Cleo's Mom

Bandster hell is the time from when the band is placed and your hunger kicks in until you receive the restriction that reduces that hunger (called the sweet spot). In banster hell your hunger is at pre-band level as well as your ability to eat (but you aren't allowed to eat that much anymore) - thus the term!

I've had 3 endoscopies. My gastro doctor puts an IV in my hand. Then I bite on this tube thing then - I'm out. I wake up feeling perfectly fine - no sore throat then or the next day. He comes out, gives me pictures of the procedure. I would have this anyday over the upper GI barium swallow. The first time I had that before my surgery I had to have my daughter go with me. I gag easily and was sure I would never be able to swallow that stuff. My fear was greater than the actual procedure. I still don't like to drink that stuff but it was slightly flavored and the radiologists have all been great. I have had it about 4 times now. Just make sure you talk to the gastro doctor first and ask what they use and how "asleep" you are. Don't let this stand in your way of getting the band. Good luck.

You will be sure to hear from some of those who have had their band removed and had revision surgery to the RNY or gastric sleeve. What do your upper GI's show? Are you too tight when you say you have restriction? How many cc's are in your band when you have restriction? It could be you are too tight then and need to have less fill. I hope you are able to resolve this issue.

You should call your doctor and describe what you have describred here. Ask if you can get a script for an upper GI at a local, closer hospital. Something is going on after all this time that indicates a problem. Probably going on soft foods and mushies for awhile until you get answers might help. But it is nothing to fool around with. Pain is an indication that something is wrong. You need to get it investigated or it's likely to happen again. If it happens again, go to the ER. Slippage and erosion don't always produce symptoms. Good luck.

Doesn't your doctor have an answering service for emergencies? Not being able to keep liquids down is problematic. Try sucking on ice chips to keep you hydrated. Do you get stuck or PB often? You might be too tight even with the unfill. When was the last time you had an upper GI? First thing tomorrow call your doctor and tell them about your symptoms. Good luck.

Even though you don't feel like you are too tight the symptoms you describe require further examination. If you continue to stay with this doctor then at least ask for an upper GI and endoscopy to see what is going on. There could be any number of things that have nothing to do with the amount of restriction you feel. You could have a slipped band or the start of erosion or something might be twisted. As your doctor he should be concerned. Ask him if he tells potential patients that they might have to live with low grade pain for the rest of their lives with the band. Call Allergan, the makers of the band and speak to their medical consultants. Ask them if any degree of pain is considered normal. That is what is so troubling to me about your situation. Your doctor is accepting your pain and trying to talk you into doing so also. It doesn't matter if he has other patients who have pain. They shouldn't and you shouldn't. You don't want to do long term damage to your stomach and esophagus and band. All you have to do is read other posts to see that that is possible. Take this matter in your own hands and demand that it get resolved or go to another doctor.

If you're only going to see him on the 13th and be banded on the 19th he could not realistically expect you to lose a lot of weight. He will tell you what is allowed on the liquid diet. Mine was 4 sugar free carnation instant breakfasts a day plus SF popsicles and SF jello - two things I never want to look at again.

Lompocbander: No, the pain you describe is not normal 5 months after surgery. Everything should be healed. Sometimes with the band it can irritate the diaphram and cause referred pain to the left shoulder. But not the scale of 1-3 pain and not being able to lie on your side. Even worse than your doctor saying pain is normal is the fact that he seems unconcerned. Here is what I would do. Demand that he order an upper GI. Then you get the results on a disk. It is your right to see all test results. If he says everything is okay and you are not filled too tight, then go for a second opinion. Make sure that you go to an experienced doctor preferably in a hospital of excellence. Does your doctor only do bariatric surgery and how experienced is he? How many has he done? How many people would consider having a lapband if at the seminars he said residual pain is normal and you just have to live with it or that it is fairly common. If he thinks that, ask him if he is required to report complication rates with his surgeries and ask to see them and find out how many of his patients have pain like you described. If he won't provide it the hospital is required to keep these records. Find out. Then take the upper GI disk to your second opinion. I recently changed doctors from a doctor whose inexperience really showed when he overfilled me and I developed a lot of problems and lied about what kind of band I had. Your health demands that you have great follow up care. It doesn't appear that you are getting that. Good luck.

