leroyspuds

I found the post to be insulting. In any case, I've held out the olive branch and am willing to move on to other topics. So in this spirit of a topic change, what do you think of Obama sending troops to the southern border? Do you think it will help?

You're right I shouldn't have stooped so low. I guess I started it with my statement about black helicopters. Then you called me hypocrit and insulted my intelligence. Then it became a pissin' match. So, can we agree to get back to a civil debate? I'm willing.

"Go ahead and re-read that when your own prejudices aren't flaring up so wildly. As it's pretty logical to most people who aren't left wing loons" ------------------------------------------------------------- No Ariscus, I'll simply ignore you as being a person whose intellect isn't up to the task of a logical debate. Hey, I think your show is on --are you smarter than a 5th grader? Of course you haven't been out of the 5th grade that long have you?

By the way, I'm making an exception to my policy against name calling since you've taken it upon yourself to do so.

DUCK ARISCUS OR THE BLACK HELICOPTERS WILL SEE YOU! :biggrin: Libertarians have always been a fringe group because their philosphy is inplausible. The government is the people, and as one of the people I want some protection from the greedy and the hateful. If there was no regulation of business they would have carte blanche to victimize consumers and ruin the environment. Even with regulations they've already nearly bankrupted the world, sucked up our tax dollars to save their butts, and damaged our air and water. Say, why don't you go down to Louisana and help clean up the oilspill? Maybe you'd like to have your health insurance dropped because you got sick? How 'bout nice plate of food tainted with bacteria? If we left the ensuring of liberty in the hands of neo-Nazis, anti-Semites, gay bashers, KKK and the like a large percentage of Americans would be hanging from trees. Assuming everything will be hunky dory by leaving it all up to the good will and cooperation of people is assinine. So long as people like Rand Paul are out there making fools of themselves I have no fear of those of his ilk coming to power.

Patty, you've often said Christians aren't against homosexuality just gay marriage. In fact, many Christian conservatives and religious leaders are indeed anti-gay, not just against gay marriage. The Christian right has harshly spoken out against homosexuality over the years and has influenced the Republic party to adopt a "family values platform." These are just a few examples but there are so many more. (Some have actually engaged in homosexual acts themselves.) Pope Benedict XVI declared that saving the world from homosexual behaviour is as important as saving the rainforests and condemned gay acts as against God's will. Jerry Falwell, founder of the Moral Majority. condemned homosexuality as forbidden by the Bible. Falwell supported Anita Bryant's 1977 "Save Our Children" campaign to overturn a Florida ordinance prohibiting discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation and a similar movement in California. In urging the repeal of the ordinance, Falwell told one crowd, "Gay folks would just as soon kill you as look at you." When the mostly LGBT Metropolitan Community Church was almost accepted into the World Council of Churches, Falwell called them "brute beasts" and stated, "this vile and satanic system will one day be utterly annihilated and there'll be a celebration in heaven." Falwell also said "AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals, it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals." Amongst many remarks over the years he is probably most known for statements attributed to him about a Teletubby being a homosexual role model for homosexual recruitment and stating that LGBT organizations angered God, thereby in part causing God to let the September 11 attacks happen. Fred Waldron Phelps, Sr pastor and founder of the Westboro Baptist Church in Topeka which is notorious for its anti-gay protests and the “god hates fags” statement, claims that most natural disasters and terrorist attacks are God's punishment for a society that tolerates homosexuality. Pat Robertson of the Christian Coalition said “When lawlessness is abroad in the land, the same thing will happen here that happened in Nazi Germany. Many of those people involved in Adolph Hitler were Satanists. Many of them were homosexuals. The two things seem to go together.” “Homosexuals want to come into churches and disrupt church services and throw blood all around and try to give people AIDS and spit in the face of ministers.” Dr. George Rekers, outspoken Christian anti-gay leader, was caught with a hooker from Rentboy.com Ted Haggard, mega church pastor and former head of the National Association of Evangelicals (NAE) was brought down in a scandal involving a gay prostitute and crystal meth. He previously stated "we don't have to debate about what we should think about homosexual activity. It’s written in the Bible." The NAE has stated that "homosexual activity, like adulterous relationships, is clearly condemned in the Scriptures." Anti-gay former Senator Larry Craig was famously arrested for “lewd conduct” in an airport restroom. Study: Youth see Christians as judgmental, anti-gay – USA Today excerpt Majorities of young people in America describe modern-day Christianity as judgmental, hypocritical and anti-gay. A new book based on research by research firm The Barna Group found that church attitudes about people in general and gays in particular are driving a negative image of the Christian faith among people ages 16-29. Among active churchgoers 80% agreed with the anti-gay label, 52% said Christianity is judgmental, and 47% declared it hypocritical. Kinnaman said that respondents felt that modern-day Christianity was no longer like Jesus. "It become clear to us that what people are experiencing related to Christianity is very things that Jesus warned religious people about.” Which is, avoiding removing the log from your own eye before trying to take the speck out of someone else's." "When Jesus pursued people, he was much more critical of pride and much more critical of spiritual arrogance than he was of people who were sinful. And today's Christians, if you spend enough time looking at their attitudes and actions, really are not like Jesus when it comes to that." Mega church pastor and best-selling author Rick Warren of SaddlebackChurch in Lake Forest, CA, "For some time now, the hands and feet of the body of Christ have been amputated, and we've been pretty much reduced to a big mouth," Warren wrote. "We talk more than we do. It's time to reattach the limbs and let the church be the church in the 21st century."

