clk

Thank you all for the kind words. Despite the fact that I encourage other people to be here when they're struggling (it's when we need support the most) I still tend to hunker down and hide when I'm challenged by life. I appreciate each and every post here. I had a rough childhood, which I've lightly touched on in the past, but my dad made life so much more bearable. He was never a great dad but he loved us all very much. I'm no stranger to loss and grief but each time it's hard to accept the permanence. I can easily understand why so many find comfort in the teachings of other religions that teach of an afterlife of some sort or even the idea of an eternal family. I'm Jewish. We just eat when we're sad and argue with G-d about it.

In any case, I'm not sure how anyone else feels but I find that as a vet, it's actually HARDER for me to come back and be here when I don't feel like I can support everyone from a positive place in my own life. I always fear coming across as too harsh about the realities of long term success and the challenges presented by staying near goal once you're living a "normal" life. I want to be here to encourage people; not discourage them by sharing the fact that I sometimes struggle. I know exactly how silly this is - I know that being a voice of reason and showing people that this isn't an easy out is exactly why vets are needed around here.

And of course I also have less patience when I'm preoccupied with my own life. It's harder to be supportive and cheer for others when on the inside you just want to scream at the world.

I'll try to be here more. I should get back with the 5:2 gals; I felt the need to check in at least once a day there and it helped.

I'm mostly struggling with lack of structure. I feel so out of sorts that I'm not planning. I need to plan to stay on top of my diet. I will drink a cup of coffee and forget to eat again until dinner if I'm not careful.

Thanks again everyone. Really. I know that losing anyone is hard. Losing my dad is nothing remotely like losing my daughter was fourteen years ago. But it's still incredibly difficult, far more difficult than I ever thought it would be. I didn't have the best relationship with him, though we talked often so I am mourning what kind of man he was when I was young and feeling sad that he won't be a part of my children's lives. He only got to meet our littlest one, Elisheva, through Skype and pictures. I have wonderful memories of his mother, my grandmother, even though she died when I was ten. I feel so sad that my children won't have the same.

I suppose anyone that's lost a very close loved one understands. Loss isn't just about the immediate hole in your life.

~Cheri

I haven't been posting much. I've needed a VST break and I've also just had way too much going on in my personal life to spend much time here.

I ended 2013 with a number of health concerns. I was told I had shingles but after I had a similar set of symptoms a few weeks later they sent me to a neurologist to try to figure it out. I've spent the last several weeks going to appointment after appointment and doing numerous tests. As of right now, I did get the good news a day ago that I have no lesions on my brain or spine and that there aren't any tumors or growths. But we still don't know what's causing my pain, pins and needles or numbness. I'm also having some pelvic ultrasounds done in a few weeks to pin down some other health concerns that are causing pain. It's just been a rotten six months for my health, honestly.

Then on Monday I got the call that my dad had a massive heart attack while driving. He had an accident (thankfully nobody else was hurt) and they were unable to revive him. He was only fifty three. I know that his health was pretty crummy but I was surprised and very disappointed. His health had been improving lately. Finally, after years of ignoring his problems he had shed 60 pounds and his diabetes was coming under control. He just called me last week to share the news that he'd finally hit onederland on the scale for the first time in more than fifteen years. He was so happy.

In some ways I'm thankful it was quick. Dad's health was pretty rotten so it could have easily been a long and slow decline from one of his other health problems. I've watched him spend weeks in ICU intubated. He'd been through a lot. His dad passed away at 42 and his mom at 50 so he outlived them both. But despite all of that it's still really difficult to accept that he's gone. I know that my dad had buried both of his parents by the time he was 31 and I'm 33 and lucky that I had dad as long as I did. But I still feel way too young to be losing my parents.

I'm just having a terrible time lately. These are only some of the issues in my life right now - we have ongoing issues with my husband's ex-wife and my step kids and my mom is also in poor health. I just feel like I can't get ahead.

And making matters worse is that my weight is all over the place. I had dropped back down to 139 (mostly due to an illness, let's not kid ourselves) but now my weight can shift by as much as twelve pounds in a day. I am not joking - it's ridiculous. I think it's stress but it could also be related to whatever is going on with my body right now. I mean, I can step on the scale one day and be 143 and no joke be 155 the next morning. It even happens at the doctor's office, so I know it's not my scale!

