Anthony

From my understanding of the matter, the stomach stretches and grows rather quickly after both procedures, which is why the VG makes the stomach in the 2-3oz range. This size would be impractical in the long run. From what I have been told, the stomach of an average VG patient should be anywhere between 4-16oz in the long run, depending on the person. The same thing happens with DS patients. Most VG patients who need additional weight loss can convert to RnY or DS easily.

Thankyou fabfatgrl! I keep forgetting that it is often reffered to as the vertical sleeve gastrectomy. Thanks again for your input

VG stands for Vertical Gastrectomy OR Vertical Gastroplasty, both of which are the same thing. IT IS NOT the same thing as Vertical Banded Gastroplasty (VBG), which has been around for a long time and has a terrible track record regarding weight loss and side effects. Here is a picture of a VG: http://www.lapsf.com/weight-loss-surgeries.html

With the band I went from 308-240 in about a year. Gained back to 278 over about another year, this was after I had my band unfilled, since I couldn't deal with the pervasive and uncontrollable gas. With the VG I went from 278-218 in less than 4 months. And my skin is no looser than it was during my thinnest with the band.

Plain ol'd heartburn, but without a proton pump inhibitor it hurts pretty damn bad. Just think about it, the acid that produced is for a ~50oz stomach is now crammed into a 2-3oz stomach. I really hope this is temporary, as I hate taking drugs. Head hunger still exists if I take drugs that previously gave me head hunger, such as; antihistamines, lyrica, neurontin, (And presumably antidepressants). Luckily I no longer have to take most of these, as they were for nerve pain in my back. Although I have noticed a strong correlation between caffeine and head hunger. But coffee hurts my stomach/intestines now, so I don't even bother. Emotional eating can still exist, but I've felt so well overall that it hasn't really been an issue. One final point. Head hunger and emotional eating are now MUCH easier to deal with due to the significant decrease in physical hunger.