------------------------------------------------------ Right on PattyGreen for clarifying your position of not supporting racism! I don't want the government to tell me how to feel or not let me speak my mind either. However, Paul really believes that privately owned business should be able to discriminate. I'm not just merely interpreting his words, but it's a very standard Libertarian point of view. It's not really because he's racist in his heart (I give him the benefit of the doubt on that point), it's because Libertarians don't believe the government should interfere with private property and free trade. That argument has it's merits, but it shouldn't be used to support institutional racism. His Libertarian belief was also the basis of him criticizing Obama's admonitions to BP as being un-American. It all has to to with free trade.

--------------------------------------------------------- No, I think he's a skunk for trying to ride the coat tails of the brave folks that actually fought in Viet Nam. It was wrong and I don't approve.

Bush's war against Iraq broke us. A lot of our cash went in the pockets of his rich cronies who got fat government contracts. He was sending our men and woman to die in a fake war against a non-existent enemy while the real enemy was digging in deeper in Afganistan. Now that's the kind of spending of blood and money we don't need. Like Cleo's said: As I have posted before, much of the spending going on now is to support the programs BUSH enacted: his two wars (unfunded), his big (unfunded) medicare part D, and the lost revenue from the two big tax cuts to the rich (unfunded).

quote PG:How petty. He's not aganst the civil rights movement, he's against the government telling people how they can and can not feel about others. Even if the majority truly believe that racial discrimination is wrong, the government still should not tell people how to feel about others, for if they do that, there will be no end to what the government can enforce. -------------------------------------------------------------------- SECOND VERSE SAME AS THE FIRST: No one here is saying the government should tell people how to "feel." The law only says that all businesses providing services to the public must serve everyone regardless of race. It's that law, not telling people how to feel, that Paul is against. If you want to feel like a racist, by all means go ahead because that doesn't hurt anybody. "Acting" like a racist does hurt people and that's illegal (with regard to the Civil Rights Act.) quote PG: See, there is no end to the regulations they try to put on us. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yeah like sodomy laws and trying to pass laws that will control women's bodies.

Yeah and we're not allowed to wear our chicken suits to her events anymore either! Geez, no chicken suits, no American flag shirts. What's this world coming to! :tongue2:

Simply because Rand Paul is not a liberal all the conservatives here will support him. It doesn't really matter who he is or what he stands for. They'd vote for a chicken pot pie for office so long as it wasn't liberal.

Republicans are sore losers. Everytime they lose the presidential election they pull these stunts. They don't give a rat's behind about their constituents, just their own wallets. Obama will never be able to do anything right in their eyes. Instead of doing anything productive for the country they just march out their usual cast of idiots to complain. :tongue2:

"This isn't about what a business person BELIEVES, this is about what a business person DOES." Aptty what don't you get about this statement? There are no laws that say white people can't watch BET or post on a certain thread on a website. However, there is a law that says businesses that serve the public must serve "all" people regardless of color. No one is saying congress has the right to pass a law that tells people what to think. End of argument. :tongue2: Read up on your history and see what happened to blacks in the south when they tried to eat at a restaurant or use the bathroom at a gas station. See photos of blacks who were beaten and hung from trees. Oh I know, the holocost didn't happen either right? If you want to have racist thoughts go right ahead. Your thoughts can't hurt anyone. Your actions can. That's the difference. Good Christian folk - practice what you preach.

