I dont know if this is a subject that has been done to death, or is even PC for that matter, but as a UK girl I was just wondering what your take on the ongoing war is?

I get torn, because I feel that we have no business being there, but still have a great deal of sympathy and concern for my friends whose DH's are serving out there.

Nina x

Bleh. Your, not you're.

I will never forget 9/11. I stood with the rest of the world in shock and horror and the deepest sympathy for the plight of NY and America, just as I am sure that you and your fellow Americans did with Britain when the IRA had their terror campaign against us.

The FACT of the matter is that Saddam and Iraq had nothing to do with 911 so that comment isnt really relevant to whether or not we should have invaded them.

Imagine this if you can.......... A group of far-right Christians bomb China's capital, and as a result of that, China ,who for there own reasons are p*ssed with America, decide to invade your country because you have weapons of mass destruction, you are all Christians and one of the terrorist recieved training in the hills of Virginia...

Would you want the world to stand back and cheer them on?

This isnt a war, it isnt recognised by the UN as a war, it is an act of revenge.

That's your opinion and your opinion only, Sadam if not directly, indirectly had to do with 911 , with terrorism, and that's my opinion, we can agree to disagree.

Ultimately Sadam had to be eliminated and the people from Iraq deserved our help and that's a good thing, obviously we both see this issue totally different and that's fine.

<p>Actually it's not just her opinion only. The 9/11 Commission also points this fact out.</p>

Quoted from the report:

Responding to a presidential tasking, Clarke's office sent a memo to Rice on September 18, titled "Survey of Intelligence Information on Any Iraq Involvement in the September 11 Attacks." Rice's chief staffer on Afghanistan, Zalmay Khalilzad, concurred in its conclusion that only some anecdotal evidence linked Iraq to al Qaeda. The memo found no "compelling case" that Iraq had either planned or perpetrated the attacks.

And I'm sorry if I appear a little aggressive about this, but it just really burns me when people cast aspersions on MY patriotism by saying things like "you must have forgotten about 9/11" when we aren't talking about anything to do with 9/11. It disgusts me and pisses me off, and I think you can understand why. The people that WERE responsible for 9/11? I think that being turned into GLUE is too good a fate.

It's like discussing the Vietnam War and telling the person that doesn't agree with you're opinion, "You must have forgotten what happened to the Jews and all the Americans that died in WWII." What the hell? One does not have anything to do with the other, and the only point of it is to insult the person you're talking to. All the references to "you" in the above were the general "you," not a specific person in the thread.

Lauren, are you really sorry to appear a little aggressive? come on, you may want to re-read your previous posts , pretty much all of them.... you appear very aggressive in mostly all of them, I'm sure you know that... you are smart... you always seem to be pissed at the world, bitter, unfortunately your posts don't come across as passionate, but aggressive.... but that's ok... most of the times I think it's funny, yesterday I was in a feisty mood... so I decided to aggresively join you...

About 911...I do believe that some people have forgotten too quickly about it, and it's not lack of patriotism necessarily, but somewhat a natural tendency that people forget after a while.... by Sadam not complying with the UN, and the US going there, taking him out and helping the people from Iraq is sending a message to the terrorists that the US is not going to put up with their crap any longer, and that message goes directly to the 911 terrorists, to all of them, that's just one reasonwhy I do think that there is a connection between 911 and Sadam, we may not agree, oh well.... but hey, don't get all pissed off all the time, you are going to get too many wrinkles too young....

Actually it's not just her opinion only. The 9/11 Commission also points this fact out.

Well forgive me, that's her opinion and the Commission's opinion.... I still have mine...

No actually I never brought it into the conversation I just showed a pic of Saddam enjoying 9/11.

I hate to tell you al qaeda is in Iraq. So it will be in the conversations.

Just be happy you live in a country where you can have your opinions and express them freely. If we had it your way the people of Iraq would be tortured by there government if they spoke like you.

9/11 changed our country and people need to realize that. I hope you are not implying that I am defiling the memories of my friends lost on 9/11.

I lost a few friends and a over 300 brother firefighters that day. The time I spent digging holes with my bare hands looking for survivors at the WTC will forever be burned in my head and maybe thats why I feel the way I do.

I'm sorry about your personal loss on 911....very sad...

I completely understand how you feel, there is not enough reading in this world, education, books that can teach you what you actually live through....those are life experiences that stay with us forever and they touch us deeply...

Well forgive me, that's her opinion and the Commission's opinion.... I still have mine...

I think that says it all, in a nutshell. The 9/11 Commission was a non-partisan commission brought together to explore the events leading up to, during, and post 9/11, and some will still reject their results as an opinion less deserving than their own. That makes about as much sense as a panel of doctors giving someone a diagnosis for an illness and that person saying, "In my opinion, I'm not sick." Condoleeza Rice's own staffer explained the absence of a 9/11 - Iraq link, not Sean Penn or Susan Sarandon, and that is still not enough evidence...amazing.

I think that says it all, in a nutshell. The 9/11 Commission was a non-partisan commission brought together to explore the events leading up to, during, and post 9/11, and some will still reject their results as an opinion less deserving than their own. That makes about as much sense as a panel of doctors giving someone a diagnosis for an illness and that person saying, "In my opinion, I'm not sick." Condoleeza Rice's own staffer explained the absence of a 9/11 - Iraq link, not Sean Penn or Susan Sarandon, and that is still not enough evidence...amazing.

