Massachusetts could become the first state to make it illegal for parents to spank their children. Today, at the Massachusetts State House, the hearing for a bill to ban the practice was standing room only - From ABCNews.com

I personally think spanking is child abuse, but I have a friend who insists that it is the best way to discipline his son. When he was a child he was beat quite severly by his mother but still insists on using this method of discipline.

brandy you make me smile.

My psych eval dove deep cause My doc knew about past sucide attempts and cutting and wanted to get down to the just of it while in the meeting to make sure I was okay. The psych I had for the eval was wonderful and helped me out a lot and made me realize a lot of things, I am very happy he approved me and he also helped me emotionally too.

My hubby and I use spanking as a form of discipline but only as a last resort. We talk to our children about their behavior and tell them the consequences. If they keep on doing something that we have told them time and time again not to do then that may be the final consequence. Not to say every little thing warrents a spanking. He was spanked as a child and so was I. The only difference between us and child abusers is the fact that we do not do it out of anger. When I am upset about what my child is doing I will go and calm down and explain to them what will happen if they keep doing whatever they were doing. Our kids are now 6 and 4. Our 6 yr old we don't even spank anymore because we no longer have to and our 4 year old only gets them every once in a while. Of course there are those that can go overboard and just beat a child and call it discipline but I strongly believe that you do not have to spank every child. A 2 yr old probably doesn't need an all out "whooping" but a little smack on the hand or a quick swat on the butt may do the trick. What ever the parent is comfortable with and make sure you and your spouse sees eye to eye on this form of discipline. My hubby and I talked about it in length before we decided to have kids.

Bottom line to my tangent is know your kids and you'll know what form of discipline is right for them and for you.

Okay, we'll agree to disagree on the fact that spanking is abuse but there are those of us to choose other means of disciplining children over spanking.

If I hadn't learned other methods other than spanking my children I probably would have spanked and not even thought twice about it. There are always those that take it too far but why not educate them now and hopefully they will relate the fact that what they do to their child now can have consequences down the line. Maybe they don't know enough when to stop or how hard to hit and they cross the line just like someone who drinks and drives may not know how much is too many and cross the line and drink too much. In each circumstance someone crosses the line and could possible injure or kill another person. Just something to think about.

I think children have the right not to be hit even if it is by a loving parent and I don't believe it makes my view to be a socialist view.

Children also have the right to have bounderies because they can not set them themselves. Sometimes there are no other way to set those bounderies.

My daughter has ADHD, OCD, ODD and is borderline bi polar. We have been in therapy, anger management and phychiatry since she was 18 months old. I have discussed my parenting style over and over with hundreds of educated people. Funny that EVERYONE one of them agree with my decision. When talking, time outs, taking things away such as games, and writing sentneces don't work I spank. But she is warned no less than 3 times before that happens.

She is 9 and I have spanked her less times than her age.

Funny that you think your ideas are socialist, I don't see them that way at all!

Bottom line the PARENT who is under control and in control of themselves knows best about their child.

As for education as a parent I have spent more time trying to help her in parenting classes, and Dr's offices than I could ever count.

I am sorry for those children whose parents do cross the line, but it IS NOT THE SAME THING.

I am sorry for those children whose parents do cross the line, but it IS NOT THE SAME THING.

Amen.

Boo Boo Kitty,

I won't comment anymore on the spanking issue, I've stated all I care to about the matter, I will let it die a natural death but am sure the thread will pop up again as they normally do and from now on will try to resist the temptation to make a further posting.

I can see that you've had to deal with a difficult situation that a lot of parents deal with these days, I've assisted in classes with children diagnosed with ADD ADHD and so on and also with emotionally disturbed children in elementary schools. I know they can be difficult but we were trained how to deal with them in a classroom situation which of course would never lead to spanking, not in my state at least. This is between you and your child. I do believe in setting limits and in discipline but in a different way. We agree to disagree.

I only brought up the term "socialist" because of many comments I got about people coming in and saying no one has the right to tell them how to discipline their children and the State coming in or the Federal Government's involvement. And it appears that when someone believes that spanking should be made illegal it can thought of as a socialist type of view.

