Wheetsin

You're not alon - it's very common.

For multiple reasons, DH is very, very, very happy that I had this surgery.

Below in blue.

I am scheduled for a revision from Lapband to sleeve on September 17th and the closer I get, I am feeling more and more nervous.

For two reasons:

Reason One: I am AFRAID of suffering a terrible complication. (I have read some real scary stories on here and all I can do is hope and pray that these poor souls will feel better soon.) But if I am doing this surgery to enrich my life, it is complete irony to come out of it suffering with chronic pain or end up on a feeding tube. Is your band already out? Or are you having it out & sleeve done at the same time? The risks for complications with revision procedures goes down a LOT when there's a waiting period between removal and revision. I think the threshold is acout 2 months. I.e. risk is still higher before then, but only negligibly lower after.

Reason Two: I am really note sure what to expect by way of restriction. Can anyone describe what Sleeve Restriction feels like after they are fully healed? Is it pain? Is it nausea? If you are banded can you describe the difference? It actually doesn't feel that different from what my band restriction felt like. Neither is what I would call a "normal" full feeling. I maybe feel the sleeve fullness lower, physiologically (because we're filling up in our stomachs, not above our stoma). I would say they both feel/felt like a barely uncomfortable pressure.

I expected my restriction to become much more consistent. It really hasn't, though it has changed. With my band, I mostly ate comfortably between about 2pm and 5pm. Anything outside of that window was TBD. With the sleeve I don't have to question whether or not I'll be able to eat, I know I can. But I really don't tolerate eating at night (I've pretty much given up dinner), quantities are totally random, etc. Some mornings I will have an egg + turkey bacon + strawberries and not really feel that full. The next morning maybe 3/4 of an egg and I'm done.

Well, I'm tall (5'10 give or take) and I think that just means my droopy skin has farther to distort.

Oh gosh, I can think of about 8 things off the top of my head called "PST test" and none of them are the same thing - though more than one ofthem could apply to this surgery. Can you give more info?

I'm not going to read through every response so forgive any of these that are duplicates.

The things I didn't know about before are fairly personal - not as in "won't share" but as in "specific to my situation". I was a revision, and so the only things that have surprised me are relative to my previous WLS, or the things you have to be living it to know whether or not they even apply to you. But I'm a researcher, and started looking into VSG about 5 years ago. Not a lot will escape those two conditions.

However, I see a lot of new people "shocked" to learn lots of things, so here are some that I see come up a lot:

• You will probably lose a good amount of your hair (I'd estimate 20% - 40%) starting about 2 or 3 months after surgery.
  
• It's possible to dump with the sleeve. Most people seem surprised to learn this. In fact, there's already been a thread on it today.
  
• It's possible to develop intolerances to foods with the sleeve. Not "sleeve doesn't like it" but actual intolerances.
  
• Reflux is a fairly common side effect.
  
  • Reflux over time can lead to additional issues such as Barret's.
    
  • Reflux can be helped (I won't say controlled) by medications - PPIs and the like.
    
  • PPIs are currently under a lot of scrutiny for their long-term effects, i.e. bone density.
    

  [*]Your tastes can change with this surgery. So can the foods that work for you. These aren't necessarily slow changes. You'll probably be eating low-carb, at least for a while, and that can bring its own complications:

  • "Ketosis" breath
    
  • Low potassium may result in muscular cramps particularly in the legs/feet
    
  • Pooping might totally change. In too many ways than I can list here, but let's just say there aren't really any good ways.
    
  • Etc.
    

  [*]You may have to take Fiber supplements and/or laxatives for quite some time, maybe permanently. But maybe you'll never need one. Just gotta wait and see.

  [*]Since this is not a malabsorptive procedure, it's still possible to gain weight. You're still accountable for the things you eat. I'm surprised to see others surprised by this.

  [*]When food doesn't "sit well" it can be surprisingly painful, and can hurt in places that initially won't make sense (referred pains).

  [*]You may or ay not have problems with nausea. I've had no nausea, and no vomiting -- but I've had my share of discomfort.

  [*]Your body will probably start to make new noises. Gurgles, burps that aren't burps (I call them nurps), etc. They may or may not go away.

