I know this was mentioned before here in the Vegans/Vegetarians forums and I wanted to maybe start this thread for all things pertaining to the book that Dr. Garth Davis authored, Proteinaholic. So far I'm on chapter 6 of it and I'm just amazed with how sound it is and all the studies that are out there to support why we don't need such a high amount of protein, and why it's a culprit of obesity, high blood pressure, diabetes, etc.... There's just so much to talk about if anyone wants to get into discussion. Now, this thread IS NOT going to be for debate. I do not want anyone coming on here advocating high protein and what they "know" and debating with any of us who are or evolving into plant based, vegans or vegetarians. I want to share the things I've learned from the book and if anyone wants to challenge those, READ THE BOOK FIRST, and then you can come and talk about it. If you don't or haven't read the book, feel free to read the things that will be posted...and do your own homework to find these facts/truths out for yourself. I literally don't have time to do a protein ping pong match...so don't start one. You will be ignored.

Okay, with that said and out of the way, the first thing I want to mention is that Dr. Davis actually dispels the myths about protein and why our bodies don't need so much. It is not an opinionated book, it's a science/fact book. It makes TOTAL sense. He is quite comical too. The parts where he plays out his doctor/patient dialogues hit me the most...because I can relate to how I was educated about protein being what we all need. I had the same mentalities as he did regarding it, but after I started watching documentaries on plant based diets for the past couple of years, I've slowly become open to all the health benefits of eating plant based. But now, even though I knew plant based is great for the health, I didn't know that the protein component was/is what was causing so many problems in my health, my husband's, etc. Now, I've got science and truth to understand the premise of protein. The history of why, what Dr Davis talks about, we western society pick apart whole foods and live based off of macronutrients. Now, it just boggles me why we do that. The other thing that rings true and is nice knowing, is that he is a bariatric surgeon too. He knows what he's coaching/telling his patients. He knows that he was not a nutritionist, didn't know a single thing, but the one hour of nutrition studies in his school days, but he took the time to dive into history, studies, reports, etc to bring light to why western society is so unhealthy, and most of it is based on animal protein.

Wow.

Read the book!

1 hour ago, fruitandveggies said:

First of all, thank you for this thread! I am so happy to see people changing/basing their diets on science-based nutrition.

You all might enjoy the work of Dr. Michael Greger. He is THE BEST in the field of nutrition and has done thousands of free videos based on the latest research. The best part is, he doesn't just cherry-pick one study to back up claims (like many do), he reads ALL the literature on a topic and presents it in each video. He's also very aware of how the source of funding can change the outcome of studies, based on what the company/group wants to achieve. Check him out: https://nutritionfacts.org/

Also, his book How Not to Die is EXCELLENT!

(Sorry for all the caps, but he really is the best!)

You're welcome and thank you for your suggestion on Dr Greger. I'll be sure to note his book down and check him out as well. You explained it a whole lot better than me in my previous post about researching. LOL Thank you for this!

2 hours ago, fruitandveggies said:

Dr. Michael Greger.

I googled him and he was on the documentary What the Health. Pretty funny too. That documentary really sealed the deal for my husband to go all in. I'll definitely be checking it all out.

@Newme17 Awesome! He really is top notch and gives me the confidence to deal with all the questions we get as plant-based eaters (especially after weight loss surgery). So glad your hubby is on board too. You will love the book!

@Newme17thanks for the recommendation!!! I bought the book and am nearly finished. It has totally changed my perspective.

As I mentioned earlier, I've been a pescatarian most of my adult life so I'm already a big believer in plant power for good health. I have to admit though, that I had really been sucked into the WLS mantra of high protein if you want to lose. I was eating a lot of eggs and cheese (which is not very heart healthy), ordering a protein in restaurants when I really wanted salad and eating protein bars or shakes on days when my protein grams were too low.

Dr. Davis actually reviewed and debunked some of the studies that I had based my decisions on. Even limiting my research to published studies, there is no way that a layperson can know who is in Big Agro's pocket or who had faulty statistical models. I'm so glad to have read a book that goes through each study the way he did.

This week has been so liberating - not worrying about protein content and putting starches back on the menu. I had oatmeal for the first time since before surgery!

Ugh, but now I feel really bad about giving out advice on this site that was misguided.

2 hours ago, deeveg said:

@Newme17thanks for the recommendation!!! I bought the book and am nearly finished. It has totally changed my perspective.