Grandma26: From my mistakes I'd say the best advice is to make sure your go to an experienced surgeon who only does bariatric surgery. I went to an inexperienced one (who was a general surgeon first and did bariatrics "on the side" so to speak) and recently had to switch to another surgeon at another hospital. His inexperience became obvious when he overfilled me and I developed problems. Now I have confidence in my new doctor.

lompocbander: Pain is not normal. Pain is your body's way of saying something is wrong. Pain with the band is not normal. Pain with getting stuck is obvious and short lived and you know what you did wrong. You are correct in saying that the band is promoted as a tool or device that reduces hunger and allows you to be satisfied with less healthy food. Your part of the bargain is to eat healthy foods, eat slowly, chew, don't drink with your meals, don't eat foods you cannot tolerate and exercise. PAIN IS NOT PART OF THE BARGAIN. DO NOT TOLERATE IT. AND FIND ANOTHER DOCTOR - YOURS IS AN IDIOT.

Avrietta - thank you for your sympathy about my husband. That is why you will see me posting here under different threads about the dangers of reflux and heartburn. It is nothing to fool around with or accept as part of being banded. I have another appt. with my new doctor next month at which point I will have the opportunity to ask questions about my band and what is next for me. On Monday, I just saw the doctor briefly in radiology when he was there for the UGI and showed me the results. I agree that I should have been given the AP Standard 10cc band. I don't think my weight at the time of surgery (196) had anything to do with his decision. I know he took over a retired doctor's practice and I think that meant inheriting all supplies on hand and I think he used this 4cc band because it's expiration date was June 2009 (meaning guaranteed sterile) and he wanted to use up current inventory rather than buy new. That is just my theory. I will never know. Thanks again.

Maybe sip on something hot to drink - like tea or decaf coffee. That might help it melt faster. Good luck.

DownInSocial: I had a follow up UGI on Monday with my new doctor which showed improvement from the March 19th UGI when I was too tight by my former doctor. I got a slight unfill after the March 19th UGI and feel better. But it still showed that some of the stomach is pushed up through the band. If things don't eventually get to where they should be, I might persue a complaint. But being that my former doctor is a general surgeon at my closest hospital - guess who would probably do emergency surgery on me if I needed it? (like ruptured appendix, etc..). So, I don't want to be too quick to burn bridges. Plus, if I pushed the complaint he would deny that he told me I had the AP Standard, that I misunderstood and that he knew he was agressively filling me. Doctors know how to cover their asses, to be sure. Thanks for your reply.

Roscoe - does your doctor allow soda? Most do not as the carbonation can stretch the pouch.

My former doctor doesn't use lidocaine and my first fill was painful with his jabbing around until he got to the center of the port. So, I bought some gel containing lidocaine and used that before my next fill and then my unfill. Neither hurt - either because he found the center the first time or from the lidocaine gel. I don't know what my new doctor uses - haven't had a fill or unfill from him yet. I think it's an individual thing and how easily your doctor can access your port and get it right the first time.

I had an upper GI yesterday and my (new) doctor said that some of my stomach is still pushed up through my band. But it was better than the 3/19 UGI when I was too tight (I have had 1cc removed). My question is: how is this condition different from a dilated pouch because that is what it looked like to me when he showed it to me on the screen.

I have the 4cc band and was overfilled and too tight at 3cc's. I had a lot of problems. But I was still hungry at 3cc's. I had one cc taken out and feel better but don't have much restriction and am hungry a lot. So any weight loss is very slow. I am depending on willpower and calorie counting and eating healthy, low fat food.

There are several types of Lapband bands. The #10CM holds 4cc. The AP Standard holds 10cc. It appears you have one that holds 10cc. I have the 4cc one.

A question for both of you: Did your doctor say why he chose the 4cc band instead of the AP Standard 10cc band which is newer? What was your fill schedule like? I have the 4cc band (Sept. 08) and I had a lot of problems when filled to 3cc's and had to have 1cc removed.

