Cleo's Mom

Alex, I am so glad you addressed this. I think the most troublesome thing about all of this is that there are so many who justify and defend their rude comments by any number or excuses. They blame those who take offense. That's blaming the victim and that's what those who engage in abuse do. It's not what I said - the problem is that you're thin skinned, can't take the heat, freedom of speech, tough love, ad infinitum, ad nauseum.
I maintain, and I have yet to hear a compelling argument to the contrary, that you can give advice and suggestions to someone in a way that is not offensive. If you can't then it says a lot more about you than the person it is aimed at.

My local paper used to have an active blog - it was mostly political. I was very active on it as were many others. So I became very familiar with tactics used in arguments. One of them is - if you can't win your argument on facts and make good points then you attack the person - personally or otherwise. That is what you have done and some others, too.
Another thing that those who couldn't win their argument on facts or with relevant terms or answer the tough question would do - they would deflect. Change the subject. You've done that too.
You can't answer the tough questions - so deflect and attack. So keep attacking and proving my point.
And you know nothing about me, either, but felt free to make a comment about my sex life. How low is that? Another example of the kind of person you are.

Like the judge who was asked to define pornography said - "I'll know it when I see it".
Same goes here. I'll know a rude comment when I see it and obviously the person(s) who complain about them do too. People who make them can continue ad infinitum, ad nauseum to try to defend them with all kinds of excuses about using back buttons, staying off here, freedom of speech and blaming the victim.
Notice how no one has to defend nice, helpful, supportive comments? That speaks volumes.

Bullies abound in the anonymity of the internet. There are cases where those bullied online have committed suicide.
Bullies should not be tolerated on here. Those on here all suffer/suffered from obesity. They know all about face to face ugly, rude and insensitive comments. They have no more reason to accept them on here than they did in person.
The fact that they call out those bullies on here who are rude, harsh, insensitive or just plain mean does not make them "thin skinned" or "weak minded". I don't recall anyone saying they were "absolutely devastated" or went into "an uncontrollable bout of depression" over comments on here.
And if a person is hurt and upset by a remark that does not disqualify them from seeking WLS. That's called being human.
Don't hide behind the anonymity of your hurtful remarks and then blame the person they were aimed at. How hard is it to give your advice in a nice way? Apparently hard for some. Don't forget where you came from. You weren't a perfect person before WLS and you certainly aren't the perfect post-surgical person either.

Don't let some people ruin your experience with this forum. Sometimes you just need to vent. And you do t need a bunch of so called experts ruin it for you. People seem to think that because what works for them then it is gospel. It's not! We are all very different, we all go through the surgery with different experiences. You will work it out, I have good days and bad days. Sometimes I wish I could just eat a piece of cake. A big piece of cake not a couple bites. Lol. But when I go shopping for new clothes or out on my designer jeans and they look good. That makes me happier than the sadness that I can't eat like normal people. Keep your chin up. And just ignore the remarks that are not kind. You can do this, It's not even a day to day thing....its a minute to minute thing.

This is supposed to be a forum where you get information, tell you stories of success (or failures) and get support. People who are struggling are looking for support and some good suggestions to help them. There is absolutely NO GOOD REASON to do that in any way but a nice, polite, supportive way.
The whole thing about "free speech" is just an excuse for some to be rude.
Yes, anyone has the right to be on here and voice their opinion and anyone else has the right to call them out on being rude.
It reminds me of blaming the victim (in this case calling them thin skinned) - remember all the fat jokes that we were supposed to laugh at because if we didn't then we "couldn't take a joke"?
I call it like I see it and rude is rude. Don't try to dress it up as tough love or blame the person it is directed at.

