Hi everyone. I've missed talking with all of you. Since I've been away, God has given me some new insights into his truths that I felt I needed to bring back to all of you. In the past, I shared with some about what happens to unbelievers when they die. I shared that unbelievers would spend their eternity in a place called hell that was an eternal seperation from God and the believers in Heaven. I've been doing alot of studying in the scriptures and digging deeper into the words of God and praying for wisdom on the topic of Hell. I've since learned that I was not accurate about what happens to those who die and don't trust Jesus for their salvation. I want to correct my past stand on the issue.

God has shown me that all men are born mortal. (they don't have the ability to live forever) They can become immortal (have the ability to live forever) if they seek after it. Immortality can be found in Jesus Christ. If a person believes in Jesus and trusts him to bring them into Heaven when they die, then they will be given (by God) the ability to live forever. God alone is immortal. No man has seen God as of yet. All who have died in the past are at rest (sleeping) until the return of Jesus to this earth. At that time,(and no man knows the day nor the hour of His return) all the believers in Jesus from Adam to the present will be resurrected from their sleep. (awakened) They will be brought into God's presence at that time. Then, about 7 years later they will return to this earth once again to rule and reign with Jesus on the earth. Jesus will rule for 1000 years more (a millinium) and after this time is over, the earth will end. All the unbelievers since Adam's time to the present will be resurrected (as mortals, for they did not seek after immortality and can not receive it) from their sleep of death and be judged according to their deeds. Since they didn't trust in Jesus for their salvation, they are cast into a place called Hell (which I believe is the earth we are on right now) and die a second death and are destroyed. They perish along with the present earth in a great fire. (thus why people say hell is a firey place) Then God will make a new Heaven and Earth for those who believed in Him to live on for all eternity. Where I was wrong was in my telling you that those who go to Hell live there forever and suffer for their decision to live without God. Since unbelievers in Jesus can not receive immortality unless they seek after it and become children of God through believing in Jesus, then they can not have "life" in Hell. They don't get life, they get death. The famous verse most people know from the bible, John 3:16 says that there are 2 options in life. Believe and have eternal life or don't believe and perish. (Perish: to become destroyed or ruined : cease to exist) So, I'm sorry for giving you the wrong information the last time I was here. God has opened my eyes to the truth and shared it with me in his word. The death sentence is one of the worse sentences that man can receive from the hand of a jury and judge. It is also the worse sentence that one can receive from God. If you wouldn't like to receive the death sentence in this life, then you surely won't like receiving it from God when you awaken from your sleep of death to be judged before Him, especially when you awaken from that sleep and view what you could be getting instead; eternal life in Heaven. So, please take some time to talk to God right now and ask Jesus to be your savior and to give you immortality.

Thanks for reading. I know it's long. Please comment back. Love, Patty

Hi patty you bring out some good points although maybe not accurately put. However i come here for my wls so maybe conversing in another way or forum would be appropriate.

I understand from you stating God has many names an using Jesus as one of them that you must believe in the trinity. That could be an interesting discussion

This forum (rants and raves) is really the only one to post on because the topics you choose to post don't have to relate to WLS. That's why I'm here in this forum. I would never post something like this in any other forum. Yes, I do believe in ONE God, who is in 3 persons. God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. You and I live in a three-dimensional world. All physical objects have a certain height, width, and depth. One person can look like someone else, or behave like someone else, or even sound like someone else. But a person cannot actually be the same as another person. They are distinct individuals.

God, however, lives without the limitations of a three-dimensional universe. He is spirit. And he is infinitely more complex than we are.

That is why Jesus the Son can be different from the Father. And, yet the same.

The Bible clearly speaks of: God the Son, God the Father, and God the Holy Spirit. But emphasizes that there is only ONE God.

If we were to use math, it would not be, 1+1+1=3. It would be 1x1x1=1. God is a triune God.

Thus the term: "Tri" meaning three, and "Unity" meaning one, Tri+Unity = Trinity. It is a way of acknowledging what the Bible reveals to us about God, that God is yet three "Persons" who have the same essence of deity. Some have tried to give human illustrations for the Trinity, such as H₂O being Water, ice and steam (all different forms, but all are H₂O). Another illustration is an egg having a shell, egg yolk and egg white, but this egg illustration shows that there would be "parts" to God, which isn't the case.

God the Son (Jesus) is fully, completely God. God the Father is fully, completely God. And God the Holy Spirit is fully, completely God. Yet there is only one God. In our world, with our limited human experience, it's tough to understand the Trinity. But from the beginning we see God this way in Scripture. Notice the plural pronouns "us" and "our" in Genesis 1:26 -- Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

Though not a complete list, here is some other Scripture that shows God is one, in Trinity:

• "Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one!" (Deut. 6:4)
  
• "I am the LORD, and there is no other; Besides Me there is no God." (Isa. 45:5)
  
• There is no God but one. (1Cor. 8:4)
  
• And after being baptized, Jesus went up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove, and coming upon Him, and behold, a voice out of the heavens, saying, "This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well-pleased." (Matt. 3:16-17)
  
• "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit." (Matt. 28:19)
  
• Jesus said: "I and the Father are one." (John 10:30)
  
• "He who has seen Me has seen the Father." (John 14:9)
  
• "He who beholds Me beholds the One who sent Me." (John 12:45)
  
• If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him. (Rom. 8:9)
  
• "Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife; for that which has been conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit." (Matt. 1:20)
  
• And the angel answered and said to her [Mary], "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy offspring shall be called the Son of God." (Luke 1:35)
  
• [Jesus speaking to His disciples] "And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not behold Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you, and will be in you." ... "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him, and make Our abode with him." (John 14:16-17, 23)
  The best illustration I have seen comes from C.S. Lewis:
  • The three dimensions of space: Length, width and height. All coincide in the same place, yet are distinct.
  

