Travelmego

You know what Lipstick lady, I am certainly not excusing the situation - I think it is a dumb thing to date former patients - the same way I think co-workers dating is not that bright.  If this stuff happened while in the hospital under anesthesia ....definitely totally not cool and would be illegal - but that is not the case here.

And yes, several people have mentioned about getting the impression that he was somehow molesting people while under anesthesia (or the like). 

Edited:  I edited out the researching medical ethics of support staff dating former patients because I am too tired to do any research. I also edited a run on sentence or two. 

Hmm, I didn't see you naming any one in the 'fan club' in that post.  

For me it is about alleged victims AND your goals and methods.  But I am glad to see you acknowledge that not everyone who questions you and/or disagrees with your goals and methods is merely some fan girl out to trash the women you speak of. 

In regards to your last statement which you posted while I was typing this reply:  I asked you questions to ascertain your credibility - which you ignored.  I have yet to become fully convinced these women who have spoken on this thread are victims rather than willing FORMER participants who deliberately RETURNED to Mexico for their affairs. 

A warning of a playboy or cad - ok. I thank them for the warning. A label of victim of a predator - not so much- from what I have heard. I have talked to one lady (not on this board) who had a minor makeout session with him when she returned to visit him. I asked her very specifically if she felt preyed upon and she said not at all.  She was mad how it ended and doesn't like and is angry at Omar for that - but she said it was completely mutual and consensual.  

Do I think it is unprofessional for Omar to date former patients (and apparently they were former patients since these things happened when they deliberately returned to visit him)? Yes I do, but it is certainly not in the realm of molesting patients under anesthesia which was what the original post led many to believe you were saying even if you didn't state that explicitly.   

What really bothers me though is the stated goal to destroy Dr. Illan when you have not spoken to him. I think that is very unfair. 

Lipstick lady - I have never bullied these women on this thread nor anywhere else in any manner what so ever, nor would I. Please don't lump me in with those who may have. 

Except I have never met Omar and have spoken to him for maybe 4 mins total. I have still been asking questions. It is disingenuous to lump everyone who might ask questions and/or disagree with you or your methods or goals into some fan club. I consider it pretty bullying to try to 'take down' a surgeon who you have never spoken to.

Well, I am pretty much done with this place but I saw Mxtransformed's post and want to add a few things.

I have no problem with someone who wants to warn other women of a playboy. That's FINE with me.

However, Susan made this big post that seemed to many of us to be saying Omar is attacking women or molesting them with the implication he is doing this while under anesthesia or otherwise unable to consent.

It is a completely different thing when someone returns to Mexico, hooks up (yes, even with a playboy), and then it falls apart. So, I am sorry you got hurt, and I appreciate the warning and I am glad you clarified that he was not attacking anyone.

The especially egregious part - in my opinion - was the original poster stating that her goal is to take down Dr. Illan while never having talked to him but guessing that he knows about it and condones it to get business. THAT is the particularly unfair part. It is very vengeful and wrong to do.

Wow this is nuts.  Please show me where I have said you have discredited mulitple posts, or that alex,  or lipstick lady are fake names you created or that you were fired?  The only thing I said was you posted under a fake name that was created last night to support your arguments and I had the EVIDENCE in a form of a screen shot to show why I felt that way. Now show me where I have said what you now accuse me of saying. This is getting beyond ridiculous.   

You know what, I don't even care.  This thread is going nowhere. I can't even get my very reasonable questions answered without being shrilly accused of all kinds of nonsense. I certainly haven't been attacking any alleged victims. 

I'm done. Yet another reasonable person probably run off from the entire site (not sure yet but most likely)  by the clique of old friends here.  I mean what can you do when the owner of the site paid for the surgery for the person making the original post and has come on supporting her ad naseum?  It seems the rest of us have no protection unless we fall in line with the clique. We can't even ask questions for clarification.

And that means what Woowoo.  I am not going to be dismissed as merely some fan girl. 

Well, we will have to agree to disagree Alex. . I have seen people fake post to support themselves many times (on other forums). It is a fairly small point anyway but I do not think my post should have been taken down.

Susan, I think your approach in this topic has been horrible. You made a very aggressive and inflammatory post then immediately went on the attack on anyone who asked questions. You tried to dismiss people as merely fangirls as if people don't have a brain and can think for themselves. I resent being told I am of a herd mentality and therefore my legitimate questions are not worthy of consideration. That is an ad hominem attack. I think you owe me an apology.

Well susan - please show me where i have beaten down and attacked any woman who has come forward to tell their personal story?  You call me a fan girl? You make a LOT of assumptions.  Not unlike how you make assumptions about Dr. Illan's knowledge and or motives even though you haven't spoken to him.  

Again, nice try but the evidence in this thread belies your accusations against me. 

I don't think that is the end of story alex. Not by a long shot. I think there is more to the side - another side - that you nor susan have inquired about.

I was not 'building a case' to 'discredit' susan. If you read back in all of my posts, I have been very reasonable and asking legit questions and certainly not saying it is not true. However, when someone clearly posts under a fake name to support her arguments and then forgets to log out and posts something she meant to post under her real name.....well that IS a matter of credibility and ethical behavior too isn't it?

