Tired_Old_Man

He is my doctor also. I assume you are talking about the Dr. Szomstein at Cleveland clinic. Getting back to the opening question of the thread: When I was banded in Brooklyn (Sept, 2002) I weighed 327. My doctor told me (through his staff) that the average weight loss for Lap-Band patients is 25% of the amount between starting weight and ideal weight. In my case at my height of 5'9", that would be 25% of 327-170 or 157/4 or about 40 pounds. The average for gastric bypass is 85%. So I could have expected to lose about 135 pounds. Weight after stabilizing with Lap-Band would be 285# Weight after stabilizing with gastric bypass would be 190# I do not know if the figures have been updated in the past 4 years since I had my surgery, but I would guess they have.

Deducting 3 pounds for every patient is as accurate as buying clothes that are labeled "ONE SIZE FITS ALL"!:faint:

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The more you tell her how bad he is, the more she will defend him. Try to make the best of it. Try to accept him and he may eventually screw up so bad, that she will wake up to reality.

You are the exception. You value honesty more than tradition.

And then there are people like me. I remember once when I left a board and didn't leave a "Good-Bye all" thread. I came back a few weeks later to lurk and found out that they were still hung over from the celebration they had when they figured out that I was gone.

How long do Dogs Live? There are two answers: Not long enough. In your Heart forever. TOM I feel for You!!

I know how you feel, but in reverse. My wife's British family acted like they had shields around them. The only person that hugged me was my wife. Shaking hands with relatives seemed so formal. :puke:

I've got deep pockets. :faint:

If it is wrong to exclude someone for being fat, then how can it be right to exclude EVERYONE for not being fat? I have known people who would exclude people for the weirdest reasons. In men's cases: her 34c breasts were too big, her 38D breast were too small. In general: he/she wears glasses, he/she doesn't wear glasses, his/her butt is too big, his/her butt is too small, his/her hair is the wrong color, his/her race is the same as mine, his/her race is different than mine. In women: he is bald, his hair is too long, he has a beard, he doesn't have a beard. People claim that they are looking for a mate, but they act like they are shopping for a piece of furniture to match their decor. Even well into my marriage, I have gotten along with women. The women are friends of both me and my wife, but tend to ask me for advice regarding men. I tell them "look for a guy who treats you nice and you can talk to. Look for someone who even if he was married or both of you were married, you would still enjoy his (non-sexual) company". Most women bring home the same losers, time after time. We as people of weight know what it is to make bad choices because that food LOOKS so good or smells so good, though we know the consequences of eating it. Sometimes we eat it anyway and suffer for a few minutes with PB's or sometimes it tastes bad and disappoints us. Many of us keep making that same mistake over and over. Well, people who are dating sometimes make the same mistake over and over; they shop for a mate with their eyes to the exclusion of almost everything else.

My experience tells me that many people will chose E, but they will live A, B or C. People lie to themselves. They do not want to admit their prejudices even to themselves, let alone a survey. :puke:

I weight myself with underware on and when I go to the doctor, I tell them my weight. This "take 3 pounds off" is just bull. I allowed a nurse to weigh me one time then emptied my pockets, took of my belt and shoes and weighed myself again. 9 pounds less. If I had taken off my shirt it would have been more. I weigh myself at the same time and in the same state (no not Florida, silly) of dress (or undress). If you do it any other weigh (I mean way), you are comparing apples with oranges. I like oranges better, especially if they are naval. When I weigh myself naked and then agained dressed like I am about to leave the house, it is a 12 pound difference.

When I go to the doctor's office and a nurse greets me with, "Hello. How are you?", I usually respond with "Not well enough not to be here." I was in the hospital many years ago and a woman that I assumed was a nurse came over to me and (like a dozen women previously had) asked, "How are you?" and I said "fine, thank you". I received a bill in the mail for $150 for consultation by Dr. xxxxxx. Since then, whenever a medical person asks, "How are you?" I ask "Who are you?" and then I ask "Is that a medical question or a greeting?"

Come on, don't blame it on the only man here.:help: Sorry CARLENE. :phanvan I corrected it. Copy and paste doesn't seem to work for the "quote" feature.

