Hey guys,

Are you up for a little debate? ok, here it goes....I'm a Christian, proud and happy to be one, I love God/ Christ and I humble myself to Him because I want to and I like it, I enjoy that humbling experience... and I do have other reasons to believe........

Of course, I know that not everyone agrees with me but I respect everyone's opinions, yes.... even if we can't agree, LOL!

I normally don't listen to celebrities talking about religion or politics, in my opinion, they show ignorance most of the times, specially when they talk about politics.... but an article popped up in MSN about Brad Pitt and I do admire his humanitarian work, so I read it , and I thought it was interesting what Brad Pitt said about his view/feelings on religion.... I personaly agree that religion in general is good....no matter what yours is... what do you think?

The following is the article:

"Religion works, Brad goes on. I know there's comfort there, a crash pad. It's something to explain the world and tell you there is something bigger than you, and it is going to be all right in the end. It works because it's comforting. I grew up believing in it, and it worked for me in whatever my little personal high school crisis was, but it didn't last for me. I didn't understand this idea of a God who says, 'You have to acknowledge me. You have to say that I'm the best, and then I'll give you eternal happiness. If you won't, then you don't get it!' It seemed to be about ego. I can't see God operating from ego, so it made no sense to me."

Thanks for reading guys, later.....

Helen;)

Burn in hell? Well, hell, me and my wife get that, and we BELIEVE in God. :fish2: I'm Unitarian and my wife is Jewish. I can't count the number of times the "forgivers" have dropped the "hell bomb" on us. Our mantra is: Religion is not the truth; God is the truth. Anything given by man is suspect. Any book that was vetted by man, had entire books (chapters) discarded by man, has been translated many times, and was argued about 600 years after its lead protaganist was killed should not be considered the infallible word of God. A revelation is a revelation to the first person god tells it to. Anything after that is hearsay. It's like the grade-school tell a sentence at the beginning of a line and have everyone whisper it back and see what the last person has to say was the original sentence. Usually, that is a far cry from the original message.

I most definately agree with you there.

That's another issue I have.

What about the books that were burned?

Why did they burn them?

What was it that you were not suppose to see?

You see most don't want to question this because we have been taught since we were children to never question GOD.

But it's not GOD we are questioning it's man!

Hey... not fair! Nobody here is saying that. Personally, I couldn't have BEEN more clear that those who behave the worst are the minority.

I explained pretty well that as an atheist when someone discovers in real time (or on line, often times) it is the loud horrible Christians I encounter. The nice folks sit back and watch. I think Lauren made the same point.

Nobody here has claimed as you say. In atheism terms, we call that attitude the persecuted Christian claim. It's simply untrue.

I wasn't quoting you at all. In fact, I totally agreed with your earlier post and was going to comment on that. There are extremes within each community, and I appreciate that you acknowledged that. But in other threads here and in editorials, magazines, and blogs, I find that the generalizations about Christians are more widespread and believed than on any other group. Maybe one has to be a member of a maligned group to see it that way, but it is very real to me and I would suspect to most Christians.

I wasn't quoting you at all. In fact, I totally agreed with your earlier post and was going to comment on that. There are extremes within each community, and I appreciate that you acknowledged that. But in other threads here and in editorials, magazines, and blogs, I find that the generalizations about Christians are more widespread and believed than on any other group. Maybe one has to be a member of a maligned group to see it that way, but it is very real to me and I would suspect to most Christians.

That's a good point. And the same can be said about ANY group, not just Christians. I've seen it about Atheists, Muslims, Hindus, etc. It's not something that is unique to Christians. It may resonate more with you because you belong to that group, but it isn't unique.

...Maybe one has to be a member of a maligned group to see it that way, ...

Huh????

I'm an atheist, HELLO???

To add to my last post (because editing is a bitch)....

Any group can say the same. Any time someone belongs to a distinct group, whether it's defined by belief, color, ethnicity, etc., that group is categorized as a whole, in many cases, usually to the detriment of most of it's members.

Supernatural BS explained:

Jesus walking on water: It was not recorded by him personally; as a matter of fact not one word of the Bible is written by Jesus. It is all written by others, and as such is suspect.

Virgin Birth: Angel gets her pregnant; this is a direct correlation to mythology, whereas the Gods routinely got mortals pregnant. This story was written at time when the ones being told the story would be comfortable with the story from their cultural roots.

God somehow protects those who believe: Tell that to 500,000 Rwandans, 6 million Jews, or 20 million Russians (World War II)

Cast out of the Garden of Eden: Ok, so God is going to punish billions of people for the frailties of one person? That makes God vindictive, which makes him flawed, which makes him a contradiction of himself. I can't really go with that.

Other examples also exist. Belief and faith only go so far. Perception and reality coexist for a reason.

I wasn't quoting you at all. In fact, I totally agreed with your earlier post and was going to comment on that. There are extremes within each community, and I appreciate that you acknowledged that. But in other threads here and in editorials, magazines, and blogs, I find that the generalizations about Christians are more widespread and believed than on any other group. Maybe one has to be a member of a maligned group to see it that way, but it is very real to me and I would suspect to most Christians.

Now to respond to the part of your post that didn't make me almost fall out of my chair...

One other issue you have to realize is that Christianity is the ONLY religion that practices active witnessing. It is the Christians out there attempting to gain more followers. Don't you think that is going to upset a few people?

I have people coming to my door at least weekly attempting to convert me to their faith. They are without a doubt, 100%, Christians.

Don't you think that is going to annoy a few folks?