I'm now almost 4 months out from having a LapBand to VG conversion and I would like to summarize my experience. Positives 1. "Caught food", Sliming, etc is almost a non issue. I have had it happen ONCE off of overcooked eggs, and one other time off of chicken was not chewed up well enough, both times I tried to drink Water afterword. This is in contrast to the same issue that would happen several times per week, sometimes several times per day with the band. I can now eat chicken (even white meat!) , pork, beef, bread, raw vegetables, citrus, etc, (All of these would get caught with my band during proper restriction) without worying where the nearest bathroom is. I do stay away from overcooked eggs (mostly scrambled) though. 2. Back pain is completely gone! My surgeon concurs with my belief that either the port or band was setting off a few nerves which would cause referral pain to my back. 3. Very little hunger. What hunger does exist is taken care of nearly IMMEDIATELY after eating. 4. Alcohol makes me DRUNK very fast and with very little of it, but I hardly drink anyway. 5. NO food RESTRICTIONS (after a while). The first 10 weeks I had some pretty undesirable dumping effects from fats and sugars, even from basic Protein shakes. Most of these effects have disappeared. I still dump from very high sugar content foods (maybe more than 25grams of sugar), but this can vary. For instance, I have eaten a Drumstick brand sundae cone and haven't dumped, even though it contains quite a bit of sugar. I can also eat approximately 4 oreos without dumping, yet if I were to immediately "chase" it with liquid, thus "washing it through", I would most likely dump, at least if it were early in the day. For some reason, dumping is worse in the morning. Dumping seems to occur in about 10% of VG patients, and is assumed to go away. I suspect it will disappear completely within a year. On a related note, I get tired of many artificially processed type foods such as oreos, snack foods, etc. For some reason, my senses of taste have changed and have become extremely turned off by artificial flavorings. Many such products will make me queesy, but they will not make me dump. Also, if I eat and then "Wash through" the food, I am not hungry again like I was with the LapBand. As far as I can tell, it is next to impossible to "Wash through" any solid protein source or fruit/vegetable... I have yet to do it, the water simply goes through around the food. 6. I CAN BURP!!! No more "stuck air" that has to take the long way out. I have virtually no gas now, unless of course, I eat a gassy food like bell peppers. Negatives: 1. Acid reflux. I ABSOLUTELY MUST take a proton pump inhibitor daily, otherwise I will have moderate heartburn. This effect is supposed to fade over 6-12 months as the pouch stretches, but I have had little to no stretching as of yet, and am becoming annoyed with this side effect. 2. Initial dumping. As I stated earlier, this effect is mostly gone, but it can sneak up if I eat junky/processed/fast food. Or items with alot of sugar and then "chase them down" with water or such. Dumping seems to occur in about 10% of VG patients, and is assumed to go away. I suspect it will disappear completely within a year. 3. It can be difficult to drink fluids. One must CONSTANTLY remember to drink enough Fluid, BEFORE eating, otherwise you may subject yourself to dumping induced by washthrough, or worse, the water may come back up. 4. You may be fatigued for up to the first year after surgery, this comes from the severe caloric restriction and weight loss. My first 10 weeks were hellishly draining. I no longer have energy problems as long as I get my 150grams of whey protein per day and FORCE myself to eat enough each day. OVERALL I am totally satisfied. I am currently at 223, the slimmest I've ever been and am still losing weight. Mind you, the lowest weight I ever attained via LapBand was 238, and that was with a constant "I'm starving" sensation. That physical sensation is now gone. While it was VERY easy to "out eat" the band, it is fairly difficult to outeat my VG, sure it may be possible with carb laden foods that compress down to nothing when chewed, but overall, the physical desire eat, AKA hunger pangs, have simply been removed. Related to this last point, I should reiterate the fact that I must FORCE MYSELF to eat enough protein to keep up with my active lifestyle (surgeon is recommending 150g-250g per day total). When I say FORCE myself to eat, I don't really know how to explainit, other than the fact that once I consume a certain amount of calories, I no longer have the desire to eat. I could fill up my calories with relatively empty carbohydrates which will leave me tired the next day, or I can eat all of my protein first and then consume carbohydrates if I feel like it. In other words, I could physically eat more at the end of the day, but after a certain quantity of calories, I simply cannot mentally stomach another bite of food. For lack of a better explanantion, it's almost as if the "eat food" circuit in my brain shuts off at this point.

Please remember that you can always have a VG, which can then later be converted to DS if needed.

I had a VG (Vertical Gastrectomy). I am almost 4 months out and LOVING it.

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/showthread.php?t=13592

I absolutely hate the idea of malabsorbtion. I had complications with my bad, but at least I could remove it. I am happy with my VG so far.

I'm in Riverside, Ca!

I did have terrible gas with the Band. Now that I am bandless and have a VG, I have none. I still consume the same quantity of whey protein, which was supposedly the cuplrit of the gas.... It was not, the gas was indeed caused by the band.

If you dont want the malabsorbtion, consider the Vertical Gastrectomy. This is the procedure that I had on 3-1-06 http://www.lapsf.com/weight-loss-surgeries.html http://www.lapsf.com/vertical-gastrectomy-weight-loss-surgery.php It has been quite the recovery process compared to the band, but surpisingly it didnt hurt as much. I have no hunger and I KNOW that I'm going to finally get to goal with this.

If you have this problem, where is your port located? This little detail could be important.

I am back. I just wanted to let you know that I experienced less pain with the Removal and VG conversion than I did when I got my band put in. I can relate this to several factors in order of likelyhood: 1. I am in significantly better shape than I was in when I got my band. 2. My Nutrition is better, overall, than before the band. 3. I had a morphine button drip. As of now, I no longer experience physical hunger, which is awesome. I never experienced this effect when I got my band put in. Head hunger still exists, but so far, it's pretty easy to ignore. In a few weeks, I'll let everyone know how I'm doing.

Tomorrow I leave for San Francisco to get my band removed and revised to a VG (Vertical Gastrectomy). I will let you all know how it goes in a week or so when I get back.

