SoulGlo

I trust mine but I have had several horrible nutritionist in the past. Prior to looking into WLS I saw 3 separate nutritionist. One insane lady kept asking me to eat chicken breast even after I had explained I was vegetarian. The worst one was one I was sent to by my endocrinologist. Once she started telling people it was okay to drink diet soda, I knew I was done with her. I then saw a holistic nutritionist who I really liked. Unfortunately her practice was nearly 2 hours away and she was too pricey for my budget.

Finding a program that was willing to actually have a conversation with me about food options and work with my allergies & vegetarianism was a deal breaker. I don't like to eat a lot of processed and artificial foods no matter what the calorie count. I needed someone who understood and could accept that. If I felt that wasn't going to happen I would have kept researching programs. I do think you we need to take some responsibility and do a little research on our own, but I expected to have a reasonable conversation with my nutritionist. I like and trust the person I have now, but I understand why many don't.

Speaking for my self, I am limited in what knowledge I can share in an online forum. When someone post that they aren't losing but they are following a good eating plan, however they also have medical issues, I think the wise thing to do is direct them to their medical team or nutritionist. It's not a cop out, it's just understanding the limitations of how much support you can provide in an online forum like this.

I'm sorry if i sounded like i was having a go at forum members who refer other posters to seek advice from their doctor/nuts. I just wanted to see how many people are having issues with their nut like me.

Also, the thing about researching online about weight loss is a huge part of it is people's opinions and experiences which can be very relative in regards to other people. I feel comforted by definitive answers and I'm frustrated that my Dietician is reluctant to give me any.

I've done this all without using any kind of NUT post surgery. I find the bariatric forums much more informative.

I totally agree, i shudder to think where i would be if i wasn't using forums to gain information . I'd Probably be eating 90% bread and Pasta.

I kept getting shuffled around to different NUTs through the entire process. Some were leaving, new one's coming in. So I don't feel I got any solid information or formed a good connection with anyone where nutrition was concerned. The NP is always better for me to talk to, than anyone. I have a new NUT now, who is fresh and new, and tells me, "we don't count carbs" and we want you off all Protein shakes. Well, not counting carbs....that's kind of how I got here to begin with. I count carbs, calories and Protein and see how I am doing at the end of the day.

My NUT was ridiculous. She had no knowledge of WLS and she tried hawking her MLM Vitamin catalog on me.

I saw her the required amount of times, assembled nutritious portions of plastic veggies and meats on a plastic tray under her direction for 15 minutes and was approved for competency.

My surgeon and his NP were my sources for diet and follow up meal plans. I loved my NP. She was helpful, knowledgable and in tune with my process.

I was just wondering how many forum members really had faith in their NUT/Dietician and that their prescribed advice would not only help them progress through their journey but also make sure that their plan would assist them in achieving the best outcome possible?

During my time on Bariatric pal, I noticed that whenever a question is posed, someone will often respond with 'check with your nut/dietician' but what if that person's nut is incompetent and not forthcoming with needed information?

I personally don't trust or have much faith in my Dietician team or their prescribed plan. First all, the diet plan that they give to patients is too relaxed and imo is not that conducive to those really want to reach their ideal goal weight and maintain it. The plan is too carb friendly, they give diet examples using rice, Pasta or bread and no real emphasis on keeping carbs low in order to better facilitate weight loss. I thank my lucky stars that I decided to really do research and go on bariatric forums or else I would have been still chowing down on breads and pasta like nobody's business.

Also they're a reluctant on giving you an answer to a lot of questions, Tbh I have given up on asking them anything because I’m always left unenlightened. On a number of occasions, I have asked about ideal carb and fats allowance per day and they always hit you with ' Just focus on Proteins and water' which isn't entirely wrong but I feel that they fail to realise that there's many loopholes in just hawking that advice and ignoring other finer details . For example, I could eat a McLand, sea and air burger from McDonald’s with loads of Water and be covering the objective of getting my Protein and fluids. Technically I would be following their advice to a tee but in actual fact I would have just congested 116g of carbohydrates. If I could change my dietician team I would but things are not that easy with the NHS (UK).