I don't know what I'm looking for. Maybe I just needed to vent. I'm just really missing my dad. And I am worried about my health and I'm worried about my step kids and I'm worried about my husband's job (which will likely be affected by whatever diagnosis we finally get) and I just feel completely overwhelmed. And totally defeated by my fluctuating weight, too. My clothes all still fit but sometimes it ain't pretty. I'm just having a tough go of it right now.

I'll be four years out in July and I really want to feel like a success here. And I suppose that losing as much as I have and keeping almost all of it off does qualify me as a success. I'm defeated by the idea of dieting back to goal again. I'm frustrated by the fact that I have to eat. I just don't feel like eating much lately. I worry that my poor habits right now might be really hard to break later. Going days without eating for almost the entire day and then just snacking all night long on junk isn't going to keep me focused and help me keep my weight in line. And I know that as always, I want to control my weight - I want to be in charge of when and how I lose because it's that easy target that gives immediate gratification. Life can go to hell and fall apart around me but somehow it's more bearable if I'm skinny. Call me insane, but that's how it works.

~Cheri

I'm so sorry to hear this, Lisa. The advice to push away thoughts of tomorrow and focus on today is excellent. Don't spend these moments worrying and frantic. Make memories, take pictures, enjoy one another and spend as much time together as you can. Focus on love instead of loss. We all have regrets when we lose someone we love and nothing will change that fact. But no matter how much time he has left (and though I know that it will never, ever be enough, I pray you have more time than you expect) you should live each day with him to it's maximum potential. We should all do this, all the time. It's unfortunate that we're only reminded about how fragile life can be when we fear losing someone. Every day can be a wonderful blessing, if we just choose to see it that way.

Be well, and my thoughts are with you and your husband.

~Cheri

CGJ,

As usual, great thoughts. I'm having a real issue with the shame factor or even (can you believe it) calling myself FAT, even if it's only to myself. That's just ridiculous, because once upon a time I would have killed to be forty pounds heavier than I am right now.

But I've never been able to shed those last few baby pounds and mostly, I'm terribly unhappy with my shape right now, even if I'm still pretty close to my goal weight. The way my weight redistributed postpartum was less than ideal. It's all in my tummy and with those deflated breasts from breastfeeding...ugh.

It's hard sometimes to remember how far I've come, even if I'm still not back to where I want to be.

I guess we all go through this and tend to beat ourselves up over regains, no matter the cause.

And Sheila (M2G) watch that Iron. I'm having some big health issues right now and Iron deficiency was one of the things I needed to watch. At the very least, make sure to get regular labs even though you're so far out, to be sure that those numbers don't drop. There is a huge difference in how I feel on my prescription supplements and how I feel when I go without. I can hardly function when I don't take my supplements. I had issues with anemia pre-op and like Diva, really got sick of taking all those pills. But it's worse now that I eat less, no better, so I'm forced to take them regularly or I suffer.

Great to see everyone here, what a nice reunion thread!

~Cheri

Diva! An official update, how nice!

Thank you for the note about Iron. I've had some problems with B12 and Iron that have actually interfered with the doctors diagnosing a problem I'm having with my nerves. Because so many of the symptoms overlap and can be caused by deficiencies, it's made coming up with a diagnosis difficult. I started to have real iron and B12 problems (and let's not forget calcium!) around 2 years out and despite being on supplements since then, I have problems keeping those numbers up.

Reminders can't hurt, and too many people don't do follow up labs or have a surgeon that tells them what supplements they might need for the long haul.

Regain is a real part of this. Negotiating maintenance is hard enough but when we get tripped up with illness, injuries or, in my case, nearly-impossible-to-shed pregnancy weight, it's enough to make you want to quit.

Especially because (I don't know how anyone else here feels) after a few years of being diligent, always weighing, watching my choices, saying no to the "bad" foods, etc. I get bored and resentful! It's easy to get burned out, I think. Because deep down I'm still fighting that idea that there's an end to this and that I get to live like a person that's never been obese at some point. Sadly, that doesn't happen and I have to keep tracking my food and not allow myself to eat around my sleeve.

