Spinoza

May be if they (the US gov’t) didn’t subsidise the growers of corn, wheat, soy Beans, rice, which are predominately used for the production of high & ultra processed foods, & they subsidised fruit, vegetables & meat producers instead you’d have greater access to healthier food & it would be cheaper. Farmers aren’t really subsidised in Australia. Subsidies are offered in rare cases to support producers in regard to our variable climate. It’s less than 2% - 2nd lowest in the world. So our prices for fruit, vegetables & meat are subject to the same ever cost of living increases (labour, electricity, Water, machinery, fertilisers, transportation, etc., etc.) as everyone else - producer, manufacturer, service provider, consumer here.

Sounds super expensive Arabesque. Absolutely beats me how people are expected to eat even remotely healthily. Especially people on lower budgets. A tax on sugary and ultra processed foods that directly subsidises fruit and veg maybe?

Oh I eat a variation on this all the time. Without the bread though - that still sits in my stomach like a lump of lead.
Avocado and (for me fried) egg is a match made in heaven. And yes, you have to have some seasoning. 🤩

Sounds super expensive Arabesque. Absolutely beats me how people are expected to eat even remotely healthily. Especially people on lower budgets. A tax on sugary and ultra processed foods that directly subsidises fruit and veg maybe?

I'm the same height as you but not the same starting weight. I lost less than half what you have in the first 6 months - around 60lbs - not including my looooonnnnng pre-op diet. I continued to lose consistently for around 2 years, although the second year was a total of 11lbs (I think) so when I got close to my new set weight I was losing a pound a month, that's major fun but still a loss, LOL.
From memory I would have been eating around 800 calories a day at 6 months so 900-1000 sounds completely spot on.
Sounds like you're doing absolutely amazingly.

I believe I only restarted raw veg at around 5 or 6 months (I might have had lettuce and *maybe* cucumber before that) but luckily I didn't have any problems at all.

Loads of useful suggestions here (as ever!) Seems such a long time ago now.
I am the exception to the rule - after 2 weeks of pre-op Protein Shakes and 2 weeks of post-op liquids my first pureed meals were like the tastiest things I've ever had. I lovvvved them. I basically pureed a selection of whatever my family were having (I cook for everyone) with a bit of extra liquid (gravy was best) and gobbled it all down! Saved a couple of tiny portions (like a tablespoon or two) for my other meals that day or the next and hit my Protein goal mainly from protein yoghurts and protein shakes.
Strangely I didn't have Soup until the next phase but it's still a big go-to for lunch now, especially with lentils for added protein.

I only ever eat full fat everything and that's since day one post op. I am so done with the mega processed low fat diet 'food' forever I hope. That stuff made me obese in the first place. I would rather have an ounce of regular cheese than a shedload of pretend cheese. Fat as part of a balanced diet is what helps me feel full/satiated and stops me eating for hours afterwards. So, to answer your question - I eat ALL kinds of cheese, just slowly and in moderation!

I don’t really understand drinking to excess either. I don’t really understand why people take drugs or smoke either. Logically I realise for some, just like many on this forum did with food, it’s to comfort & soothe. To forget or avoid, at least for a while, the challenges & issues in their lives.
Yes, I drank & still drink after surgery. I don’t enjoy it as much but I was never a big drinker as such - never large amounts. No I’ve never been drunk & only to the edge of tipsy. Personally, I don’t like the potential of losing control of what I’m doing or the situations I’m in (control freak). Also if I did drink more than a couple of glasses, I’d end up with the most hideous hiccups & that would be the end of my night anyway. We’re not a family of big drinkers either so that’s likely an influence too.
I do find enjoyment in the flavours of alcohol much like the flavours & ingredients in an interesting recipe/meal. Can’t stand sweet wines or adding sweet mixers (except tonic & soda Water in Gin 😉) to spirits but that’s the personal taste aspect. Much like I don’t understand people who say they love coffee but add syrups, cream & sweeteners to drink it. I’m more of a purist that way.
I get the drinking, smoking, using & eating to fit in or feel more confident in a situation. I briefly smoked cigars. It was the 90s & I admit I did it to fit in & for attention. I was changing some of my friendship circle & wanted to be accepted. I look back & shake my head but during that time I came to realise a lot about myself & my needs. Like I didn’t need or want to smoke & if those people I was trying to impress didn’t like me for me I didn’t need or want them. Thankfully I only smoked a handful of times over a bout a year. Have no desire to do it again. And came out of the whole experience a stronger person.
I’m not going to judge if someone drinks, smokes or uses. (Or mixes cola with scotch or lemonade with vodka.) They’re adults & it’s their choice. I’ll worry about them for sure & ensure they’re safe & not harming themselves or others.
I might have just added more fuel to the discussion. Sorry @jparadigm, your original post has been hijacked.