What about you guys? Do you trust your NUT/Dietician?

wow reading some of these post actually make me not want to post here. If you find a question to be stupid simply don't answer it. Some people actually don't know or they have a very crappy NUT that isn't really helping them be realistic. Others haven't come to the conclusion that weight loss surgery isn't magic yet. oh and BTW 20 year olds arent all immature. If you consider yourself a "veteran" try actually helping instead of belittling people. try to remember how people were towards you when you were first starting

Exactly. I don't think a lot of times these forum veterans and other judgmental posters realise that their hostile approaches to questions deemed as 'stupid' may be putting off others members from seeking needed advice for very valid and pertinent questions.

I find it slightly odd that some forum members are yet to figure out that not all things are created equally especially in terms of the realm of surgery/ medicine and medical programmes. Some folks are berating others for knowing about guidelines about alcohol post surgery but just to illustrate my point about all clinics not being made equal or to the same standards, my bariatric programme/clinicians haven't stated much about alcohol post op apart from a nurse saying that i should bear in mind that if I drink, I would now be intoxicated faster and from smaller amounts'. Nothing about damage to the pouch, empty calories or cross addiction.

I think its more of the posts that say stuff like, "I know I'm not supposed to drink, but I'm doing it anyway at 2 weeks post op.. " and there are quite a few like that..

But I agree..

I agree with you too, those kinds of threads are understandably annoying and I don't think the OPs realise they are kicking a hornets' nest when posting them. But there has to be something said for people who continued to engage them despite being extremely irritated by these questions.

In my subjective view, I feel some posters secretly relish having an opportunity to go at the Ops of these kinds of questions but that's just my opinion

Given the state of WLS today -- if you can afford it, you can find a surgeon to perform the surgery -- those who do more research online prior to surgery (by lurking on WLS message boards, reading medical research study reports, studying various surgeons' Web sites, reading the www.asmbs.com site, etc.) are going to be better prepared for what's required to be successful with WLS than those who aren't research hounds.

As a research hound myself, I'm always a bit surprised that some people go into WLS apparently knowing so little about it -- based on the questions they ask and the comments they make post-op.

I also think that many WLS surgical practices fail abysmally in preparing their patients for WLS and what they must do to avoid future problems and be successful.

Finally, and this is seldom said out loud, I think some people are ill-equipped intellectually and/or emotionally for this journey and are badly served for not having been screened better pre-op. Some folks who don't or can't make the necessary behavior changes post-op (due to lack of education, lack of initiative, or their inability to understand and undertake those changes) may wind up even worse off physically and psychologically post-op than they were pre-op.

Recovery from obesity is a tough slog, and WLS as a treatment for obesity (generally speaking) has a long way to progress.

I think that has something to do with the way a lot of people see doctors and surgeons. They are put on the highest pedestals and held up as if they were deities .

Not many people question their authority and believe that they'll always provide a total comprehensive and definitive medical advice/instructions on their health problems, failing to realise that incompetence and complacency exists in the medical profession too. Personally, I don't trust doctors so I'll always do my own research in addition to listening to Dr's medical advice. Unfortunately, sometimes you have to burn to learn and most folks will never be burnt by doctors/surgeons to know that better informed you are about your medical situation, the better your health outcomes. will probably be.

BIB: You're right but doesn't that provide an even stronger reasoning for why people need to be less hostile in approaching these situations? If someone is lacking in education, initiative or inability to really understand the changes that need to be made in order to succeed, i don't think a Maury Povich styled tough love boot camp approach (especially from a random stranger) or a roasting will help them to achieve that understanding, it might just push them further away from the right path If advice is presented in a sour or chatty tone or style then the person might not take it seriously and think the individual offering the advice is being nasty for the sake of being nasty.

wow reading some of these post actually make me not want to post here. If you find a question to be stupid simply don't answer it. Some people actually don't know or they have a very crappy NUT that isn't really helping them be realistic. Others haven't come to the conclusion that weight loss surgery isn't magic yet. oh and BTW 20 year olds arent all immature. If you consider yourself a "veteran" try actually helping instead of belittling people. try to remember how people were towards you when you were first starting

Exactly. I don't think a lot of times these forum veterans and other judgmental posters realise that their hostile approaches to questions deemed as 'stupid' may be putting off others members from seeking needed advice for very valid and pertinent questions.

