Xerox

I stalled at one week.

So after my first week post op I stopped showing weight loss on the scale until the last couple of days. I can tell I have lost fat, but for whatever reason I wasnt seeing the scale budge, I know its impossible to eat the amounts and kinds of foods I am eating without losing body fat, so I havent let it get me down, just be awear if you are a low BMI'er that you might appear to stall out very soon after surgery!

Healing
I have healed up very well, I can already almost consume 4 ounces of mixed meat, veg and legumes. I havent had any food issues, no nausea or vomiting.
Bare in mind I have gone in to this at a low BMI and I am a non-drinker, non-smoker and relitively young (26).

My diet is pretty good, at first it was difficult to get much more than Protein in to my diet, but now I incorporate much more veg and legumes in to my diet, I also measure out one ounce of mixed nuts a day for between meals, which helps me to boost my calories by 200 quite effortlessly.
I eat a whole foods diet, with no starchy carbs and I am sticking to nutrient rich foods.

One of my stitches got infected, a tight knot was eating away at my skin and created a hole open from both ends. I syringed it with isopropyl followed soap Water and it healed right up.

A typical day of eating for me

Breakfast: Scrambled egg with leek, mushroom, tomatoes, spring onion, mixed spinach / greens and pressed cod roe (fish eggs), I find it hard to only make one portion so usually split it and keep another portion in the fridge.

Lunch: Sometimes I will have the second portion of eggs cold, or I will make a small salad with turkey, smoked salmon, legumes or cod roe.

Dinner: Turkey stirfry. I throw in whatever veg I have going, broccoli, colliflower, peas (in pod) spinach and mixed greens, squash, carrot, onions, leek etc. taking care not to overcook.

I cook enough for my brother who also wants to lose weight, we both really enjoy the new diet, Its much more varied than the bland boring diet I was on before surgery.

Between meals I will snack on my 1oz serving of nuts which I prep in the morning.

Other Snacks that go down well for me are cockles, they are very low in calories and high in protein, but right now I am trying to squeeze in more healthy calories so I am more inclined to incorporate them in to a meal than have them as a snack.

In the evenings I will enjoy a small cup of Decaf coffee, I used to be addicted to coffee, decaf has really helped me curb this, very pleased!

Habits

To make life easy I freeze a lot of small portions of veg / leafy greens and meats. Some vegs I wont freeze because they taste odd from frozen, like broccoli or carrots, which do last pretty well in the fridge or cupboard. Frozen leafy greens are great for throwing in with all kinds of meals so long as you are happy to have them soft. I keep some in the fridge raw, but the rest I freeze and you can easly grab clumps of frozen greens and sprinkle them in with your cooking.

I measure my portions in to small bowls at about 4 oz per portion, what I dont eat goes to the dog, I do now recognise when enough is enough, it took a few weeks, but now I can stop before I get full.

Lastly, I am still making bone broths, their just so packed full of nutrients that I think its worth incorporating in to my diet for life. I can make small cubes of broth to throw in with meals I pan fry to use less oil. I freeze my families left over chicken/ tuckey bones until I have enough to make a Bone Broth with throw in any left over carrots or onion thats soon to go bad and then freeze the stock in bags of 200g or in ice cube trays.

What I need to do

Its great for me to say all this, but if I slip back in to old habits it will all be for naught, I know my issue with food is largely lazyness, but by getting in the habit of making the right foods easily accessible I think I can overcome this problem, I have lost weight and kept it off for good in the past by changing habits, and I hope to do this again.
I am about to start a new business which will change my life forever, so very exciting times, perfect for breaking old habits and developing new ones!

One last thing

Sorry if I come across quite tactless and rude to some people, I have aspergers syndrome so my social skills are awful,

I just made my Protein in to a pudding consistancy and added my pill to that, managed to get it down without gagging so thats an improvement.

I can give it a try, I can imagine it still tastes awful though, just wondering how other people get it down.

I was prescribed a Multivitamin that is non-chewable and tastes unbearable. I have been crushing it up and just chucking it to the back of my mouth and drinking Water but its making me gag.
Any tips on how I could take these? I am 2 weeks post VSG.

Thanks for the info. I am trying to get everything I need from what I consume including fiber through lentils liquified in to my Soups, so I havent had any issues yet.

