Cleo's Mom

When you quit are your satisfied or just tired of eating? If all you're eating is what you say you're eating, I wouldn't worry about eating too much. The goal is to be satisfied with the amount of food that will still cause you to lose weight. Do you get any signals that you are satisfied? Or have had enough to eat? I think you are on the right track and I wouldn't worry too much about the time on the clock.

Did you doctor ever tell you why he chose the 10 CM - 4cc band over the newer AP Standard 10cc band? I have the 4cc band and was overfilled at 3cc and developed reflux, heartburn and pain. I received an unfill of 1cc and am now at 2cc. I have switched doctors because I was told by my former doctor that I had the 10cc band (maybe he actually believed I did - explaining the fill to 3cc's after only 2 fills) and he was inexperienced (had only done 22 bandings before me). Everyone is different as to what they can tolerate with fills. Some with a 4cc band do fine with 3cc's. I didn't. But this smaller band has to be filled in very small increments - sometimes as little as .2cc's. I hadn't heard that about erosion. But I don't hold out much hope to reach my sweet spot because at 3cc's - despite all my problems I was always hungry and not satisfied. Right now I am going on willpower only. Counting calories. Good luck.

You need to get some definite answers from both your insurance company and your surgeon about this and present the weight you would be if you lost the 10 pounds. Would your BMI still qualify for insurance? If you don't lose 10 pounds would your surgeon still do the surgery? After my 2 weeks liquid only pre-op diet my BMI was 34.8. I was afraid that my insurance wouldn't approve it, but they did. Keep in mind that the less weight you have to lose before surgery, the less you will lose after surgery - so don't pay attention to those who post those fantastic first month weight losses. They had more to lose and probably lost less before surgery, too. Good luck to you.

If you are having liquid coming up at night (reflux) it usually means you are too tight or perhaps your band has slipped. I'm not sure what you mean by your band being noisier. The band should not make noise. Or do you mean your stomach is making noise? You need to find a bariatric surgeon who will see you and run some tests, hopefully an upper GI to see what is going on. Look at the forums for lapband surgeons that is new here and see if you can find one in a city near you. Good luck.

Your expectation of the band should be what it is promoted as doing: Helping you to reach the proper restriction (sweet spot) that will allow you to eat less healthy food and stay satisfied longer. It is promoted as helping you to lose 50% of your excess weight. If you want to lose 100% of your excess weight - great, but understand that the band doesn't promise that. Your part of the deal is to eat healthy, exercise, avoid problem foods and not drink with meals. What should not be part of the band experience: heartburn, reflux, pain, vomiting. These can be indicators that the band is too tight or the band has slipped. These symptoms should not be regarded as the price to pay for reaching some magical number on the scale. The band is for getting healthy and eliminating or improving those co-morbidities - like sleep apnea, high blood pressure, elevated cholesteral or glucose, joint pain, etc.. Every bit of written literature I received about WLS said (in bold letters) : WLS IS NOT ABOUT APPEARANCE, IT IS ABOUT BETTER HEALTH. Put me squarely in the camp of those who do NOT think it is whining to post your problems on here and expect respectful replies and helpful suggestions as opposed to a lecture or a smack down. Good luck on your journey. I think you will do well.

If you can't eat in the morning, are eating slider foods, have reflux, choking and slow weight loss - you are probably too tight. So instead of another fill, it sounds like you need a slight unfill. But your doctor might want to see what is going on with an upper GI. Good luck.

There is no scientific study, research or evidence that we need to drink 64 oz of water a day whether we are trying to lose weight or not. That 64 oz figure has no medical basis. It just popped up and now everyone seems to adopt it without knowing how it came about. We get fluids from foods, too. That being said there are many on here who swear by their water consumption helping them to feel satisfied longer and not as hungry. If it works for them, great. But don't feel bad if you can't get the 64 oz in. And all our fluids don't have to be water, either. If you like tea, try crystal lite decaf iced tea with lemon.

The C-PAP machines are set up to monitor and record its use. So, if the doctor requires it for use before surgery he will know if it is being used. The anesthesiologist usually likes to know if a person has sleep apnea and what type of machine they're on. Some doctors discourage its use right after surgery as it blows too much air into the stomach. I had two separate sleep studies a few years apart and I had a panic attack the first time and my husband had to come and get me in the middle of the night. The second time, I took xanax and was able to use the nasal pillow c-pap at the hospital but not at home. Wasn't a problem for this surgery, though. The pulmonologist read my sleep study report and did a breathing test on me and cleared me for surgery - no cpap required. 50% of those with sleep apnea can't use those machines. So you are not alone. Good luck.