I am quite sure thqat there is a substantial difference when a band is eroded/eroding. My mother had her band removed on friday morning, she was home 6 hours later and is basically unphased. Her band had slipped, but did not erode.

I was banded in 2001 as well - during the original FDA study period. And I was also the victim of a band leak as are many of our 5-years banded contemporaries. I had my port switched out nearly a year ago - and it was like a whole new band, especially with the newer lower profile access port. I havent done my research, but perhaps the lower profile port has a lesser volume in its' "chamber", thereby forcing more of the saline into the band's silicone relative to the volume of the fill. Just a possibility.

Jonathan: It sounds as if you are talking about the VBG (Vertical Banded Gastroplasty) rather than the VG (Vertical Gastrectomy). Am I correct? Also, you may find my complication story slightly interesting: http://lapbandtalk.com/showthread.php?t=13592

Wow, it's really buggy. I guess it doesnt work with Safari or Firefox. :-

Wow, I didnt know it existed! Bump! The Mods might wanna pin this thread!

I believe the reason that they push it is because they believe (as do I), that it has fewer complications (both long term and short term) than RnY. There are always LONG term risks with foreign bodies being implanted in somebody, I mean LOOOONG term...20 years or more. Obviously, the band can be removed if you happen to develop problems. I'm not positive if the VG will provide less long term risk than the band, but I believe that it will definitely provide less long term complications than the RnY. Also, from what I've heard, the VG does cut hunger quite severely... Something that my band has never done. I guess I'll find out in the next few months (I'm having a VG on 3-1-06). The evidence does seem to suggest that there is greater long term weight loss with the VG versus the band, but it will take long term research to bare this out.

Everybody has their favorites. My favorites are Champion Nutrition whey stack (vanilla strawberry or chocolate ONLY...the other flavors have Splenda...yuck!) Optimum Nutrition Vanilla (But it gives me alot of gas) I have heard praise about nectar powders, but I have not tried them. My LEAST favorites: Anything Soy. Some people like it, but not me. Anything with Splenda, which is most of the products these days. I don't believe that it causes the problems that people claim, I just hate the taste. Anything with Stevia in it. Again, I dont like the taste. Any pure egg Protein. These are truly disgusting.

Starting weight: 315 At my lowest weight, 240, when I would usually do about 6-8 hours of weightlifting in the gym.. Usually I would consume 6-10 scoops of Champion Nutrition whey Stack per day. This was always mixed with Water. I am not lactose intolerant. 200grams was the average, 400grams would happen only once in a great while. If I were still hungry I would eat lean, grilled chicken. My doctor and nutritionist had no problem with me consuming 1 gram of Protein per body pound, given my age and weight training schedule. I remember when I had my labs drawn 1 year after my surgery date, my protein values were at the upper range of healthy... My surgeon pointed this out and inquired about what type of protein I was cosuming and how much. I told him, his reply was something along the lines of "That's great, just make sure you drink enough water". 1-2 grams of protein per day per pound of bodyweight is the norm for serious gym freqentuers these days. The extra protein truly decreases your recovery time, but each additional gram consumed beyond a certain point results a diminishing rate of returned benefits (somewhere around the 1g/lb ratio, this should be based upon IDEAL bodyweight, which sets me up for 200g/day). It was either consume more protein, be hungry, or consume fat. ***I should add in that I only maintained this plateau for 8 months, afterwhich, I finally gave in to the fattier or more carb loaded foods. I could never break the 240 limit for any longer than a week, because at this point I would get so hungry that I was distracted from nearly everything else*** I have now cut back to about 100 grams of protein per day since I am not in training.

Constant hunger pangs while my pouch is full is one of my main quibbles with the band. At my lowest weight, I would be hungry, even with 400grams of Protein per day, yes, 400grams (approximately 200g from whey protein, 200mg from lean chicken or fish). I'll hopefully see this vanish when I'm converted to a VG.