being on these forums long enough i would assume that one should realize by now that everyone is different. we say/post it multiple times a day, every day.
i don't like weight lifting . it's don't like olives. i don't like talking about my wls.
others don't feel the same way. i get that.
we are all different people getting our own versions of joy. i may not make the same connections to things as you do, and thats cool.
i mean, some people have sex every day while others don't. some people weigh themselves every morning others don't. some people read books while others don't.
why do people drink too much and become alcoholics? alcohol is so gross. this line if thinking is the close sibling to why do people eat too much and get fat? being fat is so gross. to paraphrase you: "but how did you get to the point where <eating> was enjoyable enough to do it often <that u end up being 300 lbs>?"
the incredulity in your post is loud and clear...but really, if u think about it, its not that impossible to understand (especially from the point of view from a person who was morbidly obese)
your intention may be not to sound judgy...but in my very insignificant opinion, you kinda do.
but i mean, you are entitled to say whatever you want. i guess i just wanna ask you to take a pause and reflect on how ur post may or may not have come across.
sorry. 😔
i don't normally weigh in this heavily in anonymous internet chats as i hate confrontation, but this touched a wee nerve for me.
(i may just delete this post after i overthink it to death...we shall see...i have already edited this post a gazillion times in my overthinking, ha.)

I hope I don't come across as rude when I write this but everyone has different likes or dislikes and you clearly say you have never liked alcohol from the outset so good for you but the post does come across as judgmental. If someone likes to have a drink it is up to them as adults to do as they wish, be it too many calories etc. It is everyone's choice to make if they would like to have a drink (alcoholic or non-alcoholic) and deal with the consequences, if there are any like weight gain, reflux, dumping etc.
Do you like eggs? I don't like the smell or taste of them so why do you eat them? Just making the point!

Why don't you like all the foods and drinks I like? I can't see how you don't like something I find so enjoyable.
Different strokes for different folks.
Good luck,
Tek

When it comes to virtually any human behavior or endeavor there are people that from the very first exposure love it more than life itself and those that believe it is the worst thing in existence and can't grasp the appeal. Many of the former simply can't understand the latter's aversion and vice versa. There are people that take up behaviors or endeavors they hate in order to fit in just as there people that avoid behaviors or endeavors to fit in. And those that do or don't do things to not fit in.
We all only have the actual experience of what is going on in our heads. We have no experience of what other people experience in their heads. This is a major stumbling point of being human. If another person seems to love a behavior or experience as much as I do I still can't know their experience. Nor can I experience their hate or disgust. We are each stuck in our own heads.
Empathy can only get us so far. Empathy allows us to intellectually understand that people have reasons for doing things just as I have reasons for doing similar or analogous things. Empathy doesn't cause me to experience what another person experiences.
So, while I intellectually understand there are different strokes for different folks, I will never experience those different strokes the same as different folks.
People are freaks. Well, not me of course.
Good luck,
Tek

Whether you drink alcohol or not or how much or how often you drink is really a personal one. You know yourself best & you are best placed to see how & if it affects you.
I was a big glass of wine every night person before surgery. Never a big drinker as such but would enjoy a glass or three if socialising over a couple of hours. After surgery I had a gin & tonic at about the 2 month mark at my cousin’s 40th. Literally sipped it for hours. Had another 1or 2 gin & tonics over the next 4 months while losing, always nursing the glass for hours. Honestly, I lost my taste for it. Think I was only able to tolerate the rare g&ts because of the bitterness of the tonic.
Now I usually have a glass of something about once a month when out or celebrating something. Still usually only one & I drink it over about an hour now. I have a fridge & a cupboard full of alcohol I just don’t drink. LOL! When I do drink I go for quality over quantity these days. A glass of real champagne, a glass of good quality scotch or a good gin (they’re my go tos).