Did you sign anything in the doctor's office that said you would be responsible for payment if your insurance didn't pay? If so, you need to get a copy of that. If you didn't sign anything to that effect, then I would say that it is a problem between your doctor's office and your insurance company. He acted irresponsibly and unethically to do an elective surgery before it was approved by insurance. He should be reported to the hospital administrators and the state's medical board. If I were you, I would not pay anything. I would exhaust all my options first in fighting it and if no luck, then get a good attorney. Good luck.

If there is no one from your doctor's office who can do an unfill, go to the ER. You can become seriously dehydrated if you are not able to keep any liquids down. It would be irresponsible of your doctor to be out of town and not have another doctor on call for his patients should they (like you) need emergency care. Good luck.

Willowcat - are you on any PPI's like Protonix, Prevacid or Nexium? Have you tried ginger root capsules? I've read that they can calm a queasy or upset stomach. But the bottom line is to seek medical help - maybe with a gastro doctor who has experience with banded patients. Good luck.

Reannah: You have a right to a copy of all your medical tests, including the disks of upper GI's. Contact medical records at the hospital at which you had the testing done and request copies of everything you had done. And I'm sure you will be able to find an experienced bariatric practice in which you don't have to pay such outrageous upfront fees. Good luck. Let us know how it works out.

Many insurance companies require a BMI of 40 or 35 with co-morbidities. If you are self-pay, it is usually the doctor's requirements then. You will need to be tested for co-morbidities either way, I think. Surgeons always want to know what state of health you're in. Good luck. And PS - take it from me - make sure your surgeon is experienced and only does bariatric surgery.

Has your hypothyroidism been treated? Do you get regular blood tests? I don't think it has anything to do with your symptoms, though. Have you discussed these symptoms with your surgeon? Have you had any recent tests like an upper GI or endoscopy that might show what is going on? How many fills have you had and how many cc's are in your band? Whether your insurance will pay for removal will probably be dependent on documented problems that can't be resolved. You need to visit your surgeon and document all these episodes and any other problems you are having. Then have your surgeon submit it to your insurance company. This may take awhile. Good luck. Sorry the band hasn't worked out for you.

CLEO'S MOM IS HERE!!! Been there, done that! And all I can say is to run, don't walk, to your nearest hospital of excellence & bariatric program with an experienced bariatric surgeon. My doctor had done 22 bandings before me. He is a general surgeon and maintains an active general surgery practice and only recently started adding bariatric surgery "on the side" (it seemed to me). His whole knowledge of how the band works, his unrealistic expectations for weight loss and his inexperience with dealing with my complications when he overfilled my 4cc band caused me to seek a second opinion and then change doctors. You do not want to go through this. Start out with someone who already knows what he is doing. And technically, the surgical part might be the easiest part of the whole process. The follow up is actually more important. Had I gone to an experiened surgeon to begin with, I would have had a new, 10cc band and would not have had to go through all the pain and suffering I did. There is no hurry. This band is going to be in you for the rest of your life (hopefully). Good luck and take your time doing your research.

I didn't get any paper work or card when I got my band. As I said, my surgeon was a general surgeon who maintained an active general surgery practice and had only just gotten into the bariatric surgery - almost "on the side". My mistake was going to him in the first place. I don't think he "gets it" about follow up care or how the band should work or has realistic goals for weight loss. I don't consider my problems to have been "a few little problems, not too bad". They were bad enough that even my former doctor called me in right away the day I got my upper GI to do an unfill. He saw how significant the esophageal dilation and swollen pouch were. Nothing was going through. In addition - just for your information - when food, acid, etc are in the esophagus and this happens over time, cellular changes can take place. This can lead to Barrett's esophagus which can lead to esophageal cancer. I know this because my husband died of esophageal cancer almost 4 years ago from many years of GERD. And he had yearly endoscopies and it was caught early. Didn't matter. It is nothing to take lightly or dismiss. All that being said, I did not say I was giving up on my band. I'm not sure where you got that from either of my posts. What I am saying is that I think my surgeon should have given me the newer, 10cc band. I think he should have filled this band less aggressively and when I developed problems immediately after the second fill he should have known it was overfilled instead of blaming me. And I also believe that since I was still hungry and not satisfied at 3cc but had all those problems, I don't hold out any hope of finding a sweet spot that will allow me to eat the amount of food that both satisfies me, keeps me from being hungry for hours and allows me to lose weight at about 1 pound a week. I am hoping my new doctor will offer some suggestions as to where he wants me to go from here. When I had my follow up Upper GI last month, he said there was some improvement and offered to remove the rest of the fill. But since my problems were gone, I didn't see the need. I meet with him again next month and will be anxious to see what he thinks about everything.

