Tired_Old_Man

I used the "Rape Card" because one of the cases that made the news recently had to do with a pharmacist who refused to dispense "Plan B" or to refer the rape victim to a pharmacist to dispense "Plan B" even though the store he worked for required it.

It is the leadership of the Christian fundamentalist movement who, though they are ministers, (I think) act like politicians and businessmen. They are using religion to fill their bank accounts and to feed their hunger for power, yet the masses only see them as men of God.

Regarding "It is quite unusual to be diagnosed with MS in your 60's": I was having a physical exam done in early 1999 (I was 53) and during the prostate exam there was a lack of response that the doctor defined as a "Sacral Negative Response". The doctor sent me to a neurologist who used used pins, hot and cold plates and a tuning fork to check my feeling responses. He said I might have spinal cord or brain cancer, or a tumor and set up an MRI of the brain, spine and pelvis. The MRI was negative and the neurologist sent me to a doctor for a "Sacral Evoked Potentials" test, but my insurance would not pay for it. I decided to see if things would get worse and the only important problem I had was a twitching of my left leg if I moved it into a weird position, like a fat person trying to cut his toes nails gets into. I wonder if that could have been the onset of MS.

The problem is not funding of abortions with tax dollars. That is another myth used to inflame the public. THE RELIGIOUS RIGHT WANTS ABORTION, MORNING AFTER pills, BIRTH CONTROL AND SEX EDUCATION MADE ILLEGAL.

I also read foreign websites like the BBC and Guardian, based in the UK and some based in other English speaking countries. And they often have more on the BuSh scandals than the US papers. There is no comparison between the loss of lives in the humanitarian effort in Somalia that went wrong and the loss of lives in the Iraq invasion that was wrong from the start. The Clinton White House had one sex scandal which hurt no one and could have waited until after the term was over and a few scandals (many of which were found unprovable), while the BuSh administration has been dissolving our constitutional rights as if they had poured acid on the document itself. Cheney and Rove, through their lying and plotting of lies have caused more deaths than many would realize. If it was not for those two and the lies they cooked up, the US public never would have been behind the invasion of Iraq and it may have never happened, hence my "Laugh so hard you die comedians" comment. Yes, the comedians on the left can be harsh, but they are not calling for the execution or jailing of the Republican voters, right wing spokesmen or honest politicians on the right. The same can not be said of the jokes masquerading as journalists on the right.

I am sorry to hear of the pain in your life and your family. I also hope that both of our families can find comfort during these trying times. In a funny way, I think Tina's crying helped you release some of your pent up emotions. You don't know Tina, and in a certain sense, you do not even "know" me. I am but electrons dancing across cyberspace, but this medium can be used for good and I hope your cry was one of those good things made possible through cyberspace. You have a great Husband.

Thank you Karen for those warm words and for sharing that story about your niece and hope. And Thank you Leatha for sharing that very personal story with me (and the forum). Not everyone is quick to talk about their meds (of that type) because of the undeserved stigma attached to the illness. And Thanks to everyone else who has shared their ideas and time with me. LBT is truly a wonderful forum because of the people that post here.

Laugh so hard you die comedians.:mad::girl_hug:

Those were nice tries, but I never know who is going to fly in the planes that I fix, except when we were working on Military Charter planes (MATS). Well, they were our planes, but we chartered them to the US Military to fly US troops back and forth. I worked on MATS during the Vietnam war and during Gulf War l. I did not refuse to work on the planes even though I was against the war in Vietnam and would have refused induction. I had and knees plus my father was killed in action in WWll, so I was 4A, and had very little chance of being drafted. It would be impossible to know that someone had a nuke and was going to use it on the flight, but I will play along: An Al-Quiada terrorist is on board and going to nuke NYC as the plane flies over it. I know this for a fact. Of course I would stop the plane, but that is not moral conviction. If you come to visit Tina and I, and fall into our swimming pool and suck a lung full of Water, it is not moral conviction for me to rescue you. It is not moral conviction to stop a killing. Killing is against the law. Abortion and day after pills are not against the law. When the freedom riders and the people who staged lunch counter sit-ins were arrested in the 1960's during the civil rights protests, it was because of moral conviction, but they knew it was against the law and took the penalty by spending the night or week or whatever on jail. The tide turned because the American public saw the police turning huge dogs and fire hoses on little children, so the law was changed. These pharmacists do not want to pay the penalty for standing up for their moral convictions. I was ready to go to jail rather than go to Vietnam. Civil rights demonstrators were ready to go to jail for their moral convictions. But these pharmacists want to refuse to do their job (dispensing prescription), while they want to keep their job and are not ready to go to jail for their moral convictions. You can not have it both ways.

