So, I know this is passe', but damn! I was playing around with a BMI calculator earlier, and found that if I lose down to my "ballpark" goal of 250, I will still be obese! I'm 6'4", and have a powerlifter build (this won't mean much to the ladies, but the guys will know what I'm talking about). I struggled early on with setting a "target weight", because I have no idea. My tangible goal is to get down to a heart-healthy waist size (bout 34).

The skinnest I have ever been in my adult life was 225. I was 17 yrs old and playing football. When I was 225, my ribs were prominent. Too thin for my tastes, when I look back on old photos. Subsequent years resulted in gained weight, but some was still muscle (as evidenced by ability to lift more and more weight).

The depressing part is, for me to get to a "normal" BMI, I need to get down to 205. That's right, 20 lbs less than my weight in high school. Sheesh! I know the subject of BMI has been bandied about recently, so I don't expect a lively debate.....just needed to rant. (Am I turning into a chick?!? LOL)

I think BMI is a tricky subject at best. I would say do what makes you happy! If having a higher weight makes more sense to you then so be it. I don't think BMI really does men any justice, if you think about it logically most professional athletes would be over weight due to their muscle mass!

This whole experience is about you feeling better about yourself and more comfortable in your own skin. Being at too low a weight for you could make you feel as insecure as being bigger could. You’re the boss of you! Sod the BMI!

PS pretty sure the power lifting rules out you turning into a chick!

KiKi XX

i think BMI scale is not good.

it does not take into account muscle mass. many weight lifters are "overweight" and would be considered obese by bmi scale. silly.

a better measure would be muscle vs fat ratio, I think.

there can be a varying weight range for a height that's still healthy.

I don't think BMI is good for men or woman. I think it is very individual. Not that I don't totally respect the accomplishments that our "Normal BMI" bandsters. I really admire them.

Just not sure it is for me.

Don't think its for you either.

Your doing great.

My gym has a body fat analyzer. It's looks like a doctor's scale. It weighs you, then sends a mild current from your hands to your feet to measure electrical impedance.

Healthy BMI for women is 20-25, healthy body FAT is 20-28%.

Healthy BMI for men is 18-22, healthy body FAT is 5-15%.

The literature I have found says that if you are a muscular person the BMI is not a good thing to really rely on because muscle weighs more than fat. I think this is where your Medical Team can come in handy and help you figure out what is right for you. Don't let it get you down and kudos for being able to be Muscular!

My BMI has always been higher then I "look". For my teenage and most of my 20's I was normal weight. I lifted weights along with cardio. On my petite frame even though I looked good I was not considered a healthy BMI, however, at a size 5 I looked thin. Any smaller and I wouldn't look good.

Now I'm "morbidly obese" I don't think I'm in denial or anything because I know I look pretty big, I just don't think I look "morbidly obese". I feel it has to be partly my body frame and muscle mass.

I have a friend who wears a size 3-5 and she is not in her BMI range either. She is a personal trainer and is solid muscle, one of the healthiest people I know. If she lost any more weight she would not be healthy.

There are better tests out there, body fat content things like that. Maybe that would help you determine what is most healthy for your body frame??

My BMI has always been higher then I "look". For my teenage and most of my 20's I was normal weight. I lifted weights along with cardio. On my petite frame even though I looked good I was not considered a healthy BMI, however, at a size 5 I looked thin. Any smaller and I wouldn't look good.

Now I'm "morbidly obese" I don't think I'm in denial or anything because I know I look pretty big, I just don't think I look "morbidly obese". I feel it has to be partly my body frame and muscle mass.

I'm the EXACT same way. When I was down to a 'healthy' weight according to the BMI scale, I was told by everyone I looked anorexic. I laughed at them because I have always had muscular legs so they sure didn't look like an anorexic's would.