Certainly addiction transfer is a consideration. As is the increased effects of the alcohol on your body & how fast it can affect you is another. Then there is the calorie & nutritional impact. But again, your choice, though if your plan says no alcohol while losing, I’d probably stick to that as closely as possible to take best advantage of your losing phase.

ok, gonna throw my story on the table...take from it as you will, as a lesson to live by, a cautionary tale, or a personal justification...you choose.
pre surgery i was also a weekend warrior, actually, more like a yearly quarterly warrior, lol. i had like a couple drinks every 2-3 months. probably got stupid drunk once a year or less.
during weight loss phase (which lasted 7 months) i had maybe 5 partial drinks. i don't think i finished any of those drinks. my first "drink" was 3 weeks post op. I had maybe 2-3 sips of a glass of red wine. it was really weird, i swear i could feel the burning of the alcohol pass down my esophagus, through my stomach and along my intestines. my second drink was about 1 month later (christmas) and it was a very sugary soju-sake drink. again i had maybe 2-3 sips but this one resulted in my second worst dumping experience ever. *shudder*. the next 3 or so drinks were vodka or gin sodas (learned my lesson! less sugar!)
ok. now its 2019, im in maintenance and i'm looking hawt and feeling awesome and me and mr. go on a couple vacations and i drink way more than i normally do. but its vacation, right? so its ok. i also took up smoking again after being smoke free for 10 years (but thats another story).
now its 2020 and its effing covid, and i, like many others i know started drinking at home (i never did this before, i was always a go-out drinker)
...and now its 2024 and i drink every day. i don't get stupid drunk every day or anything (not that i'm trying to justify anything - i fondly call myself a high-functioning alcoholic), but i do drink every day. its at a point where others (i.e., my doctors and my hubs) are chastising me with the amount i drink. i know i drink too much and its probably doing a number on my health despite nothing showing up on any of my labs or whatever. i quit drinking for a month last year because my son said i couldn't stop drinking for a week. so i know i can stop (or at least slow down) if i really wanted to. trouble is i don't seem to really want to. last year, my OBGYN said i really should stop smoking AND drastically cut down the amount i drink. i told her i'm not sure i could do both, so i made her a deal and said i would stop smoking. i'm proud to say i have been smoke free for 9 months (after smoking for 4 years after quitting for 10, after smoking for 20...say that ten times fast, lol). its been surprisingly easy, but i think its because i can still drink.
ANYWAY.
i'm hoping to get into a mindset soon to address my drinking problem. i don't doubt my ability to reduce, but i'm not sure i will actually WANT to anytime soon. le sigh.
so there you have it. i am the poster child of transfer addiction.
despite all this, my weight has more or less remained unchanged (go figure). i continue to stay below goal weight this entire time.
....and i am literally typing this post out with an espresso martini in hand.
dont judge me! lol. i am relatively chill about all this so even if you do judge me, i wont take it personally.
p.s. oh, i should also mention that i get "affected" real quick and on very small amounts. and i also sober up real quick. this phenomenon is a purely post surgery thing. i needed lots more to get drunk before surgery....although my smaller size now may also be a factor....

OK this is a biggie. You might want to treat alcoholic drinks like a big glass of sugar. Empty calories and not helping you to your goal - hindering actually.
However I am Irish and therefore have to acknowledge the fun/relaxation/social stuff associated with imbibing those totally worthless calories.
Lots of people who have previously had a completely healthy relationship with alcohol (even if on the slightly heavier side of healthy alcohol intake) can develop a very UNhealthy relationship with alcohol after bariatric surgery. You get a bigger hit, you get it quicker, and you get all the neurotransmitter rush associated with that that makes you want to repeat the experience. For lots of us it has been a big trigger for regaining weight. Just do a search for alcohol and read some of the posts here describing it as THE factor on people's regain.
Lots of others have been able to maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol too.
If you do your research AND are aware of all that AND vigilant AND able to take immediate action if your relationship with alcohol changes then it might be OK to drink it earlier than your programme allows. Otherwise it might be best to just concentrate on the lovely honeymoon period when you lose weight with not too much effort.
I was sleeved 7 weeks before Christmas 2021 and negotiated a glass or two of bubbles over that first holiday season with my dietician. I have been able to continue to drink alcohol at my previous rate and not regain. UNTIL I stopped losing - that was about 2 years post op, 5 months ago. Since then I have been regaining (albeit very slowly). I do wonder whether if I had just ditched alcohol (my only sugar now) early on whether I wouldn't have put on 5lbs in 5 months. I know that third year regain is a thing, but I will never be able to say what effect alcohol may have had. It does seem to have stabilised for me and I know my regain is tiny (not angsting, LOL) just wanted to share my thoughts and my experience.
Sorry that turned into a bit of an essay. I hope it helps.
Long story short, my programme said no alcohol for 6 months, my (Irish) dietician said go right ahead.

So great to read your update. Sounds like everything went really well!