@@lclemur
WARNING WARNING WARNING
extra long post, even for me
no, no, no!!!
pleeease don't run away mad
you are the best thing that has happened here (in the past 2 minutes anyways )
when you are reading a thread
if you are really interested read all the posts - top to bottom
otherwise you might be missing some doozies that i wrote!!
this is a wonderful journey you have embarked on
hope your thoughts/feelings have been gradually improving
the prob with computer boards, texting stuff like that..................
you can't see the other side of the coin/monitor
most people hopefully/probably are trying to be helpful
their sentences comments unfortunately could be misinterpreted
we ARE all wonderful people (especially me )
ask your questions, we love to help all
give support especially
you'll hear many good comments, suggestion, opinions, experiences
but at the end of the day always only listen to your NUT (nutritionist) or your doc
or me of course LOL
read alllll over the boards
you might/probably will find questions/comments that are similar to your situations
there is also a SEARCH area on top too
hope your spirits have gone upwards, along with your smile
some people do get depressed for awhile that they can't eat as much
getting used to having to change their eating habits
or just sad in general
it can be hard finding a place that you can eat properly (family friendly)
but many places are out there
wendy's is great
they have a small chili
i love their chicken salad (1/2 size) with pecans (don't have to eat them) vinegerette (msp ) dressing
other fast food places too
Red Robin sounds like it was a reat choice
broccoli, grilled chicken sound great
lemonade too
yum yum
only problem...................
why didn't you call me??
sure its true you will not/should not eat toooo much
some people do mourn their old eating ways
but all that eating you/me/we did in the past
got us in the same obesity boat
i don't want to sink anymore, how about you??
eating less, drinking more, upping your Protein, and lessening your carbs to name a few
we need to live by these rules
never killed anyone yet (i don't think) LOL
these are things that "normal" people should do too
choosing WLS (the sleeve in our case)
most people say is the best thing they have done for themselves
i totally agree with that statement
hope you gradually feel better about stuff (not depressed)
might take a while, but what else are you doing?? LOL
we're all supposed to be concentrating on ourselves!!!
we've got all the time in the world to be successful
no hurry - we'll get their in our own time
34 lbs down!!!!
party dance, party dance!!!
keep up the good work for the rest of your healthier, happier, longer life
kathy
congrats

Tech question - how do you do that whole @ thing with the posters name. I am not tech savvy. lol - Thanks.
As to the other part of your post. I don't see why anyone on here has the right to be judgmental or mean. Everyone on here is here for the same reason - obesity. And not one of the sleevers is a perfect post-surgery candidate. No one is going to put a tiara on their head. So give some sound advice, maybe some sympathy and be helpful. If you can't do that then don't post, IMO.

Here is the original post that was the cause of this thread starting:
Posted March 14, 2015 - 2:39 PM


#1 I have been down lately, and questioning my choice. When I go there, I realize that there is no going back. Stomach is gone, can't come back. Then I am even more depressed. food, food everywhere, and am not allowed to eat it. I think of all the things that I have enjoyed, and wonder if I will ever make the transition to enjoyment elsewhere. I feel like such a "weirdo" not being able to eat a typical, "normal" portion. I get a kids meal and can eat less than half. I keep telling everyone that this won't be forever, but I really don't know if that is true. This week I have "only" lost 2 lbs. I question if it is because I have added "real" food to my diet. Then I know how rediculous this is, since I have only added the average of 300 - 400 calories. Then I wonder if I am in "starvation mode." Does that happen with wls


She says she is depressed over the loss of her stomach, not being able to eat normal portions - in other words - she is having some doubts and feeling depressed about her choice. This is perfectly normal. Many who go through WLS experience this sense of loss and frustration.
She later clarified that it was a Red Robin kids meal of chicken skewers and steamed broccoli but some jumped to conclusions (a new thread she started where she explained again).
But here is what she got in return about the comments made to her post(s):
-She is thin skinned
-Overly affected (by comments)
-Too fragile
-Comments affected her stability
-Such an emotional reaction
-Weak minded
-Mental health not up to par
-Uncontrollable bout of depression (about comments)
-Off kilter
-Can't handle the heat then get out of the kitchen
-Depressed because someone said something mean.
-If the only thing you have ever or ever will love is fast food then, yeah, you made the wrong choice. IS EATING ALL YOU EVER DID? or think about life at McDonald's with a kids meal and pout.
-I suggest you go back to your surgeon and have them immediately reattach your stomach.
-She had surgery just a few weeks ago and you think she should just go ahead and have it - why don't you just drive her McDonald's while you're at it?
Wow! There is nothing in her post that even remotely comes close to the inaccurate, not to mention insensitive comments that were made.
She was not depressed over comments but over the loss of her stomach and the loss of food and fearful she would never eat normal foods again.
But just take a look at the comments she got and didn't deserve. And to make matters worse, those who made them defend them and if someone is insulted by them (she didn't even say that) then of course that's their fault because they're....well see above

I don't understand why the amount of "friends" a poster has, whether they have a profile picture, or provide current vital statistics in their profile in any way qualifies an individual as a troll. These are all personal individual choices we all make that are neither right nor wrong.
And asking someone whether they work outside the home for the sole purpose of making assumptions as to their popularity outside this site is in no way a legitimate question.