  [*]Your hunger may significantly diminish, or go away completely. But it might also remain consistent. Our fundus is the primary place where Ghrelin is produced, but it's not the only place. Think this is only a good thing?

  • Lots of studies right now are pretty consistently linking Ghrelin to things like memory and cognitive function, is in - not enough Ghrelin, so in 50 years you may be skinny & have no idea why.
    

  [*]Lots of aspects of general weightloss tend to be forgotten or overlooked: things like your feet get smaller, your fingers, etc.

  • Medication dosages may also need to be recalibrated
    
  • You will need to actively adjust your caloric intake (you won't have much say in it for a while, tho) to adjust for your shrinking body - needs can change by 1000 calories, easily. Don't get in a "rut" and assume things will be forever this way, or that.
    

There's more, but that's all I can think of off the top of my Ghrelin-starved brain.

I couldn't decide where to put this one so I figured that most of it's gonna come after surgery so I put it in post op. Feel free to move it if necessary.

I was reading another thread and someone said these words and it made me think about what I have learned reading this board and was amazed at the responses I saw stating that they were not told such and such before hand. What are some things that you have learned after the fact?? The things you didn't find out until you were elbow deep into this journey...

Let's hear them, the good, the bad, and the ugly. I know that I am not the only one to wander this and I know that others looking are curious as well. The only way to learn is to talk to others that have been through the experience. Thanks, Dave.

If you want to get into the stats and risks, I have a very, very long post around here somewhere that details the reporting practices for risk and mortality rates on WLS. The numbers were current as of the time I posted it. It should help make sense of the percentages and numbers we see. They really are not transparent at all. Nor are they all applicable. Even something narrowed down like, "...risk of dying from lap VSG" is going to count in numbers that simply will not apply to you.

It sounds to me like your family is having a knee-jerk reaction based on ignorance. The ignorance causes the fear. If there are other things like jealousy and/or animosity playing a role, that will complicate things a bit. It can be addressed, you just need to decide if it's worth the effort to you.

If my family does not support me, it means that ________________________.

So figure out what your blank is. Then you'll know whether you can accept their lack of support, or if you need to remedy it. It's your decision whether their support is important enough to be worth the effort of educating. If it were me, it would not be, but the emotional aspect of it is not that important to me (I don't need people to "support" my actions or decisions, I'm a big girl -- though I would not accept my family retaliating against my husband for supporting me.)

I guess I need to start out by saying HELLO!! I am a newbie...

Okay so here is my issue..

I have no family support (from my mom, sister, best friend). I am 30, 5'3, 302lbs and I don't have any major health issues yet but i can feel my body starting to get sick. I started the WLS journey in July with my 1st doctor visit and was elated to tell my family the news. Well lets just say i made a really big mistake. They started telling me about all these horrible things about WLS and what has happened to people. I have struggled with my weight all my life, going up and down and up and down, until i just kept going up. I have 3 beautiful children and I am married. My husband supports me(by the way my family is upset with him because he does).My surgery date is set for Sept 17 and the only person who will be at the hospital is my husband because i decided that i was not going to tell my family anything else about the surgery .I can't take anymore negative comments. When i told them of my plans in July they said, and i quote "you are going to die" I mean who says that to someone they love. I guess their comment was out of fear and lack of knowledge. What they said to me has been on my heart since my surgery date is so close. I don't know if i should go through with the surgery now, I am just so confused and scared. Has anyone else dealt with this issue. If so what did you do?

As you've already learned by now, it's to be expected - and it probably won't be the only stall you have.

My "3 week stall" kicked in at 3 weeks on the dot, and lasted the better part of 3 months. I think I was stalled 12 going on 13 weeks before anything budged.

.

I'm 3 weeks out, lost 25 lbs (including pre-op diet) and I'm stalled for over a week now. Has anyone else had a stall this early?

Surgeries have been cancelled for not following the pre-op diet. It's good that we can all share our unique experiences, but IMO we also need a little onus for the permissions we give others by doing so.

rapf - discuss your challenges with your nutritionists. They, not we, are the ones who should be OKing any exceptions to your pre-op diet. Pre-op diets vary widely, by surgeon, and surgeon has circumstances under which they're most comfortable operating. Trust me, we want to cater to them a little. Someone posted not that long ago having a really hard time with the pre-op diet and was OKed to add in some chicken or tuna without any problems. But do it on their advice.