....big business and financial institutions. Kentucky's Republican Senate candidate Rand Paul says Obama's criticism of BP oil company sounds like an attack on business and "really un-American." Rush Limbaugh stated that the Sierra Club should pay for cleaning up the oil spill because they forced BP to drill so far off shore. Does a free market mean it's OK for BP to destroy our coastline and ruin the livelihoods of our citizens? Does a free market mean it's OK that greedy Wall Street brokers and bank CEOs nearly bankrupted our country? Does a free market mean it's OK that wealthy insurance companies drop people when they become ill and charge such exorbitant rates that people can't afford coverage? Does a free market mean it's OK for politicians with their hands in the pockets of lobbyists to use scare tactics on the American public to make them fear regulation of business? Protect yourselves Americans, not wealthy businessman. Ignore claims that regulating business threatens Capitalism. Don't give free reign to entities that have no conscience. Insist they don't destroy our environment in order to make a buck. Don't worry about big businesses, they'll do just fine!

"Welcome to the club!! I have been a member for about 3 weeks. I think the stomach swells after you PB so it is really hard to eat anything for a couple of days without getting the same result! Does yours hurt like the DICKENS??? Mine hurts when I am PBing. I think this whole issue has been the cause of me not loosing any weight lately, I can't seem to get enough good calories in when it hurts to eat anything. I hope you get over yours soon!:thumbup: It sucks! " --------------------------------------------------------------------------- I think you're right about that. Mine was touchy for about three days after the first episode but I haven't had a problem since. I felt pain at first, like food getting stuck in my esophagus. After that I felt extremely nauseas (sp?). Do you think your band is too tight? If it's been going on for three weeks that can't be right. Like you say, when you can't eat you don't lose weight because your body goes into starvation mode. So, it doesn't pay to put up with being too tight. Hope you loosen up soon!

Take this quiz to see where you stand on the political matrix: The Political Matrix

Ariscus, I'll be blunt. Anyone who advocates private businesses being able to discriminate against people because of their race is a racist. This country took a moral stand on racism and passed the Civil Rights Act nearly 50 years ago. It is the law of the land. Your right -- it doesn't make it illegal to feel like a racist, but it makes it illegal to practice discriminatory racism in your place of business. I personally think it's wrong to feel like a racist, but you can feel any way you want.