OK this is a biggie. You might want to treat alcoholic drinks like a big glass of sugar. Empty calories and not helping you to your goal - hindering actually.
However I am Irish and therefore have to acknowledge the fun/relaxation/social stuff associated with imbibing those totally worthless calories.
Lots of people who have previously had a completely healthy relationship with alcohol (even if on the slightly heavier side of healthy alcohol intake) can develop a very UNhealthy relationship with alcohol after bariatric surgery. You get a bigger hit, you get it quicker, and you get all the neurotransmitter rush associated with that that makes you want to repeat the experience. For lots of us it has been a big trigger for regaining weight. Just do a search for alcohol and read some of the posts here describing it as THE factor on people's regain.
Lots of others have been able to maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol too.
If you do your research AND are aware of all that AND vigilant AND able to take immediate action if your relationship with alcohol changes then it might be OK to drink it earlier than your programme allows. Otherwise it might be best to just concentrate on the lovely honeymoon period when you lose weight with not too much effort.
I was sleeved 7 weeks before Christmas 2021 and negotiated a glass or two of bubbles over that first holiday season with my dietician. I have been able to continue to drink alcohol at my previous rate and not regain. UNTIL I stopped losing - that was about 2 years post op, 5 months ago. Since then I have been regaining (albeit very slowly). I do wonder whether if I had just ditched alcohol (my only sugar now) early on whether I wouldn't have put on 5lbs in 5 months. I know that third year regain is a thing, but I will never be able to say what effect alcohol may have had. It does seem to have stabilised for me and I know my regain is tiny (not angsting, LOL) just wanted to share my thoughts and my experience.
Sorry that turned into a bit of an essay. I hope it helps.
Long story short, my programme said no alcohol for 6 months, my (Irish) dietician said go right ahead.

My less eloquent take. I am also a foodie. I never stopped cooking for family and friends. I just pureed what I cooked and then had tiny portions of what I cooked and can now have bigger portions but nowhere near what I used to.
food is a big part of socialising. Eating out was super tricky in the early months because nobody outside my immediate family knows about my surgery, so I just avoided it. Once I could eat a starter or at least rearrange the leftover stuff to look like I'd eaten most of it, I was back in the saddle! I said I had eaten already or wasn't really hungry and nobody ever cared. Lots of thin people eat like that - I have regularly split main courses with people I've known for years who always left half their meal anyway.
Small plates like tapas are absolutely ideal. And sharing plates - you can have a bite or two of everything and if other people are digging in they'll honestly not notice. And don't bother with the sides - our plans want us to concentrate on the good stuff!
Most of us (especially with sleeves) can very quickly eat everything again. Don't worry, you will absolutely still be able to Celebrate food whilst losing weight.
Welcome to the forum and welcome to your new life.

Amazing post. I may print it out so I can read it every day. 😍

OK this is a biggie. You might want to treat alcoholic drinks like a big glass of sugar. Empty calories and not helping you to your goal - hindering actually.
However I am Irish and therefore have to acknowledge the fun/relaxation/social stuff associated with imbibing those totally worthless calories.
Lots of people who have previously had a completely healthy relationship with alcohol (even if on the slightly heavier side of healthy alcohol intake) can develop a very UNhealthy relationship with alcohol after bariatric surgery. You get a bigger hit, you get it quicker, and you get all the neurotransmitter rush associated with that that makes you want to repeat the experience. For lots of us it has been a big trigger for regaining weight. Just do a search for alcohol and read some of the posts here describing it as THE factor on people's regain.
Lots of others have been able to maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol too.
If you do your research AND are aware of all that AND vigilant AND able to take immediate action if your relationship with alcohol changes then it might be OK to drink it earlier than your programme allows. Otherwise it might be best to just concentrate on the lovely honeymoon period when you lose weight with not too much effort.
I was sleeved 7 weeks before Christmas 2021 and negotiated a glass or two of bubbles over that first holiday season with my dietician. I have been able to continue to drink alcohol at my previous rate and not regain. UNTIL I stopped losing - that was about 2 years post op, 5 months ago. Since then I have been regaining (albeit very slowly). I do wonder whether if I had just ditched alcohol (my only sugar now) early on whether I wouldn't have put on 5lbs in 5 months. I know that third year regain is a thing, but I will never be able to say what effect alcohol may have had. It does seem to have stabilised for me and I know my regain is tiny (not angsting, LOL) just wanted to share my thoughts and my experience.
Sorry that turned into a bit of an essay. I hope it helps.
Long story short, my programme said no alcohol for 6 months, my (Irish) dietician said go right ahead.