BTW, the pre-op diet is a bit more systemic than most people think. It's often attributed to wanting to shrink the liver, which is true, but you'll gain more than that. And your nutritionists should know the systemic advantages and be able to coach you or tweak your diet so that the benefits are still possible:

Shrinking the liver is just one of the things a liquid diet will accomplish. There are things you will gain from a liquid diet that a diet with solids, regardless of carb count, will not achieve. Such as:

• No solids or residues in the digestive tract. Any time a surgeon is going to be cutting into any part of your GI system, you really, really don't want any solid matter in there.
  
• It can have a benefit when dealing with post-op nausea - it's easier and generally more pleasant to expel liquids.< br />
• It helps you get properly hydrated before a major surgical procedure.
  
• Better hydrated you are, the easier/quicker your recovery will be.
  
• Reduces liver size AND clears the colon.
  
• Body does not have to work hard to digest whatever is in the system.
  

HTH

BTW, this will be my 2nd WLS. Both times, I've been given a 2 day diet of clear, sugar free liquids.

Genetics, lifestyle, the state of your skin, how much it was stretched, how long it was stretched out for, etc.

I personally attribute the most value to 1) how far stretched and 2) how long stretched for. Genetics are important, but there are some things even genetics can't overcome.

30 lbs overweight for a year when you're 18, not nearly as big of a deal as 150 lbs overweight for 10 years when you're 40.

Yes, you can dump with the sleeve. People who have never had WLS can dump, so certainly we can. The difference is that it's a "risk" with us, but more or less a guarantee with RNY.

Here's a lot of info on dumping (causes, breakdown, etc.) that I posted on a similar thread a while ago:

http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/topic/32060-we-dont-technically-experience-dumping-buuuut/#entry279816

I am reading this document that my doctor requires me to read and sign before surgery and it lists the risks that are involved with the surgery and side effects afterwards. It mentioned something about dumping syndrome...I didnt think people had that with this surgery? I thought it was only with the RNY? Can someone elaborate on that for me please? Does it really happen to sleeve patients?

I have a mild allergy to latex, I'm mildly allergic to most adhesives (something in them but I don't know what, and only adhesives used on certain brands will bother me), and I tend to get "irritant contact dermatitis"/ICD. I'll get a much more severe version of what alliecat posted, but also the entire area that was covered will welt and I'll usually get extremely itchy, tiny blisters. ie. not just the outline of the bandaid, but everywhere the adhesive touched me.

When I had my first surgery in 2006 we thought it was limited to a few brands of commercial bandages and they covered my abdomen with pieces of that "clear contact paper stuff" - Tegaderm or comparable. When they pulled it off, it took skin off too. I actually have a few scars from my reaction/injury to that bandaging that are way more visible than from the actual surgery.

You might want to search for "straw" or "straw use" or something like that. This has come up very frequently. The best thing I can say is follow surgeon's orders.

That being said, there's really no rationale for not using a straw. Many, many (possibly most) people find they drink better/easier/more with a straw.

I know the reasons they give for not using them, but they just don't seem to hold up once you really look at the mechanics of what they say is happening. I think there's a straw "bandwagon" among VSG offices. Lots of bandwagons... definitely a straw bandwagon.

I went and bought a kayak that came it said with a size large adult life vest. I put it on and said, "Hm, guess i wear a large." I took it off and the thing said "Adult Small/Medium"

Does that officially make you a skinny b***h? I think I could be underweight and still not wear a small. You guys suck.

I was thrilled to put on my 22 pants the other day, then realized they're actually 24. Bah.

I can gain about 13 lbs with TOM. The process of moving glycogen in & out of your liver can take hmmm... I'd widely say 6 - 12 lbs.

My cankles probably come in at 2 lbs each (if I sit at a desk or in a "legs down" position with heels on, I get cankles - but I used to get them all summer long so I'm not complaining).

I hadn't weighed in like 1.5 weeks, but I weighed this morning after a Dr appt (I wanted to see how far off our scales were). I'm up about a half a pound from when I last weighed, but I was noticing yesterday that my body felt like it had another "woosh" -- seemed smaller, pants seemed a little baggier, etc. Me & my stomach both know I haven't eaten enough to gain a half a pound of fat. And I like to say, "If it's not fat, who cares?"