Then why don't you enlighten us all and tell us what post you were referring to.
It still doesn't change the comments that were made about the post I posted - even if your comments were about another post - obviously I wasn't the only one who thought it was her post @blacktee92675.
And I stand by what I said above with regard to what was said to "4 weeks out and depressed" and the insensitive comments made to her. That you were referring to a different post doesn't change that.

Like my grandma says... It's easier to keep up with truth's than lies.
Nothing in this thread is about truth vs lies. It's about how people post their remarks and if someone interprets them as rude then that's their fault because they're thin skinned, mentally unfit for WLS, get out of the kitchen if you can't stand the heat - well, if you've read all the posts here you know what they've said as well as defending their comments when someone thinks they're rude.
Like I've said before - those who post suggestions in a civil, mannerly and polite way never have to defend them. Guess what - it can be done and many do it. It's not hard. I suggest everyone give it a try.
And btw - look at what Alex, the founder of bariatric pal, posted in the "Jumping to conclusions" thread. He is exactly right.

I am an assertive person who sticks up for myself and others who I feel have been unfairly criticized.
There are ways to tell someone you think they're on the wrong track. Insulting them in a way that makes you sound superior is not the way. Offer practical suggestions or things others have used that have worked.
No one expects rainbows and butterflies and while this is if public forum with freedom of speech (an oft used excuse to be rude) there are ways to get your point across. @@JamieLogical does this very well. She's one of the better posters.
I've been on these forums for almost 4.5 years - back when it was only the lap band forum. I've seen it all - including fights that caused people to leave.
I hope that doesn't happen here.

Alex, I am so glad you addressed this. I think the most troublesome thing about all of this is that there are so many who justify and defend their rude comments by any number or excuses. They blame those who take offense. That's blaming the victim and that's what those who engage in abuse do. It's not what I said - the problem is that you're thin skinned, can't take the heat, freedom of speech, tough love, ad infinitum, ad nauseum.
I maintain, and I have yet to hear a compelling argument to the contrary, that you can give advice and suggestions to someone in a way that is not offensive. If you can't then it says a lot more about you than the person it is aimed at.

Just what I thought - deny it was the thread "4 weeks out and depressed" but then feel strongly enough about someone or more who posted something that you felt so strongly as to start a thread unrelated to WLS but to what you perceive as people who are thin skinned and weak minded.
@@GreenEyes604 I gotta ask.....is the original poster you are referring to with starting this thread even aware of the epic battle being waged in her name lol!
That is a good question. I think the OP of this thread should tell us the person(s) to whom she was referring when she started the post so that person of persons can at least defend themselves.
I find it absolutely hypocritical that you of all people would actually want me to tell you who I was referring. After ASSuming that you knew who and what I was referring to. At least whoever I was referring to doesn't know that I was referring to them, so they can't be hurt any further by my so called "rude" and "nasty" comments. But no…. you want to know who it is so they can defend themselves…. SERIOUSLY? REALLY?
Your comment is just another example of posts that I real that make me say EXACTLY what I said in my original post. What a hypocrite you are. And just for the record, I'm NOT going to tell you who I was referencing. What someone doesn't know won't hurt them, they don't know and you don't know either!
Time for you to move on to something else!
No YOU are the hypocrite. If you had a problem with something someone posted then say it to their face on the thread they were in. But you took the coward's way out.
This isn't about not hurting anyone with your rude or nasty comments. What they don't know doesn't hurt them, blah, blah, blah. What a total cop out.
I knew we would never get a truthful answer out of you.
Keep hiding. And btw, I got a private message today from someone who supported me - but she also assumed that those who post like you are veteran WLS people. I corrected her on that assumption about you.

Yes her post was tame and certainly not deserving of some of the comments some people made.

Additionally, this thread morphed into a discussion about those who can't take insulting comments by calling them all the things I listed above, questioning their mental stability to even have WLS, etc.. - so it really doesn't matter if it was this post that started this thread or if it was another post - the discussion went in that direction and my comments still stand.

And I never named names as to who said what - that is up to each person to do their own research in the threads and posts to find the source. Didn't take me long.

Yes, people said that stuff. Yes, typed out. There are lots of people on here who are depressed before and after surgery. Depression after surgery is well documented.
I might add that many gave her some very good suggestions and advice and were civil while doing so. Dare I use the word "nice" (it is subjective, you know). They were sensitive to her dilemma. Some had been there themselves. They did not have to defend their comments or replies.