Oh, in case (any of) you are wondering how I get all the work done and still post so much; I pick out a length, treat it with "Round-Up" to stop grass from growing back through the rocks, drive the truck near the area, shovel out the amount of rock required (moving the truck gradually), rake it level and then come in for a few posts, then back out again.

When she asks me how I did all that work by myself, I'll just say, "Thinking of You" and if she smiles, I'll say. "HAPPY BIRTHDAY". She has called me a few nights this week and I was almost in too much pain to talk, but I would just tell her that my knees were bothering me. It wasn't really a lie; my knees, feet, thighs, calves, shoulders arms, hands and back were all aching. I just left a few things out. Thank God for "Extra Strength Tylenol".

Just as I was hitting the “Submit Reply” button for the last post, my phone rang. I picked it up and it was Tina uncontrollably crying. It was not a sob, it was full force balling. The first thing that came into my mind was that her mother had died or someone else had been badly injured or worse. What happened, I found out after I calmed her down, was that Tina was talking to her older (and only) sister and the sister said, “Mommy is tired. She wants to go home.” Tina asked what she was talking about and the sister said, “Mommy lived a good life and it is time for her to die.” Tina could not handle that. When I was a child, I had a very big family and there were funerals on a regular basis (normal after considering the size of the family). Tina's immediate family left England when Tina was 3 years old. She had never had a family member die when I met her. I met her within a week after my mother died. I had to be involved in the decision making about my mother's health care including when to stop. Tina was totally insulated from death. She was double insulated. All parents insulate a child from death, but all of Tina's relatives were thousands of miles away, so even her parents were insulated. They would get a phone call or a letter saying that “so & so” had died, but when they told the 5 children, Tina, the youngest usually did not even know what or who they were talking about. Today, it took me a while to calm her, but we wound up crying together and then she calmed down. She can not wait to come home. She asked me what I was doing and I lied to her and said I was working on my car, because I am doing a job on the lawn that she has wanted done for years. I am putting in Marble rocks around the fencing and walks. I have been back to the supply yard over and over this past week getting by pickup fulled with a yard of rock and then shoveling it out all around my property. It is 750 feet, 18 inches wide and 2 inches deep. My back is aching. She will be so happy when she gets home and sees it. It will take about 7 yards at $135 per yard. When they fill my truck bed up from the bulldozer, my truck drops almost a foot in the back and the tires look flat. I hope I don't break my truck or my back.

Thanks to everyone who responding either here or via PM. I will not tell Tina anything until she gets home on Tuesday. I will make my other decisions depending on what the doctor says on Monday when I have my visit. I am going to say something now which may upset some people, especially the women, I would assume. Tina and I are not equals. No two people are equals. Tina and I are so different that our friends were betting that we would not last mire than 2 or 3 years (even before we were married). We will have our 40th wedding anniversary in July. One reason why is because we have made those differences work for us, not against us. I do some things that might appall many of you and Tina does things that might also shock you, but because we blend things together we have created a union that as a whole is greater than the sum of its parts. Where I am weak, she is strong and vice versa. That means that she does things for me that many women would say, let the lazy bum do it himself, but I do things for her that people tall me she should be doing that for herself. But this is the way we like it and how we have made it all these years. So when Alexandra said, "I know if it were my husband, I'd want to know," I believe her, but I don't think Tina can deal with it, at least not all at once. How do I know? We started dating in 1964. I know when I have told Tina about problems and I needed her emotional support, she became so distraught that I wound up having to comfort her. I know with MS, it would not be the case, but if I was told that I had 6 months to live, yes, of course I would share it with Tina. But if it is MS, ruining her birthday will not help and with all the other problems, I would rather wait for a while. BJean asked, "TOM: In your first post about this you wrote "Muscular" Sclerosis. Did you mean Multiple Sclerosis? Anytime someone in a doctor's office says a word like cancer, or multiple sclerosis, or alzheimers or any other possibly life altering disease, it is jars you to your very core." I am 100% positive about it. In fact it was just that one word "Demyelination" that I could not remember and when I found it by Googling, it was exactly as the doctor described it.