Nobody told me this was going to be so much work! Regain pounds are doubly hard and I'm struggling to lose those last baby pounds (plus a few extras put on while I've been sick, I won't lie) but it's so reassuring to see that this is not a new hurdle or a personal problem - this is something a lot of people that I look up to on the forums deal with, too.

Thank you so much for stopping in to say hello. I've been taking a break from the boards lately but your post and all of the really great replies has me thinking that the best place I could be while I'm struggling is with other people that understand what it's like.

~Cheri

A reunion party with all of my favorite sleeve people either posting or being mentioned, I might add.

~Cheri

I'm really glad there's always a dedicated group of vets to post and that there are newer people that are very active and picking up when we're ready to move on. Fiddle, FeedYourEye, Laura-ven, Butterthebean - that's a really great group of very active posters and I'm sure that after a few more years roll around those will the the old, old timers.

Those were very kind words and I miss some of those names, too. I was never active in the forums they're a part of so it's extra nice to see some of them pop in once in a while. I saw Diva posting in a few places today, which was nice.

Tiffikins was a huge part in my choosing the sleeve over the band. I was sure I wanted a band until I saw her posts (and Oregondaisy's and Diva's) about revision.

It's so nice that you thought to post this. I miss some of the really great posters that don't come around anymore, but I do understand that life happens.

But I do miss seeing all of those and these faces around. It's like a reunion party in here.

~Cheri

Very sound advice on avoiding sliders. They are a huge cause of regain because they're usually not nutritionally sound foods in the first place. Add in the ability to eat much larger quantities because they slide and you've got a bad combination that usually spells regain. Double ouch if the food in question is a trigger food that starts that cycle of craving and overindulging. Those are things we have to consciously avoid, because our surgery doesn't fix those type of food issues for us.

But really, I'm amazed at these sleeves of steel that can slide potatoes and pasta! I still have trouble with those foods at 3.5 years out. Just more proof that all sleeves are not created equal.

~Cheri

I told my PCM, too, and had no issues with them doing my labs or prescribing me supplements when needed. I did not purchase additional insurance because I did a huge amount of research on my surgeon and felt very confident in his ability. That said, if you have a very real concern and it will reassure you, go ahead.

I just plain told my doctor I was having the surgery and wouldn't hear arguments. My insurance doesn't cover the sleeve and I wasn't about to get a surgery I didn't want. Once it's done, it's done. They can disapprove but that's not my issue, that's on them.

~Cheri

Also, I'm just giddy that I've been away from the boards for a while and came back on a day that Diva popped in, too.

I was told when I was pregnant that the reason women can eat more during their pregnancies and during their cycles is due to the hormones. They relax the stomach, sleeve or no.

So when you're PMSing (or pregnant, or breastfeeding) you can eat more. I encounter this issue every month and only manage to stay on top of things by throwing calorie counts by the wayside and eating as much Protein as I can hold while forcing myself to step away from the carbs. Because that's what every hormonal woman really wants: wine with a side of carbs.

Your capacity IS going to increase. It's natural and normal and it's the reason that focusing on good habits is absolutely critical. I can eat so much more now than at one year out it's crazy. Sure, if I make the right choices I can still feel stuffed right around 4-7 ounces of food, especially if the first 3 ounces I eat are dense Protein. But if I choose to eat the junk? Ain't nothin' stoppin' that crap from sliding through and I can sip soda and eat a damn bucket full of popcorn if I want to, so I have to make the choice not to do it. Further complicating the carb/junk/slider thing is that those foods make you want MORE of those foods, feeding into a cycle that will almost certainly end in regain if you don't nip it immediately. My advice is to focus less on quantity during hormonal times and more on quality. Eat as many hardboiled eggs and carrot sticks as you want, and I promise you won't experience heartache on the scale later.

~Cheri

Yes.

I get it.

We all must have gotten fat the same way. And since all of our bodies, metabolisms, stress levels, and co-morbids are all the same, too, we must all lose and gain by the same magic formula.

And my doctors were all right, too. I should have been losing weight the same way they tell everyone to lose weight. But I wasn't, so it was my fault and I was in denial.