I find it slightly odd that some forum members are yet to figure out that not all things are created equally especially in terms of the realm of surgery/ medicine and medical programmes. Some folks are berating others for knowing about guidelines about alcohol post surgery but just to illustrate my point about all clinics not being made equal or to the same standards, my bariatric programme/clinicians haven't stated much about alcohol post op apart from a nurse saying that i should bear in mind that if I drink, I would now be intoxicated faster and from smaller amounts'. Nothing about damage to the pouch, empty calories or cross addiction.

This is not a nice subject to respond to but I am going to.

For all of you that are judging this 20 year old girl in a negative way,

Do you remember being 20 years old?

Were you regular sized or obese?

Did you like to party?

I was an obese 20 year old that liked to drink and go to bars. Always wishing I was as "thin" as my friends. Of course there was not WLS available back then so I do not know what I would have done.

But for goodness sake she was being honest and truthful in her questions. Have a heart. Be kind, I can only imagine what she is thinking as she reads all these replys.

On another note, those that post about not losing weight and "doing all the right things" you have one of two things going on, you are lying or it is just part of the process. There are many posts you can search and read BEFORE posting.

You're spot on. Even 'veterans' start out ignorant and clueless and hopefully someone answered their queries and questions in a respectful manner so they were able to build up their knowledge bases in order to progress into knowledgeable veterans instead of chiding or humiliating them.

Not all bariatric programs are made the same. Some bariatric programs make ensure their patients are fully informed whilst others are more lax when it comes to informing their patients. Therefore,some people have more gaps in their knowledge than others.

I don't understand why if someone is so annoyed by 'these stupid questions' then don't just skip the thread and erase the question from their minds and move on? What's the point in posting a reply just to whinge or belittle the asker? Unless they're a masochist or a touch sadistic

I agree with everyone. Why focus on keeping calories so low. Getting your Protein and Water is where your focus should be. The calories will fall in place. You are probably sabotaging your optimal weight loss trying to keep calories so low.

I wish you were my Dietician/NUT, you're always dropping knowledge in every post. What about Carbs and fats? How much is allowed?

I'm 3mths post and I'm about averaging between 300's and 500's in Calories and about 71g to 28g in Protein. Tbh, i seemed to more concerned about the amount of calories than protein amount.I'll freak out if i go over 500 calories. Now that you have confirmed that this is hurting my weight loss, I'm definitely will get that protein number up.

On average i have about 5 to 8 g of carbs a day, I keep it to a bare minimum and sugars to as close to zero as possible. If i do get carbs they are veggie carbs or a little brown rice ( like 2 tablespoons at most) with my Protein but that is about it. if i push over 25 to 35 it slows down my weight loss a lot.

What kind of sorcery is going on here?

If you don't mind asking does your diet primarily consist of meats and eggs?

I don't see the issue. As long as their behaviour or work ethic doesn't affect or increase my workload why should i care? These businesses and corporations have no loyalty to their employees and will fire or cut an employee that has been slaving away for the company just as easily as they would get rid off of an employee that's been slacking off.

That's the problem. It ALWAYS increases the work load of those of us who actually CARE. And those type of employees are sneaky. They know the ways around not doing their work and doing just enough to not get fired. They also know whose asses to kiss. I've been in the workforce for over 30 years. I've seen it hundreds of times.

Well, if you read my post properly you would see that I said it's not my concern as long it doesn't affect or increase my workload. Just because you put in capital locks doesn't make it a fact. It hugely depends on the role and job duties and responsibilities of the persons at hand, some tasks are specific and can't be simply passed on to someone else.

If their actions do increase other's workloads then that's another issue. IMO, some are too overly concerned about what other workers doing even if it doesn't have any effect on them. I rather work alongside someone who's slacks off and has punctuality issues than someone who is always watching and waiting for the colleagues to mess up.

I don't see the issue. As long as their behaviour or work ethic doesn't affect or increase my workload why should i care? These businesses and corporations have no loyalty to their employees and will fire or cut an employee that has been slaving away for the company just as easily as they would get rid off of an employee that's been slacking off.