Take care, brandyII, who is done with this thread, at least for now........

Boo Boo Kitty: Of course horrible child abuse is not the same as a well thought out, planned swat on the backside. But a swat on the backside is also not usually what is administered as a spanking. Everyone likes to think that's all they do, but you know what they say... denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

I've been very vocal about spanking being a poor way to discipine children. But I am not accusing you of abuse or even harsh spanking. In fact, I'm not accusing anyone of anything. I just want people to know that if they work really hard at learning alternatives to spanking, they can very successfully discipline their children without using corporal punishment.

I have no desire to storm into your house and point an accusing finger at you for the way you discipline your daughter. I have no desire to pass a law that parents cannot choose their own form of discipline for their children. I do, however, wish that parents in the U.S. were better educated about alternative ways to discipline and teach their children. I do wish we had some mandatory parenting classes before we take charge of the children we bring into this world.

As for you, it sounds like you've worked very hard at getting help in determining the best way to handle your daughter. I respect you for that. Parenting a child with those problems is extremely challenging, to be sure.

I would still like to hear from the non-spanking side of the line, what the 'non-spanking alternatives' are. Since those of us arguing for it are speaking of it in a well planned, last resort manner. After one has tried talking to their child, or time out, or grounding them from playing with their friends, or their favorite toys. If the message just isn't getting through, then what?

Plenty of kids, the above that I have mention would be more than enough. But for plenty of kids that I have seen, things like that are more an annoyance than punishment. In my sister's case, she would just sneak the things she wanted, or try to bargain her way out of her grounding, etc.

Does it always work out after spanking a child. I mean you spank a child once does that mean they will never offend again? It's the same thing, just another method of discipline, don't know what's so complicated about it. Kids are kids, it's part of their make up to test the limits. Giving them a time out may make it more painful for the parent than the child but it's still a manner of discipline. I think it's easier in the long run for parents to spank than to use other methods which we've previously gone over before.

I think time outs are a great alternative. Many in my extended family (and my ex's family) had never even heard of time outs (we are talking 20 years ago) when i had my boys taking time outs. They were very well behaved, we always got compliments. It is something that takes more time than a spanking, it takes committment from the parents. Time outs are somewhat like the band, it is not the easy way, it takes a lot of work. And it must be from the beginning.

I used to have day care in my home, so I have had several personality types of children in my home. I will admit that I have spanked my own children, but as other's, it was a last resort, and i hate it. I hated myself for it. One little girl I took care of, well, she was a handful, there were even relatives of hers that refused to watch her anymore. But, I had no problem with her. It takes time to find out the needs of each child, her need was she needed you to be direct with her, and not give in to her. If you got down to her level and looked in her eyes and explained to her whatever the situation, she understood. Her stepsister, complete opposite, but they both were like angels eventually. It does take time.

I think time outs are a great alternative. Many in my extended family (and my ex's family) had never even heard of time outs (we are talking 20 years ago) when i had my boys taking time outs. They were very well behaved, we always got compliments. It is something that takes more time than a spanking, it takes committment from the parents. Time outs are somewhat like the band, it is not the easy way, it takes a lot of work. And it must be from the beginning.

I used to have day care in my home, so I have had several personality types of children in my home. I will admit that I have spanked my own children, but as other's, it was a last resort, and i hate it. I hated myself for it. One little girl I took care of, well, she was a handful, there were even relatives of hers that refused to watch her anymore. But, I had no problem with her. It takes time to find out the needs of each child, her need was she needed you to be direct with her, and not give in to her. If you got down to her level and looked in her eyes and explained to her whatever the situation, she understood. Her stepsister, complete opposite, but they both were like angels eventually. It does take time.

Great insight and comparison!!!

Imagine how sad you'd be when they picked up that little girl that you took the time with an they were slapping her around on the way to the car, would your stomach not drop??:thumbup:

You have to be smarter than your children. You have to understand what is motivating the bad behavior. That does take time, as mentioned above. And it takes a lot of thought and creativity.