Thanks for clearing that up for me, I was confused. All those years of failed diets and it turns out everyone that told me it was my fault was right. Whew, what relief I feel knowing I'm just a failure and deluded instead of actually having a problem that WLS could help me fix!

By that measure, I suppose that since I can control my binge eating everyone else can do it, too, so people that don't are just wrong for being different. It's one thing not to understand someone's behaviors or particular issues and to voice it. It's another thing entirely to come out and say, "anyone that does X is delusional or in denial."

Hey, for people that love to finger point and complain about us vs. them, you sure spend a lot of time making people feel isolated, calling them liars or delusional and doing the opposite of being supportive.

Give yourselves some pats on the back there for doing a great job at alienating people.

And some of you have in the past taken ME to task for vents that might make people feel they shouldn't be honest or open here or come here to post questions and gain support.

This entire site lately has become a mess of people that seem to feel it's their duty to jump in and dictate that everything from mental well being to diet to the causes of obesity are all from one cookie cutter mold and that if you're not doing things one way, you're clearly wrong. And heaven forbid you're proud of your accomplishments and actually post about it - it might make someone else that's not reached the same goals yet or who might never reach those goals feel insecure. And for some reason, that's not okay behavior.

Color me confused.

I invite debate and I invite other views because I'm able to civilly carry on a conversation even when I disagree completely with the other party.

I don't then take my frustration over to an entirely new thread, start bashing people, calling them delusional, talking about how they're sabotaging everyone else by being different, complaining that they do things differently and spin up another thread that *GASP* does exactly what I've complained about before: divides people.

You people suck. That's divisive - you've managed to make people feel unwelcome or unwilling to be here. Great job.

~Cheri

Because we're insecure? Because we're taught to be competitive? Because that carries over and we're taught from a young age that the best girls are the prettiest girls and the smartest girls?

Unscientific, but a friend shared this on FB the other day: http://io9.com/evolution-is-steered-by-aggressive-competition-between-1462442537

I will say it's stupid and I hate it.

It makes me feel as if there's never enough. I have to look young, be thin, be fit, be a great mom, have beautiful, fit kids, have a few degrees, wear fashionable clothes, drive the right car, have a husband, have a rich husband...on and on and on.

It's just plain stupid and divisive and is the number one reason my close female friends number in the single digits and my female acquaintances in the teens.

I don't have time for the one-up game. I do not need to witness a dear friend venting about her impending divorce, only to have some other, insecure and attention-hungry woman jump cut her off to talk about how much worse it was for her to divorce. Enough, already!

~Cheri

Cheri,

Thank you for spelling out the last part for those of us that weren't bright enough to get it...

Don't be mean, Laura.

You actually read all the way to the end? You're solo, girl. Gold star!

~Cheri

People gravitate towards the ones that agree with them. We want validation of our own thoughts, opinions and ideas so we congregate and choose to associate with people that will give us a pat on the back.

The people you agree with today might not be the ones you agree with in six months. And as Butter has said in the past, you'll find that you know less about this journey the farther out you get.

Things I had strong (and naturally, correct) opinions on a year ago are things I'd take the other side on now. I'm still right, because I'm always right. I'm just growing and changing. No, I didn't make any of the crazy or borderline suicidal posts that some people make here. But I accept that even when I disagree with them, most people are genuinely trying to work through their own crap, get feedback about their choices and find ways to improve here.

I remember getting into it even with Laura back when she was newer, because she couldn't understand my feelings or opinions on things. Fast forward and I see my opinions and feelings are now better understood!

In any case, the crazy people usually don't stick around for more than a few months. I just wish the self-righteous, gotta do this my way or you're wrong folks would do the same and boogie onward once they hit the point where all of their posts become tedious.

~Cheri

I totally agree with you on this point because I it's clear the OP was not forthcoming initially about what she was eating. And ......whatever the cause.....we are ALL overweight because we ate too much of the wrong kinds of food for our body. Doesn't mean you shoveled in food like a dump truck. But you ate more than your body could process. If you ate a healthy amount or even less, and your body still stored it all as fat due to some metabolic condition, then why have WLS? It will not help. It only reduces your intake. Why not address the real problem? And I don't think doctors are gods, but I do know that you are not capable of diagnosing the OP from here.