But if a private business which gets no public funding, chooses to be racist, that should be their right. It's not against the law to be racist. ------------------------------------------------------ Oh yes it is -- read the Civil Rights Act Title II. Also see that private clubs are exempt. Ya know, people were beaten and killed to have the right to use a restroom and sit at a lunch counter. Discrimination is illegal regardless of what that dipsick Paul would like it to be. Anybody that purports otherwise is a racist. TITLE II--INJUNCTIVE RELIEF AGAINST DISCRIMINATION IN PLACES OF PUBLIC ACCOMMODATION SEC. 201. (a) All persons shall be entitled to the full and equal enjoyment of the goods, services, facilities, and privileges, advantages, and accommodations of any place of public accommodation, as defined in this section, without discrimination or segregation on the ground of race, color, religion, or national origin. ( Each of the following establishments which serves the public is a place of public accommodation within the meaning of this title if its operations affect commerce, or if discrimination or segregation by it is supported by State action: (1) any inn, hotel, motel, or other establishment which provides lodging to transient guests, other than an establishment located within a building which contains not more than five rooms for rent or hire and which is actually occupied by the proprietor of such establishment as his residence; (2) any restaurant, cafeteria, lunchroom, lunch counter, soda fountain, or other facility principally engaged in selling food for consumption on the premises, including, but not limited to, any such facility located on the premises of any retail establishment; or any gasoline station; (3) any motion picture house, theater, concert hall, sports arena, stadium or other place of exhibition or entertainment; and (4) any establishment (A)(i) which is physically located within the premises of any establishment otherwise covered by this subsection, or (ii) within the premises of which is physically located any such covered establishment, and (:cursing: which holds itself out as serving patrons of such covered establishment. © The operations of an establishment affect commerce within the meaning of this title if (1) it is one of the establishments described in paragraph (1) of subsection (:mad2:; (2) in the case of an establishment described in paragraph (2) of subsection (:party:, it serves or offers to serve interstate travelers or a substantial portion of the food which it serves, or gasoline or other products which it sells, has moved in commerce; (3) in the case of an establishment described in paragraph (3) of subsection (:tt2:, it customarily presents films, performances, athletic teams, exhibitions, or other sources of entertainment which move in commerce; and (4) in the case of an establishment described in paragraph (4) of subsection (, it is physically located within the premises of, or there is physically located within its premises, an establishment the operations of which affect commerce within the meaning of this subsection. For purposes of this section, "commerce" means travel, trade, traffic, commerce, transportation, or communication among the several States, or between the District of Columbia and any State, or between any foreign country or any territory or possession and any State or the District of Columbia, or between points in the same State but through any other State or the District of Columbia or a foreign country. (d) Discrimination or segregation by an establishment is supported by State action within the meaning of this title if such discrimination or segregation (1) is carried on under color of any law, statute, ordinance, or regulation; or (2) is carried on under color of any custom or usage required or enforced by officials of the State or political subdivision thereof; or (3) is required by action of the State or political subdivision thereof. (e) The provisions of this title shall not apply to a private club or other establishment not in fact open to the public, except to the extent that the facilities of such establishment are made available to the customers or patrons of an establishment within the scope of subsection (. SEC. 202. All persons shall be entitled to be free, at any establishment or place, from discrimination or segregation of any kind on the ground of race, color, religion, or national origin, if such discrimination or segregation is or purports to be required by any law, statute, ordinance, regulation, rule, or order of a State or any agency or political subdivision thereof. SEC. 203. No person shall (a) withhold, deny, or attempt to withhold or deny, or deprive or attempt to deprive, any person of any right or privilege secured by section 201 or 202, or ( intimidate, threaten, or coerce, or attempt to intimidate, threaten, or coerce any person with the purpose of interfering with any right or privilege secured by section 201 or 202, or © punish or attempt to punish any person for exercising or attempting to exercise any right or privilege secured by section 201 or 202. SEC. 204. (a) Whenever any person has engaged or there are reasonable grounds to believe that any person is about to engage in any act or practice prohibited by section 203, a civil action for preventive relief, including an application for a permanent or temporary injunction, restraining order, or other order, may be instituted by the person aggrieved and, upon timely application, the court may, in its discretion, permit the Attorney General to intervene in such civil action if he certifies that the case is of general public importance. Upon application by the complainant and in such circumstances as the court may deem just, the court may appoint an attorney for such complainant and may authorize the commencement of the civil action without the payment of fees, costs, or security. ( In any action commenced pursuant to this title, the court, in its discretion, may allow the prevailing party, other than the United States, a reasonable attorney's fee as part of the costs, and the United States shall be liable for costs the same as a private person. © In the case of an alleged act or practice prohibited by this title which occurs in a State, or political subdivision of a State, which has a State or local law prohibiting such act or practice and establishing or authorizing a State or local authority to grant or seek relief from such practice or to institute criminal proceedings with respect thereto upon receiving notice thereof, no civil action may be brought under subsection (a) before the expiration of thirty days after written notice of such alleged act or practice has been given to the appropriate State or local authority by registered mail or in person, provided that the court may stay proceedings in such civil action pending the termination of State or local enforcement proceedings. (d) In the case of an alleged act or practice prohibited by this title which occurs in a State, or political subdivision of a State, which has no State or local law prohibiting such act or practice, a civil action may be brought under subsection (a): Provided, That the court may refer the matter to the Community Relations Service established by title X of this Act for as long as the court believes there is a reasonable possibility of obtaining voluntary compliance, but for not more than sixty days: Provided further, That upon expiration of such sixty-day period, the court may extend such period for an additional period, not to exceed a cumulative total of one hundred and twenty days, if it believes there then exists a reasonable possibility of securing voluntary compliance. SEC. 205. The Service is authorized to make a full investigation of any complaint referred to it by the court under section 204(d) and may hold such hearings with respect thereto as may be necessary. The Service shall conduct any hearings with respect to any such complaint in executive session, and shall not release any testimony given therein except by agreement of all parties involved in the complaint with the permission of the court, and the Service shall endeavor to bring about a voluntary settlement between the parties. SEC. 206. (a) Whenever the Attorney General has reasonable cause to believe that any person or group of persons is engaged in a pattern or practice of resistance to the full enjoyment of any of the rights secured by this title, and that the pattern or practice is of such a nature and is intended to deny the full exercise of the rights herein described, the Attorney General may bring a civil action in the appropriate district court of the United States by filing with it a complaint (1) signed by him (or in his absence the Acting Attorney General), (2) setting forth facts pertaining to such pattern or practice, and (3) requesting such preventive relief, including an application for a permanent or temporary injunction, restraining order or other order against the person or persons responsible for such pattern or practice, as he deems necessary to insure the full enjoyment of the rights herein described. ( In any such proceeding the Attorney General may file with the clerk of such court a request that a court of three judges be convened to hear and determine the case. Such request by the Attorney General shall be accompanied by a certificate that, in his opinion, the case is of general public importance. A copy of the certificate and request for a three-judge court shall be immediately furnished by such clerk to the chief judge of the circuit (or in his absence, the presiding circuit judge of the circuit) in which the case is pending. Upon receipt of the copy of such request it shall be the duty of the chief judge of the circuit or the presiding circuit judge, as the case may be, to designate immediately three judges in such circuit, of whom at least one shall be a circuit judge and another of whom shall be a district judge of the court in which the proceeding was instituted, to hear and determine such case, and it shall be the duty of the judges so designated to assign the case for hearing at the earliest practicable date, to participate in the hearing and determination thereof, and to cause the case to be in every way expedited. An appeal from the final judgment of such court will lie to the Supreme Court. In the event the Attorney General fails to file such a request in any such proceeding, it shall be the duty of the chief judge of the district (or in his absence, the acting chief judge) in which the case is pending immediately to designate a judge in such district to hear and determine the case. In the event that no judge in the district is available to hear and determine the case, the chief judge of the district, or the acting chief judge, as the case may be, shall certify this fact to the chief judge of the circuit (or in his absence, the acting chief judge) who shall then designate a district or circuit judge of the circuit to hear and determine the case. It shall be the duty of the judge designated pursuant to this section to assign the case for hearing at the earliest practicable date and to cause the case to be in every way expedited. SEC. 207. (a) The district courts of the United States shall have jurisdiction of proceedings instituted pursuant to this title and shall exercise the same without regard to whether the aggrieved party shall have exhausted any administrative or other remedies that may be provided by law. ( The remedies provided in this title shall be the exclusive means of enforcing the rights based on this title, but nothing in this title shall preclude any individual or any State or local agency from asserting any right based on any other Federal or State law not inconsistent with this title, including any statute or ordinance requiring nondiscrimination in public establishments or accommodations, or from pursuing any remedy, civil or criminal, which may be available for the vindication or enforcement of such right.