I was raised Christian, I know the routine, I don't believe it. I'll make up my own mind. Having people come to my door to tell me I am wrong and I will burn in hell for not thinking their way... it's annoying.

If I don't answer the door I'm rude, if I tell them I am not interested I'm rude. If I tell them I am an atheist they have actually asked to see if I have the mark of the devil on my hands. If I still don't convert they tell me I speak the words of the devil. How would you feel in my shoes? Honestly, how would you feel? I've yet to have a Christian come to my door and welcome me in the neighborhood as an atheist or thrilled I was there. That's why I can't tell people in real time my lack of belief.

BTW, I lack belief in a devil too. To me it's like threatening me with hell for not believing in the Easter bunny. It's just ... well, silly.

Do you know I have been lectured about working on Sundays? It was by a Christian. He said I was so sweet and caring so I must surely be a Christian and therefore I should know better than to work on Sundays.

??? The man just had a heart attack, he was in CCU. I was his nurse. Should I really go home for the day? Would that make me a better person to let him fend for himself?

THIS is what we encounter. If I am nice and treat him with compassion and respect as a patient then I am obviously Christian. Can you imagine what he would have thought had I told him I am atheist? It wasn't the time or place for a religion debate and my lack of belief is really none of his business. But it's the point. It's frustrating and annoying not to mention insulting.

If people had ANY clue who is caring for them in hospitals they'd be shocked. The majority are either gay or atheist. We just don't talk about it. But you know what? The best hospital I ever worked for was Mayo Clinic and the nuns were the last people to care what our belief or lack of belief was. Their expectations were the highest around and they demanded the best from everyone. If you couldn't cut it you were out of there without a second thought. But our beliefs or lack of were the least of their concerns.

They have the right attitude.

I think Mayo is probably the hospital with the most atheists of all places I have worked. You can't stand on your tippy toes, arms stretched out, and spin in circles without hitting an atheist. Can you imagine what the Christian fundie types would think of that? Heh....

Cast out of the Garden of Eden: Ok, so God is going to punish billions of people for the frailties of one person? That makes God vindictive, which makes him flawed, which makes him a contradiction of himself. I can't really go with that.

Here we disagree. Eve didn't mess up, God did.

What was that tree she ate from?

Supernatural BS explained:

Jesus walking on water: It was not recorded by him personally; as a matter of fact not one word of the Bible is written by Jesus. It is all written by others, and as such is suspect.

Virgin Birth: Angel gets her pregnant; this is a direct correlation to mythology, whereas the Gods routinely got mortals pregnant. This story was written at time when the ones being told the story would be comfortable with the story from their cultural roots.

God somehow protects those who believe: Tell that to 500,000 Rwandans, 6 million Jews, or 20 million Russians (World War II)

Cast out of the Garden of Eden: Ok, so God is going to punish billions of people for the frailties of one person? That makes God vindictive, which makes him flawed, which makes him a contradiction of himself. I can't really go with that.

Other examples also exist. Belief and faith only go so far. Perception and reality coexist for a reason.

I've done reasearch and I was trying to make a point.

Religion and science are one in the same.

Just for the record it's the spirtual world not super natural bs.

Those worlds exist!

There are many realms outside of what you see before you.

I totally agree with what you are stated especially the holocust of innocent people!

Actually there were billions of Africans slaughtered.

There is no excuse for that what's so ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Religion and science are one in the same.

Speaking as a scientist, how do you figure?

<p>

I didn't say they weren't doing anything wrong. There are bad people out there, no matter what their personal creed is. But when you get a group of people that are supposed to love their fellow man and whatnot to be in that group, and then one turns around and starts talking about gays and black men as "faggots" and "niggers," it kind of makes an impression. And, good or bad, it makes more of an impression coming from someone is part of a group that is supposed to be loving and caring.

</p> <p>The way I see is that whoever hates that way is wrong and cruel, it doesn't make any greater impression on me because a Christian or a Muslim or an Atheist said it... just because the Christians or the Muslims are supposed to abide by their rules or standards of their religion doesn't make them perfect and sometimes they may do wrong and sometimes big time wrong... like being hateful ......and just because an atheist doesn't have to live by some group's rules or standards or religion's rules doesn't make them any less accountable and the impression that either will leave for me is exactly the same...</p>

Speaking as a scientist, how do you figure?

Astrology. .

Holidays espcially easter and the resurrection of christ ,jesus walking on Water,etc.

I'm very much into astrology.

Astrology. .

Holidays espcially easter and the resurrection of christ ,jesus walking on Water,etc.

Astrology isn't a science. Astronomy is. Two very different fields.

And I'm still not sure what you are talking about with the statement " Holidays espcially easter and the resurrection of christ ,jesus walking on water,etc." I need a sentence, here.

Hey... not fair! Nobody here is saying that. Personally, I couldn't have BEEN more clear that those who behave the worst are the minority.

I explained pretty well that as an atheist when someone discovers in real time (or on line, often times) it is the loud horrible Christians I encounter. The nice folks sit back and watch. I think Lauren made the same point.

Nobody here has claimed as you say. In atheism terms, we call that attitude the persecuted Christian claim. It's simply untrue.

Even though I understand your point, from a Christian standpoint, I also encounter plenty of loud horrible atheists....in different forums, etc... but it's not always all of them, so I wouldn't say the "the nice" folks sit back and watch... because then I'd be saying that atheists in general are not nice....I'm sure you've encountered some loud horrible Christians, same way I've encountered some loud horrible atheists, but I'm sure that there are some from both groups sitting back and watching and being nice....