I agree with this - and mostly with the idea that too much for me might be just right for someone else.

Metabolic testing is what led me to surgery. Learning that I could expect to lose nearly one pound per month on a 1,200 calorie diet unless I drastically increased my exercise levels pointed me towards surgery as a forever option to keep the weight under control.

I don't deny (heh) that there's some level of denial about our habits for most everyone. I thought I was eating even less than I was - but I was not regularly eating as much as doctors, nutritionists and BMR calculators told me I could eat without gaining. I had to eat less and even now I eat less than you'd think my activity level would allow. I was also in denial about how and why I was eating.

But it's truly a peeve to see people step in and claim people are delusional or outright lying about food. Why? Because I had more than one doctor and more than one nutritionist insist that I was eating more than I was recording. I didn't just give up on dieting and opt for surgery after one go. I tried to adhere to strict diets for years with minimal results. I was constantly chastised for not "coming clean" about what I was eating in my food journal. Excuse me? I'm the woman that took the time to work up the nutritional data for six measly M&Ms so I could account for the calories! I wasn't cheating or forgetting or sitting in denial about my habits. I simply couldn't lose on the same number of calories other people could lose on.

To take it a step further, this whole idea feeds into that "if you're not losing, you're not trying hard enough" or that there's a one size approach to losing weight.

THERE IS NOT.

I'm sorry, it's too individual for that. I can eat and easily maintain on things that would make someone else pack on pounds. And other people need far more calories than I eat.

Pointing fingers and casting accusations makes me think of the never obese and totally judgmental people that worked incredibly hard to crush my self esteem while I was genuinely trying to better myself. I'm all for ideas both positive and negative being shared, and I don't want to say people shouldn't share their feelings or opinions.

But geez, think about it before you paint everyone with the same brush. I know damn well I starved myself for months on end without seeing weight loss, and anyone that tries to tell me I'm delusional or remembering it wrong should have spent a little time with me back then, when I would have clawed someone's face off in response because the lack of food made me more than a little testy!

~Cheri

This isn't precisely in response to the OP but rather to the comments generated here that are also carrying over into other posts as criticisms.

So, I'm running into an issue almost every time I'm out with my kids. I have boy/girl twins that will be six soon and an eight month old.

My girls are big. My older daughter is obese, despite the fact that she eats our much healthier, post-WLS diet and is an active kid. My son is skin and bones. I don't worry about him staying that way because I was always the shortest, skinniest kid. Until one day I wasn't, and eventually I had WLS.

No bragging, really, but I have some darn cute kids. People stop us all the time to compliment their behavior or their appearances. But lately, I find this to be a negative and I'm curious what other people think.

We'll get stopped, someone will compliment how pretty girls are or how long my older daughter's hair is or how cute the baby is and then naturally, ask how old the children are. Almost every single time, the follow up response is "wow, she's big."

Okay, yes. My almost six year old wears 7/8 clothes. She's also tall for her age. My baby is 8 months wearing 12-18 month clothing.

But they're healthy. You know what they're not? Deaf. Or stupid. My older daughter hears it when people say this and knows what it means. Guess what? There is no doubt in my mind that my daughter knows she's bigger than the other girls. She's the second tallest girl in her class and she's heavier than the other girls, too. She's also a twin - she's well aware of her brother's size and weight and when we go to the doctor that he's 15th percentile and she's 95th.

Look, I know that these people mean well. I know that they're doing something they view as nice. I know that they are just saying something without really thinking. I know that some people just really love kids and like to interact with them or shower them with praise.

But I don't need my daughters to have hang ups about their weight as little kids! I don't want my girls to think that unless they have a steady stream of compliments, they aren't beautiful or well-mannered or worthy. I also don't want my girls to hear the word "big" and think "bad" or to compare themselves to other girls already. I really, really don't want them to view pretty as separate from big or to think that being big must mean you're not attractive.