Darlin my husband feels your pain, so does my B-i-L for that matter. They are both 6'+ and have very muscular builds. I love it every time my DH has to do a weigh in for the AF. At first they tell him "you're over weight" then they actually look at him. They do a tape on him and he is actually "under" by those standards. The BiL is 250 (ish) and he is 6'5" and not an ounce of fat on the man. His doctor told him he needed to lose some weight (it was a new doctor as insurance switched docs) and according to my BiL when he asked and where exactly should it come off of, the doc finally looked at him and went 'oh'.......

Honestly I think the BMI charts are antiquated and need to be rethought in a major way. It doesn't take into account body type, build, etc.

Let me tell you i know what you mean. The major reason I was banded was to have a much needed knee surgery, ACI , to be exact. Insurance CO requires my BMI be 30 before they will do it. Well for me thats too small. I understand the muscle thing but they dont. I will post it after Im done ranting, but my cousin who is a trainer researched this for me for my insurance fight and they still didnt care about fat vs muscle. I have spent the last 12 years working on an ambulance & 4 as a firefighter, which was another reason as well for losing weight, I didnt want to be the patient I transport back and forth the dialysis etc. Muscle wise I have biceps that scare most of the guys I work with ( try carrying someone that weighs over 250 down 3 flights of stairs on a regular basis ) , my legs are SOLID, even my ortho agrees they are being absurd with this. I will be happy at 165, not 130 like they want. I know what ya mean about the bones too i have ones sticking out , and cant imagine what it would be like at 130, I will never be able to wrestle another drunk on the stretcher again... Yes I needed to lose weight, but I dont need to look anorexic either. heres the research he found if anyone may ever need it for an insurance battle. I apologize its long.

The problem with BMI calculations is that it makes an assumption of someone's health based solely on their height and weight. It also makes no account for the distribution of obesity; indeed, where fat is distributed on the body has been linked to increased risk of certain diseases.

The BMI is blind. It doesn't know the difference between 300 pounds of muscle and 300 pounds of fat. National Institutes of Health, which lists a BMI calculator at its site (http://nhlbisupport.com/bmi/bmicalc.htm), acknowledges that there are some limitations (translate that as problems) with the BMI. It makes this clarifying statement: It (the BMI) may overestimate bodyfat

Dr. C. Everett Koop, recently published a press release pointing out the shortcomings of BMI. According to the Shape up America website, BMI missclassifies one out of four people and should not be used by athletes.

Why is BMI a poor measure of health and fitness? It's simply because BMI does NOT take into account body fat vs. lean tissue. Body builders and other athletes carry more lean body mass than the average person and will therefore be classified as overweight if BMI is used as the criteria for measurement. Conversely, someone could have a "healthy" BMI of 19 to 22 and yet have a dangerously high level of body fat (a "skinny fat person").

BMI does not take into account skeletal size, amount of body Water and, most notably muscle mass.

Let's use an example where two people who are 5' 8" and weigh 220 pounds. The first person in our example has a body fat percentage of 33% while the second one is a bodybuilder with a body fat percentage of 7%. The first person in our example, we will call him John, is carrying a lean body weight around 174 pounds thus carrying about 72 pounds of fat. Our bodybuilder in the example, who will refer to as Matt, has a lean body weight around 204 pounds carrying about 16 pounds of fat. Now let's look at the BMI calculations for both of our examples.

As you can see a BMI calculation cannot be used for everyone. BMI is just not a good indicator for someone's health and should be avoided when making any health assumptions.

The best recommendation for getting a good indicator of your health is to invest in something that actually tracks your body fat percentage.

Famous body builders:

Jack La Lanne (b. Sept. 26, 1914), noted for his pioneering physical fitness TV shows, celebrated his 90th birthday on September 26, 2004. He is 5'4" and weighs 152 pounds (BMI 26.1). At one time he had 20 pounds more muscle.

Arnold Schwarzenegger (b. July 30, 1947) Arnold is 6' 2" and his competition weight was 235 lbs with a waist of 34". His waist-to-height ratio was 0.46 and his BMI was 30.2. In 1969 he won the Mr. Universe title and he dominated the Mr. Olympia competition from 1970 to 1975. Arnold's off-season weight was 250-260 pounds.