I guess I'd care of it was a big tumor or something. But not Fluid.

I don't really like popcorn but I just had some last weekend for the first time. Even not liking popcorn, I couldn't turn down hot & fresh kettle corn. It's not really popcorn. It's pretty much its own food group.

I have no idea what I ate in terms of volume, but let's just say popcorn is definitely not a slider for me. I definitely felt it in the sleeve.

The term "slider" actually confuses me too. I used to think it was something you could eat "more than you should" of, like a food that "slid" through the sleeve quickly (hence the term slider), and you could eat twice as many ounces as normal (for example). Like let's say you can eat 3 oz of hamburger patty, but 7 oz of sloppy joe (same meat, just in a slider form). But if things like popcorn that really just compress are sliders, I've been wrong all along. In that case things like ice cream, cotton candy, snow cones, anything "whipped" or aired, etc. -- namely things that just LOOK like more food volume than they actually are, are sliders...

^ that's not new, it started when I had my band & just never went away

I'm very judgmental of what others eat now. Sitting at a buffet disgusts me.

Some of my typical snacks:

Beef Jerky, 1 oz = 12gm Protein

1 oz gruyere cheese = 7gm Protein

16 pepperoni chips = 18gm protein

1 tbl PB = 5gm protein

Cheddar cheese stick = 6gm protein

1 oz almonds = 6gm protein

Poke/maguro 1oz = 7gm protein

I still have a hard time with daily calories (I still average under 600) and protein (I probably average 50, but really do try for 60 and consider anything over 60 a bonus, I guess). I try to get 6 - 10 gm of protein per snack, and about 10 per meal. I generally try to eat 6 - 8 times per day: 2 meals + 3 - 6 Snacks (recently I've had to pretty much give up dinner, so I'm trying to add in an extra snack to compensate but I'm truly to the point of having to eat when I'm not hungry).

I'm 20 months out and figuring out that I'm not hitting the amount of protein on a snack that I would like to. I've been eating 3 small meals and 2 Snacks a day, trying to average a min of 10 g protein each time. I am just curious what the avg amount of protein everyone shoots for in a snack that isn't a protein bar or a protein shake.

Below in blue.

Does Water make anyone else feel kind of sick? Yes - this is very common. Water didn't make me sick but it did hurt me. But "water nausea" is pretty common. Does it get better? Generally yes, though I've seen people months & months out saying that they still cannot tolerate plain water (though usually tea, crystal light, etc is OK) I know I'm only a week out, but I do worry about being dehydrated. You probably are dehydrated. It will get easier/better. Also, since I was able to start full liquids this week, I've been dabbling the instant carnation drinks. Every time I try to drink some, my stomach kinda gets this weird... click-y, gas bubble feeling. I don't know how to better describe it other than that =/ Sounds normal. My sleeve "gurgles" when food hits it. The contractions the stomach makes to push foods down also hurt - that stopped a few weeks out. hopefully people get what I'm talking about. I'm not sure if this is just my new tummy getting used to the milk, or maybe if I should be looking into soy milk or something? My guess - it's just your stomach's reaction to content (not milk specifically). If you are worried about a milk intolerance - don't, yet. If it's an intolerance, you'll have more symptoms than a gurgly stomach. I dont get extreme stomach aches, and I haven't thrown up or anything yet. I'm just wondering if anyone else has taken this opportunity to try a milk alternative. You can always try one but I'm not seeing anything in your words that make me think intolerance. (Not everyone developes intolerance).

Also-- does anyone else have neck pain? After I came home from the hospital I chalked it up to just sleeping weirdly to get comfortable at night. But now that my incisions don't hurt anymore I've been able to sleep however I want, but I still manage to end up with one during the middle of the day. Do a search for surgical gas pain. My guess is that's what you're feeling. I've posted some info on it a few times. If you search for my username and "phrenic" you should find quite a few posts. See if the info in them sounds like what you're feeling. I've had gas pains every lap surgery I've had (4 total) and it never really hits me right away. It's delayed, and sometimes is still there 3 - 4 weeks later. Our nerves tend to get over things on their own timelines. Just now I went for a walk and instead of my legs or my lower back hurting (woohoo!) it was my neck/shoulders. I know my nurse said that this was a possibility, but this wasn't really an issue in the hospital. Does anyone else have this problem post op and what do you do about it? (no hubby for back massages! maybe I should find one??)