Maybe this isn't even rant worthy. But my little girl told me during bedtime cuddles last night that she's bigger than her twin. I agreed with her and reminded her that we're all different and that I think she's wonderful. But then she asked me why she's bigger than her brother while her dad is bigger than me. All I could do was remind her that we're all different, and that I used to be bigger than her father.

It's hard. I don't know that I handle this the best way. I don't really know what to say to her, or to the steady stream of people that stop us. I will say that as crappy as it might sound, I'm very thankful that both of my girls are built the same way. I imagine it would be even more difficult for them as they get older if one of the girls were teeny tiny like my son.

Maybe there's a question or two in there. Maybe this isn't a worthwhile post. I dunno, I just wanted to put it out there. I think I'm hypersensitive when it comes to weight and attractiveness and also the dumb, thoughtless things that people say to children. I just needed to vent!

~Cheri

I don't know, I think they did a pretty good job for combining several very large sites with large numbers of members into one. There were more issues off the bat than I anticipated and I couldn't log in at first, but other than that I have had no problems with using the site from my web browser. The app, however, is a hot mess and I refuse to use it. It's screwed up all the time!

~Cheri

Good thing....cause I checked with missus butter and she said ....not no but fucked no.

Ha! My husband and I are in the same place. But then, baby Elisheva is his NINTH child.

~Cheri

This is the only place I can post off the subject and get immediate help.. But I don't get how to read the status updates in the right side column. To me there are some very disturbing posts and I'd like to read them but it takes me to their profile. I want to read the entire status update.. Where am I going wrong?

Wish I could help but I'm not having the same issue. Is it worth a PM to Alex?

~Cheri

Ah, you've posted in the meanwhile. Yeah...I skip a lot of threads these days. I often wonder why I even bother visiting the site anymore because there are a ton of people here that clearly don't want any help.

Thank you for sharing FYE - your story resonates, too. Many of us here have similar experiences or feelings. I'm glad we can all share here.

Swizzly, I am SO sorry to hear your news. Good vibes for sure!

Sarsar - I think the trick is just not to lose control. Easier said than done! But remember that overindulging is the norm this time of year, and try to remember why so many people wind up unhappily making New Year's resolutions about weight! Enjoy yourself, certainly. Don't stress about it or allow it to make you anxious. But do be cautious. Use sense - you know the rules. The good news is that you probably CAN get away with more than you could early on. Just go into it and allow yourself to enjoy it, but without getting carried away. And if you have a small gain, know that it's pretty normal after the holidays, you're not alone and you know how to lose it.

I consider holding steady though the holidays a hell of an accomplishment. Small gains are expected and if I ever saw a loss I'd be floored!

~Cheri

That's maintenance to me, and that's my version of moderation. The occasional weekend of indulgence then back to more purposeful eating. What I can't do is the half cookie everyday. That makes me binge.

Excellent post. I do things that are completely unlike most folks - but I've been sleeved for more than three years!

The important thing for people to do is figure out their personal limits so they can work moderation. I can't drink soda everyday (and I finally don't want to, which is great) and I can't eat popcorn or I'll want it all the time. Oh, and fast food? Gotta watch that stuff. If there's something that triggers me, it's fried up carb-laden badness. I want it every day, no matter how uncomfortable it makes me or how much it bugs my sleeve. If I indulge in too many "bad" carbs I hit that insulin resistance and that's all my body wants me to eat. I have to be very careful.

But it's possible! I mean, moderation IS possible if you find what works for you. I think that's huge - I see so many people discouraged like chicken breasts and steamed broccoli are the rest of their life. But that's not true. You just have to find what works for you.

~Cheri

It's honestly why I never wanted to have kids. There have been too many times in my life where I opened my mouth and my mother's voice came out. Jeezus it scares me every time...like I've been possessed by her evil spirit. Since I mostly knew her as a parent, I figured if I became a parent I'd have millions more opportunities to channel her demons and repeat her mistakes. I just couldn't let myself do that.

Now I just have dogs and when I tell them they should have never been born, all they hear is "do you want a bone?"