I very often complain, but I also call to complement. I have asked phone reps to speak to their supervisor. Sometimes the supervisor will suggest an e-mail to the company to tell them about the extra help provided. I have asked the waiter for the manager in a restaurant and when he comes over and asks “What's the problem?” I say “I wanted to complement you on the wonderful service” or what ever I wanted to complement him about. You can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. I do the same thing. I go out of my way for stores with better service. When I don't have enough time to go to the store with better service and the manager says, “Long time no see, where have you been?” I tell him why he hasn't seen me. While living in Brooklyn, I knew some Asians on a personal basis and I was told that it is considered disrespectful to touch another person without their permission. I know it annoys me too. But, I am married to a British women and I was hurt when I met her family because they seemed to dislike me, but then I found out that they were just products of their culture. When my wife met my family, she was shocked by all the hugs she received. She asked me if they were being phony or really did like her that much. “No! They are just being Italian(/American)s”.

When I lived in Brooklyn, my next door neighbor was a big muckety-muck for one of the biggest brokerage houses in NYC and worked in the WTC, so he took the train to work everyday. He wore $3000 suits and shoes that cost a week's wages (mine anyway) and was in his 50's. The subway exit was two blocks from our homes and right in front of a vegetable store. He sometimes would leave the subway and pick up a few items for his wife (a stock consultant at the same brokerage firm). Though he was dressed in sartorial splendor, he was still followed around the store and spied on from between shelves (to make sure he didn't put a tomato or pickle in his pocket?) because he is Black. Yes, being over-weight is a bitch, but hopefully our Lap-Bands will overcome that hurdle in our lives. My friend will have to wait for his fellow Americans to get over their hurdles so that he can enjoy his life. Oh, and he didn't have the option to complain, because it was the owner or his wife or son who followed him around and it happened in every mom-pop vegetable store in the area. No! He couldn't prove it. The store owners had every black male followed around whether it was someone dressed like my neighbor or a kid in a hooded sweatshirt. They all look the same.

YUCK!! :faint:

So true. Remember the teenie boppers fainting in their seats over the Beatles in the 60's, Frank Sinatra in the 40's, and the "Boy Bands" this past generation? Females are no less awed by looks than males. In fact we don't make public fools of ourselves (to quite the same degree) as girls. BTW, the #1 physical trait that attracts the opposite gender? A slim waistline-tight abs. And if you don't believe Carlene, just ask Anna Nicole Smith or "The Donald's Bimbo De Jour". "Why do you love Donald?" "He has such a wonderful sense of Humor!!"

Did you tape it? :straight

The divorce rate is so high because many make excuses for the short-comings of the prospective mate until they marry and living together proves more unbearable than they thought it would be. And many people I know who have been divorced repeatedly go back repeatedly to clones of their previous partners. :faint:

In most cases men have no ability to decide who turns them on. When you feel something growing between you legs, you know. Women that I am close to have told me about a tingling sensation when they see “Mr. (physically) Right”. Of course as thinking animals we should be able to overlook the sensations and deal with the personality rather than the looks, but many times we never get to talk to the one we are not attracted to. I always tell the story of my first meeting with my wife (over 42 years ago). It was love at first sight. I walked into a friends party and my wife was dancing next to a her best friend. I took one look at my wife's best friend and I was enamored. I started renting an apartment from my wife's parents and broke my angle the first day after I moved in so for the next few weeks, I kept giving my wife messages to give to her friend who I had gotten to know at the party. After a while, my wife and I became friends, then a couple. The other girl? Haven't seen her in 40 years, though her sister is my son's Godmother. The funny part about it was my wife was being chased by dozens of guys, she was even a model for a while. I could see she was beautiful, but then other girl made my head spin. The exception to the rule seems to be Black men. I have a lot of Black friends and I went to a wedding recently between a mid-40's, 5'9”, 150 pound man and a late 30's 5'6”, 400 pound women. All sizes are guesstimates. I know the man for many years and he has previously dated women in the same weight class. When I was working and we had union picnics, a lot of the white guys were meeting in clusters the next day at work to discuss the sizes of the dates and wives of many of our Black coworkers. “Did you see the size of the elephant that Jones brought to the picnic?” Or, “did the see the whale that Barny is married to?” The Black guys if they were ashamed could have skipped the picnic, but they were not. Many of these Black men were young and the women were fat when they were married. Many of the Black men I worked with would bring in family pictures to show the other guys. They habitually contained photos of normal to slim men with huge women. Even if the coworker's wife was slim, his brother or friends in the pictures would invariably be with huge women. White guys would never bring in pictures like that.