Glenn Beck watchers need to watch their purses! While stirring up fear about the economy among his followers he's trying to line his own pockets. "It is not surprising that Glen Beck is attempting to deflect from his behavior in promoting Goldline," said Congressman Weiner. ""But the facts are clear. Goldline rips off consumers and Glenn Beck helps." Weiner charges that Goldline "grossly overcharges" for coins and makes false claims about gold being a good investment. Goldline touts gold as a more solid investment in this economic climate. The report says the gold retailer has entered "an unholy alliance with conservative pundits" — among them Beck, Fred Thompson, Dennis Miller, Mark Levin and Laura Ingraham — to "promote Goldline by playing off the fear of inflation." "What we have found, by looking through the public records, is that very often they use their public programs to advocate purchasing gold, and then immediately, advertisements begin for Goldline," Weiner said in a news conference Tuesday.

Apparently he's never heard of the first rule of holes.....when you're in one stop digging!

Big business has no conscience: "60 Minutes" interviewed a survivor of the Deepwater Horizon disaster and verified that crewmembers had either ignored or insufficiently addressed serious safety concerns on the rig as BP executives pressed them to drill down faster into Earth's core to reach the oil. Don't worry, the BP CEO says it's just a tiny spill. No need to release their underwater footage of the leak site, there's just a few gallons spilling out. Any hey, only 11 people died so no big deal.

Here a good one: Kentucky's Republican Senate candidate Rand Paul is criticizing President Barack Obama's handling of the gulf oil debacle as putting "his boot heel on the throat of BP." Paul says Obama's criticism of the oil company sounds like an attack on business and "really un-American." Oh, poor BP. I go back to my premise that a lot of what's wrong with our American way of life is because big business is running the show. They have no conscience when it comes to making a buck. They'd do anything to influence our legislators to prevent regulation. They shout "socialism" to scare the average working Joe into thinking there's a plot to take away their freedom and way of life. It's all just to protect their pocketbook and so far they're getting away with it. Spill baby spill.

excerpt from Paul's 2002 letter to the Bowling Green News: "Should it be prohibited for public, taxpayer-financed institutions such as schools to reject someone based on an individual's beliefs or attributes," he asked in the letter. "Most certainly. Should it [rejecting someone based on beliefs or attributes] be prohibited for private entities such as a church, bed and breakfast or retirement neighborhood...." Absolutely not.

Ha! Republican leaders are running away from Rand Paul as fast as they can. Rand who? The guy thinks civil rights only applies to the government, he's against the fair housing act, against the American disability act. Congressman Clyburn of SC said "now we know the true face of the tea party."