While the word "trinity" can not be found in scripture, the concept is there.

I like having areas of LBT that don't have to be about WLS. I get to know people a bit here because we all have WLS in common, but I can only talk about fills, constipation, restriction, Protein and tickers so much.

I'm still happy to see Patty return to the site and continue to post. I don't agree with her all the time, but have great respect for her. She really makes people give thought to many issues and have connections to others here that have nothing to do with WLS.

Patty, when I have time after work I want to send you a PM. I was given what I consider an offensive Christmas gift by someone and want your take on it

Miss Patty i truly respect your obvious love of the Word. Thank you for the time an effort you put into your study an reply.

I appreciate your examples of 1x1x1=1 an the egg example.

Even though i may not agree with the simplicity of the image i DO respect your view

Thank you

Miss Patty i truly respect your obvious love of the Word. Thank you for the time an effort you put into your study an reply.

I appreciate your examples of 1x1x1=1 an the egg example.

Even though i may not agree with the simplicity of the image i DO respect your view

Thank you

Your welcome. I enjoy sharing. Hope your day is great.

Patty Green, I see your starting where you left off! Just kidding. You see your the glue that held this group together. Soon after you left everyone seemed to slowly disappear. I see some familiar names are resurfacing, now all we need is for Airiscus99 (although you might be the same person) and Cleos mom. Its about time, the election is nearing and we need 4 more. In think you left because Obama did a great job so far and you couldnt "handle the truth"! The truth being, Romney doesnt stand a chance! The Tea Party is I mean were as worthless as I said they where, Romney is the farthest candidate from a Tea Bag Conservative as the reps could possibly find but they're supporting him! I told you before they were too small to sway votes their way but just big enough to F things up for you republicans! A bunch of whiney middle aged woodstock era idiots who feel they're entitled to whatever they want, me, me, me! You see how well that worked for ya! The best candidate the reps. could find is the retread who couldnt win 31/2 years ago and is so out of touch with reality. He's so bad even most rep politicians are leary of giving him their support!

Seriously though its been a while, how have you been, how has your band been treating you? Its good to see you return.

Bob you're back!

Patty and I dont usually see eye to eye as you would see if you checked out some of our battles from the past but (just my opinion) this is an off topic debate area which means talking about ones religion is allowed here. To come on here and put someone down because they "preach about religion" is crazy. There are alot of topics that would be worse even if your not Christian. This used to bother me also but after long battles with her (Im Christian) I realized she's a good person who cares about others and theres no fault in that. Id rather have someone on the street approach me to share their thoughts about Jesus than to have someone tell me to go F myself because I looked at them wrong!

Yah, Ive been on here a few times but since everybody from our time left there was really no need to come on and my plumbing business has kept me really, really busy over the last 1 1/2-2 years. With me being busier, my wife working and my kids getting older its been hard to find time. Its good to hear from you "guys", if you all stick around It will be more reason to come on here. Everyone disappeared so quickly and there were alot of new people on here, I feel like we all kinda got to know each other which made it fun. I hope you've all been doing well and hope to talk to you all in the future.

I have no clue why there is a line through my sentences but again Im very computer illiterate.

Patty Green, I see your starting where you left off! Just kidding. You see your the glue that held this group together. Soon after you left everyone seemed to slowly disappear. I see some familiar names are resurfacing, now all we need is for Airiscus99 (although you might be the same person) and Cleos mom. Its about time, the election is nearing and we need 4 more. In think you left because Obama did a great job so far and you couldnt "handle the truth"! The truth being, Romney doesnt stand a chance! The Tea Party is I mean were as worthless as I said they where, Romney is the farthest candidate from a Tea Bag Conservative as the reps could possibly find but they're supporting him! I told you before they were too small to sway votes their way but just big enough to F things up for you republicans! A bunch of whiney middle aged woodstock era idiots who feel they're entitled to whatever they want, me, me, me! You see how well that worked for ya! The best candidate the reps. could find is the retread who couldnt win 31/2 years ago and is so out of touch with reality. He's so bad even most rep politicians are leary of giving him their support!

Seriously though its been a while, how have you been, how has your band been treating you? Its good to see you return.

Hi Bob, It's good to talk to you again. I've been doing good, how about you? I'm a new grandma (she'll be one this month) and in Nov. I'll be having my 3rd grandchild. It's so exciting.

I can assure you that I'm not airiscus99, nor have I ever been. I'm not happy with Romney, but in politics I usually vote for the lesser of 2 evils and he's the lesser one. So, he'll have my vote in November. Obama has been a sad case for America. I'm totally disappointed in all his failures as CIC. I don't understand the lines on your post either, but let's hope you can get that fixed.LOL