Alicia: When I called Allergan to find out how to get a wallet card (with band info, etc.) they told me that I first had to find out what band I had - with letters AP or VG and when I called my doctor's nurse and she called back she said I had an AP Standard 10 - that is a specific band that hold 10 cc. My operative report says I had a #10 band and I assumed that meant 10 cc. When I got the second opinion the doctor there told me it was a 4cc band. When I got the medical records from my hospital with the serial number and catalogue reference number for the band, it was confirmed to be a 4cc band. So, there was no misunderstanding on my part. I was told I had a different band than I do. When I went for a second opinion the doctor also saw a small slip that was missed by my former doctor. I was only my former doctor's 23rd banding. His inexperience showed in his aggressive filling of my 4cc band. It should not be filled with 2cc's then 1cc in two fills. It should be done in smaller increments. Again, either his inexperience or he actually thought I had a 10 cc band. Troubling either way. So, I was a victim of his inexperience and I then took matters into my own hand and changed doctors. But I am certainly not "playing the victim". And I'm not sure what excuses you thought I was making. And my weight loss was on my own, then the 6 month pre-op diet and then the two week pre-op and two week post-op liquids only (who wouldn't lose on those?) and at this point I lost about 60 pounds. Since the band - about 13 more since September 2008. My former doctor was never happy with my weight loss. My new doctor is very happy and said I lost a year's worth of weight in 6 months. So, I do blame my former surgeon for putting a band in me that he could not fill properly and caused me problems with my esophagus and pouch that I can only hope will return to normal at some point in the future. The band is suppose to make you healthier not create health problems. I am glad the 4cc band has worked out so well for you and wish you contined success. Thank you for your reply.

I've been on synthroid for hypothyroidism for 27 years and it has never helped me to lose weight. In fact, I was losing weight before I was diagnosed and quickly gained 14 pounds when I started on synthroid. Your doctor will make sure that you aren't on a dose that is too high because it will affect your heart negatively and you wouldn't want that. So, you don't have to fear losing too much weight.

For all of you who replied I have these questions: 1) When did you have the 4cc band put in? 2) Did your surgeon tell you why he chose the 4cc over the newer AP Standard 10cc? 3) Did you know prior to surgery that this would be the size band used? This band is not used much anymore. I had one put in in Sept. 2008 but was told I had a 10 cc band when I asked. When I developed problems with my second fill (first fill was 2cc's and second fill was 1cc) of pain, reflux and heartburn and had an upper GI my surgeon removed 1cc. I went for a second opinion and that is how I found out I didn't have the 10 cc band and that I had a slight slip. Because my surgeon initally blamed me (and not his overfill) for my problems and for not telling me the correct band I had, I changed doctors. At 3cc filled I was still hungry despite having pain, reflux and heartburn. My upper GI showed slow esophageal motility and a swollen pouch. So, I don't hold out any hope of finding my sweet spot. I am relying on willpower and calorie counting. Weight loss might be about 1 pound a month, but I have lost 70-75 lbs. of which the band helped with about 13 lbs. There are many who have the 4cc band and love it and are doing very well. That's great. But a newer, better model came out and I feel cheated that I was given an older model. It's like putting a black, rotary phone in your home. It will get the job done, but there are better touchtone phones. The newer AP standard bands have a scalloped pillow type inner tubing that supposedly allow less of the tubing to come into contact with the stomach, thus reducing risk of erosion.

Freddy: I don't understand why they couldn't tell you what kind of sleep apnea you had after one night. That is what the first night's study is for. To make a diagnosis. You either have obstructive sleep apnea or another kind called central apnea something. Most have OSA. Then the second night, they try different cpap masks to see which one works and you tolerate. The anestesiologist needs to know about your sleep apnea in the event that you need to use it after surgery. Others who were on the machine before surgery were told by their surgeons not to use it immediately after surgery due to it blowing too much air into the stomach area. I was diagnosed with mild/moderate sleep apnea and could not tolerate the cpap but before my surgery I just had to go to a pulmonologist who did a breathing study and said I was good to go. The original doctor who did the sleep study was a bit of an alarmist. A new set of eyes provided, what to me, was a more rational look at my results. Anyway, you might need to use the cpap before the surgery and have another test down the road to see if your apnea is improved. But I totally agree with you about those sleep studies. I've had two 2 night ones and the last time I had to take xanax to get through it. So, good luck. I hope you get this resolved.