ParrotheadCathy: The 4cc band by Allergan is not discontinued. It was put in me in Sept. 2008. In the process of trying to find out what band I actually had, I got the serial number and catalog reference number and I called Allergan and they told me it is not discontinued. My doctor's office told me I had the AP Standard 10 - which I do not - and my doctor aggressively filled me with 2cc's the first fill and 1cc the second fill when I developed a lot of problems. I don't know if he actually thought I had the 10cc band. Because of this (and other reasons) I have changed doctors.

I changed doctors last month. I went from an inexperienced doctor who was a general surgeon and did bariatric surgery "on the side". I was his 23rd banding. His inexperience showed when I developed problems with an overfill. Plus he told me I had a different band than I actually had. When I went for a second opinion, I switched to that doctor. Went today for a follow up upper GI to see if the problems caused by the overfill have gotten better (they have). My former doctor's general surgery patients took priority - what with all their emergencies, etc. He didn't seem to have time or the knowledge to deal with post bariatric surgery patients. I am glad I switched.

DownInSocal: I called Allergan to get one of those wallet cards that lists your band type, cc fill level and doctor. They told me I would need to know the letters for the band - AP, V . So I called my doctor's nurse and she called back and said the doctor says I had an AP Standard 10, when what I really have is a #10 which means 10CM (4cc) NOT 10cc. I had the operative report and it said #10 but I thought that meant 10 cc, too, so when she told me I had an AP Standard 10 it made sense, until the second doctor opinion. Then I called Allergan again and was given the catalog reference number for the #10 band and for the AP Standard band and then I called medical records at the hospital and requested the catalogue reference number and serial number for my band. When I got the results, I again called Allergan with the information - just to be sure - and it is the 4cc band. Not used much anymore and I will probably never know why he used it on me. My new doctor is unlikely to second guess my former doctor - you know how that is. I did have a $15 co-pay for each office visit but my insurance covered the rest.

Update: I did see the second doctor for another opinion on April 7th. Big surprise! I found out I don't have the AP standard lapband that holds 10cc, as I was told by my former doctor. I have an older version that isn't used much anymore. It's a 10CM that holds 4cc. He gave me 2cc's in my first fill and 1cc in my second fill - when all the problems started. I learned this from this new doctor - to whom I switched after the visit. His second opinion report was that I was filled too tight the second time and that it appears I might have a small slip. I am going Monday, May 4th for a follow up Upper GI to see if things have gotten better. I feel better. No more reflux, heartburn or pain. I am not losing weight very fast - maybe a pound a month - but I have already lost 70 lbs (only 10 from the band) so I am okay with that. My former doctor lied about what kind of band I had and maybe he actually thought I had a 10cc - which is why he gave me 3cc's after only 2 fills. All the more reason to leave his practice. BIG LESSON - do not go to a practice where they are general surgeons and just do bariatric surgery "on the side" so to speak. His general surgery patients took priority and he was unavailable outside of office hours - didn't even have an answering service. Just go to the ER I was told. How costly and ineffective is that? Anyway, I will now be treated at a hospital of excellence and hope that the band is okay. I will find out what the new doctor thinks about the hiatal hernia and if it should be repaired or leave it alone. I will post updates. Thanks everyone.

TSB - How many bandings has your surgeon done? Perhaps he is not as experienced at doing them as he is with GB. He could also be a surgeon who relies on the number on the scale to somehow prove his worth or success and is used to the fast and big losses with GB. He equates weight loss with his success. I recently changed doctors because (1) My surgeon lied about what band I had (2) he is a general surgeon who does bariatric surgery, too. (3) He had only done 22 bands before me and (4) His inexperience became apparent when I developed problems. I then sought a second opinion with an experienced doctor and have now switched. Please make sure you are comfortable with this doctor BEFORE you have the surgery. You don't want to end up in arguments at every post-op with him telling you you should have had the GB if you develop problems. Good luck.

Thanks, it was resolved the next day.