When I get down on myself and verbalize it with my husband he always says the same thing to me. You aren't gaining wt are you? The wt. will come off. I look at shorter goals instead of goals a long way away. I second that if you are not seeing a therapist than you really need to. when I feel the way you do right now I feel the need tohurt myself and struggle not to. that includes feeding those thoughts away. So I ask you are you gaining wt. because remaining the same is a plus for us. I used to gain 10lbs a month before surgery. Keep to your plan one time you are going to feel joy about how your clothes feel, how you are able to bend over without being out of breath. wanting to take the stairs instead elevator. not sweat when you move. all these things will go away in time. I wish you lots of Luck please take care and do what you must to be successful.

No. Strangely i'm doing really well (imo). I'm sticking to the plan and even exercising daily but even that won't entirely shake off my negative thoughts

Oh, and here is the other thing. I had NO expectations of what I would look like when i got to goal. I was very very focused on health, physical ability and life enjoyment. I strongly encourage you to put your focus the same way becasue life is too damn short to worry about every lilttle nitpicky flaw.

I did have skin removeal/reconstructive plastics and am THRILLED with my results. I have observed that people who make peace with their bodies are always much happier (without plastics or post plastics even) because the mind is actually harder to change than the body quite frankly...

Initially when i started the WLS process, i had no expectations, I just wanted to be a little bit smaller and healthier. As time go goes on, I feel myself wanting more than what is likely to be given or realistically will happen. I have never had a normal sized body, even when i was in primary school, i was bigger than everyone else. I just wanna to look normal for once.

I agree with you. I'm hoping i can develop the same approach and have a similar outlook.

When all is said and done....if I reach my weight loss goal, because honestly....I don't fool myself one bit, that's a long shot in my opinion. I'll be just a few lbs shy of a 200lb weight loss.

I am faced with this daunting task, even with this amazing tool. I've lost 100 lbs a few times in my life. Gained it all back, I know my track record. I was (not typical for me) pretty suicidal when I first got home from the hospital. I had so many complications and felt horrible, I thought...this is my new life? Those feelings have passed, thank goodness!

I have spent almost the last year in therapy, twice a month, working on my food addiction issues, the reasons I got fat, and believe me, this has been me since age 5. I had some traumatic events take place when I was very young, and the pounds just started packing on and on and on and I just never seemed to be able to stop it. I also had some other things that were working against me, PCOD and Hashimoto's. But for the most part, my eating has been predominantly emotional. The need to feel comforted was key. The fat, a suit of armour to protect me.

To let that go at this point is probably the scariest thing in the world to me. The least of my worries is failure, my biggest worry is success. That's about as honest as it gets.

You are not alone @@SoulGlo There is help to be had, therapy works. It's been a lifesaver to me throughout my life, but mostly now. I wish you strength, and resolve, and peace. This is a good place to come for support, and information, and help.

Hello,

Next month I will be 4 years post from VSG. I lost around 150 lbs, and am maintaining a net loss of about 125, so I know I do not meet your request of 200+ lbs loss, but I have experienced a lot of what you refer to.

Since you used the term, "suicide ideation", I can only assume you are also seeing a therapist/counselor. If not, I would highly recommend this and be totally open and honest about what you are feeling.

I know, for myself, it has been life changing to seek mental help. I realized that I used food to fill the gaping hole in my self esteem. But it wasn't just food as I also abused many other substances as I sought to find a way to make myself whole again ... to be that person I wanted to be, but could never attain. I, too, thought WLS would be the answer, but it was merely one piece to a much larger puzzle. My puzzle was a complex rendering of a person who has been shamed most of his life. My self esteem became so low, I began to accept this shame as truth. I would get the "F**K IT" attitude where self destruction was the result.

Do you know the song "Hurt", by Nine Inch Nails? I could relate to the opening lyrics too well:

I hurt myself today,

To see if I still feel.

I focus on the pain.

The only thing that's real.

But WLS and losing 150 lbs did not solve my problem. Sure, I did feel better about myself for awhile, but the underlying issues as to why I abused food still were present. That is what I had to work on. I have been seeing a therapist for awhile now and it has been an amazing experience as I discover and vocalize my feelings and attach words to them. When I am able to be open and honest with my therapist, I am able to be open and honest with myself. I treat my therapist (a woman) like they are one of the committee members inside my head. Whatever I am thinking or feeling, I say it out loud. Things I have never and would never say to another human.