One more thing, Bill Maher is a comedian, says he is a comedian and doesn't claim to be a commentator or journalist. Neither Ann Coulter, Michael Savage, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity nor Bill O'Reilly claim that they are comedians and in fact they claim to be commentators on the news or journalists. Both commentators on the news and journalists are supposed to be objective, but none of them are. Even Bill O'Reilly admitted on 60 Minutes a few weeks ago that Rush Limbaugh is not a journalist, though Rush thinks he is one. Karl Rove and Cheney on the other hand are not only "not comedians”, but they have the power to harm people by more than innuendo or jokes. They have immense governmental powers and they are involved with increasing those powers beyond what our "Founding Fathers" ever envisioned. So while Bill Maher may offend you and while he may say some things which you find tasteless, he is a satirist mocking the present situation. The present situation that Cheney and Rove have helped bring about through their actions as officials and that Ann Coulter, Michael Savage, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and Bill O'Reilly have helped bring about by pretending to give the news and distorting the facts.

I think you miss one important distinction. Ann Coulter, for example would have me executed for what I have written at "Lap Band Talk". Bill Maher would disagree with much of what you write, but would not want to be punished. Ann Coulter, wants Democrats in Congress executed for what they have said, written and how they have voted in Congress, while Bill Maher would disagree with much of what BuSh and the Republicans do, but he would not want anything to happen to them except to lose their jobs as representatives.

Should pharmacists or doctors take jobs knowing that a percentage of the time they will have to go against their moral values? What happens when Christians of high moral quality start studying to become pharmacists just so that they can refuse to dispense certain prescriptions? Do you know how many cities and towns in the USA have a lock on keeping doctors and nurses and pharmacists out who disagree with the town's high moral values? If a woman is raped and can not afford the bus fare to the other side of the state or another state, should she be required to pay for raising an unwanted child, a child that reminds her of being raped everyday that she sees him/her? And all because it offended the pharmacist's higher moral values? Could you imagine raising a biracial son in a town that hates Blacks, but hates biracial children even more, because a pharmacist didn't think he had to do the job he was hired to do because of high moral values? Do the pharmacist's high moral values include telling the local bigots to leave the child alone or to tell the local people that "we should help the women with expenses for food" and maybe even for council for the women? "If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen" is what I say to pharmacists. Instead, they are coming into the kitchen to make it hotter and hotter. I may believe in Jesus, but I do not think that Jesus said that people should punish other people based on their interpretation of moral values.

Which groups do Bill Maher and Al Franken attack? Bill Maher says "all religion is stupid", so he doesn't single out Jews, Christians or Muslims" for fighting over the alleged teachings of their holy books. Both Maher and Franken come down on Neo-Cons, but they explain nuance, something that members of the right usually overlook. The listeners and followers of Savage and Coulter tend to be more violent and vulgar IMHO than the listeners of Maher and Franken. I have spoken to advocates of Savage and Coulter, and they are glad they have their NRA membership and their guns for the coming (violent) revolution in which they will "take back our country from the Liberals and Liberal media". The Liberals want to take back the country from the Neo-Con's and Christian Fundamentalists by the ballot box and by education. Both sides want their agenda to win. But there is a difference in the reasoning and the methods.

Cheap Labor?:girl_hug:

Buy dry food. The rat poison was in the wheat gluten which is used to moisten the food. Dry food is supposed to be safe.

Are You Chicken?

Jack, your dictionary learning is wonderful and I complement you on your research and intellect, however the appeal to the intellectually weakest, but vocal and belligerent groups by people like Michael Savage and Ann Coulter is strong and their power is magnified by being seen as an authority figure on mass media, plus the mass media itself magnifies both their powers and reach. You may be able to split the hairs, but to too many only a blunt object will do.

How about the new soft-drinks that children are swallowing in huge amounts that are loaded with caffeine? Are we creating a generation of speed freaks?

:amen: :kev:

Which has the power of multiplying the hatred of one person and re-enforcing the hatred in millions.

You should have been like Kenny and Stan, and gone to Mel Gibson's home to get your money back.