There is always a reason that a child is acting out. It is not that they are just bad children to the core. They are having some kind of problem and it is motivated by something that is usually not always obvious.

Swatting a child is something that you're doing for YOU. Not for the child. If you put the child first, and think about what is best for the child, hitting them is not the best answer. Especially long term. Helping them solve their problem, the one that is causing the bad behavior, is what you must take the time to do.

If you think that just making them take a time out alone is the answer, it is not. The time out is not only for them to have a cooling off period, it is also for you to have some time to figure out what is really going on.

BJean, you say it so eloquently and in such simple terms I still don't see why people don't get it?????

Brandy, even just reading this: "Imagine how sad you'd be when they picked up that little girl that you took the time with an they were slapping her around on the way to the car, would your stomach not drop??" made my stomach upset, just the thought, its unbearable.

One of my boys gave me problems, discipline, trying to skip school, stealing, even drugs. And believe me, I heard many times "what that boy needs is a good ass whipping." No, he didn't. He watched a very abusive relationship turn into a nasty divorce then tried to get his dad's attention by "following in his footsteps" (my son's own words), and then didn't know how to deal with his dad not even contacting his own children, not to mention that mom, who was always there was now working all the time. What he needed was some tough love. I told him that his dad used up all his excuses (this regarding cigarettes i found, and then the drug issue), I had help from local PD (very small town, I was told, "not like we have anything else to do") to get him to school, when he stole, i took him back to the store (who refused to do anything, so that didn't help me, just told my son it was ok). I put him in juvie over night for pushing me(he tried to hit me, but didn't make contact, he has been taller than me since he was about 11). But not once did I hit him. Some tried to say that my decision not to spank him, contributed to his behavior at that time (between the ages of 10 and 12 is when all this transpired), I disagree and say he was a child who was overwhelmed with what was going on in his life and acted out. This does not mean he was allowed to get away with anything, by no means.

Now, to listen to this boy, wow, it makes me feel i did a great job. He is now 21, and he gets as frustrated as I do when he sees a child whom he believes deserves better parenting. When he was going through all that, he called me every name in the book, now he calls me mom and compares other moms to me. That may seem small and normal or whatever, but to me, it means the world.

newhope4me,

See and it all worked out in the end. It's not an uncommon situation that kids have issues like that due to problems they don't know how to deal with whether it's similar to yours or compounded also with just being a teen and dealing with all the stuff they do on a normal basis.

I was a pretty good kid but by the time I was a teen I was hanging out with the druggy type kids self medicating I suppose. I turned out well and my kids have some issues with depression or anxiety but it's in our genes, not much we can do about that now except seek professional help.

A lot of their friends though did end up coming here not because we were the "cool" house and I was giving them alcohol or cigarettes but because it was a stable kind of a safe house with no screaming and I guess just a somewhat normal life that most of them didn't have.

I'm lucky not everyone has that kind of a home situation but I guess I kind of was intent on my kids not having the kind of life I had growing up with a mother dying too young and being raised by an alcoholic father (who functioned at work) but who was not exactly Mr. Brady at home. So spanking really isn't always the main problem it's what's underneath the spanking or hitting that's the problem. How parents interact with their kids when there are problems and I guess you get it where a lot of people don't.

I used to work as an assistant in a special ed class for kids with special needs, ADD ADHD and sometimes they just had some real emotional problems and tended to act out in a normal classroom environment. They were difficult and we were taught how to deal with them when they acted out but sometimes when their parents would show up it kind of broke your heart because on one hand these kids had problems but then you saw the interaction between the child and the parent and you kind of understood that things may not get better and you worried what happened when they were home together. I'm probably just over sensitive and didn't work there long enough to be jaded but it always made me kind of sad.

I'm glad that things have worked out so much better for you and your son. It's not easy when you're in a situation especially if you need to involve the police that in itself is a real heart breaker because you're basically using tough love but it's killing you at the same time! I haven't dealt with that end of things but have dealt with putting a child in a psych hospital for about a week and that was something I've never thought would hurt so bad!

Anyway good luck to you, you sound like a great parent and should be proud!:smile2: brandyII.