Right now, we are working on shame, as I mentioned above. I have been reading a lot of material from Brene Brown. Here are some links to her TED talks:

http://on.ted.com/Brown2012

https://www.ted.com/talks/brene_brown_on_vulnerability

Go to your local library and grab one of her many books on disk, if you are not a reader.

If you are truly looking to heal, you have to start from the inside, otherwise, we just use our intended solutions to sabotage us further.

Good luck and I will keep you in my thoughts.

Good for you for addressing this now. Take yourself to therapy as soon as you can. I lost about 100 lbs. and had major surgery to replace both my hips about a year and a half ago and went to a therapist because I had no idea who the old lady in the mirror was. At that time, my skin was sagging badly, my hair was falling out at an alarming rate, my lower body was swollen beyond belief and I was despondant and lost.

I've been in therapy for more than a year and we are working on root causes of the obesity, body image, and all that entails along with self esteem, family dynamics, and all the other parts of what makes us who we are. You're starting to understand that weight loss is not a panacea for your issues. Better you start to work on it now than wait till you are in crisis. Good luck my dear and please keep posting and update us as you continue your journey.

I'm not currently seeing a therapist or having any counselling. I have been in counselling a couple of times before.

I would go to my GP and ask for a referral for counselling but for some strange reason most of the interventions they offer are CBT based where they focus on solving one major issue . I have had CBT before and don't feel it makes a difference. I would like a psychological based intervention where i could talk in depth about my feelings, past and concerns but therapies like that are normally private therapies and i simply don't have the money to afford it.

@@SoulGlo, there is so much wisdom and compassion in the posts above. I am grateful to be amongst this community of powerful people. That includes you! xo

Aww, thank you!!

@@SoulGlo, how are you doing today?

I'm relatively ok today, i'm much better than i was when i posted the original post but i would be lying if i didn't say i was still worried about my outcome or future. I know i have to take each day as they come and I'm hoping as time goes on I might be content even if i don't reach society's ideal or a normal weight.

Thank you all for your advice, encouragement and care, I'm really touched by it and it really did lighten my dark thoughts xoxoxoxo

Hello all my fellow sleevers! I'm 5 months into my nutritional visits so I have 1 more before I get to submit to insurace for approval. Iv been having second thoughts about the surgery and its giving me so much anxiety I can barely sleep at night. My life is great.. To a point. I have amazing friends and we love to go out and party quite often. There's only one thing.. I miss out on so much because I hate my body. Its kills my self esteem every time I'm out and I can't even get a guys head to turn because I'm constantly surrounded by my beautiful tiny friends. I want to lose the weight, I want to be happy but I just wonder, how am I going to be happy if I loose the weight and can't go out and have fun? And please don't judge me when I say this, but I'm 21 and "going out and having fun" always includes drinking. I mean I know I'm going to have to stay away from alcohol for a good 3 months after and my tolerance is going to be a lot lower but has anyone been able to maintain a party life with healthy vsg foods and proper exercise? And I know alcohol is extra calories but I really could use some insite from someone my age who understands the struggles I'm having. PLEASE comment!! Is there anyone out there who's like me?!

Your post really got me in my feelings. I'm 27 and i know that's only a 6-year difference but the things i would do to go back to 21 and have wls then. I spend nights crying and thinking about it. The amount of things i have lost in 6 years because of my weight, it has taken my old friends, career and life opportunities. It hurts me to think about it. From 16 -21, I was pretty sociable but as the weight started creeping on, I wasn't even bothered about partying or alcohol, I started to fear going out to the shops never mind a bar or club.

Regardless of whether my WLS outcome is successful or whether I am fortunate enough to get plastics, i'm always going have deal with mental and physical scars of being fat for so long, you have chance to nip it in the bud and spend the rest of your twenties being happy, healthy and still having experienced your fair share of alcohol and parties.

Tbh, my food costs post op haven't been as cheap as would have expected or liked. My shopping lasts much longer but some items are much more expensive and plus i have gotten very bougie with my food choices.