Lou Ferrigno (b. Nov. 9, 1952) won his first Mr. Universe title in 1973 at age 21. He won the title a second time in 1974. Lou, who is 6'5" tall, weighed 285 pounds and had a 34" waist at the time. That corresponds to a BMI of 33.9 and a waist-to-height ratio of 0.44. Lou's off-season weight was 310-325 pounds. Lou gained notoriety for his role in the TV series "The Incredible Hulk".

Ronald "Ronnie" Coleman (b. May 13, 1964) is 5'11" and has a competition weight of 296 pounds (BMI = 41.4). His off-season weight is 330 pounds. Ronnie's enormous muscles make everybody else seem small by comparison. He has won the Mr. Olympia contest every year from 1998 to 2005.

Stephanie Park (b. Jan. 20, 1976) is 5'2" and weighs 118 lb during contests (BMI = 21.6). Stephanie's off-season weight is 145 pounds. She is a Canadian fitness model and won the 2001 South Western Ontario Bodybuilding Level I Championship.

Yaxeni Oriquen (b. Sept. 3, 1963) is 5'7" and has a competition weight of 160 pounds (BMI = 25.1). Her off-season weight is 185 pounds. Originally from Venezuela, Yaxeni now lives in Florida where she is a physical fitness trainer. She was the winner of Miss International at the 2005 Arnold Classic.

Jeff Dwelle (2002 NPC Nationals, 12th place) carries a BMI of 30+ at his contest weight of 220 pounds. His off-season weight of 255 gives him a BMI of 35.6, which is virtually off the scale. The BMI says that even when Dwelle cuts down to contest condition, he is still obese!

ATHLETES:

A recent study by University of North Carolina endocrinologist Dr. Joyce Harp utilized the BMI to check out the condition of today's professional football players. She, along with a student assistant, used height and weight statistics to find the body mass index of the various players on each roster. The results they came up with led them to declare that over half the players in the National Football League are obese.

fashion model Ana Reston who died of anorexia earlier in 2006 (at death her BMI was 13.5,

Shaquille O'Neal has a BMI of 32 which rates him as "obese" to "morbidly obese" and so seriously overweight he is in life threatening danger due to his inactive lifestyle...according to the BMI.

A look at the 16 top elite fencers at the last Olympics as well as some of the elite Canadian female fencers gives an average BMI of around 24; according to the BMI, just this side of "overweight".

But the notion that 200 other NBA players out of 426 are even within a 3-point shot of tubby might make one wonder: Just how good is the BMI at telling if somebody is too fat?

The finding follows a study of football players published in Feb 2005 in the Journal of the American Medical Association. That research concluded that according to BMI standards, more than half of National Football League players are obese, and nearly all are overweight. The study's validity was questioned by an NFL spokesman.

In the new study, published in Medicine & Science in Sports & Exercise, the researchers calculated both BMI and body fat percentage for 439 college students. Study results showed that male and female college athletes, as well as male non-athletes, could have a BMI suggesting they were overweight yet still have healthy levels of body fat, defined as less than 20 percent fat in men and 33 percent in women.

Overweight Gold Medal Olympian Athletes according to the Body Mass Index (BMI)

Shawn Crawford (USA) Sprinting (200m)

(Overweight: 177cm, 81kg, athlete BMI=26)

Mark Lewis-Francis (GB) Sprinting (100m Relay)

(Overweight: 183cm, 89kg, athlete BMI=26)

Matthew Pinsent (GB) Rowing (Coxless four)

(Overweight: 196cm, 108kg, athlete BMI=28)

James Cracknell (GB) Rowing (Coxless four)

(Overweight: 192cm, 100kg, athlete BMI=27)

Ed Coode (GB) Rowing (Coxless four)

(Overweight: 193cm, 96kg, athlete BMI=26)

Steve Williams (GB) Rowing (Coxless four)

(Overweight: 189cm, 96kg, athlete BMI=27)

David Cal (Spain) Canoeing (C-1 1000m)

(Overweight: 183cm, 91kg, athlete BMI=27)