As I mentioned earlier, I've been a pescatarian most of my adult life so I'm already a big believer in plant power for good health. I have to admit though, that I had really been sucked into the WLS mantra of high Protein if you want to lose. I was eating a lot of eggs and cheese (which is not very heart healthy), ordering a protein in restaurants when I really wanted salad and eating Protein Bars or shakes on days when my protein grams were too low.

Dr. Davis actually reviewed and debunked some of the studies that I had based my decisions on. Even limiting my research to published studies, there is no way that a layperson can know who is in Big Agro's pocket or who had faulty statistical models. I'm so glad to have read a book that goes through each study the way he did.

This week has been so liberating - not worrying about protein content and putting starches back on the menu. I had oatmeal for the first time since before surgery!

Ugh, but now I feel really bad about giving out advice on this site that was misguided.

You're welcome hon. I too, was eating a lot of eggs and cheese just to get "protein" in. I'm still reading the book and I'm so happy to have the truth. You wrote everything that I've been experiencing as well...basically freedom. My husband says it is deception; that we were deceived to believe the animal protein/high protein diet. Well, I don't like being lied to, get this...by those who are being lied to. HA!

what level of protein will you all now eat daily to maintain muscle mass and heart muscle?

will you put protein whey into oatmeal/potatoes to get enough if you are skipping eggs and cheese? did he give a number in the book that is the lowest we can go?

FYI - had my pre-op visit yesterday, and my soy and pea protein are totally working! I'm getting about 40 grams per day on liquid pre-op diet. And, as I am allergic to ALL substitute sweeteners, I've been taking half in my green juice AM, and half in broth PM. My surgeon said all my vitamin levels were great, and my liver is smaller than any he'd seen in pre-op. If you doubt, don't! I feel better than ever going into Sx on Monday!!!

catt

10 hours ago, Private Citizen said:

what level of Protein will you all now eat daily to maintain muscle mass and heart muscle?

will you put protein whey into oatmeal/potatoes to get enough if you are skipping eggs and cheese? did he give a number in the book that is the lowest we can go?

He recommends not worrying about it at all and it will take care of itself. But he also says that if you want to figure it out, you can multiply your lean body mass in kg (what you would weigh without any body fat) times 0.66 to 0.8, depending on your needs. Mine worked out to approx 40g. He mentions that body builders, the elderly and the bedridden need more.

I see on your profile that you are pre-op? He doesn't mention post WLS needs. I think your needs would be higher in the first 2 or 3 months after surgery as you heal, so follow your doctors plan - and this can be for when you settle in to a new routine for the long haul.

6 hours ago, CattMyst said:

FYI - had my pre-op visit yesterday, and my soy and pea Protein are totally working! I'm getting about 40 grams per day on liquid pre-op diet. And, as I am allergic to ALL substitute sweeteners, I've been taking half in my green juice AM, and half in broth PM. My surgeon said all my Vitamin levels were great, and my liver is smaller than any he'd seen in pre-op. If you doubt, don't! I feel better than ever going into Sx on Monday!!!

catt

Whoop whoop!!!! This is amazing news. Wow...keep it up hon, and Monday is just right around the corner! How exciting!

36 minutes ago, deeveg said:

I see on your profile that you are pre-op? He doesn't mention post WLS needs. I think your needs would be higher in the first 2 or 3 months after surgery as you heal, so follow your doctors plan - and this can be for when you settle in to a new routine for the long haul.

I second this. Although I did mostly animal protein starting out, then dwindled to dairy, and now very limited, if any, on the eggs/cheese, I'm starting my month four post op and I feel like I'm in the clear or having to focus on protein. I get what my body needs through my now, whole foods, plant based diet. @CattMyst has had success with soy and pea protein....definitely a better option than whey and animal protein if you need to focus on it early on.

For me to not be at maintenance (which was when I was going to do plant based--so glad I decided against it), we shall see how it all plays out; I get blood work done this next week.

Edited August 5, 20179 yr by Newme17

Best of luck to you Newme17!!

catt

On 8/5/2017 at 9:38 AM, CattMyst said:

Best of luck to you Newme17!!

catt

Aww hon, thank you! And the same to you tomorrow!!!! ?

I'm getting really excited! It's so lovely to have sweet souls here to share the journey!!

catt

Diabetes....caused by animal proteins. SAY WHAT!? Lol. I'm thoroughly enjoying the science and studies about diabetes. It's quite an eye opener, as this whole book is. Starts on page 145!

1 minute ago, CattMyst said:

I'm getting really excited! It's so lovely to have sweet souls here to share the journey!!

catt

I was super excited too when it was my time. What time you go in?