check with them the facts of what actually happened to make sure that your anger is as merited as it seems to be. In the end it saves you time and energy, and costs you nothing. If they stonewall you and refuse to answer the question...then see an attorney because that would be a huge red flag for potential negligence and their insurance would likely settle.

[sc101071 398]

You probably signed a consent form that if it became necessary they could change the procedure. And, if you are otherwise doing well, damages are not going to be so great to justify the costs of expert witnesses, etc. I would definitely never trust the doctor again if they didn't inform you of the change afterwards. I'd find another doctor.

You will face a statute of limitations for legal action. I haven't seen your records so I would encourage you to talk to a lawyer in your state asap.

[OutsideMatchInside 10,166]

Umm contact a malpractice lawyer, and like others have said, travel. I feel like you need some tests somewhere else to confirm exactly what happened to you.

[WLSResources/ClothingExch 3,443]

Fyi, visit summaries that are available online to the patient are always sketchy regardless of specialty. You do have the right to full reports of your visits with no fuss. Just ask. The medical records are your property.

Also your lab work, radiology images, everything, the whole shooting match.

[smg 471]

You will face a statute of limitations for legal action. I haven't seen your records so I would encourage you to talk to a lawyer in your state asap.

Any statute of limitations would be from the date that you have discovered, or through the use of reasonable diligence SHOULD HAVE DISCOVERED the issue. @@sc101071 is absolutely correct in that you should run, not walk. to anyone who can offer legal assistance with this. This is not to say that you should start suing everyone involved, but you do NEED to know what happened, for all of the reasons mentioned by @@LipstickLady and others....and you need to know ASAP. If further action is warranted and you feel that it's necessary, that's between you and your attorney, but you absolutely need to know the entire story of what actually happened and what specifically was done to correct it.

I stress the red portion of the statement above because there's a large part of the responsibility to find out what is wrong placed on you. Document your attempts to retrieve the information. This is where the attorney comes in if the surgeon is not willing to provide that information. I had a follow up with my surgeon 3 days post-op, where he specifically went over all pictures and the entire surgery report. Then he gave me the whole folder and also sent copies to my GP for reference in the future.

It's imperative that this information is made available to you so that if you ever have any issues down the line (for any reason), then your history is complete and correct.

Best of luck!

[Pescador 1,374]

Go to the hospital and stand there until they make copies of every medical record, no matter the cost. Catch them off guard. Otherwise they can pick and choose what to give you. It will cost but this is your life. Digest it and move accordingly. Don't go to any small time lawyer. Best wishes.

[Djmohr 6,965]

I am with everyone else here. You have an absolute right to know what exactly happened to you. I would request your medical records immediately and honestly I would seek legal counsel just to help ensure your butt is covered down the road.

The biggest issue for me would be the fact that no one has told you the truth about what happened and if in fact you were to have an emergency procedure, doctors need to know your actual real history.

I would be pissed, but I would follow through so in understand so that you can move on.

[cbonet 336]

In my opinion you should make an appt. With your surgeon. Your husband should go with you. You should state firmly the diagnosis that you read without stating how you found out. You had injury to your body and you were not informed. How dare they not tell you!! You don't know If some complication could come from this later. You should then get legal council. Your anger is earned and justified. Best wishes to you

Sent from my VS986 using the BariatricPal App

[Pescador 1,374]

The doctor will not like being confronted and won't give you atraight answers. Hopefully the medical records are undoctored. If your surgeon thinks for one second you might sue him he will never see you again and will be forewarned of your intentions. I would go quietly into this til you have what you need.

[LadyDarkness415 41]

Sounds like the doctor is being negligent. I would be livid. If it were me, I would def get another doc and see if I can get some legal action going if it's warranted. That is definitely personal preference. But first and foremost, you deserve to have good, quality care.

~~ LadyDarkness415 ~~

[theantichick 2,204]

Whether you decide to confront the doctor or not, get copies of all of your medical records before you do anything. They legally can't prevent you from getting them, but they can put all sorts of obstacles in your way including charging you for each and every page and depending on what computer system they use, they might be able to change the entries after the fact and it might not show up on the type of copy you get. (Though with all of the major systems, there is a way to get records of what has been changed, you probably just have to have it subpeona'd.) Get what information you can before you start rocking the boat.

If you had a perf and they didn't tell you, that's major misconduct.

[emma4884 81]

Thank you to all who took time to respond to my post. My husband thought I should just let it go as I'm alive and seemingly doing just fine. "What's the point of stirring things up?" he said. "You were doped up and might not remember clearly what was said right after the second surgery." Yet he remembers well that they told us both that they couldn't find the cause of the internal bleeding at the follow-up appointments.

So your feedback is greatly appreciated, especially input from those members who have medical backgrounds. I've been a member long enough to know that I'm privileged to have received responses from some of the most respected people here at Bariatric Pal.

I am going to act on the wise counsel you've imparted to me.

• First, I am going to get copies of my medical records, before showing my hand or allow them to alter the records.
• Then I'll schedule an appointment with another bariatric center that can also request my records. I hope I can get in to see another bariatric office soon. I'm thinking that appointment will give me a better idea of the seriousness of my situation.
• Then I can decide about seeking legal redress.

For me, this isn't about money. It's about respect and honesty.

I'm already running into problems with the logistics of getting my records. When I call the office that handled my surgery, I get voice mail. I was planning on just asking about the process of getting my records, without providing my name. So that approach isn't going to work.

The center is located within the clinic within the hospital. When I went to the front desk of the hospital portion and asked about getting copies of my records, they told me that I can leave my contact information and someone will get back in touch. Again, this will not work if I wish to avoid giving them advance notice of my intentions. It's a very small place and word will spread quickly. Does the law really allow me to just camp out at the front desk of the hospital where the surgeries were performed until they give me my records?

I am not naturally a confrontational person on my own behalf. So I need to know I'm on firm footing before I act up in the hospital lobby. It will be hard enough to deal with my husband who is not supportive of these actions. He just doesn't see the point and will not like the long drives to the new bariatric center. After reading of Djmohr's difficulties getting a new insurance to pay for expensive lab work required for our lifetimes after bariatric surgery, I want to proceed wisely. Part of me knows that one of the reasons I became overweight was because I consistently refused to put myself first. No more!

Thanks again for your input. Every last one of you was constructive and your sincere concern makes me feel truly part of this community. Family and friends are thousands of miles away and unaware that I had WLS. I've got no one else and you guys came through for me.