I also have an issue with someone trying to 'bring down' a widely regarded excellent surgeon based on her speculation of his knowledge and/or motives without having ever spoken to said surgeon.

I'm (not) sorry, but I am not taking your or susan's word on this matter 'just because you say so'. I need to see real evidence that this is more than a consensual romance gone sour.

I think I am a more interested party in this matter than most since I am getting surgery there in 3.5 weeks. I, of all people, have the right to question the claims and ask for more information and evidence.

So, my posts busting susan for posting as bill were taken down - including the screen shot?

What ETHICAL moderating.  What bull! 

I am thoroughly not impressed that Whitney's posts got deleted and she got banned for no logical reason.

I am thinking Bariatric pal i not the place for me if it is going to treat people like that.

If I were Dr. Illan, I would get a lawyer.

Ok, then let them show proof that Omar did something illegal.  Show us it was something other than 2 consenting adults and an affair that ended badly.  Right now all we have is Susan saying 'because I said so because I heard something' and her fiance/herself posting to support her point.  Feel free to share the evidence.   I think that is reasonable to ask for.  

As with any other business, I like to hear about other people's experience with any company before I choose one. I respect every opinion and take them all to heart. When I hear multiple complaints saying the same thing, then I see proof of the allegations, I have to change my opinion. Defend if you wish, but don't ignore the obvious.

Bill, you see 1 complaint and no proof.

Whitney - you made an interesting point. I know that it is said a lot of women fall in love with their doctors - whom they see as saviors. I am not saying this is what happened here though.

Well, I haven't attacked her but I just wanted to point that out.  

Well to be fair Lipsticklady - Susan is attacking Omar and Dr. Illan, no?

I am going to ask around and see what's what.  The stories could be true, they could be not true, or they could be a mixture of both or they could be one sided. I would like to try to get a fuller picture of what is going on.

Par - I don't think this post means Susan has deep anger issues with men....that is sexist.  However, I do agree on the issue of practicing safe sex though. 

I will report back what I find out (no names or private details of course).  PM me here if anyone can offer clarity.  I have surgery scheduled in a few weeks. 

You know Susan, when you make a post saying you want to bring down a surgeon because of his coordinator while asserting your right to do so because the surgeon (supposedly) knowingly condones what is (allegedly) going on - but that you never actually spoke to the surgeon - you can expect people to react and ask questions. This seems like a pretty vicious goal when you are going by hearsay and attributing things to Dr. Illan that seem to come out of your own guesses and certainly not his mouth..

Now you are attacking everyone for asking for clarification or giving their own experiences. I am not an Omar apologist. I have no problems asking tough questions and I can tell you that Omar has certainly NOT asked me to come over here and sing his praises as you say here:

"As I stated in my original post, I fully expected Omar's fan club to stand up for him and respond in full force to this thread. I wouldn't expect anything less from Omar to have his followers respond to this, and I am sure he has contacted Alex demanding removal of this thread. However, I posted this with his approval."

I want to add that people asking questions and asking for clarification is not necessarily dismissing your allegations but why should I, or anyone, just take them at face value 'because you said said so'. The stories could be true or untrue (or a mixture of both). Certainly you can agree that people have the right to ask questions and agree or disagree with your analysis

Actually, to be fair, it was you Susan, who brough up Whitney being a new person first.  She just responded to your comment about her being new. 

If you will notice I said IF - which means I wasn't assuming anything. If I am going to assume something, I put assuming as I did in my first post.  Thanks.   You really didn't put many details in the original post so how are we supposed to know anything hence the IF. 

If these were consensual relationships then it is certainly unprofessional by American standards but not necessarily criminal nor predatory.

Assuming your allegations are true of which I have no evidence, how do you know Dr. Illan knows anything about it or what his motivations are if you have never spoken with him?

You made another post of Dr. Aceves where you advised people to not go to Mexico at all. You, yourself, have stated that you used to work as a coordinator. Do you have any business dealings in the bariatric world now? Do you work for any company that makes money off of this population - be it an online support group, sales, or the like? Why did you stop being a coordinator? Was it only because of your as stated botched surgery or were there other reasons - perhaps personality conflicts or the like? Is there any possible professional conflict of interest going on?

I am only asking these questions - not to accuse you of anything - but to ascertain your own credentials/motives since you have stated it is your goal to bring someone down and a decent surgeon with him based upon allegations when you have not actually spoken to the doctor in question.

*Throws rocks at Linda* Boo! Hiss! It should have been me!

J/K Congratulations to both Linda and Bariatricpal!!

You guys should make new posts so people can see them and address your individual issues.

Hi,

Sorry to hear you are so frustrated. Just so you know, there is an entire forum that is new and dedicated to stall discussion. You might find good information and support to help you. Here is where it is located: http://www.bariatricpal.com/forum/1102-dont-sweat-the-stall-stuff-new/

Ha, clean your house! Can I borrow your friends?