Hey, It may be amazing to you, but I still have the right to my own opinions.... and those facts may be interpreted in different ways by different people, as of now and since then Al Qaeda IS in Iraq and one way or the other it's connected with 911 in my opinion, again, this is just my opinion, I'm definitely not going to try to change yours and thousands of articles, writting, nothing is going to change mine, so we disagree, that's fine, no need to keep arguing about it you and I, and I'm ok with that. I hope you are too.

Do you wonder why Al Qaeda are in Iraq now? They probably welcomed them with open arms, does no-one realise that by the actions that we have taken , we have in fact played into the hands of the fundamentalist islamics?

In Britain we have terrible situations arising in even the most moderate Muslim communites.

If you persecute someone based on their religion and tar all with the same brush, after getting the cr*p kicked out of them a few times because they ' might be terrorists' - and I have Muslim friends that this has happened to, they are going to kick back, and there have been rich pickings in Britain for the radical sects from the disillusioned

We are now in a position where these people see themselves as freedom fighters, and NO I dont agree with anyone spewing hatred, and if I am honest part of me thinks ' if it is so friggin great there why dont you live there??' and I dont like being called an infidel anymore than they like being called fundamentalist but that doesnt mean that I cant understand the dynamics behind the situation.

Can someone please define for me what the American and British governments see as being the differences between a 'terrorist' and a 'freedom fighter'??? I am danged if I can see one other than political veiwpoint.

NIna x

Lauren, are you really sorry to appear a little aggressive? come on, you may want to re-read your previous posts , pretty much all of them.... you appear very aggressive in mostly all of them, I'm sure you know that... you are smart... you always seem to be pissed at the world, bitter, unfortunately your posts don't come across as passionate, but aggressive.... but that's ok... most of the times I think it's funny, yesterday I was in a feisty mood... so I decided to aggresively join you...

About 911...I do believe that some people have forgotten too quickly about it, and it's not lack of patriotism necessarily, but somewhat a natural tendency that people forget after a while.... by Sadam not complying with the UN, and the US going there, taking him out and helping the people from Iraq is sending a message to the terrorists that the US is not going to put up with their crap any longer, and that message goes directly to the 911 terrorists, to all of them, that's just one reasonwhy I do think that there is a connection between 911 and Sadam, we may not agree, oh well.... but hey, don't get all pissed off all the time, you are going to get too many wrinkles too young....

Yeah, I do come across aggressive in my past posts. Want to know why? I kind of get a tad pissed off when someone basically calls me a bad American. You would, too, I think. It doesn't make me bitter. What it does make me is very, very angry.

I think that says it all, in a nutshell. The 9/11 Commission was a non-partisan commission brought together to explore the events leading up to, during, and post 9/11, and some will still reject their results as an opinion less deserving than their own. That makes about as much sense as a panel of doctors giving someone a diagnosis for an illness and that person saying, "In my opinion, I'm not sick." Condoleeza Rice's own staffer explained the absence of a 9/11 - Iraq link, not Sean Penn or Susan Sarandon, and that is still not enough evidence...amazing.

Yep, it is absolutely mind-boggling, isn't it? It reminds me of an ostrich sticking its head in the sand. All these people MUST be wrong, even though they were privy to all the intelligence and information that was gathered. They're wrong, wrong, wrong. Even when all the evidence says they're right, right, right.

Hell, when the people that actually made the decision can admit that they were wrong, you would think that everyone else could admit it, too.

Yeah, I do come across aggressive in my past posts. Want to know why? I kind of get a tad pissed off when someone basically calls me a bad American. You would, too, I think. It doesn't make me bitter. What it does make me is very, very angry.

well, it's good to know it's not bitterness... you are way to young for that... I don't think that nobody has called you a bad american though... and yeah, I would not like it either.... thankfully nobody has ever called me that.... I admit that I consider myself freaking patriotic....at least I'd like to think so....lol.. but it's all in the eye of the beholder, what may seem patriotic to me, may seem silly to others, I don't think we all go by strict definition of the word...

well, it's good to know it's not bitterness... you are way to young for that... I don't think that nobody has called you a bad american though... and yeah, I would not like it either.... thankfully nobody has ever called me that.... I admit that I consider myself freaking patriotic....at least I'd like to think so....lol.. but it's all in the eye of the beholder, what may seem patriotic to me, may seem silly to others, I don't think we all go by strict definition of the word...

Thank you for explaining. The implication that infuriates me is that if I don't agree with the current President about the Iraq war, I must not be a patriot, and I must have forgotten about all the people that lost their lives on 9/11. It's a low blow, IMO, and it does basically call my patriotism and how "good" of an American I am into question. Can you understand how someone could be hurt and become very angry because of that comment?

Yeah, I do come across aggressive in my past posts. Want to know why? I kind of get a tad pissed off when someone basically calls me a bad American. You would, too, I think. It doesn't make me bitter. What it does make me is very, very angry.

Laurend: Who has called you a "bad American"? I haven't seen it but maybe I missed that post. I think what happens here is that if someone doesn't agree with someone else's posted opinion, their response comes across as disagreement with the person themselves. We are all guilty of it. But I haven't seen anyone call anyone else here "unpatriotic". In fact, I see more of a "you are an idiot for thinking that" kind of post here, which is mean but which has nothing to do with patriotism. Personally, I wish we could just stick to stating our own opinions instead of throwing stones at others, but then, that is just me....

For the record, I consider myself to be a huge patriot. That's why I am so infuriated with the current President. I feel like he's ruining this country, our reputation overseas, everything we stand for. It's all being washed down the drain and it makes me so mad.