I think you missed my point. I was everything they wanted, except for looks, so they never gave me a chance. They would constantly pick guys who mistreated them and gave them heartache, but were "so cute". One girl who I hung out with for quite a while (at least 6 or 7 boyfriends) would tell me, "Oh TOM, I met this wonderful guy last night" and then go on to tell me, blow by blow what they said and did. After she was finished talking I would say, "I don't like him because..." and give her good reasons. She would say, "You are wrong this time...". But 6 weeks or 3 months later, I would be wiping the tears from her eyes. I would hear, "why can't I find a guy like you...?" Each guy she would meet was a model for this fashion magazine or had done TV commercials, some were personal trainers, all were fine physical specimens, looking to put another notch on their bedpost. We live in a society where looks are paramount. People (both male and female) brag about how good their dating or mating partners look. I see no difference. My female friends always said they knew which guy they wanted as soon as they walked into the room. The major difference IMHO, between men and women is that men allow their hormones to point them at the choice woman in the room, but only to mate (though not with conception on their conscience mind). After sex, they want the next fine looking one. Men needn't care what stupid things come out of a women's mouth, they just want to put something in. No matter how stupid a women might be, if she is great looking, she will have a hard time chasing the man away with stupid conversation. Women do the same thing except they want a long term relationship with "Prince Charming". Women, therefor will not allow too much stupidity from an air-headed "dream-boat". She will make excuses for awhile and rationalize his dumb moves, but after a few weeks, she will move on to someone who can think. But the result was the same in both cases. Wasn't it? :faint: I better stop now. Too much honesty is hard on you women.

I am married for 39 years and when I met my wife she was 18 years old, 5'4" & 118 pounds and if she hadn't been a 38DD, she might have been 112 pounds. We dated, broke up got back together, broke up (I could copy and paste ad nausea, but I won't) and got married. Things were tough at the beginning and for the first 15 years, we were on the verge, but we grew, both inwardly and outwardly. Me to 327 and her to 180. I am now in the 250 bracket and she is in the 150 bracket. I never loved her any less at 180, not more at 118. She is my women and I would like to say, "no one could tempt me" but I will be honest and say, "I think I could resist Ms. Roberts, Angelina Jolie or a host of other movie stars". You are 100% wrong. Men lie to women about sex and their desires. Women lie to men, women and most importantly themselves. Women have to get themselves drunk so they have have an excuse for their failings (or conquests in a man's eyes). I hung out with women for many years because I never got along well with men. The women would always ask my advice about their prospective boyfriends and current boyfriends. I was like the gay guy that a lot of women hang out with, except... They would always say, “Oh, I wish I could meet a guy like you, who I can talk to, share secrets with, who can dance, take me for motorcycle rides, knows how to treat a women, etc., etc...” But there I was, but I was not the “Prince Charming” with movie star looks or Schwarzenegger abs. No, women are just as shallow as men, maybe more so. When I was freshman in college, I fell in love over the phone. I had a radio show on the campus radio station. I took phone requests and dedications. I started getting calls from this girl who would not tell me who she was. After 7 weeks, I tracked her down and we finally went out. She wore clothes to hide her fantastic shape, but it didn't matter to me what she looked like. She was a junior, 3 years older than me. We dated my freshman year and half my sophomore at which point I left school. I came back after a year and she had graduated. We lived in different states and went our own way, but about 5 years ago, we started corresponding again. She is now a 64 year old grandmother and my wife would have more to worry about in her than about Julia or Angelina, that is if she had to worry at all. We now are all friends. Her new husband, her, my wife and myself all got together at their home recently when my wife and I went to Disney World (for a visit, not what you people are thinking). No, I don't get turned on my overweight women. My biological sexual reflexes respond to the movie star, no not fashion model, types. That is ingrained in my genes and can't be helped, but I don't come on to anyone. TOM PS: Oh, a few weeks ago, I seduced a young chick at the mall and when we got to here house and got on the bed, she stopped me at the last moment (when I was nude). She was afraid that at my age, I might have a heart attack on top of her and die, and at my weight she might not be able to push me off and would die herself from suffocation. :faint:

And I don't tell off the dentist before he drills my teeth.

I am also old enough to remember that the "Good Old Days" are a figment of the (wishful) Imagination. We never had it so good.