Here is the original post that was the cause of this thread starting:
Posted March 14, 2015 - 2:39 PM


#1 I have been down lately, and questioning my choice. When I go there, I realize that there is no going back. Stomach is gone, can't come back. Then I am even more depressed. food, food everywhere, and am not allowed to eat it. I think of all the things that I have enjoyed, and wonder if I will ever make the transition to enjoyment elsewhere. I feel like such a "weirdo" not being able to eat a typical, "normal" portion. I get a kids meal and can eat less than half. I keep telling everyone that this won't be forever, but I really don't know if that is true. This week I have "only" lost 2 lbs. I question if it is because I have added "real" food to my diet. Then I know how rediculous this is, since I have only added the average of 300 - 400 calories. Then I wonder if I am in "starvation mode." Does that happen with wls


She says she is depressed over the loss of her stomach, not being able to eat normal portions - in other words - she is having some doubts and feeling depressed about her choice. This is perfectly normal. Many who go through WLS experience this sense of loss and frustration.
She later clarified that it was a Red Robin kids meal of chicken skewers and steamed broccoli but some jumped to conclusions (a new thread she started where she explained again).
But here is what she got in return about the comments made to her post(s):
-She is thin skinned
-Overly affected (by comments)
-Too fragile
-Comments affected her stability
-Such an emotional reaction
-Weak minded
-Mental health not up to par
-Uncontrollable bout of depression (about comments)
-Off kilter
-Can't handle the heat then get out of the kitchen
-Depressed because someone said something mean.
-If the only thing you have ever or ever will love is fast food then, yeah, you made the wrong choice. IS EATING ALL YOU EVER DID? or think about life at McDonald's with a kids meal and pout.
-I suggest you go back to your surgeon and have them immediately reattach your stomach.
-She had surgery just a few weeks ago and you think she should just go ahead and have it - why don't you just drive her McDonald's while you're at it?
Wow! There is nothing in her post that even remotely comes close to the inaccurate, not to mention insensitive comments that were made.
She was not depressed over comments but over the loss of her stomach and the loss of food and fearful she would never eat normal foods again.
But just take a look at the comments she got and didn't deserve. And to make matters worse, those who made them defend them and if someone is insulted by them (she didn't even say that) then of course that's their fault because they're....well see above

Alex, I am so glad you addressed this. I think the most troublesome thing about all of this is that there are so many who justify and defend their rude comments by any number or excuses. They blame those who take offense. That's blaming the victim and that's what those who engage in abuse do. It's not what I said - the problem is that you're thin skinned, can't take the heat, freedom of speech, tough love, ad infinitum, ad nauseum.
I maintain, and I have yet to hear a compelling argument to the contrary, that you can give advice and suggestions to someone in a way that is not offensive. If you can't then it says a lot more about you than the person it is aimed at.

Alex, I am so glad you addressed this. I think the most troublesome thing about all of this is that there are so many who justify and defend their rude comments by any number or excuses. They blame those who take offense. That's blaming the victim and that's what those who engage in abuse do. It's not what I said - the problem is that you're thin skinned, can't take the heat, freedom of speech, tough love, ad infinitum, ad nauseum.
I maintain, and I have yet to hear a compelling argument to the contrary, that you can give advice and suggestions to someone in a way that is not offensive. If you can't then it says a lot more about you than the person it is aimed at.

To the original poster, I’m sorry you had this experience on this site. I aim to make BariatricPal a friendly, welcoming community – and as you can see from a lot of the responses on this thread, most members here really are trying to be helpful! This is a place where I want members to feel comfortable posting their questions, concerns, and triumphs.
Please don’t leave the site just because a few members were rude or were perceived as rude. My advice would be to read what they said and see if you can get anything useful out of their words. If you are already eating healthy and you know which healthy foods to choose and how much to eat when you do find yourself at a fast food restaurant, you’re doing fine. You’re doing better than fine – you’re doing great.
And another poster was right – anyone who is/was in the position to get weight loss surgery isn’t/wasn’t always perfect with their diets. Don’t let others get you down.

I am an assertive person who sticks up for myself and others who I feel have been unfairly criticized.
There are ways to tell someone you think they're on the wrong track. Insulting them in a way that makes you sound superior is not the way. Offer practical suggestions or things others have used that have worked.
No one expects rainbows and butterflies and while this is if public forum with freedom of speech (an oft used excuse to be rude) there are ways to get your point across. @@JamieLogical does this very well. She's one of the better posters.
I've been on these forums for almost 4.5 years - back when it was only the lap band forum. I've seen it all - including fights that caused people to leave.
I hope that doesn't happen here.