Ya know, I'm not gonna tell you to go and breed. But I will say that I faced this head on and it was a huge challenge. Nobody teaches us how to be parents but our own parents. My childhood was so traumatic and abusive...and it was a storybook upbringing compared to my mother's childhood. I work on this. I think it's important to say (even if you never do have kids) that people CAN overcome this the same way they overcome food demons. I had to work at it and there are still days when my instinct is to react the way she did. Like the food - three years of a sleeve don't undo 20 years of shitty choices. Being a mom for six years sure as hell hasn't erased my childhood. But I do the three question check when I'm feeling bad about myself: 1) are my kids scared of me? NO 2) do they know I love them? YES 3) do I know they love me? YES - then we're all good. Because the fact that they tell me they love me and are willing to touch me means we're head and shoulders above where I grew up.

Parenting is the hardest thing I've ever done - doing it without f*cking my kids up has felt impossible at times but we're making it. I'd rather lose the weight a million times than parent a few more kids, though. I wasn't meant to be a mother. I'm doing a pretty good job at it (people tell me this; I'd never believe it otherwise) but it's work, not natural.

So, I think that was somehow related to what you said...but like usual, I hijacked it and went off and wrote a damn novel.

Thank you so much for that support. You are not alone. And we are so strong.

Misty, thank you for sharing. I agree so much with Lynda's post, too. Everyone here has some issue or we wouldn't be to the point where we consider/require surgery to get control of food.

------------

And on that other conversation, I have two things to add. Yeah, yeah, long post, whatever.

One, for what it's worth, I do not consider pointing out that we're different or handle things differently is an us vs. them mentality. We're all different. While we may not understand each other entirely, we should embrace the fact that we're not the same. We don't all have to be the same in order to get along, or to respect one another.

Two, it's not denial to relate your experiences and have them be different than some or even the majority here. I know why I was fat. I don't talk about it, but I know why I was fat. Part learned coping mechanisms as a kid and a very real fear that there wouldn't be food again tomorrow if I didn't eat it all today. And partly self-sabotage.

Yes, you read that right. Self-sabotage. Because as much as I wanted to lose the weight and as much as I felt I'd be happier doing so, I did not (and sometimes still do not) feel I deserved that happiness. I fell off diets that were causing me no issues, simply because I could. For me, it was never a lack of control. It was always a choice. I have been punishing myself for years because I carry a load of guilt even bigger than my old fat self. Plain and simple; I sabotage myself because I feel guilty for the good things in my life.

My eating has always been about hiding emotions or fulfilling a compulsion. If I indulged that desire to just ruin myself, I'd eat everything around me. It takes incredibly strict control to stay in line and stay so close to my goal weight.

Losing? That's another story.

My sleeve did one really tremendous thing for me. I'm pretty sure it's the thing that got me to goal and has kept me in the range. And that's the fact that it immediately got the diabetes under control. It's now so much easier to say no, even to those foods that trigger cravings, the ones I wanted to eat endlessly before. If I hadn't had that (and let's face it, the complete lack of hunger) the size of my sleeve wouldn't matter. I would have eaten around it and I would have stretched it as much as it would stretch.

~Cheri

I have a question for GG and Cheri, and please don't interpret my question as judging or saying anything negative. I'm just curious about your background and am summarizing here.

You both mentioned you don't understand why people can't walk away from food, so I am curious as to how you came to choosing a bariatric procedure. I know for me, if it were as simple as choosing not to abuse food, I would have never needed WLS ... I would have merely chose not to overeat or make poor choices.

Unfortunately, I tend to believe other folks who have WLS have a similar background as myself, so I am curious as to your story. I know I am asking a very personal question here, so please do not feel compelled to answer if you don't want to. Again, I am not judging you in as much as I am judging myself for making a poor assumption.

So, I haven't had time to read anything but this page so I may touch on things already mentioned.

GG's response is very similar to mine. And most of my response is based upon my life now post sleeve, not prior.

In my case, I truly believe that insulin resistance (and my earlier diabetes) as well as hormones (and insulin resistance plays into hormones as well) are the real reasons I had/have issues with food. I went back to ask my husband to see what he said about my past eating habits. And yes, if faced with exactly the right food (like pizza, or fries) I'd eat a very large quantity. And I would always feel hungry if I ate anything that was high glycemic - Pasta, potatoes, etc. I could eat to pain and still hear my stomach growling and feel like I was starving an hour later. That's the insulin resistance at work. So it was a cycle that I fed into with poor food choices.