Khadjimourat Gatsalov (Russia) Wrestling (84-96kg)

(Overweight: 180cm, 96kg, athlete BMI=30)

Artur Taymazov (Uzebekistan) Wrestling (96-120kg)

(Obese: 189cm, 112kg, athlete BMI=31)

Roman Sebrle (Czechoslovakia) Decathlon

(Overweight: 186cm, 88kg, athlete BMI=25)

Ryan Bayley (Austria) Cycling (Sprint)

(Overweight: 181cm, 84kg, athlete BMI=26)

Odlanier Solis Fonte (Cuba) Boxing (81-91kg)

(Overweight: 180cm, 91kg, athlete BMI=28)

Alexander Povetkin (Russia) Boxing (over 91kg)

(Overweight: 188cm, 91kg, athlete BMI=26)

Ihar Makarau (Belarus) Judo (90-100kg)

(Obese: 180cm, 100kg, athlete BMI=31)

Yuriy Bilonog (Ukraine) Shot put

(Obese: 200cm, 135kg, athlete BMI=34)

(Note: all heights and weights were taken from the official Athens 2004 web site)

Just go for body fat percentage and waist to hip ratio and forget BMI. Not only is it too "one size fits all" but it's not based on the best data.

I must agree that BMI (especially for men) can be a tough one. At your height and with your body structure (since you powerlift I must assume you are quite muscular) I think you need to have an end goal weight that you are comfortable with and still healthy. The BMI definitely doesn't take into account if you have 30lbs more muscle mass than your other average guy your age and height. And well done with the 45lbs gone! Woohooo keep up the good work

What CrueFan said. BMI is useful as a general rule of thumb but that is all. My own BMI is currently excellent and also a case in point. Because I am now fighting cancer I don't do anything much except lie around. As a result I have terrible muscle mass and yet still have isolated areas of fat. In addition, fat or skinny, I have always been thick-waisted and this is now known to be a Bad Thing with respect to heart and stroke issues. Ugh, eh!

Thanks for the replies, everybody. I do have quite a bit of fat to lose. I'm not delusional, nor in denial. That's why I got banded. I am giving serious thought to doing that "underwater" test that supposedly gives an accurate lean body mass / fat ratio.

So, in conclusion, we are all agreed to pick up our burning torches and pitchforks, congregate into an angry mob, and storm the BMI stronghold, yes?

A tip I was given by a trainer at the gym, was if you are going to rely on the body fat ratio scales, and hand held devices used by many gyms, is to make sure when you go in to use them each time to be similarly hydrated.

He said that is the way it measures the fat/muscle ratio, is by how fast the current runs through the body, the more hydrated you are the more fat is shows I think he said----BUT when working out you want to remain well hydrated. So he said it might not be a REAL accurate measure, but if you strive to be in a similarly hydrated state each time, then you can see your numbers drop accordingly.

So either do it immediately upon entering the gym ready for your workout, before you begin drinking extra-----or always do it after the first bottle of water---or whatever, just always approach doing it at the same time.

My oldest DD is overweight according to the BMI charts as well, and she is toned, and looks awesome! She is 5'9" and wears a juniors size 7----she is a kick boxer, and has her brown belt in Aikido----she is well muscled.......so her BMI is not far from mine, but her tone level---makes mine laughable!!!

Kat

I think in the end you can really only go by how you look and feel. I'm the opposite, my BMI is normal, but I still carry just a tad too much body fat at 26% (if that's even accurate). I'm not a heavily muscled build despite being a regular exerciser, my body type is meant to be very lean, and I will not look my absolute best till I"m right down the bottom of my health weight range. Other people I know of similar height and weight wear a smaller size, and look much less flabby than I do.

BMI itself means little, its ballpark, that's all and there are plenty of people around who are more muscular and can afford to weigh more. But really, unless you're VERY muscled as in training hard, the range of BMI will probably cover it. YOu cant kid yourself that you can weigh 20lb more than anyone else unless you really know that it IS lean body tissue, not fat.

But I think shoot for 250 and reasses from there.