BSG: I am so sorry you had to go through this ordeal but am glad you will now be on your way to recovery. The part of the story that I can identify with is the doctor's attitude. Though I didn't have anywhere near the degree of problems you had, my former doctor overfilled me and then blamed me when I immediately had pain, reflux and heartburn for how and what I was eating. However, when he saw the results of my upper GI, he saw the trouble I was in and called me in immediately for an unfill. His attitude was completely different then. Very concerned, etc.. Having a good relationship with your doctor, having him listen to you and having confidence in him is so important. My doctor's lack of experience (I was only his 23rd band) showed when I had problems. I promptly got a second opinion and switched doctors. Should you ever decide to do another surgery - don't go back to this doctor. He obviously doesn't listen. Also, if you think there was medical malpractice, get a good attorney and your healthy insurance should be on your side, too, as they have had to pay for all of this. Good luck and I hope you get better. Take care.

I think the band works differently for different people. Some get to their sweet spot where their restriction reduces hunger and allows a small amount of food to satisfy them. They do not have any problems with pain or reflux or heartburn. There are others who seem to be willing to put up with a whole host of problems and complications to lose weight and reach some magic number on the scale. Theirs are the posts that begin with all the pain and problems that they are having and then saying.. but I love my band..I have lost "x" amount of weight. The band is suppose to make you healthier than you are now by helping you to lose the weight that you need to in order to improve your health - whether it's joint pain, sleep apnea, type II diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesteral or high triglycerides among other things. The band is not suppose to create health problems, make you sicker or cause heartburn, reflux, vomiting or pain - provided you are following the eating rules. You need to find an experienced doctor whose philosophy about the band reflects this. Some doctors won't listen to patients when they have problems. Then you'll need to find a new doctor, like I did. You also must have realistic expectations about the band. You might still be hungry. You might not be able to reach your sweet spot. You might not be able to eat some foods. Each person is different as to what their band won't tolerate. You will have to exercise. But it seems like you have done a lot of research and I wish you the best of luck.

I agree with the two other posts. If for some reason you are unable to change doctors, tell your doctor you are coming in for a complete unfill. And if he refuses, contact the hospital administrators or the patient advocate. Demand that you get an upper GI to see what is going on. If all else fails, go to the ER where they might find a doctor who will unfill you. And then find another doctor. Your infections and fever might not be band related but your inability to eat and drink properly and having reflux at night is. Don't be passive about what you need. You have the right to feel and be better. Good luck.

Find out what the 5 years success rate is for the Kimkims diet. Overall diets fail about 95% of the time. Obviously Kimkins wants people to buy their diet and products, not have weight loss surgery. What makes them think that those who go on their program won't fall into the same bad habits that they outline in this article? I would bet that almost everyone on these boards has tried weight watchers - especially if they are older and have been overweight/obese longer. It is a program that is usually given good overall ratings by the medical profession. But have you ever seen any statistics on those who join and long term weight loss? After 5 years, almost everyone who joined has quit, and regained the weight. While I do agree that WLS won't rid you of emotional eating or change bad habits overnight, if you had to do a pre-op diet for several months, it does teach you about healthy food, good nutrition and portion size. The band is a tool that when it works properly can help you to feel satisfied with smaller amounts of healthy foods. I use xenical (prescription alli) and I think of it as another tool. Why shouldn't we avail ourselves of all the tools we can? Aren't we trying to build a better and healthier body? And with the high percentage of diet failures, ask Kimkins about what yo-yo dieting does to the body. I would dismiss this article for what it is: an infomercial for it's diet and products. Contact Kimkins and ask if they will accept your health insurance as payment for their products if they are so much better than WLS.

Reflux and heartburn can lead to changes in the cells in the esophagus which can lead to Barrett's esophagus which can lead to esophageal cancer. After many years of GERD and heartburn then Barrett's my husband died of esophageal cancer almost 4 years ago. It is not something to tolerate in order to lose weight. Contrary to others on these boards who think it is whining to complain about heartburn, I know it is serious. When I was overfilled I developed these problems and had a slight unfill. Problems resolved. I don't care if I lose another ounce. I got the band to get healthy not create new medical problems.