But outside of that I could go the entire day and not eat. I was the master of will power - for four month bursts at a time. I mean, I could starve and be okay. Once I fed the carb monster/poor insulin monster, I was caught in the trap. But outside of that I could walk from food and be fine. Resentful, maybe, but I could do it.

I also had to break the clean plate club rules. That took work even post sleeve. I didn't WANT to eat. I felt compelled to eat. We suffered beatings for not eating our food as a kid and that definitely played into my compulsion to clean my plate.

It was a mental game. And while I did have some food addiction signs (sneak eating, feeling angry when I couldn't eat, etc.) those were always, always tied into stress or a hormonal issue. So fast food, (fried carbs or greasy burgers, in particular) can still sing a siren's song when I'm stressed. But I am still in control of my desire to eat those foods. And again, it's so hard to explain but I don't even *want* those foods. I know they won't satisfy me or taste good. It's a mental thing, not a physical one.

Even when I overindulged before surgery, it was never about enjoying food too much. Well, with few exceptions. I did enjoy cheesecake far more than the norm. But I never ate the whole pan of brownies. I never ate pints or half gallons of ice cream. I ate meat and potatoes and most of all, fried things or cheesy things.

In any case, my real spur for surgery were the results of my metabolic testing. I'm the gal that did Medifast hard line - never cheated once - for four months. And lost a mere 20 pounds. The willpower was there but not for the long haul.

I just could not lose weight. It happened so slowly I'd inevitably give up on my diet and go on a binge to make up for the deprivation.

Even sleeved, I lost 107 pounds over 17 months. I lost at a ridiculously slow pace even consuming low calories and eating a rigid diet. I think it averages out to six pounds a month. Less than a pound a week. AFTER bariatric surgery.

So that's why I have a sleeve. And if I keep my hormones in check, I'm the boss of food. But my issue is and has been that it doesn't matter because I have to fight incredibly hard to lose even a single pound. I've been losing these last ten baby pounds since APRIL - and I still have six to go.

I hope that answers it. I'll have more time later to read what's here and tweak this response.

~Cheri

GG, that's me, too - before and after surgery. My hubs (pretty fit, active duty military) thinks a pint of ice cream is a serving. I can eat off a pint of ice cream for two months, having just a tiny spoon a day.

I always just tossed the crumbly chips at the bottom of the bag and my husband thought I was nuts wasting them. I was the one with the clean your plate club parents, too. We got beatings for not eating our meals, and weren't even allowed to make our own plates. We were served by our elders - massive portions even for adults - and punished for not eating every bite.

Maybe THAT plays more into my ability to walk away from food. Maybe it's my rebellion. Who knows.

I just can't relate to the needing to eat. I don't. I still go hours on end without eating and only realize I need to do it when I get lightheaded or my sleeve growls at me due to the acid roaring around in there!

~Cheri

Edited to add: I actually CAN'T eat off a pint of ice cream any longer. Like I said earlier, rich dairy like that kills my tummy. I could probably eat off a pint of that So Delicious coconut ice cream though.

Maybe. But I've only had that type of experience a handful of times. I just lost a huge amount of my interest in food.

That doesn't mean I've never overdone it. I have. I had a more difficult time learning my sleeve's limitations than some because I enjoyed overeating and eating to pain prior to surgery. I also had a hard time because work obligations kept me out at dinner parties that lasted hours and I was expected to eat, eat, eat. That was tough. I've tossed up my last bite or two more times than I'd care to admit.

In my case, when I overindulge or eat too much of something I shouldn't it's not because I felt I really wanted that food. In most cases, I'm STILL disinterested in food. When I binge or mindlessly eat, I do it because I feel compelled to do it. It's an ingrained habit, it's a completely unsatisfying act, it's not enjoyable at all. And it is 100% of the time related to stress or hormones.

So yeah, I can still throw away more than half an uneaten cake. Not because I am worried about the negative effects of eating that cake, but because I don't care about that cake and don't need it around. The only feelings I used to feel about tossing food away were guilt for being wasteful, and even now that's fading.

~Cheri