summerset

I think especially the long term users are very interesting, both when it comes to cliques and how they treat new members. Highschool school yard anyone?

Doesn't change anything in the end. You wanted to be funny (maybe) or you really wanted to rave and rant about other members and when you noticed you might have gone a bit too far you wrote that it was just a joke. That's a really useful thing when it comes to irony: you can always use "it was just a joke" as a bailout.

You could do that on almost any internet board that has long term users though.

Congratulations. You managed to possibly offend about 99% of all users on this board in one post. LOL

True. However, it breaks my heart to see that struggling people continue to listen to the "try harder" advice when obviously this didn't work for them because they're too afraid of trying a different road.

If you are well aware that you won't be 100% compliant (are there people who are?) but "only" 80% or 90% it simply will have to be enough. Yes, maybe you will end up with a higher BMI than someone with a 99.999% compliance rate. However, one has to wonder: is the additional work and hassle worth it? If you can maintain an e. g. BMI of 26 or 27 without much hassle is it really worth obsessing about food and exercise and whatsoever to get down to a BMI of 24 while being well aware that you're most likely feeling more miserable than you would need to and risking burnout on top and then maybe end up at a BMI of 50 again in the end?

Relax a little. Don't set yourself up for failure from the beginning on by trying to be 110% perfect. This need to "be perfect" can be both terrifying and paralyzing.

When I read this line I had to think about something I read in a book about normal eating some years ago. It was something like "every restricting phase has its counterbinge phase" or "every diet has its counterbinge". At least it might be something to think about when talking about the very strict diet of some WLS patients and all the struggling vets a few years down the road, too.

There is even some scientific reasons why our voices sound different to us than to anybody else - I bet it's the same with a photo vs. the mirror.

OMG, voice records are no better than photographs, LOL.

I basically know nobody that likes how he/she looks on a photograph, lol.

@FluffyChix: The weight gain is indeed because of "not following the rules". However, as with other strict diets this whole bunch of strict rules can't usually be followed forever. Willpower wears out. There might be a few exceptions who can follow the whole book of rules forever (as there is with other diets; after all there are people who maintain their weight with WW etc. as well). To not make WLS into just another diet or diet in disguise that gives you great success in the beginning and makes you miserable a few months or years down the road: implement rules that you can follow forever.

And I can completely understand how frustrating this is. Try your best to learn new skills to deal with everyday life. It's not that I'm not struggling in some way. Caffeine and sugar problems anyone? (make that a double espresso, please, ok?) I wish you all the best.

Yes, this.

Hm, I'm beginning to think I got you wrong. I thought you were talking about this 10% regain of lost weight after WLS.

Truth be told? My really honest opinion on this? The stuff so many people don't want to hear? I think there is much more luck involved than many people might want to acknowledge. In some people it seems the surgery seems to work better and they get to a normal weight without much struggle. They also maintain without much struggle. Others struggle a lot, battling a lot of hunger or head hunger etc. Some people are able to adopt new habits way easier than others. Again - some are luckier than others just like there are people who are quick learners when it comes to learning a new language etc. Some people also really like to exercise - it's not much of a chore for them, that's why they're consistent without having to use a lot of energy to kick themselves in the butt. In the WLS population I think it's like in the rest of the population when it comes to the occasional overeating - some get away with more overeating than others without gaining weight. They also don't fall back into an everlasting bingeing mode once they screw up at a birthday party. This "working on yourself" stuff is extremely important if you lack the skills (I talked about "regulation" in my other post) but let's face it: some people do way better when it comes to this just like some people do better than others learning new languages or new working skills. Travel back in time in your mind and think about school or college: I guess you will remember some people who didn't have to study that much and had good grades anyway because they simply seemed to get the hang of it somehow while others struggled a lot to get even moderately decent grades. We all have to play with a set of cards life has dealt us - make the best out them.

So you lose 200 lbs and regain 20. That's still a weight loss of 180 lbs. Still success. Nothing that throws you back into the morbidly obese range. I think there is a big difference between a rather small weight gain (compared to the weight lost) and a really big weight gain.

You seem to be absolutely terrified of this? May I ask why?

If you're able to maintain that kind of starvation lifestyle for 2 or 3 years and beyond - kudos to you! I'm terrified of having to eat 1000-1200 cals a day while needing to exercise 4-5 days 45 min a day. Find a sustainable lifestyle early on. Like a really sustainable lifestyle. One that fits your needs and not that of somebody else or a lifestyle that blows to pieces the very moment "life hits you". I know a lot of users on here throw a fit the very moment there is talk about "moderation" - however, I think our whole life is about "moderation", not only this eating stuff. Or maybe I should rather use the word "regulation" instead? You need to learn how to regulate yourself, the amount you eat, drink, use alcohol or caffeine, have sex, exercise, express your emotions etc. Too little of these things and life might be miserable, too much of these things and life might be miserable, too.

There is a variety of non-milk based protein powders. Soy, pea, rice, hemp etc. Vega tastes very sweet (if you mean the brand Brendan Brazier created). It's very heavy on stevia. I use some Vega products as well but only occasionally.

It's kind of weird to call your diet "plant-based" when you're eating meat every day.

If only people who are "ready" (i. e. who won't overeat) would get the surgery we would have a 100% success rate of surgery. Everyone would lose 100% excess weight, everyone would maintain it. If people would already have overcome overeating before surgery - they wouldn't need the surgery at all. It's completely unrealistic to expect WLS patients to never overeat again. A surgeon who has his things together should be aware of this. And white knuckling over an amount of six months or three months or whatever the magic timespan for your surgeon might be doesn't proof diddly squat, let alone the patient "doesn't overeat anymore". Why wear the willpower of the patient out before surgery?

I guess so. Maybe being very overweight was the only thing holding the wife or husband back from getting a divorce. "Better being in a not-that-ideal marriage than having to face a future life all alone" might be what a lot of people are thinking. Statistically it's way harder to find a new partner if you're fat. Same with jobs. Getting a new partner or a new job is way less harder if you have a normal weight or if you're only slightly overweight so people might finally find the courage to do what they wanted to do for years.

Liquids are way more important than protein. The body won't die when you're not meeting your protein goals. Not getting in enough liquids is way more critical.

Sounds familiar, that "this time it will be different", huh? --- WLS doesn't prevent people miraculously from "falling off the strict diet and exercise program wagon". Might be time to consider what wagon really to hop on.