Might be what I call "throat gurgles". Sounds like a burp, but is more just like a noise that my esophagus is doing. It can be pretty loud sometimes. I'm in a lot of meetings most days and I often have to explain - "It's just a noise I make." DH claims it wakes him up some nights.

I had it with my lapband too. I called it "gurgling" back then, but now I make a new noise that better fits "gurgling" so the moniker shifted.

I'm now 25 months out from surgery, but ever since I had it I've had something similar to burps that come out of my stomach, but they're not burps - it's more like air escaping from my stomach through my mouth. It happens 3-4 times a day, and I can generally control it. My boyfriend describes it as "it sounds like you're giving birth to aliens through your mouth."

It doesn't bother me at all (it's kind of funny), just wondering if I'm alone in this.

GB removal is a total breeze compared to VSG. You'll be very happy it's out. Acclimate slowly to trigger foods - some people have "phantom" attacks for a while (I didn't but I've seen them happen).

If you wake up with nausea, try a small glass of juice in the morning. It could be a sugar thing. Does it change at all when you eat/drink? What PPIs are you on?

Cysts, endometriosis, fibroids, adhesions, hernia, strain....

If you have good insurance, you might want to see a Dr. who specializes in sports medicine, since the pain seems related to prolonged physical activity. It could be something as simple as a sports hernia.

Did you ever have a moment of intense pain, and maybe now it's just a recurring pain? Did it set in gradually? Etc.

(Sorry for all the questions, I have a slight medical background and am generally compelled to try and solve problems -- but please in no way take any of this as medical advice... I'm not a Dr...I don't even play one on TV...)

This is just one of many reasons I'm glad that I'm the only female on my team at work.

I guess what I would do depends on what kinds of things they're saying - e.g. are they speculating you had surgery, or that you're sick, or is it just catty stuff since your body is changing, or what?

I'd probably also consider the relationship I had with the people. Are you close? Are you frenemies? Good terms? Etc.

And also the work environment. Most of my work history is on large scale enterprise - corporate headquarters of Fortune 500 and up companies. How things work there, and how things work at Joe-Bob's Burgers & Tackle is a little different. What type of environment are you in? Do you have an HR department, or an HR person who is also your boss?

This is my first post on this forum and unfortunately, it's not going to be very positive. I only told my closest friends about having weight loss surgery so the majority of my coworkers are unaware of what I have done. I've lost a lot of weight in the last three months and every day someone has said something about it to my face and/or behind my back. Some of its nice, a lot of it is petty. Does anyone have any tips for dealing with this type of situation?

Oh that's ridiculous. At first I thought you meant the two offices had communicated with each other about you - which could be illegal. SO I just wanted to make sure I understood before sharing my 2 cents.

I have no idea if this is still going on, but years and years ago my surgeon's office had employees who would read the WLS boards and look for negative comments about the surgeon/practice. Then in support groups they'd "plant" people to ask about message boards, and try to figure out which person was what username. Ridiculous, huh? But fine, whatever you need to do. But then they'd confront people about their online activity during during their office visits, and semi harass them during support groups. Totally unaccepable.

I got a little chummy with two of the ladies and we had a very facetious long-term thread on one of the sites. One of the ladies (happily married with kids) thought the surgeon was handsome. She jokingly referred to him as "Dr. Hottie" on the message boards. That got back to the practice, and the next time she showed up for an office visit she was pulled aside and chastised for not respecting the surgeon's marriage, or family, or her own. We were all like...wha?? Then it became this big drama. I was waiting in the consultation room once and heard the nurse who used to manage patient care outside the door saying, "This is one of the ones who..." and couldn't catch the end. So when she came in, I asked her, "One of the ones who what?" And she wouldn't answer me. For some of the people, it got to where they chose to transfer their aftercare to another surgeon, because they just didn't want to deal with it.

Thankfully those particular staff aren't there anymore, and things seem normal. But the real unfortunate part is that I think he's one of the strongest bariatric surgeons - definitely in my area - but it's hard for things like that not to reflect poorly on the entire practice (including surgeon).