Sex is part of a healthy relationship, both partners have to pull their weight, tell her how it is, if you are willing to fight for your family she should be willing to fight for hers.
Its great to say you would be faithful to your wife nomatter what, but that gives her free rein to get as lazy as she wants with the relationship. You have to give yourself some leverage. Truth is if it got bad enough you would have to leave the marriage and she needs to know that.
She now knows what her limits are, you need to tighten those limits like you are your waistline, you now have more sexual options and if she knows this it will encourage her to keep up with you. She has already shown that shes willing to try because she wants to stay together, but you let her slack off, she will push the boundries.

Since im not an athlete, yes I do intend to be in the healthy range. I have now dropped from obese to overweight since my op on the 7th this month.

Its probably pychological, now is the best time to re-train your body and mind to let go of its cravings and focus on nourishing the body instead.
The feeling will subside if you give it time. Your brain is used to the ritual of eating so not eating is quite a drastic change and takes some getting used to. But IMO its an important step.
Home made broth tastes much better then store bought broth if you can nab a chicken carcas from someones leftover roast.

I find the youtube videos a bit rambly, take a drink every time they mention their hair.

Dal is an Indian dish that can be anywhere from smooth like a Soup to a thick puree, It is made from split peas or lentils but I think chickpeas can also be used.
Dal is a staple in india because most indians are vegetarian and lentils are high in Protein.

Dont think we have this brand in the UK.

I have some fiber powder I could add?

I got sleeved on the 7th rather than the 6th. I was sleeved at a BMI of 30.6, I think I had previously said I was 31.6 but I was mistaken.
I was told to stick mostly to Water for my first week, so I have had 2 portions of home made chicken bone and vegetable broth each day and water throughout the week. The last few days my stomach has started to growl and churn, but otherwise its been pretty effortless, if not a chore to remember to drink my fluids and broth.
I am feeling pretty weak tbh, My dog has bad back legs and I have to carry her around a lot and this has become a challenge. I get exhausted doing things I used to do effortlessly.

Last night I made two Soups for the first week of full liquid stage, Ive tried to cram as much nutrition in to them as possible. Both are made from home made chicken bone and vegetable stock and grilled chicken thighs, one is carrot and squash and the other is mushroom. They have been frozen in to individual containers.
I am lazy when it comes to cooking, so its easier for me to make a weeks supply in one evening than to cook every day.

This morning I started my transition to full liquids with a Protein Shake (powder + water) I am not particularly looking forward to starting full liquids because I dont know what to expect and I dont feel a drive to eat anything right now. I also have some greek yogurt, but keep forgetting to eat it.

I dont have a feeling of fullness at all, If I drink too much I can get a pain, but otherwise im just measuring out my broth portions and hoping its enough.

So that is pretty much how the first week has been for me, Hopefully I am on the right track.

Quote

So people who can't maintain their weight loss after eating just Protein and veggies, as much as they want, all have psychological problems? That's what you are saying.

No it is not what I am saying. What a ridiculous statement to make. Im saying if you want to lose weight but you feel like you cant sustain a diet that is enriching your body with all the calories, Vitamins and minerals your body wants, soley because you cant resist eating foods that you know will cause you to gain weight if eaten regularly and in excess, but you do it anyway, thats phycological, not physical, you arent physically hungry or starving, its in your head.
Its the inability to resist which is a psychological issue which you can work on.

You said

Quote

they simply do not feel good doing this

I responded

Quote

Because? What? they're starving? What is the pressure that makes them not able to do it anymore? How is it not sustainable? Are they low on energy?

Followed by

Quote

If you are saying they dont feel good because they crave high calorie foods too often and want to give in to temptations often enough that it causes weight gain then that is psychological and can be changed with persistance its like an addiction

I was very specific about what I am talking about. Im not saying anyone who gains weight for any reason has a psychological issue. Im saying a very specific behaviour is a phycological issue.

3 minutes ago, setoo said:

Alright, and that is also simply not true. As @Creekimp13 pointed out, the most healthy and lean people on earth thrive on exactly that kind of diet! They are doing absolutely wonderful. That's a fact which one can look up. So that dismisses your argument, no?

No, I dont eat that diet, they dont eat my diet, they might eat a component of my diet but not in the way that I do or to the extent that I do, Our diets are not the same, if they were I would be the most healthy lean person on earth, but im not.

Quote

So are you saying that overweight people who lose tons of weight and then at one point start eating higher calorie food again and also start regaining weight do have a psychological problem?