My less eloquent take. I am also a foodie. I never stopped cooking for family and friends. I just pureed what I cooked and then had tiny portions of what I cooked and can now have bigger portions but nowhere near what I used to.
food is a big part of socialising. Eating out was super tricky in the early months because nobody outside my immediate family knows about my surgery, so I just avoided it. Once I could eat a starter or at least rearrange the leftover stuff to look like I'd eaten most of it, I was back in the saddle! I said I had eaten already or wasn't really hungry and nobody ever cared. Lots of thin people eat like that - I have regularly split main courses with people I've known for years who always left half their meal anyway.
Small plates like tapas are absolutely ideal. And sharing plates - you can have a bite or two of everything and if other people are digging in they'll honestly not notice. And don't bother with the sides - our plans want us to concentrate on the good stuff!
Most of us (especially with sleeves) can very quickly eat everything again. Don't worry, you will absolutely still be able to Celebrate food whilst losing weight.
Welcome to the forum and welcome to your new life.

OK this is a biggie. You might want to treat alcoholic drinks like a big glass of sugar. Empty calories and not helping you to your goal - hindering actually.
However I am Irish and therefore have to acknowledge the fun/relaxation/social stuff associated with imbibing those totally worthless calories.
Lots of people who have previously had a completely healthy relationship with alcohol (even if on the slightly heavier side of healthy alcohol intake) can develop a very UNhealthy relationship with alcohol after bariatric surgery. You get a bigger hit, you get it quicker, and you get all the neurotransmitter rush associated with that that makes you want to repeat the experience. For lots of us it has been a big trigger for regaining weight. Just do a search for alcohol and read some of the posts here describing it as THE factor on people's regain.
Lots of others have been able to maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol too.
If you do your research AND are aware of all that AND vigilant AND able to take immediate action if your relationship with alcohol changes then it might be OK to drink it earlier than your programme allows. Otherwise it might be best to just concentrate on the lovely honeymoon period when you lose weight with not too much effort.
I was sleeved 7 weeks before Christmas 2021 and negotiated a glass or two of bubbles over that first holiday season with my dietician. I have been able to continue to drink alcohol at my previous rate and not regain. UNTIL I stopped losing - that was about 2 years post op, 5 months ago. Since then I have been regaining (albeit very slowly). I do wonder whether if I had just ditched alcohol (my only sugar now) early on whether I wouldn't have put on 5lbs in 5 months. I know that third year regain is a thing, but I will never be able to say what effect alcohol may have had. It does seem to have stabilised for me and I know my regain is tiny (not angsting, LOL) just wanted to share my thoughts and my experience.
Sorry that turned into a bit of an essay. I hope it helps.
Long story short, my programme said no alcohol for 6 months, my (Irish) dietician said go right ahead.

OK this is a biggie. You might want to treat alcoholic drinks like a big glass of sugar. Empty calories and not helping you to your goal - hindering actually.
However I am Irish and therefore have to acknowledge the fun/relaxation/social stuff associated with imbibing those totally worthless calories.
Lots of people who have previously had a completely healthy relationship with alcohol (even if on the slightly heavier side of healthy alcohol intake) can develop a very UNhealthy relationship with alcohol after bariatric surgery. You get a bigger hit, you get it quicker, and you get all the neurotransmitter rush associated with that that makes you want to repeat the experience. For lots of us it has been a big trigger for regaining weight. Just do a search for alcohol and read some of the posts here describing it as THE factor on people's regain.
Lots of others have been able to maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol too.
If you do your research AND are aware of all that AND vigilant AND able to take immediate action if your relationship with alcohol changes then it might be OK to drink it earlier than your programme allows. Otherwise it might be best to just concentrate on the lovely honeymoon period when you lose weight with not too much effort.
I was sleeved 7 weeks before Christmas 2021 and negotiated a glass or two of bubbles over that first holiday season with my dietician. I have been able to continue to drink alcohol at my previous rate and not regain. UNTIL I stopped losing - that was about 2 years post op, 5 months ago. Since then I have been regaining (albeit very slowly). I do wonder whether if I had just ditched alcohol (my only sugar now) early on whether I wouldn't have put on 5lbs in 5 months. I know that third year regain is a thing, but I will never be able to say what effect alcohol may have had. It does seem to have stabilised for me and I know my regain is tiny (not angsting, LOL) just wanted to share my thoughts and my experience.
Sorry that turned into a bit of an essay. I hope it helps.
Long story short, my programme said no alcohol for 6 months, my (Irish) dietician said go right ahead.

I agree with the others - I found warm liquids miles easier to drink a few weeks post op. Glad you're finding your groove OP - so much adjusting to do along the way but it's so worth it!