Omg, Yes!! I was too embarrassed to a make a thread or tell someone. I haven't got a man at the moment so I was planning to keep my Lady winter fur but a month after the surgery, everytime I would shower would be strands of hair going down the drain. I was shedding like a cat.

That has now stopped and now i'm having issues with the hair on my head.

I'm three weeks out and having a ton of issues with nausea. I've noticed my salvia is like really thick and white...so is my tongue. But I've got so much salvia, I have to spit it out. Is this because of dehydration? Nausea? Acid? Any thoughts appreciated.

I had the same exactly thing. My spit was like gel. It's dehydration. My issues with my spit and nausea went away after i started hydrating much more.

Great thread. I was also wondering if a lack of Protein stalls weight loss???

You Sir are a brave brave man. lol I did something similar with some Won Ton Soup I had about a week post op, except I chewed up all of the vegetables in it and spit them out.

Once a cheater always a cheater. Two days post, I couldn't take the broth anymore, so I went to Sonic and ordered a Jr. Cheeseburger with mustard, ketchup and onions. I chewed each bite about 20 times and spit it all back into the bag. Pretty nasty, but the taste, woooo weee. I felt like a fat kid in a candy shop. Awesome. But to actually eat, 5 days out, went to this great seafood place to Celebrate a major event in our family and had oysters on a half shell. Went down smooth of course and sat well. That was the same fat kid in the candy shop, but actually eating the candy.

To be fair though, while certainly unhealthy, my cousin, who also had the sleeve done, said she lived off of McDonald's cheeseburgers for the first several months after her surgery as soon as she was able to eat solids.

I get scared anytime I put anything in my mouth that I know I'm not supposed to. At this point, I'm more worried about rupturing my staple line than anything else. I imagine that 6 weeks out(when I should be able to tolerate most foods), I'll start being a lot braver, which could be a dangerous thing.

I think the key is to reign it back after you mess up. Knowing that there can be dire consequences to bad choices helps with that.

If you don't mind me asking, did this adversely affect her weight loss or did she lose a good amount regardless?

She started out at 300lbs. Got down to 170lbs and is now three years out and maintaining. I think it slowed down her weight loss, but it definitely didn't stop it.

Please note, I do not advise that ANYONE tries to live off of McDonalds cheeseburgers just because they can get away with it and the portion size reduces the amount of calorie intake. We all know this is not healthy.

Cool. I'm glad she was able to get to a decent weight and maintain it.

Ten days post op - prime rib and brussel sprouts! Yumm.

Didn't it hurt going down??

Once a cheater always a cheater. Two days post, I couldn't take the broth anymore, so I went to Sonic and ordered a Jr. Cheeseburger with mustard, ketchup and onions. I chewed each bite about 20 times and spit it all back into the bag. Pretty nasty, but the taste, woooo weee. I felt like a fat kid in a candy shop. Awesome. But to actually eat, 5 days out, went to this great seafood place to Celebrate a major event in our family and had oysters on a half shell. Went down smooth of course and sat well. That was the same fat kid in the candy shop, but actually eating the candy.

You Sir are a brave brave man. lol I did something similar with some Won Ton Soup I had about a week post op, except I chewed up all of the vegetables in it and spit them out.

To be fair though, while certainly unhealthy, my cousin, who also had the sleeve done, said she lived off of McDonald's cheeseburgers for the first several months after her surgery as soon as she was able to eat solids.

I get scared anytime I put anything in my mouth that I know I'm not supposed to. At this point, I'm more worried about rupturing my staple line than anything else. I imagine that 6 weeks out(when I should be able to tolerate most foods), I'll start being a lot braver, which could be a dangerous thing.

I think the key is to reign it back after you mess up. Knowing that there can be dire consequences to bad choices helps with that.

If you don't mind me asking, did this adversely affect her weight loss or did she lose a good amount regardless?

Not exactly cheating but i'm having a sordid love affair with Melba Toast atm. Even though allowed Melba toast but i'd rather not have it in my diet.

The geriatric fashion styles constantly inflicted on us.

And is it too much to ask for bigger bra sizes to come in colours other than white or black? Big chicks like colour too.