Erm, no? How on earth did you get that Idea? I just said people fall off the wagon for thousands of reasons. They might have just decided they prefer eating more than being slimmer.

Im saying if you cant maintain a diet where you are over indulging in low calorie nutrient dense foods, but cant keep it up because you just really want to eat junk food every day, then that is phycological, not physical. There is no physical barrier stopping you from eating an abundence of low calorie, nutritionally dense foods which is what your body wants.

Quote

I know where you are coming from

Clearly you dont, I never said a food was objectively bad, Im using casual language, you just fail to understand these words in context.

Quote

Sorry, but I think it is ridiculous to say that said foods are the cause of weiht gain or even calling them "absolutely not healthy". They are completely fine and healthy foods and have been a staple for hundreds of years, so yeah, I have to disagree.

I said

Quote

Eating all of these foods daily in place of lean meats and vegetables is absolutely not a healthy diet

If I thought they were inherently bad I wouldnt say

Quote

When I lost over 60lbs in the past, I could still occassionally eat these, but not to near the extent as I am now

In both of these quotes I identified that I am eating these items in place of more nutritionally dense and less calorie heavy foods. This isnt healthy.
What is and is not healthy eating depends on the individual circumstances. If I were an athelete maybe It would be beneficial to eat something that will skyrocket my blood sugar before a workout but I am not.

Please understand peoples arguments and understand the context in which words are being used rather than assume that we are painting a food as objectively bad for you.

Quote

I feel like you lean heavily towards people making "bad choices" or not forming "healthy habits" to be main reason for the weight regain. I do not think that's true. While I agree that healthy choices and awareness in general does help, it does not justify the regain in my opinion.
Let's apply your logic to some person that had no WLS surgery at all:
They are starting to eat "healthy" aka Protein and veggies (this seems to be definition of healthy around WLS surgergies forums). They lose tons of weight, but say, after a year, they just can't do this anymore. They are not happy with this, their body is also fighting this. So they give up, because they simply do not feel good doing this.
So you could say these people have failed, because they have decided to go back to "bad choices". If that is the case, then everybody who does not maintain a great weight loss via eating a rigid diet (which is 99% of the population) is just making bad choices? That does not sound reasonable to me , at all and I think many of us can agree, by having experienced the said scenario.

Yes, absolutely. There are many reasons you fall off the wagon, usually falling off the wagon isnt introducing a bit more lean meat, vegetables and legumes in to your diet to ward off hunger, its going off the rails and eating high calorie and nutritionally void foods too frequently. Nobody gets obese eating comforting portions of lean meats, vegetables and legumes most of the time and treating themselves occassionaly.
If you dont feel good eating filling portions of nutritionally dense food then you have a phycological issue, you arent suffering physically from this.
Its difficult to gain weight by over indulging in lean protein and vegetables, but you can by over indulging in potatoes or high calorie processed foods.
So I dismiss the idea that people stop eating nutritionally dense low calorie foods because? What? they're starving? What is the pressure that makes them not able to do it anymore? How is it not sustainable? Are they low on energy?
If you are saying they dont feel good because they crave high calorie foods too often and want to give in to temptations often enough that it causes weight gain then that is phycological and can be changed with persistance its like an addiction. You wouldnt be saying this to an alcoholic.
I felt like I wasnt getting anywhere on wholefoods after a while, but in hindsight if I kept going I would have broke the plateu eventually, even if I didnt it would be a better place than I am at now. I take full responsibility for mucking things up for me.

Quote

Think twice about labeling food as "bad". Rice is not bad, bread is not bad, potatoes are not bad either.

Eating all of these foods daily in place of lean meats and vegetables is absolutely not a healthy diet and is precisely the cause of my weight gain. When I lost over 60lbs in the past, I could still occassionally eat these, but not to near the extent as I am now. I was simply explaining my reasons for regaining which was replacing my whole foods diet with a high carb/starch diet out of convenience.

Quote

I think most surgeons have a way more distant and neutral view of this treatment method than most patients. The patient's view seems to be loaded with emotions (no surprise here) and that is reflected on this board as well. It's never the treatment method that fails, it's always the patient who isn't strong enough, disciplined enough, motivated enough if goal weight isn't 100% or 100% maintained for the rest of life.

This is very interesting because we used to be the same with diets. Then came the "diets don't work" movement along, backed up scientifically. And then as a last resort there is WLS - it's kind of depressing to accept that this last resort treatment isn't 100% fool proof either. It's easier to blame the fellow patients because it's quite frightening to think about the fact that you yourself might be one of the patients where it doesn't work 100%.

The answer to long term weight loss and maintenence isnt dieting or WLS, its the adoption of long term improvement to your diet and lifestyle. (not debating you just making a statement)

Like you say, most people just arent going to make those changes and life hits you in such a way sometimes that pushes you towards unhelpful behaviours, but it is ultimately us as individuals who do it. We have agency over our lives and bodies.
I dont personally have an issue with accepting where I am going wrong, I can see exactly why I lost weight and why I gained. But we are flawed creatures and life is unpredictable.
I think we need to bear in mind that WLS is a tool and not a cure to be used in conjunction with developing better habits and improving mental health. Atleast that is how I look at it.
In my mind not reaching your goal 100% isnt a fail, its a success if you have lost a life improving amount of weight, if you lose a few pounds then I might consider it a fail.

Quote

Me neither, but just as every other medical therapy on this planet doesn't work in 100% of the cases with 100% success it's not realistic to expect 100% of WLS patients being 100% successful.

Indeed, its one of the reasons I have chosen to undergo surgery, although I could work at it myself, I cant garantee I wont regain at some point, and I am undergoing surgery in 2019 after which I will have to keep my weight down perminantly to avoid problems. So WLS for me is an added support to help me keep my weight as low as possible.

Quote

If that's really the case I wonder why you don't go back to a diet that really satisfy you.

My disinterest in cooking is currently greater than my need to satisfy my pallet. In recent years I have avoided cooking and rather look to quicker alternatives. bread, rice and potatoes also store longer, and I dislike crowds and shopping, so keeping stocked with fresh vegetables is difficult for me.
I have become reluctant to push myself out of my comfort zone, when I do it life is better, but It gets the better of me at times.
Essentaily I have social disorders that make me more inclined to behaviours what would lead to weight gain. What I call lazyness is probably anxiety and avoidence.
my bmi is only 31, took me a while to climb to this weight again but here I am. If it wasnt for my future surgery |I probably wouldnt be going through with WLS.

I wouldnt say we couldnt do it. Ive been down from my highest weight for years and im up from my lowest weight in my adult life which I initially acheived through diet and exercise.
My problem was binge eating, but now my problem is lazyness, its a shame because the food ive been eating recently doesnt satisfy me in any way other than making me not hungry, while eating a healthy whole foods diet was enjoyable, but my problem is I have developed new bad habits of being too uninterested to cook and resorting to quick fixes in the form of high carb foods like bread, rice and potatoes.
If I continue this post op then I will not shift the weight, my hope is I will become a more mindful eater over the next year or so because I dont remember a single meal ive had since Christmas, probably just a whole lot of sandwiches and left over christmas Cookies.< br />

The OP was about why people regain, not how many people statistically regain and to what extent.
The focus on regain is kind of silly. Wouldnt it make more sense to say that statistically people post op do not adopt the kind of eating habits and lifestyle that would result in weight loss and maintenense long term? Because that is what we are talking about.
Energy doesnt come from nowhere and you cant live without expending energy.
The reason people regain is because they are consuming more energy than their body is expending on average.
If you want your body to burn more calories then you will need to exercise and build lean muscle.
If you dont want to exercise then you will have to eat low calorie foods like lean meats and non-starchy vegetables.
Statistically people probably arent willing (or dont have the means) to make that kind of change to their lifestyle and that is why they regain.

I would have thought that after a few years your body adjusts to being able to consume more food, and may even increase your hunger hormone production. So in that time you want to develop a healthier relationship with food and adopt a healthier lifestyle.
Then it is up to you.
I used to be a binge eater, I would think up exactly what food I wanted on the way to the store and then go eat it in private, but I shook off those habits many years ago and I feel like I cant physically consume as much food as I used to and thats without WLS!
These things most definitely are not set in stone but you have to put the effort in!
I also beleive that there is a correlation between poor mental health and obesity, my most positive changes coincided with improvments to my mental health, and I know many obese people with mental health problems. So if you dont tackle those issues then it wouldnt surprise me if you fall back in to those habits.
As an example, if you are a hermit with social anxiety, you might lose the weight, but if you continue to stay cooped up in your house and never tackle your issues with anxiety then that isnt a healthy way to live and you will most likely gain weight back if you are turning to food to fill the void of regular human interaction.